If your budget was $1000 bucks and you wanted to build small engines.....

[Nickademusss]

If your budget was $1000 bucks and you wanted to build small engines, 7" flywheels and smaller. Steam/air at first from castings then plans.

What would be the best lathe/tool set combo ?

THis is a starting budget, more later as long as gas stays below 5 bucks a gallon.


I know that the budget could net me a very large older lathe from a defunct factory, but I only have one room to donate to the work...

I find that my other hobbies could greatly benefit from having the means to to build my own parts.

 

[n4zou]

This machine is a little over your budget but it's about as close as you could get when buying new.

http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=328-1308&PMPXNO=25221737&PARTPG=INLMK3

It's compact taking up little space. You can take it with you if you had to move to a new job. I've owned one of these machines and they are capable of making precision parts IF you don't mind the time required to set up each operation. These machines are easy to sell if/when you upgrade to larger machines. After I purchased my lathe and mill I sold mine the day it ran in the newspaper classifieds. The newspapers were delivered early in the morning and it was sold and picked up by 8:00 AM. A couple of weeks later I was kicking myself for selling it.

 

[TroyO]

Heh, shopping with someone else's money.. whooohooo! ;-)

Hmm, lathe only? I would probably go for this machine:

http://www.harborfreight.com/8-inch-x-12-inch-precision-benchtop-lathe-44859.html

If you can get it on sale and use a %20 coupon you could probably get it for $640 but just in case we'll go with the full hit of full price and the %20 off... $800. The coupons are everywhere so it's silly not to use them. (I got this lathe on sale and with %20 coupon for $384 before Harbor Freight figured out how good a machine it is. It says something that I can still recommend it as a good deal at $800.)

$1000 - $800 = $200
Only 2 bill left... but we are going to ignore taxes and shipping, right? :big:

HF will also sell you a 4 jaw chuck and a faceplate. Give them the model number of the lathe.
ITEM# 12334 (125mm / 5") four jaw independent chuck $58.50 USD
Get the faceplate from HF while you are at it for $13

(Also available from HF is:
Follow Rest $17
Steady Rest $18)

$200 - 71.50 = $128.50

OK, the toolpost on that lathe holds 4 bits at once and is quite effective, so get a pile of HSS 1/2" tool blanks (I think, double check the specs) call it... $40 for 8.

http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=383-5332&PMPXNO=941028&PARTPG=INLMK32

$88.50 left....

Cutting fluid, a white grinding wheel (I'm pretending you have a bench grinder.) and if you can sneak it in a 1/2 inch cutoff blade holder that fits the toolpost will eat that up OK.

There ya go.... 1K and quite a versatile lathe setup. You can turn stock, offset stock to make cams and such, do precision centering in the 4 jaw, square and face stock to accurate sizes... all kinds of stuff.

Just my (not so) humble opionion. :bow: :big: :bow:

 

[machinerguy]

Size matters. You can have a pretty nice desktop setup for 1k with sights on CNC. Anything bigger, a used American lathe will serve you WAY better than a new cheapo import.

 

[b.lindsey]

Nick,
Somewhere in all of that you will still need milling capability. That can be done on a lathe with some additional tooling like a milling column for the cross slide but IMHO nothing beats a separate lathe and mill. I am not really a combination 3 in 1 guy either though I have seen some nice work done on them. I might suggest finding one of the build logs here that closely matches the type of project or engine you are interested in and look through the log at the pictures and various setups. Compare the use of lathe work vs. mill work, various setups, aditional tooling used, etc. Unfortunately, $1000 doesn't go as far as it used to. I say that not to discourage you at all...we all start with nothing unless we happen to have gotten something from family or friends. Its always necessary to prioritize until additional funds are available. The point is to look at what you want to do...make a list of what its going to take to do it, and then you are in a better position to prioritize what you buy and when. Just my 2 cents

Bill

 

[n4zou]

Nick,
Somewhere in all of that you will still need milling capability.

Many people that put down the 3 in 1 machines have never owned or used one. Sure; they are a pain in the ass to set up but not as bad as having no milling capability at all. A milling attachment on a lathe is a bigger pain in the ass than a 3 in 1 machine. Another thing most people miss is the ability to bolt a spindle and motor on the 3 in 1's vise table and add an indexing system to the lathe spindle. You just turned that 3 in 1 into the best rotary table you could ever imagine having.

 

[ShopShoe]

Nickademusss,

My two cents worth:

Don't spend $1000 on startup all at once. Follow b. lindsey's advice and read what people are doing here and on other forums. Decide to start somewhere and realize that you can't make a decision without living with the work for awhile. You will need more money than you think for tooling and accessories. If you don't have measuring and layout instruments and supplies you will need them and they need to be accurate enough for your ability. Work on a project or to enhance your other hobbies. Practice on good and bad materials. Purchase of known materials is valuable but will add to your expenditures.


In my first year I spent more than the cost of my lathe on learning, tooling, materials, and accessories. At the end of a year I knew what my next purchase priorities would be and I had a plan based on my abilities and budget.

 

[TroyO]

I had assumed he was looking just at the lathe part of the equasion at the moment...

What would be the best lathe/tool set combo ?

I would indeed go a different route than I listed if it was more of an overall tooling including the mill setup.

i have always been intrigued by the 3 in 1 machines myself. It does seem to have quite a few advantages, or at least potential advantages if tweaked correctly. (The tradeoff being the setup complications.)

 

[b.lindsey]

Well i was focusing more on the statement "wanting to build small engines."

Bill

 

[purpleknif]

I got a couple of good deals on e-bay. I don't think I spent $1000 on my used 7 x 10 lathe with a lot of extras and a brand new mill from big dog. My mill is slightly heavier than an X-2. What's the tooling budget?

 

[rake60]

Grizzly's G4000 9 X 20 lathe is just under $1000 right now.

That is what I started out with.
The X2 Mini Mill came along about a year later.

I have never owned a 3 in 1 machine, but I have helped several friends set theirs up.
They will fill the need for a lot of light hobby scale machining.
With very light cuts they will do what you would expect from them.
I wouldn't buy one myself because rigidity is marginal in every operation.

Rick

 

[ninefinger]

I have never owned a 3 in 1 machine, but I have helped several friends set theirs up.
They will fill the need for a lot of light hobby scale machining.
With very light cuts they will do what you would expect from them.
I wouldn't buy one myself because rigidity is marginal in every operation.
Rick

I have owned a 3 in 1 and I can definitely say that the rigidity is marginal for milling. Also, depending on what 3 in 1 you get its not just the swapping out of mill setup to lathe that is a royal PITA, its that the mill head is fixed and you only have the quill travel (mine was ~ 4" if I recall right).
So lots of times depending on the tools required your setup is both too short and too long to do 2 operations in the same fixture setup.
Ie picture drilling a bore and using a boring head and also milling some details in the same clamping with a 1/4" endmill. One setup has short tool (1/4" endmill in collet) the other quite long (large drills in a chuck and / or boring head and bar).
The lathe portion of the 3 in 1 does have one pro going for it - really large swing for a given "size" of machine (often 15" or so) but the rigidity is missing - you can't take any heavy cuts so you will spend hours cutting if you need to whittle down some steel for a crankshaft...

My personal path was I bought a 3 in 1. Suffered with it for 6 years and learned alot in the process. I bought a "real" mill (MD001 - RF45 type mill) about 2 years ago and became amazed at what I could actually accomplish (then CNC'd it which is another story). Sold the 3 in 1 and now m waiting for my 12"x36" lathe to show up.

For $1000 get the biggest lathe you can buy - a 9x20 or bigger (ie the one Rick just pointed out or the 10x22 G0602 or the 11x26 G9972Z) - you'll never regret buying a nicer, bigger machine. Put away a little money each month (or every week even) till you can afford what you really want.

Mike

 

[hopeless]

I bought the G0602 (Aussie version CQ6125x550) via ebay from a nearby seller for A$1250 2 years ago and am very happy with it. Worth saving a bit longer for this 1 ;D. prior to this I had the 7x20 but it had limitations mainly spindle bore size. Also tooling will cost unless you go for HSS which I did. I learnt to shape them to suit the job in hand and also have a tangental tool (a present from my boy for birthday a couple years ago) and give that a good run as well. before I got my mill (RF 30 clone) I used to mill what I could on the lathe so a mill can be a later buy. I reckon you can't go past this model for what you want to do and it will allow you to do bigger staff when the neighbours find out you have a lathe :big:
Cheers
Pete

 

[Nickademusss]

Thanks so much !!!! everyone for your calculations and recommendations!!

I am selling off some other hobby stuff and may have just a little bit more to add to my budget, But I think I will follow the plan of getting the lathe first then a mill/ mill attachment....4 jaw chuck will be a necessity....

:bow: :bow: :bow:

 

[rake60]

The Grizzly G4000 comes with a 4 jaw chuck.
That's why I bought the Grizzly over Harbor Freights offering of the same machine.

The 4 jaw chuck that Grizzly includes with their lathe is terrible as a chuck and it
isn't heavy enough to be a boat anchor.
It pretty much a waste of cast iron and freight weight.

I do use it but a better 4 jaw is on my wish list.

Rick

 

[machinerguy]

Doesn't a pair of Sherlines hit a grand?
Lathe first. Get to know tour faceplate & 4jaw, you'll impress yourself. Attatchments compromise rigidity.
You can build some first rate engines on a lathe & drill press as long as you stick to basic engine designs. Multi-bank radials cost more.
Needed a 4-jaw. $400 USA/UK or $50 (#!^@ ? Well, that import needed alittle work.

 

[Gordon]

My dad and my uncle both did some pretty impressive things on an old used Atlas lathe and a cross slide table on a drill press. They both built Olds and Associated engine kits sold by Breisch. Things were slow and careful but in the end they ended up with some pretty impressive work.

 

[Tin Falcon]

well what do you want and how patient are you. If you happen to be at the right place at the right time mini lathes and mini mill have sols for as little as $200 -250 each . if I knew when and where I would go buy the machines and not tell anyone about the when ad where.
that being said I started basically in your shoes about 15 years ago . before I was on the internet and before web forums like this one. I wanted to start by making pen and pencil sets and later be able to make steam engines. The first lathe I looked at was the US made taig they are nice little machines . I also looked at the Sherline lathe. I had some formal training and knew what features a lathe had. I needed small and cheap/. in my view threading capability was a must.
I ended up with a grizzly 7x closeout my first machine. A short time later I purchased a grizzly 9" table top band saw and combo sander 6in wide belt and a 9" disk. Probably made a couple hundred pen and pencil sets over time. pretty much paid for the machines. in 2001 I added a x-2 mill. ......
I have added many tools since but I still have and use the originals.
Tin

 

[Nickademusss]

What do you guys think of the Unimat db-200 as a small working lathe/mill for small projects?

My dad has upgraded to a larger lathe, I may buy is unitmat, its in great shape and has all the attachments...Also 3 and 4 jaw chuck

 

[Tin Falcon]

the unimat is a nice little late. the river queen engine Plans on John tom are designed for a a build on the unimat.
Tin