Selecting a Machine tool program final project.....

[machinistTim]

I am in the final semester of the Machine Tool Program at Northeast State Community College in NE Tennessee. This semester we, as a class, have to select a project that is complex to produce multiple copies (1 per person plus 2 extras) in a production setting. Our shop has both CNC and manual machines as well as MasterCam.

Today was the classes first meeting and after some online searching, we were taken with Pneumatic Engines, particularly radial ones. The videos we found were interesting but prints are difficult to find. Naturally I have questions and this seemed to be the obvious place to come for help. By the end of our next class we have to have our project selected.

Given our machines and equipment :
1. What pneumatic radial engine blueprints would you recommend?
2. If there are no reasonable radial engine blueprints what other engine prints would you suggest?
3. What materials do you prefer to use in Pneumatic engine?
4. What questions have I failed to ask?

Thanks very much in advance. I look forward to the responces and, hopefully, to posting our progress on this project.

Tim

 

[kvom]

Here's a 2-cylinder "CO2" engine http://www.john-tom.com/MyPlans/SteamPlans3/DavidKerzelCO2/TwinKerzelCo2.pdf

 

[machinistTim]

Thank you very much kvom! That's a cool one. Did you have to do any tuning on the engine to get it to work?

I believe our instructor will want us to do something larger but I will bring these prints in.

 

[Wizard69]

Well hopefully my iPad app doesn't crash this time.

The one issue I have with the radial engine is complexity and the ability to complete it in the allocated time. Since I don't know all the parameter here I would examine this closely. Having no engines under my belt I can't offer suggestions on specific radials.

Alternative would be twins and single cylinder engines. Also don't discount diesels and two strokes though the fuels systems are a lot of extra work.

You might have already considered tools which is always a good investment. The so called "screwless vise" is one very useful tool for a machinist. However there are some other ideas along this line, for Eample:
* a drill press / tapping stand similar to G. Thomas. Since you have a full blown machine shop the design can be altered as needed and if time is an issue the drill press function can be dropped. If you have enough time and enough members in the class you could end up with a fairly complete kit with most of the accessories. Since this is a kit the manufacture of a case can be part of the project.
* trammel and other layout tools. Again the idea would be to make a complete kit.
* gage stands.
* boring heads.

You might want to look up the Metal Lathe Accessories web site for ideas. They have an interesting diesel project.

As far as compressed air engines there are a few in the books targeting the Model Engineer market. Unfortunately I can't tell you which ones right now. It might be worth talking to Village Press. Like wise search the model engineering magazine web sites for articles that have air or steam powered engines as the subject matter. For that matter you might find other projects of interest. There are plans out there so look around.

Hopefully you will get plenty of advise, there are amny options just in steam or air engines.

 

[machinistTim]

Thanks wizzard!
As far as tools go we should be good to go. I didn't mention it my original post but we have pretty much any tool/machine we could want. Surface and cylindrical grinders, EDM, presses, oven so on.

An internal combustion engine is a no go for the school. You know how it goes with the hazmat/combustibles storage. We got shot down quickly with the gas engine plans we had.

 

[kvom]

Thank you very much kvom! That's a cool one. Did you have to do any tuning on the engine to get it to work?

I believe our instructor will want us to do something larger but I will bring these prints in.

I tried to make this at 3x scale, but found that the physics didn't work, so my big engine didn't ever run.

My CNC class team project, similar to yours, was to make 20 Kerzel flame eaters. The benefit of this type of engine is that you don't need compressed air to run them. The school wanted them to give/show to high schools as recuitment tools.

 

[machinistTim]

I really like the project, hopefully my instructor will allow us to make more of them instead of insisting on a different larger one.

 

[Wizard69]

Thanks wizzard!

As far as tools go we should be good to go. I didn't mention it my original post but we have pretty much any tool/machine we could want. Surface and cylindrical grinders, EDM, presses, oven so on.

Sounds like anything is possible given the time. Time is my biggest concern thus keeping an eye on simpler projects.

An internal combustion engine is a no go for the school. You know how it goes with the hazmat/combustibles storage. We got shot down quickly with the gas engine plans we had.

Well that sucks! I'm not sure how that comes into play though unless you have to prove that the motor works. There is nothing wrong with steam / air engines though, it just limits your options as far as free plans go

 

[machinistTim]

Yeah it does suck we can't make an internal combustion engine. I reckon I can understand the policy though. I've seen a few knuckle head studens since I've been in the program. Those individuals have washed out of my class but it would only take one to be an issue.

 

[Wizard69]

Yeah it does suck we can't make an internal combustion engine. I reckon I can understand the policy though. I've seen a few knuckle head studens since I've been in the program. Those individuals have washed out of my class but it would only take one to be an issue.

That I understand, knuckle heads are everywhere. The thing is from the schools standpoint is it really needed to run them in the school? I guess this means revolvers, shotguns and rifles are out of the question! 😉

I guess the real question here though is how much time do you have for this project, is it weeks or months? I suspect if we are realistic you don't have an excess of time with all the other activities in the program, maybe 40 hours per person. This is why I leaned towards easier motor designs as it would avoid a string of sleepless nights trying to get the project done.

Other ideas that have come to mind:

* Build a model train car. Make it a tanker or box car and paint or engrave the classes graduation date on the tank. Like an engine it would be something the students could take with them throughout life. In some ways though this is just as involved as making an engine. This like the engine would be for display.

* I still like the idea of building tools, especially tools that will last and be useful in your career. A couple of suggestions here would be a rotary table, an collet indexer, drill sharpening fixtures and whatever you can dream up.

 

[machinistTim]

We have our class on once a week for 5 hours a day and have available "open shop" time as well. Total available class time is about 70 hours not counting extra time.

Needless to say we prefer to get them all working but we are only required to build all of them and get one to work.

Firearms are most definitely not allowed. Lol They wouldn't even let us select a pocket knife as a project.

 

[kvom]

How many people on the team? The flame eater project we did divided the class into 3 subteams, two for CNC mill and one for CNC lathe. We did all the parts CNC as it was a CNC project class. Each subteam did its own CAD and CAM.

 

[machinistTim]

We only have 5 students in the class

 

[Tin Falcon]

Tim
We do have radial plans here :
http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/downloads/files/PottyThreeCylinder.pdf
IIRC there was a college student a while back that made one for a class project. These plans are metric but cnc does not care is only a number and a soft switch.

You may want to look here:.
Did you see this thread? this could be an option.
Mod the design a bit to make it your own stretch the stoke a bit for more power. Add acouple vericle suppors make the suport table bigger.
University of Maine's BSMET Steam Engine

Also lots here to look at.
http://www.john-tom.com/html/SteamPlans.html
Good luck with the project keep us posted.
Tin

 

[Tin Falcon]

What materials do you prefer to use in Pneumatic engine?

the radial engine plans I posted the link to has a bill of material that should work fine. you may want to read here as well.


http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/f27/selecting-first-engine-build-15183/

Tin

 

[barnesrickw]

I wish I would have taken these types of classes.

 

[machinistTim]

This Machine Tool program has been fantastic. By no means does it make you a master machinist but, if you apply yourself, you will become more than competent enough to start working in the field.

 

[Tin Falcon]

Tim
I was trained by the US Air Force as a machinist welder. We learned the basics of welding and machining.
IIRC Block 1 60 hours Math, shop safety , AFOSH, blue print reading . Sketching etc. . Block 2 using vertical and horizontal band saw hand tapping stuck fastener removal drill press drill theory and sharpening. Block 3 80 hours lathe . Block 4 40 hours milling machine. . Block 5 Oxyacetylene welding and cutting block 6 Arc welding and finaly 7-8 tig welding. 12 week course 28 college credits. I ended up with a 2 year degree out of it.
I like the fact you guys are expected to work as a team and make 7 copies of the same engine. It will teach you about real world machining.


BTW do you like the radial plans ??


We have done team builds here takes planning but they are fun when well executed.
Tin

 

[machinistTim]

Wow Tin, you got some good and valuable training while you were in the Air Force. I was a Marine but I just had to do all the "cool guy" things and spent all my time cold wet and knee deep in mud or running around in the desert playing hide and seek. As such I had no marketable skills when I got out.

I love the radial plans! I hope those are the ones that win the vote. Unless the other students have changed their mind I'd say they will.

The whole focus of this final class, "Machine Tool and Die", is to get the students ready for the production setting. The three previous semesters have been getting to know the machines, processes and materials. Though it was along time ago I had drafting in high school so that had been quite helful.

 

[Tin Falcon]

As such I had no marketable skills when I got out.

I tell young people every chance I get if you go in the military sigh up for something you can use on the outside. My son did not listen well. long story . He is doing ok working along side of me and learning from the school of hard knocks. I actually went through 4 military Tech schools and have 2 CCAF AS degrees and most of 2 Year community college engineering degree. Only took 24 years to do it. LOL.

I love the radial plans! I hope those are the ones that win the vote. Unless the other students have changed their mind I'd say they will.

Glad you like them . Hope they work out for you and the team . CNC should make light work of the many cylinders and pistons.
Tin