learning cad

[canadianhorsepower]

this links give you access to a FULL FREE CAD 2D
enjoy
http://www.emachineshop.com/

 

[johnmcc69]

I agree with Brian. If you haven't used CAD before, start with 2D. This will be VERY beneficial when you move to 3D.
In 3D modeling, the first thing created is the 2D sketch & is the basis of the 3D geometry. If you have a sloppy 2D
Sketch (unconstrained, bad dimensioning scheme..) this "simple" 2D sketch can create many problems further
down the road in your model. (You might have to change a Dim in that sketch & it may not give you the results
You want)

John

 

[Brian Rupnow]

This is the link for free Draftsight 2D software.---Brian
http://www.3ds.com/products/draftsight/download-draftsight

 

[Chriske]

I agree with Brian. If you haven't used CAD before, start with 2D. This will be VERY beneficial when you move to 3D.
In 3D modeling, the first thing created is the 2D sketch & is the basis of the 3D geometry. If you have a sloppy 2D
Sketch (unconstrained, bad dimensioning scheme..) this "simple" 2D sketch can create many problems further
down the road in your model. (You might have to change a Dim in that sketch & it may not give you the results
You want)

John

I must disagree on this one John.
I started my 'drawing career' learning AutoCAD 12 (2D) For me it was a never ending learning process..! . I was not busy drawing a part on my computer, no I was busy drawing lines on a screen. I got nuts drawing lines...!
Until someone proposed to try Inventor 7. Starting Inventor 7 was kind of a revelation. After a few minutes I had opened the program I drew my first 3D parts. There were a gazillion fewer conventions to work with the program compared with AutoCAD, Inventor is easy to learn, intuitive.
The most important issue about Inventor (and other 3D software) : while drawing 3D parts, your 2D drawings are automatically generated out of that 3D part....!
Putting these 2D drawings 'on paper' takes you literal a few seconds. You click and there is your front view, click again and you have an additional view, left, right, upper, you name it, only seconds to do that. Add some figures to the drawings and your done.

And of course larger companies still use 2D software. They have a long life licenses (and support) to deal with. Not one new company will invest in 2D software anymore.

 

[aonemarine]

How about posting drawings of what you have done then let him decide what he really wants? Honestly you wind up starting your drawing in 2d with any cad program, then just extrude it. so you are learning 2d cad as well. But the end result is way cooler LOL

 

[Woodster]

Solid Works, just using tutorials that come with it.

 

[aonemarine]

Nice woodster!!

 

[cncjunior]

Having read all the posts and seeing that each person has their own preference based on need and use, I myself use solidworks for manual machining projects. I would use Mastercam for CNC machining/turning. One thing to note Mastercam imports solidworks models. I find Solidworks easier to draw with than Mastecam. A bit of background here. I learned AutoCad back in 88 and still use it for quick layout work of say machinery in a building. I took a Solidworks training program and I find that it is much easier to use than Autocad due to it's use of solids. Mastercam was part of the CNC training program I took at a technical institute.

As said above, each has there areas that they shine and other areas that need more polishing. In the training at the technical institute there was a gentleman that had no experience in any drawing program and he had a hard time keeping up with the rest of us who had drawing experience in other programs. He got it for sure after some frustrating times. My main point here is that pick a program to start on and learn it. With that experience you will be able to move into another program and not have such a steep learning curve and with a few under your belt it gets easier.

In the machining industry, Solidworks is the main program that is used. In fact, some companies won't deal with those that submit drawing packages in Autocad or other 2D programs.

If you can find someone in your area that is willing to spend a few hours with you on a particular program then that will quicken the learning curve. As others have also said, there are tutorials on some of the programs. If these tutorials are available they are a great tool to get an introduction and get into more detailed techniques.

Daniel

 

[Dave Sohlstrom]

I do not under stand why folks even suggest Solidworks. They are talking about a program that costs several thousand dollars and the maintenance is in the thousands.
Same with Gibbs Cam, Master Cam X5 or X6 13,000 per seat for each.

There are very few HSM that can afford those programs so why even suggest them.

There are a couple of good free 2D programs. Draftsight and Solid Edge.

If you want to do 3D CAD parts and assemblies I think that Alibre is the best for your $$. Personal Edition $199.00 and they will give you 30 day trial.

If you discover that you can make some money from you 3D CAD work you can upgrade to Pro or Expert and still not spend what you would for maintenance in solid works

Next you want to do some CNC machine work on that mini mill you converted to CNC get a copy of CAMBAM. I think it runs around $150 and will handle 2.5D and 3D CNC machining. Will it do 5 axis NO

If you are having trouble with the learning curve ask for help on the forums. Ask if some one with Skype could do a screen share with you and help you through your rough spot.

Dave

 

[jixxerbill]

I really do appreciate everyones replys, but after wasting 2 hours of Dave Sohlstrom's life last night he has me on track with alibre.. Im drawing up plans and printing them out, nothing to detailed mind you. More detailed drawings will come with practice me hopes lol...Thanks everyone..And mostly you dave !! Thanks a bunch...Bill

 

[TorontoBuilder]

I must disagree on this one John.
I started my 'drawing career' learning AutoCAD 12 (2D) For me it was a never ending learning process..! . I was not busy drawing a part on my computer, no I was busy drawing lines on a screen. I got nuts drawing lines...!
Until someone proposed to try Inventor 7. Starting Inventor 7 was kind of a revelation. After a few minutes I had opened the program I drew my first 3D parts. There were a gazillion fewer conventions to work with the program compared with AutoCAD, Inventor is easy to learn, intuitive.
The most important issue about Inventor (and other 3D software) : while drawing 3D parts, your 2D drawings are automatically generated out of that 3D part....!
Putting these 2D drawings 'on paper' takes you literal a few seconds. You click and there is your front view, click again and you have an additional view, left, right, upper, you name it, only seconds to do that. Add some figures to the drawings and your done.

And of course larger companies still use 2D software. They have a long life licenses (and support) to deal with. Not one new company will invest in 2D software anymore.

I would disagree with you chriske, or rather say that there are 2D drawing programs other than AutoCad, and I recommend that people first learn the fundamentals on one of the free 2D packages before moving on to 3D.

Too bad programs have becoming massively complex since the good old days.
I have used literally dozens of CAD programs, and in my mind nothing beat the DOS version of AutoSketch 2.0 from Autodesk for pure speed and ease of use to make simple engineering drawings.

Complexity and user friendliness was all downhill from there... and I followed along with many AutoCAD releases to finally settle into AutoCAD LT 2007. Of course, AutoSketch was seriously limited on the output device side of things... imagine no PDF output.

That being said, I can complete design houses in AutoCAD and troubleshoot designs easily... the same with engineering drawings, so have a good foundation for 3D design once I settle into a program that fits my preferences... and budget. I have no desire to use a 3D platform for work.

I'd recommend someone first tinker with a simplistic 2D drawing program for the free trial period, there are plenty. Delta Cad comes to mind.

 

[canadianhorsepower]

Complexity and user friendliness was all downhill from there... and I followed along with many AutoCAD releases to finally settle into AutoCAD LT 2007. Of course, AutoSketch was seriously limited on the output device side of things... imagine no PDF output.

cant agree with you more AutoCAD LT2007 was users freindly, since then it's a hide and seek where they hide the ICON

 

[Chriske]

How about posting drawings of what you have done then let him decide what he really wants? Honestly you wind up starting your drawing in 2d with any cad program, then just extrude it. so you are learning 2d cad as well. But the end result is way cooler LOL

ok ...ok...I know...this is not correct because this is all drawn in Inventor, but I show it anyway...

One of this years project, drawing not finished yet.
Age of my guys building and drawing this project : 15 years old. To have an idea, height of the drill-press about 6" . This little 'workshop' will be driven by one Stirling engine built by older pupils. This Stirling engine is already up and running(not shown in the drawing)

This older project is a rather large one. All students in our school helped building this 'Project train'. It took us 5 long days to set this up for our 'Open door'. To have an idea of the dimension of this project : length : 13 meter width : 9 meter (it's about the same in yard)

Every single part you see in this drawing has been drawn by our students. I can assure you this is a huge undertaking...! But lots of fun to.

And This is how it looks like in real .

Sorry again aonemarine...

Chris

 

[Dave Sohlstrom]

You ask for examples. Here is an assembly of parts in Alibre. If you grab ahold of the shaft and rotate it the piston will move in the cylinder and the valve will cover and uncover steam ports. You can check for interference and correct travel.

It would take a lot more work to do this in 2D.

Once you have every thing worked out Alibre lets you take each part and do a 2D drawing of it with the standard views you need.
These drawings can be dimensioned and printed so you can take a drawing to the shop to make the parts.

Dave

 

[littlelocos]

Hello Bill,
Sounds like Alibre is working out for you. That is great. Enjoy.

Just for the sake of completeness. Turbocad also has free trials, forums, etc. (http://forums.turbocad.com/). The gallery of other people's work is quite impressive. There is a 2-1/2D CAM plug in available for $199.

It is somewhat cumbersome, but it's a full-blown CAD package and I am fully invested. BION, I purchased the print manual for the first time in about 5 years. It reads like a phone book - 2" thick and 8-1/2 x 11. Like I said, I really enjoy using it. My only wish is that once rendered, it would animate like Alibre does.

You and others might enjoy a few renderings from my 'board' as well.

If you (or anyone else here) decide to go the TurboCAD route and need some assistance, let me know. I am glad to help.

Have fun,
Todd.

 

[Brian Rupnow]

Yes, the 3D cad shurely does make them pretty. But, as I said, every part in the model started with a 2D dimensioned sketch. Given that there are some really great free 2D packages, and NO free 3D packages, I still recommend starting with 2D. Find your way around in it, then move to 3D if you want to make pretty models. Just remember---No matter how pretty and impressive the 3D models are, its still 2D drawings that get issued to the shop floor for machinists to work from, and its still mainly 2D .dxf files that go to the shop for cnc programming. For many people who are hobby machinists, thats enough.---Brian

 

[wildun]

It all depends on whether you want to learn CAD in order to do some actual working drawings, or works of art to impress everyone and I'm not talking about any of you guys - I like to see that sort of stuff too! but I'm trying to say that if you are designing and building a project that you only need to satisfy yourself as to how much detail you will need in order to get the job done.
Not of course begrudging anyone having the higher end programs you understand! but with the really great ones, doing really great drawings and renderings often becomes the main focus and the actual engineering often gets shelved!

Sure you can have Solid Works and be a master of graphics (all at great cost), or you can be a practical engineer in your little shed actually desigining and making stuff, in which case you can download a trial version of DESIGN CAD which is perfectly adequate for doing a real job - They (Design Cad) will give you the full version for $80 (or $100 if you didn't download the trial from the IMSI site) when its time has expired, this is for Version 22 with 3D. - that's also much cheaper than Turbocad.

You don't need to be a master draughtsman (draftsman to Americans )in order to design your own engineering project.
This one is quite easy, - every cad program has a steep learning curve of course, but just have patience and it'll all come to you! -like riding a bicycle it will always stay with you - Check it out!

 

[dman]

Yes, the 3D cad shurely does make them pretty. But, as I said, every part in the model started with a 2D dimensioned sketch. Given that there are some really great free 2D packages, and NO free 3D packages, I still recommend starting with 2D. Find your way around in it, then move to 3D if you want to make pretty models. Just remember---No matter how pretty and impressive the 3D models are, its still 2D drawings that get issued to the shop floor for machinists to work from, and its still mainly 2D .dxf files that go to the shop for cnc programming. For many people who are hobby machinists, thats enough.---Brian

freeCAD is 3d and runs on any os. not to mention the whole program is free, not just a trial... gotta love the gnu licence, not that you could really live without proprietary stuff.... but there are areas where open source shines and without it to compete with the evils of micrsoft we'd all be using internet explorer to chat here ewww.....

 

[kf2qd]

I really do appreciate everyones replys, but after wasting 2 hours of Dave Sohlstrom's life last night he has me on track with alibre.. Im drawing up plans and printing them out, nothing to detailed mind you. More detailed drawings will come with practice me hopes lol...Thanks everyone..And mostly you dave !! Thanks a bunch...Bill

Doesn't sound like it was wasted time. Just gives you an idea of what the learning curve is like. Now that you've started, the climb gets a whole lot less steep. It still continues for a ways, but you got a boost up on the initial slope.

 

[littlelocos]

It all depends on whether you want to learn CAD in order to do some actual working drawings, or works of art to impress everyone and I'm not talking about any of you guys - I like to see that sort of stuff too! but I'm trying to say that if you are designing and building a project that you only need to satisfy yourself as to how much detail you will need in order to get the job done.
Not of course begrudging anyone having the higher end programs you understand! but with the really great ones, doing really great drawings and renderings often becomes the main focus and the actual engineering often gets shelved!

Sure you can have Solid Works and be a master of graphics (all at great cost), or you can be a practical engineer in your little shed actually desigining and making stuff, in which case you can download a trial version of DESIGN CAD which is perfectly adequate for doing a real job - They (Design Cad) will give you the full version for $80 (or $100 if you didn't download the trial from the IMSI site) when its time has expired, this is for Version 22 with 3D. - that's also much cheaper than Turbocad.

You don't need to be a master draughtsman (draftsman to Americans )in order to design your own engineering project.
This one is quite easy, - every cad program has a steep learning curve of course, but just have patience and it'll all come to you! -like riding a bicycle it will always stay with you - Check it out!

Wow!
a) I agree that if someone is just getting started in CAD, that the simpler the package and the closer to their needs, the better. That would be great for a free to $100 package and is pretty-easily affordable. Good suggestion.

(For reference, by now, I've got thousands of dollars and thousands of hours invested in TurboCAD. I wouldn't expect too many hobbiests to want to make that kind of investment in CAD, regardless of what package they are using.)

b) Pretty renders ARE nice. For me a 3D render functions as a visualization tool during design, then as a sales tool for when I publish the drawings. Since most of the folks that purchase these have not been formally trained in reading engineering drawings, the 3D wireframes for each part are a big help.

c) What ever happened to drafting as an art? I am much more inspired by a 100yo line-shaded etching than a machine-generated "working" drawing spit out by an automatic dimensioning routine. A good working drawing should clearly convey the engineer's vision and guide the machinist to work logically and minimize errors in the shop.

d) I design for myself first, so that I can enjoy time in my little shop making chips with my manually-operated machines. BTW, each of the renders above represents a different project of mine, designed to be machined from solid (except for the P/W which will be cast) with the equipment I have (10" Atlas, Grizzly Mill-Drill, Unimat, 15" Sebastian Gold Seal)

This render is a little more solid: [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyelFqb7HW0[/ame] Enjoy.

OK, the old engineer steps down from his soapbox.
Let's make some chips,
Todd.