More benchtop area required, obviously!
HELP, my shop is a MESS
- Thread starter Lloyd-ss
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How about a rotary design? Multiple bench tops, with the push of a button the benchtop becomes a shelf board and a "fresh" benchtop shows up in front of you.
At least it will last for as many button pushes, as you have spare bench tops.
This will solve the bench top cleaning. Only shelfes need to be cleaned.
I think a part of the answer is that 'a place for everything' is impossible. I have a small box labeled 'odd bits of aluminium' but do not go as far as as the once reported tin of 'pieces of string too short to be of any use'. Some things just defy categorisation, when you have stashed everything down to 'probably useless tools' there will still be a load of stuff on the bench you do not think you should throw out just yet. Perhaps, after, 'miscellaneous small offcuts' one needs to face up to reality and have a box for 'random junk'.
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cgabel
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Brilliant topic!
I am basically a chaotic organizer ( my wife says non-organizer.)
My shop is 8 x 12 and is part of my double car garage which has never housed cars.
The shop is highly insulated and is for clean work only. Grinding, sanding, finishing takes place outside the enclosed shop in the main garage space.
I find it comforting to share attributes with the community. I too tidy before visitors come. I too sort using storage systems based on storage boxes of one manufacturer and use labels.
Surfaces are my nemesis. I think it is because I sort and know where things are visually, but there is a definite limit before total chaos sets in. An hour of putting stuff back feels good and makes things work better too. I do this quite often. I do keep mill and lathe pristinely clean all of the time. I think that too many parts from too many projects means that saturation point is easily reached. I will try a secondary storage space on the unused or little used tools and materials (3 year rule!) and by creating this “archive” kept in the garage space, should have more freedom in my tiny workshop.
I am basically a chaotic organizer ( my wife says non-organizer.)
My shop is 8 x 12 and is part of my double car garage which has never housed cars.
The shop is highly insulated and is for clean work only. Grinding, sanding, finishing takes place outside the enclosed shop in the main garage space.
I find it comforting to share attributes with the community. I too tidy before visitors come. I too sort using storage systems based on storage boxes of one manufacturer and use labels.
Surfaces are my nemesis. I think it is because I sort and know where things are visually, but there is a definite limit before total chaos sets in. An hour of putting stuff back feels good and makes things work better too. I do this quite often. I do keep mill and lathe pristinely clean all of the time. I think that too many parts from too many projects means that saturation point is easily reached. I will try a secondary storage space on the unused or little used tools and materials (3 year rule!) and by creating this “archive” kept in the garage space, should have more freedom in my tiny workshop.
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Welcome to the forum, cgabel!
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I am impressed and humbled by the evolution of this topic. It is covering everything from the practical to the esoteric , to the humorous, and to the sometimes hopelessness of the situation. This is almost becoming a deep dive into the psychology of "shop organization." But a few tidbits have popped out that ... for me ... might just make a difference. As I sit here at my computer right now and look around at my shop, maybe its not hopeless after all.
Lloyd
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I'm still seeking that photo perfect spiffy shop. I don't think they actually work, they are just an artists conception, rather like the picture on the box of frozen dinner.
After three + years of building repair and restoration at our retirement place I'm getting to play in rather than work on my shop buildings. Darn near broke me, it's doubtful another project of such scale is left in me.
I've been sorting, tossing, and cleaning for a while, and have one building just about to the point that I'm happy with it. My other shop building has decently organized tool cabinets, so when I need to repair something I can find the right tool quickly (almost always, exceptions still cause me some consternation...).
Still skating along trying to find that happy balance between the expense and the cost of organisation, both have a cost in time, space, materials, and sometimes money. I must have 10 rolls of pipe tape, three drywall saws, who knows how many utility knives, all those doing a quick job and can't find things needed but the job has to get done today and you're not home sorts of stupidity.
The storage building isn't a full nightmare, but it is at least an unpleasant dream
I'm at the point where my shop used to look like Pat J's photo, now it's looking somewhat along the lines of Poppy Ott's shop, and it's doubtful that I would have the discipline required to achieve Mike Ginn's level of organization, although I come close on the materials and cutting tools storage part of the deal.
Interesting thread, nice to get some ideas from everyone.
Cheers,
Stan
After three + years of building repair and restoration at our retirement place I'm getting to play in rather than work on my shop buildings. Darn near broke me, it's doubtful another project of such scale is left in me.
I've been sorting, tossing, and cleaning for a while, and have one building just about to the point that I'm happy with it. My other shop building has decently organized tool cabinets, so when I need to repair something I can find the right tool quickly (almost always, exceptions still cause me some consternation...).
Still skating along trying to find that happy balance between the expense and the cost of organisation, both have a cost in time, space, materials, and sometimes money. I must have 10 rolls of pipe tape, three drywall saws, who knows how many utility knives, all those doing a quick job and can't find things needed but the job has to get done today and you're not home sorts of stupidity.
The storage building isn't a full nightmare, but it is at least an unpleasant dream
I'm at the point where my shop used to look like Pat J's photo, now it's looking somewhat along the lines of Poppy Ott's shop, and it's doubtful that I would have the discipline required to achieve Mike Ginn's level of organization, although I come close on the materials and cutting tools storage part of the deal.
Interesting thread, nice to get some ideas from everyone.
Cheers,
Stan
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My hobby work on engines started when I inherited my dad's shop equipment, which was a Grizzly lathe, mill, and some tooling.
I figured I would make a few bar stock engines, and call it a day.
Then I got interested in foundry work, and built a full iron foundry, and of course had to add a full pattern shop, and so it has mushroomed from something simple to a pretty complex endeavor.
And I have collected a few full sized steam engines, and those take up a lot of space.
I am not sure if I will ever get the shop "clean" per se.
I would settle for "usable", and somewhat organized, where I can readily find things.
Pat J
.
I figured I would make a few bar stock engines, and call it a day.
Then I got interested in foundry work, and built a full iron foundry, and of course had to add a full pattern shop, and so it has mushroomed from something simple to a pretty complex endeavor.
And I have collected a few full sized steam engines, and those take up a lot of space.
I am not sure if I will ever get the shop "clean" per se.
I would settle for "usable", and somewhat organized, where I can readily find things.
Pat J
.
Rocket Man
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Every time my shop gets full of trash, tree leaves, saw dust, papers, etc. I open both big doors then park my go-kart in 1 door and start the engine. The 30" airplane propeller makes a tornado wind IN one door around the shop then OUT the other door. LOOK OUT all the trash blows out the other door. It only takes 45 seconds to clean my shop. LOL. My shop is organized but dirty.
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The only way my bench top would stay clean would be if it was slanted at 45 degrees!!
Like others, I clean my shop periodically - usually before starting a new project. Overall, it is actually pretty organized. It has to be, to fit a full machine shop (including 2 lathes) and a full woodshop and a fab shop into half of a two-car garage. Or at least, it's supposed to be half. My wife keeps thinking she is supposed to be able to park in the other half - clearly she doesn't understand the true purpose of a garage ...
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When I was running my fabricating shop it was actually easier because I would work on one project at a time and when it was complete I would ship it out and start the next project. At the end of the project I would always put everything back before I started the next project. That was all tools, hardware etc. This was in spite of the fact that I would have to take out many of the same tools for the next project. I had most of the tools assigned to a specific place with everything clearly marked. That meant that I would immediately know that the 9/16 wrench and the left handed widget wrench was missing and I had to find it before I moved on to the next project. Now that I am old and retired and easily distracted I have much more of a problem. I will work on the project of the day and then think that I should make this little gadget or just get bored and move on to another project or just stop for coffee and forget what I was working on. Fortunately old and retired means that I no longer have to make money on every project and there is no deadline on the project of the moment.
Guys
Thank you for your kind comments. Although you might think I am over-organized it really is from necessity. With the build up of tools over many years I found that far too long was spent looking for “that tool” or component. I was also forgetting what I had. My solution was to group like items. Do I have an odd-leg caliper? No idea but I know all my scribing “things” are in the scribing box. Scribers I use on a daily basis are kept loose on a small shelf above the bench. The next logical step was to log everything in a spread sheet and number the boxes.
My main improvement from my last workshop was to make use of decking planks as the shelves using welded brackets (these could easily be bolted together but would need a modified design).
I have saved many, many hours not having to search for items and to me that justifies the organization.
I have a similar view about digital vs traditional measuring kit. Digital just saves time - but that’s another post.
Guys – take the plunge and save time – we are all getting older and time is limited!
Mike
Thank you for your kind comments. Although you might think I am over-organized it really is from necessity. With the build up of tools over many years I found that far too long was spent looking for “that tool” or component. I was also forgetting what I had. My solution was to group like items. Do I have an odd-leg caliper? No idea but I know all my scribing “things” are in the scribing box. Scribers I use on a daily basis are kept loose on a small shelf above the bench. The next logical step was to log everything in a spread sheet and number the boxes.
My main improvement from my last workshop was to make use of decking planks as the shelves using welded brackets (these could easily be bolted together but would need a modified design).
I have saved many, many hours not having to search for items and to me that justifies the organization.
I have a similar view about digital vs traditional measuring kit. Digital just saves time - but that’s another post.
Guys – take the plunge and save time – we are all getting older and time is limited!
Mike
Brilliant thread. I now appreciate I am not alone. Heartwarming to appreciate theren are others out there with too much stuff and not enough space.
I recently built a 4ft x 2ft 6in bench to fill a space vacated by a 3ft cube pottery kiln. I used "old" timber and materials I didn't know I had (saved £50!), and now have a new bench and floor full of stuff I didn't know I was storing.
I think the rule is simple.
The bench stores just enough stuff so the available work-space is just too small for whatever project needs that space.
But a recent success. A fluorescent tube LED tube replacement failed after just at a year ... so I stripped it to see what made it work, and fail. The 2 power supplies had both expired. (Lost their smoke?). The LED strips (2 x 4ft long) both worked. So instead of buying a replacement 8ft LED tube (prices have gone up from £15 to £30 in year!) I bought 2 LED power supplies for £13 each, and re-made the LED Lamps. As 8ft tubes and fittings have been withdrawn, I am happy with my 2 x 4ft lamps.
(OK call me a sad old whatsit!).
K2
I recently built a 4ft x 2ft 6in bench to fill a space vacated by a 3ft cube pottery kiln. I used "old" timber and materials I didn't know I had (saved £50!), and now have a new bench and floor full of stuff I didn't know I was storing.
I think the rule is simple.
The bench stores just enough stuff so the available work-space is just too small for whatever project needs that space.
But a recent success. A fluorescent tube LED tube replacement failed after just at a year ... so I stripped it to see what made it work, and fail. The 2 power supplies had both expired. (Lost their smoke?). The LED strips (2 x 4ft long) both worked. So instead of buying a replacement 8ft LED tube (prices have gone up from £15 to £30 in year!) I bought 2 LED power supplies for £13 each, and re-made the LED Lamps. As 8ft tubes and fittings have been withdrawn, I am happy with my 2 x 4ft lamps.
(OK call me a sad old whatsit!).
K2
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I love to see how shops are built and organized...... Which reminds me of a poster that had a multi-step set of process questions for projects and ended up with "Where did you steal your idea from?"
So: of many stolen ideas, I will contribute two to this discussion.
1. Put your tools in the middle of the floor or near a doorway while working in the field, so you don't leave them behind or put them in a "safe place" and forget about them. I was told this by an electrician I once worked for after I left too many tools laying on joist braces in ceilings or on customer's kitchen counters.
2. Redundancy can be good. For example, I have the relevant sized tools for the lathe stored in a drawer in the lathe stand and another cache of tools for the mill stored near the mill. Each one that gets used goes right back in its place. I don't have to remember where I last used the 10mm wrench. Of course that means my shop close-out sale will have lots of tape measures, flashlights, and fastener tools.
--ShopShoe
So: of many stolen ideas, I will contribute two to this discussion.
1. Put your tools in the middle of the floor or near a doorway while working in the field, so you don't leave them behind or put them in a "safe place" and forget about them. I was told this by an electrician I once worked for after I left too many tools laying on joist braces in ceilings or on customer's kitchen counters.
2. Redundancy can be good. For example, I have the relevant sized tools for the lathe stored in a drawer in the lathe stand and another cache of tools for the mill stored near the mill. Each one that gets used goes right back in its place. I don't have to remember where I last used the 10mm wrench. Of course that means my shop close-out sale will have lots of tape measures, flashlights, and fastener tools.
--ShopShoe
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I found one thing to help with the clutter of old tools and multiples of tools and excess materials - many acquired at auctions and events like Cabin Fever. I'm naturally a pack rat, but started forcing myself to put some of them in a Rubbermaid tote every so often and taking them to the antique engine swap meets I go to during the year and selling them.
This is not foolproof. Those same swap meets also are opportunities to indulge, but I am getting better at not buying things I don't have a need or immediate use for. I have recovered a noticeable amount of shelf space in the shop by doing this, as painful as it is to dispose of some interesting-looking gadget that I'll never use. It also nets me a small amount of cash at each event to spend on tools and things I need.
This is not foolproof. Those same swap meets also are opportunities to indulge, but I am getting better at not buying things I don't have a need or immediate use for. I have recovered a noticeable amount of shelf space in the shop by doing this, as painful as it is to dispose of some interesting-looking gadget that I'll never use. It also nets me a small amount of cash at each event to spend on tools and things I need.
My dad was a boatswains mate in the Navy and was a hard ass for keeping everything ship shape. Before he died, he somehow managed to get rid of all the rif-raf from his shop and only the good stuff was left. I think I thanked him at his grave-side for that. My mother-in-law was the opposite, including a "mystery room" piled to the ceiling with junk and rat poop, but also a few seriously valuable items that could have been easily missed with a mass cleaning after she died.
Because of the contrast in the two situations, my wife and I have vowed to NOT leave a preponderance of junk (or apparent junk) for our kids to have to deal with after we are gone.
One method I have developed for thinning out the junk is when I have something worth selling on Craigslist or Facebook, I will always have a box of similar themed junk handy, with one cool and/or useful thing on the top. When the person shows up to buy their item, I give the sob story that I am cleaning up blah blah blah, "here, please have this for free," and I am always successful in getting rid of something that was useless for me (or my kids).
Works like a charm. When I get back to the house, my wife and I always have a good chuckle about the "free" junk I managed to get rid of.
Lloyd
Because of the contrast in the two situations, my wife and I have vowed to NOT leave a preponderance of junk (or apparent junk) for our kids to have to deal with after we are gone.
One method I have developed for thinning out the junk is when I have something worth selling on Craigslist or Facebook, I will always have a box of similar themed junk handy, with one cool and/or useful thing on the top. When the person shows up to buy their item, I give the sob story that I am cleaning up blah blah blah, "here, please have this for free," and I am always successful in getting rid of something that was useless for me (or my kids).
Works like a charm. When I get back to the house, my wife and I always have a good chuckle about the "free" junk I managed to get rid of.
Lloyd
I like the idea of getting rid of the "unused stuff".... and recently had a wake-up call when a close friend departed within 2 weeks of feeling a bit poorly. The sudden loss was upsetting, and the family had to clear lots of his planned jobs, bits, tools and stuff without knowing what half of the stuff was for, or what it was worth. So I had to help and try and think like him to advise: the headlamps were for the car that had glaucoma, the plumbing fittings were for the dripping cistern, etc. And the Graduates would have to learn how to change the windscreen wipers, etc. after watching some Utube demonstrations, instead of texting their mates.
We all gather the stuff and have projects we can't finish, when St. Peter calls us to fix the Pearly gates. But it is a bit easier for others if things are organised - which is what I will try and do from here onwards.
Keep on keeping on, while you can.
K2
We all gather the stuff and have projects we can't finish, when St. Peter calls us to fix the Pearly gates. But it is a bit easier for others if things are organised - which is what I will try and do from here onwards.
Keep on keeping on, while you can.
K2
I've had similar family experiences to those of Lloyd-ss with my mother keeping everything, fervently believing that anything old or that an ancestor owned must have great value. We have found out that the six moving barrels packed with "antique valuable crystal and silver" was mostly just run of the mill mass produced glass or silver plate stuff. Two yard sales, where glass collectors were in attendance and buying, told us what had value. All the left overs we didn't like went to a local charity store. We and the kids got to go through everything and take what was wanted first. Many books have been given to the local library for their book sales, others have been sold online or at the Cabin Fever consignment area. Sold a fair bit of stuff just last weekend there, enough to pay for food, gas, and one nights lodging. Home team wins!
The kids have all been told when we're gone take what they want from the shops and house. They know my view is that I got all the fun and pleasure out of the stuff I could, there's probably some fun left in some of it if they want it. Then post on our regional metal club (CAMS) mailing list and the area yard sale site that Stan has bought the farm, doors are unlocked, coffee cans by the doors. Please pay what is fair. Hopefully empty buildings and full coffee cans will be the result. Some will be generous, some will take advantage, but hopefully it will make sorting out the estate a much easier process for them. We do live in a very low crime area, certainly helps.
The important thing is that the kids KNOW we don't want them to drag tons of crap through life just because it was ours. My mother kept everything from all ancestors, feeling it was her obligation to preserve it ALL for future generations. It was a nightmare to find the good stuff among the mundane. The kids know which few pieces of furniture are really of value, and that the rest of it is just stuff. Some nice, some OK, but just stuff.
These days, if something is in my way it either gets stored properly, fixed and used, or sold / donated/ given away/ taken to the dump. My pick up has a trailer hitch and an empty bed, might as well use them to make our lives better now. I've collected all sorts of projects that would have been great to do at the time I got the stuff. Many have been overtaken by events, or my interests have changed. The ones I still want to do are getting done, one or several at a time. Feels really good to be able to walk into a shop and do something without having to rearrange piles of stuff to get to a roll around chest for a tool.
The kids have all been told when we're gone take what they want from the shops and house. They know my view is that I got all the fun and pleasure out of the stuff I could, there's probably some fun left in some of it if they want it. Then post on our regional metal club (CAMS) mailing list and the area yard sale site that Stan has bought the farm, doors are unlocked, coffee cans by the doors. Please pay what is fair. Hopefully empty buildings and full coffee cans will be the result. Some will be generous, some will take advantage, but hopefully it will make sorting out the estate a much easier process for them. We do live in a very low crime area, certainly helps.
The important thing is that the kids KNOW we don't want them to drag tons of crap through life just because it was ours. My mother kept everything from all ancestors, feeling it was her obligation to preserve it ALL for future generations. It was a nightmare to find the good stuff among the mundane. The kids know which few pieces of furniture are really of value, and that the rest of it is just stuff. Some nice, some OK, but just stuff.
These days, if something is in my way it either gets stored properly, fixed and used, or sold / donated/ given away/ taken to the dump. My pick up has a trailer hitch and an empty bed, might as well use them to make our lives better now. I've collected all sorts of projects that would have been great to do at the time I got the stuff. Many have been overtaken by events, or my interests have changed. The ones I still want to do are getting done, one or several at a time. Feels really good to be able to walk into a shop and do something without having to rearrange piles of stuff to get to a roll around chest for a tool.
Richard Hed
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I thimpfk that the LED manufacturers are making the claim (maybe not overtly) that these LEDs will last 10-20 years--but they don't as you found out. They ARE however, nice and brite! I have three in my shop and I like them very much. A fourth one "burnt out" but I thimpfk the thing is still good, just haven't opened it up to see.
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