Horizontal Mill Engine From Kit

[arnoldb]

Zee, you don't drivel! You "think out loud", ask for opinions, and then work from that. That is highly commendable!
And THANK YOU for taking us along for the ride!!! :bow:

So maybe some are ready to play before I am. That's okay.

Just enjoy the "play" time, and the rest will sort itself out
Regards, Arnold









Here's one from me !
And PS: CC and kvom posted while I was thinking :big:

 

[Foozer]

And THANK YOU for taking us along for the ride!!!

Are we there yet? Are we there yet? Are we there yet? Are we there yet?

 

[vlmarshall]

Zee, you don't drivel ! You "think out loud", ask for opinions, and then work from that. That is highly commendable!
And THANK YOU for taking us along for the ride!!! Just enjoy the "play" time, and the rest will sort itself out.

Quoted for truth. Well said.


Keep it up, Zeep! :bow:

 

[zeeprogrammer]

I had a post but somehow it didn't take. Maybe forgot to press 'post'. Too bad. It was the best reply I've ever made and now no one can enjoy it.

Got my 5C collets today! And a spin indexer as suggested by the 'instructions'. Well let's just not say anymore about that. ;D

I'm thinking though that people are talking about using the 5C in the lathe. I did a quick look on the net. I'd need an adaptor, a backplate, and a stop. The adaptor alone seems to be $200. I'm wondering if the backplate that came with my 4-jaw will do. In any case I'll wait and see how wife reacts when she returns Monday and sees I haven't done the weeding and cleaning.

Keep on eye on this thread next week. There may be a sale of a small lathe and mill and a bunch of tooling - cheap. I have to admit...wife is priority (although I wonder if 'firebird' is still looking for a deal).

Am I right in believing that a 5C collet is a 5C collet? That is, that thread, length, etc. will be the same. Or put another way...the 5C for the spin indexer can be used in the lathe?

kvom: I measured them and you're right. I'd have to turn the disc down a bit.

CC: Well as you can see...I doubt I'll be much help until I figure out the lathe/5C stuff. At least you're on the ladder. I haven't even found it yet. ;D

Arnold: Thanks! And speaking of drivers...see that back-seat driver that followed you?

Robert: I remember what my Dad did when I ask that.

Vernon: At my age it's not easy...but I'll try....oh.

Thanks all....now for another go...

 

[CrewCab]

Spinidex is a good start for the mill ZP ;D .......... you will gain a lot by having a 5c chuck on the lathe though, just by being able to interchange parts.

Have a look at this Thread

Have a fun weekend, weeding and cleaning could be therapeutic, certainly be good for your health come Monday :

CC

 

[two dogs]

Carl,
I got a 5C chuck for my lathe from CDCO. I checked and it's still $139. You'll need an adapter to bolt it on your lathe, but that's only about $30. The chuck is really nice, runs very true. Once you use collets, you'll never want to use a jawed chuck again ;D

Mark

 

[zeeprogrammer]

CC: Great thread you linked! Thanks! That should prove very helpful in the future. That's the very spin index I got.

Weeding and cleaning could be therapeutic huh? Liar. :big: She was in London not too long ago. How much did she pay you?

Mark: Found it. Yeah $60 cheaper. What about the thingie (draw bar?) that tightens up the collet?

Thanks!

 

[zeeprogrammer]

Progress!

1) Made the crankshaft.
2) Added the two 'experiments' from last night to the 'wall of learning'.

Still need to machine the flat and the hole for the pin. Hopefully this weekend unless guilt overcomes me and I actually get to the weeding and cleaning. (Well, it won't be guilt. It'll be fear. Plain, old, refreshing cold fear.)

Still haven't gotten measuring down...it won't matter for the engnie but the shaft is about 0.025 too long.

 

[zeeprogrammer]

Poop.
Could I leave well enough alone? Nope.

Shaft won't go into bearing.

Maybe I should try gardening (weeding) instead.

Ah well...we'll fix it later.

 

[rake60]

Poop.
Could I leave well enough alone? Nope.

Rof}
Zee you made my night with that comment!

It WILL come together.
Just be patient.

Rick

 

[shred]

FWIW, the 'poor mans' collet chuck is one of the 5C collet blocks (square or hex, as appropriate) chucked up in a 4 or 3 jaw chuck. Collet blocks are very handy things in any case.

 

[zeeprogrammer]

Shred,

When looking for 5C collets I came across those collet blocks but I had no idea how they work (specifically how they tighten) or what one does with them.

Your post got me to looking around the forum and the net. They do look handy and I got some my questions answered.

Looks like you insert the collet in the block, attach the ring, use the ring closure to tighten the ring (and collet) then remove the closure? Then you can clamp the thing in a mill or use the vise to hold it.

But I haven't found anything that showed them chucked in a lathe. Does it take a different kind of chuck? On my little system it would seem the collet assembly would be sticking out a few inches.

I'll keep looking but any shortcuts would be appreciated.

 

[kvom]

You are correct about mounting the collet/work in the block.

If you use the ring bolt you just leave it on until done. The ring is tightened with a pin spanner, that costs extra. Blocks come with a cam closer; you screw it on and then use a lever to tighten it. Personally I always use the pin spanner/ring.

You can hold the hex block in a 3 or 6 jaw chuck, and the square block in a 4-jaw. However, the runout will be the same as for the chuck, not the collet.

If you want to mill a 60 or 90 degree angle in round stock, the collet block held in the vise is likely easier and more accurate than the same in the spindex.

Note that you do not want to use a 5C collet on a piece that is more than a few thousandths smaller than the size of the collet.

 

[mklotz]

Shaft won't go into bearing.

You were supposed to test the bearing on the shaft while the latter was still in the lathe. That's why you made the bearing first, n'est-ce pas? Of course, if you'd used drill rod for the shaft ..., but I won't go there.

Now that you have collets, consider collet blocks to be an essential, not optional, buy.
There are just so many things one can do with them when model making.

Before you use your Spindex in anger, spend some time convincing yourself that you really understand how the angular vernier works. It's not complicated but I've encountered a number of novices who were confused initially.

If you have the headroom on the mill, adding a base block to the Spindex so it can be clamped in the mill vise is a great idea. Like Bogs, I've done that to mine and the convenience factor ensures that I use it when it's needed rather than attempting some hokey workaround.

 

[zeeprogrammer]

Thanks kvom. That helps a lot. Especially the bit about the spanner. (And the tip about runout.)

You were supposed to test the bearing on the shaft while the latter was still in the lathe. That's why you made the bearing first, n'est-ce pas?

Marv Marv Marv. Yes I knew that (for once...I think) but there was that bit at the end of the shaft that had to be cut off. I had no way (at least the way I did it), to make the tip smaller. Maybe I overcompensated for not having the live center deep enough and went too deep...but I don't think so.

So, once the tip was cut, no more turning allowed since there was (supposed to be) 1.62" sticking out. So down to sanding, which I can still do. I'll watch for taper. (Have that problem anyway as there seems to be about a 0.001 to 0.002 runout along that 1.62".)

Any comment on the idea of rechucking the bearing and reaming with a 0.001 larger reamer? Probably not a good idea huh?

'anger'? No anger here. Pay no attention to that crankshaft sticking out of the wall. Or the flywheel embedded in the ceiling. Means nothing. But I'm thinking you meant 'in earnest'.

Little headroom on the mill. But I should receive the extension kit today or Monday. Probably won't do anything with it for a while.

Thanks Marv.

 

[mklotz]

Ah, you need a zombie (half-dead) center so you can work right out to the tip of the stock.

Turning long (say L/D > 6) shafts without taper is always a dodgy enterprise unless your lathe is perfectly rigid and perfectly adjusted. That's why we try to avoid doing that whenever possible.

You can try enlarging the bearing. This is where a set of over/under reamers comes in handy. Hold the reamer only by the very tip of the shaft in the tailstock chuck. That way it can deflect more easily to follow the existing bearing hole.

I would prefer to fix the shaft however. Filing/sanding to remove the taper and size it to the (presumed parallel) hole in the bearing will make for a better, wobble-free fit in an area where small inaccuracies are fairly obvious in the final product.

"Use in anger" refers to the military interpretation, i.e., used in a situation where the outcome of the use is important - as opposed to use in a practice situation. LEOs often say that they've never shot their sidearm "in anger". Anyway, it has nothing to do with actual rug-chewing anger.

 

[JMI]

Of course, if you'd used drill rod for the shaft ..., but I won't go there.

If it isn't any trouble I'd like to hear your thoughts on the subject.

Thanks

Jim

 

[mklotz]

If it isn't any trouble I'd like to hear your thoughts on the subject.

Go back and read replies 31 through 34 in this thread and you'll understand why I don't want to pursue this.

 

[zeeprogrammer]

Go back and read replies 31 through 34 in this thread and you'll understand why I don't want to pursue this.

That seems in conflict with #34. ???

This isn't 'my' thread. It's for learning.
[EDIT: I mean it's not just for me although I may talk as if it is.]
That's where I went wrong with #32. If I said something that would cause anyone not to contribute any advice, suggestions, ideas, or alternatives...I apologize for that. And if I do it again...remind me of that.

I'm hoping I didn't upset anyone but please don't not answer on my account.
Thanks.

 

[Foozer]

. I'll watch for taper. (Have that problem anyway as there seems to be about a 0.001 to 0.002 runout along that 1.62".)

Bit by the taper bug. Can be an irritant, I try to avoid it by checking the dia of the stock at the extremes as it gets close to size. A little nudge on the tailstock adjustment, another light cut and so on. If I'm lucky I'll get the taper down to 0.001 or less over a few inches. Problem is usually tightening the tailstock hold down moves it more than desired. So we do the "If I had a Hammer" dance.

Can be done, yet in this case "Weeding the Yard" might be more pleasurable.

2nd time around on the similar task is always harder. Your trying to incorporate what you learned from the first go around testing that new found method.

Robert