Good Lathe Deal from Enco

[rake60]

I'll scan and post it tomorrow evening.

I'm still hoping the techs at Enco can give me a quick and easy solution.

Rick

 

[Don1966]

My apology Rick, you have a large motor so you must have a contractor and a heater block. I read a couple more of your write ups. The heater block is now too small and will need replacing if it doe not give you enough range. If you have a control transformer in your circuit it to must be reconnected for 120v. If your motor heats up it is probably connected wrong. The reversing switch on single phase motor may be effected when you reconnect the motor since it is controlling the starting winding also. The starting winding is center taped to the run winding for 220v and paralleled to it for 120v this could cause you problems unless connected properly.

regards Don

 

[rake60]

There are separate contractors for forward and reverse.
The motor will run in either direction if there is absolutely no load on it at start up.

Way back in 1978 I graduated from a vocational/technical school with a certification in electronics.
That ranged from radio and television repair to industrial electronics.

You don't repair radios or televisions any more. Throw it away and buy a new one.
Industrial electronics hasn't really changed that much over the past 30 years where basic electric
motor operation is involved.

I've checked all of the obvious.
I can see a capacitor starting out low and slowly building on the ohmmeter as it should.
But I do not know which one it's reading because this motor has both a start and run capacitor in it.

The only way to tell for sure is to crack the motor open and see which one has the highest uF.
The start capacitor will have a much higher impedance than the run capacitor.

I believe the start capacitor in this motor is supposed to be 150 microfarad at 220 volts.
My experience tells me that should be at least 200MFD at 120 volts, but that's not my call at this point.

I'll wait for Enco's techs to tell me if I'm right.
(And keep the warranty valid on the lathe.)

Rick

 

[Don1966]

My apology again, the start capacitor should be what you are reading since the centrifugal switch makes the run capacitor after it is started. If the start capacitor is ok you should have good torque at start up. If it has no power after it starts the run capacitor is not in the circuit. I agree with you wait for enco to get back with you.

Best Regards Don

 

[Shopguy]

My two bits worth
Way back in 1978 when I bought my Tida lathe (made in Taiwan) I had the same problem out of the crate running it on 110 Vac. Mine came with a cord all ready to plug into the 110 but when I plugged it in I had pretty much the same results that you have experienced. It turned out that hooked up for 220 volts the motor windings,start and run, are in series. For 110 operation they have to be in parallel. Guess which configuration it was? I only have a three button control (forward, reverse and stop) yours appears more complex It took me a while to figure it out. I finally borrowed a book out of the library at the technical institute where I taught.

Keep smiling
Ernie J

 

[Stan]

A comment to cause confusion with all the other previous comments.
It is quite common for the start winding in 120/240 motors to be 120 volts in either configuration. The start winding is tied to the end of the run winding that is either one end in parallel or the junction point in series.

 

[rake60]

I had called Enco Thursday morning at 11:00 AM.
I was told that one of their machinery tech would call me back within 24 hours.
That wasn't happening.

I checked the power in the 208 volt 3 phase plug next the that lathe.
It was showing 118 volts on both legs. That's close enough for me.
I rewired the machine for 220 volt and wired up a 3 phase plug with no neutral.

The motor does exactly the same thing. It a MOTOR problem!

At 1:30 PM Friday one of our managers called Enco again and managed to get a tech on the phone.
This guy suggested our amperage was too low to start the motor, on both the 110 and 208 circuits.

This is in a one year old manufacturing plant not a garage hobby shop.

After I heard all of this I wanted to talk to that tech.
We called Enco back again. They're going to get back to us again.
SOMEDAY ???

I am not impressed with Enco's customer service OR tech support.

That manager from work decided to call Enco back again after he went home and
quite openly expressed his displeasure with handling of this matter.

He called me to say Enco has decided we will have a new motor next Monday
morning at no charge.

I will continue this review, but if you are considering buying the import 12 X 36 lathe,
I would recommend buying it from Grizzly. I know they respond to customer problems.

Rick

 

[Mike N]

Bypass the heater relay & it will work. Thats how I fixed my jet lathe!

These relays are junk!

 

[rake60]

The entire electrical system of these lathes are junk but they can be made to work.

I want to see if Enco will go the distance to see that through.
It isn't looking good at this point.

After the warranty is expired I'll make it work as I think it should.

Rick

 

[rake60]

It took a full week but Enco did come through in the end.

They sent me a new motor at no cost.
Not another import motor but a USA made Baldor.
(Sorry about the sloppy cell phone photos again.)

They did not sent the wiring diagram for the machine with it so that took another
day. I wired it up on the two legs of a 208 volt 3 phase circuit as I had done with
the original motor and it starts and runs great!

Still a couple problems. The Baldor motor is larger than the import motor.
There isn't much room for belt adjustment, maybe 1/4" and the original B-31 belt is
too short. A B-32 worked out perfectly on this machine.

The motor covers the original belt adjustment rod hole, but with this motor weighing
55 pounds, it may not even need it.

It's still a very tight installation.
The cover would not go back on, so we had to cut away an area on the back side
to clear the motor pulley and belt.

Now it's all cleaned up lubricated and ready for some trials.

That may have to wait a couple weeks because we have a production run to work through.
After that is done I'll have time to get back to it.

I can tell you the 3 jaw chuck has a TIR of .0015"
That was a nice surprise!

It was interesting to see it spinning the chuck smoothly at 1550 RPM.
I don't know why you would need that speed on a 12" lathe, but it works fine.

Rick

 

[kvom]

It was interesting to see it spinning the chuck smoothly at 1550 RPM.
I don't know why you would need that speed on a 12" lathe, but it works fine.

My Monarch will spin up to 4000. I haven't had the nerve to go over 2000 though, and that with a collet chuck. ;D

I guess drilling tiny holes it would be useful.

 

[steamer]

Oh I've had my 12" Logan to 2000rpm.....yes it goes there without mods.. ;D

Dave

 

[rake60]

9 X 20 lathes will spin 2000 RPM.

The thin belt is tight in that position so you can't really disengage the drive for
start up. It dims the lights when it starts, but it will go to speed.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvuVW1UvJis[/ame]

I wouldn't try that in reverse. It would probably spin the chuck off.

I have never used that speed for any turning or drilling operation myself.

Rick

 

[steamer]

My Logan has the mechanical variable speed drive...and a 3 phase converter...so it just goes.

Dave

 

[rake60]

It's getting closer to being ready to run.

We ordered THIS PhaseII QCTP from Enco today.
Great sale price on a wedge QCTP and we had a 20% discount code to make it even better.

Then tonight I ordered my own personal tools for it from Shars Tool.
I am not affilated with Shars Tool in any way. They are just a very good supplier of import tools that I can afford.

A set of 5/8" shank turning tools: LINK HERE.
(I know some have had problems with these tools but I have had good luck with them. They are not built for hogging!)

10 inserts with a 1/32" corner radius for those tools: LINK HERE.

And, a couple P-Type cutoff blades to fit the PhaseII holder: LINK HERE.

With the current production demands, I don't know when I'll have time to get all of that stuff set
up and made user friendly.
I hope it's soon!

Rick

 

[sunworksco]

All of this has me thinking of not ever buying Chinese lathes!
I would rather buy US or European makes. :-\

 

[rake60]

I have bought a lot of import tools and equipment from Enco in the past and will
probably continue to do so.

They did drop the ball on this purchase, but they did come through in the end.

Rick

 

[rake60]

I had another chance to use the new lathe today.

When I walked in this morning the molding foreman asked me if I could take .015" off the
bottom face of a press punch. I asked if it was hardened. He said yes.

It turned out to be about 50 Rockwell C."

250 feet per minute at .007" feed, no problem at all!
I was impressed by how well it cut.

Rick

 

[n4zou]

I know how frustrating it must have been after it was delivered with a bad motor. Now look at the bright side because it's got that Baldor motor now when you need it.

 

[rake60]

When I started the lathe up today it was making some unusual noises and
jumping all over the place.

I believe someone tried to change spindle speeds without stopping the chuck.
It took out the outboard bearing on the input shaft and damaged the inboard bearing.

That outer bearing was JUNK new!

I worked for a bearing supply company for 10 years from 1979 until 1989.
I've never seen rollers in a ball bearing break as these have.

Rick