Brian does Ridders flame eater

[Brian Rupnow]

No luck today with the 70% alcohol. Engine refused to run on it. I do have some "real" work today, so haven't had much time to play with the engine. I don't think that 8 mm diameter cotton rope is going to do for a wick either. I have to jam it in so tight to get it down the 1/4" wick hole that it interferes with the wicking action. I called the pharmacy about my 95% alcohol that was supposed to come today, and somehow they have lost it--I'm waiting on a phone call. The magnet I have J.B. welded into the engine base does a great job of holding the alcohol tank in place. If I get my 95% alcohol I will try it with the 6 mm cotton rope wick.

 

[werowance]

was talking to a friend about it, he mentioned windshield washer fluid in concentrate form. I think pre mixed is almost 50 methanol and 50 water, fudge that a little to account for the blue dye in it. so wonder what concentrate would be?

 

[Brian Rupnow]

I found an hour to play today, so removed the 8 mm rope wick and installed the 6 mm rope wick instead. Now I find that when I flip the engine over by hand to see if it will start, it blows out the flame.--Consistently. I assume that the 95% alcohol will be more apt to stay lit, than the 70% that I currently have. The engine still acts as if it may actually run, but certainly not with the flame going out so easily.

 

[bmac2]

Hi Brian
For wicks I find Canadian Tire and Cabelas have a good selection. I buy 99.9% alcohol at Superstore (Loblaws). It’s behind the counter so just ask the pharmacist.

 

[el gringo]

I have found the problem of the flame blowing out is usually caused by improper
functioning of the valve and or cold start issues
Rat M

 

[johnny1320]

Try home depot paint section methyl hydrate is 100% methanol alcohol

 

[Brian Rupnow]

No joy--I hunted around on my shelf of 10,000 things and found a small unopened can of Methyl Hydrate. This gives a much larger, hotter flame that doesn't blow out. Engine likes it, tries to run, but can't quite get there. I tried a little WD40 on the bearings, which does make it spin more freely, but it won't keep running. There really isn't anything on this engine to adjust, other than moving the alcohol reservoir around to reposition the flame. I have one more thing to try, and then I guess if it doesn't run I will try a graphite piston and valve.

 

[CFLBob]

No joy--I hunted around on my shelf of 10,000 things and found a small unopened can of Methyl Hydrate. This gives a much larger, hotter flame that doesn't blow out. Engine likes it, tries to run, but can't quite get there. I tried a little WD40 on the bearings, which does make it spin more freely, but it won't keep running. There really isn't anything on this engine to adjust, other than moving the alcohol reservoir around to reposition the flame. I have one more thing to try, and then I guess if it doesn't run I will try a graphite piston and valve.

As I'm starting to make the first pieces for my Duclos engine, and I follow every post to this thread, I find this a little discouraging.

On the other hand, I've watched a lot of videos of flame eater engines running and almost every video includes time spent trying to get it to run. They seem to be really fussy about where the flame is and how big it is. (I can almost imagine the early experimenters saying, "if only we could figure out how to get that combustion inside the engine")

Rather than make a graphite piston, I think Ridders is the guy who said to sprinkle graphite powder (shavings?) inside the cylinder as lubrication. They sell that as lock lubricant. Maybe whittle back the wood on a soft pencil and color the walls of the cylinder?

Here's hoping you get it running.

 

[Brian Rupnow]

Allright!!!--I've done everything that I know how to do, and the engine doesn't run. It is machined to spec, it turns over freely, and I have tried 95% alcohol as fuel. There isn't really anything more to try. So---I just ordered a one foot length of machinable graphite from some outfit in Illinois. I'm a bit disappointed, but the fat lady hasn't sang yet.

 

[werowance]

Brian, do you have a video of you trying it on the better alcohol by chance? or are you to the point of step away and take a breather don't talk about it right now? :hDe:? I'm just curious to see and compare the flame to all the others I have watched

 

[Brian Rupnow]

Werowance---Here ya go---
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPiwXM4xSvM&feature=youtu.be[/ame]

 

[Brian Rupnow]

Here is a video which shows how "free wheeling" the mechanism is.
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSu-PGZnQkI&feature=youtu.be[/ame]

 

[werowance]

Thanks Brian, It looks like you have it in the right position according to all I can see on line. the only thing I see is the color and length of your flame seems to be different than what I'm seeing on other runners. I don't know. I was just hoping something would jump out at me or maybe someone else will watch the video and see whats wrong.

just incase I screen shotted proper wick position - yours appears to be right, a running engines flame and color, your engines flame and color.

 

[werowance]

Here is a video which shows how "free wheeling" the mechanism is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSu-PGZnQkI&feature=youtu.be

ok, on this video, forgive me if you say this already in your video, I'm at work and cant turn up the sound, but Jans troubleshooting steps state:
freewheel flywheel only should spin about 2 mins
flywheel and piston together should run 15 to 20 seconds
and full assembly should spin about 8 to 10 seconds. in your video I'm only getting about 4 Mississippi's of spin time (that means 4 seconds )

how long does fly wheel alone spin? 2 mins seems awefuly long but I double checked and he does state mins no seconds on that part

 

[Brian Rupnow]

Without the con rod in place mine will spin for close to two minutes.

 

[werowance]

one more thought, i know i mentioned this earlier on in the build. but if you run flywheel and piston only, remove valve and pushrod, about how many seconds of run time do you get? I'm thinking pushrod friction, where i see a lot of folks are putting in a bushing on both ends so the rod only has about 1 or 2 mm of rub firction spots on each end instead of the rod having the entire length of the cylinder to lay on the bottom and rub the full length.

 

[el gringo]

Brian,
The video looks like a problem with the valve fit or timing.
In any event these videos might help with wick positioning, proximity to the port etc.
Your wick seems to be a bit high.
pss... do you have a vent in the fuel tank?

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLCgPwKgbBM[/ame]
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0gNU0LVUvk[/ame]
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfGUDEkPU18[/ame]

I'm using denatured alcohol, AKA methyl spirits

Ray M

 

[el gringo]

I can't make any thing spin for 1 minute let alone 2
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0DCyjwoFTs[/ame]

 

[Cogsy]

The spin test looks a lot like mine did when I built it, so I assume it will work with that. To my eye, the flame does still look a bit on the yellow side, but with the blue section at the bottom I would think it may work as well.

Looking at the flame position, the wick may be a little high, leaving the very bottom of the port lacking enough flame. It's hard to tell how you have it set up from the video, but I have the wick touching the cylinder, slightly forward of the port for best running. Even then, a 1-2mm adjustment can mean the difference between running and not running. I, quite literally, made my arm sore over several days, and remade the piston/valve several times (thinking, as you do, that fit was the problem), before I got it fine tuned enough to run. As version 1 of this engine ran with cast iron piston and valve at only 18mm diameter, it should run for you with cast iron as well. I feel your pain, it's very frustrating, but if you keep at it, it will run!!

 

[Blogwitch]

Look where this wick sits, it almost covers the inlet hole. Forget about moving the reservoir about, get a bit of thin rod and move just the wick into position over the hole. Eventually you will find the sweet spot and it will start to kick.

You do need to warm the cylinder up first, I gave mine a dose of plumbers torch for about 30 seconds then left it about the same time to soak through the metal cylinder. Only then can you start to adjust the wick to get it to run. No lubrication at all as all it will do is gum up the works.

This is with a glass wick and methylated spirits and a cast iron piston. It will run on gas but it soon clogs everything up with soot.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iF9bvnobZ0k[/ame]

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyrWRBoC-2c[/ame]

John