Gingery metal shaper in cast iron?

[moose4621]

I have been keen on making a gingery metal shaper for a while and have been casting aluminium for a few years but I have been reluctant to cast the whole machine in aluminium.
I have recently been gearing up to start casting in iron and the idea of the shaper came up again. Would it be better in cast iron, and is it worth the trouble?
I'd be keen to hear from anyone who has built a shaper in either alluminium or iron and what their thought are.

 

[ddmckee54]

Rick Sparber has a butt-load of info and upgrades that he did to his Gingery shaper. He'd be one of the people I'd contact. Rick's Web Site

 

[Asm109]

If you can cast iron, use it. It is far superior to aluminum in a machine tool. Gingery chose Aluminum because the barrier to entry casting is so much lower.

 

[Richard Hed]

I have been keen on making a gingery metal shaper for a while and have been casting aluminium for a few years but I have been reluctant to cast the whole machine in aluminium.
I have recently been gearing up to start casting in iron and the idea of the shaper came up again. Would it be better in cast iron, and is it worth the trouble?
I'd be keen to hear from anyone who has built a shaper in either alluminium or iron and what their thought are.

I have not made the shaper, but would like to. I wojuld NEVER make it out of aluminum. Maybe a mix of alum and steel but NEVER alum by itself. If I could do casthing Iron I would certainly consider that.

 

[fencer]

The shaper I am making was started by a friend who was an agricultural engineer.He fabricated it from plate and welded it together.The drawings are for a shaper that appears to be bigger than a gingery shaper and although onle 18" high is very heavy and there is more to add.My friend worked a shaper and said it needs to be heavy as they are brutal in operation.
Frank

 

[Richard Hed]

The shaper I am making was started by a friend who was an agricultural engineer.He fabricated it from plate and welded it together.The drawings are for a shaper that appears to be bigger than a gingery shaper and although onle 18" high is very heavy and there is more to add.My friend worked a shaper and said it needs to be heavy as they are brutal in operation.
Frank

Steel plate, presumably? Yes, that's why I would never use aluminum. Aluminum could not lasst very long with the "brutal" work it would be required to do.

 

[moose4621]

My reason for wanting to build a shaper is because I just want one.
Let's face it, for the vast majority of work, a mill will get it done probably easier than a shaper.
I can't think of one job around here, other than internal keyways and splines, that the shaper would be better at doing.
But I still want one!
I can't see myself doing heavy cuts or large parts. Maybe a few V blocks, and the odd plate, and lots of keyways, but anything too heavy for a little shaper can be done on the mill.
So it's not much more than a practical ornament to me.
I think the alloy gingery machine with steel ways would most likely handle the internal keyways and splines, but a cast iron one would be better. Is it worth the extra work though?
If a smallish shaper turned up on marketplace for a reasonable price I would go that way. But they don't seem to be around.
Still undecided.

 

[Richard Hed]

My reason for wanting to build a shaper is because I just want one.
Let's face it, for the vast majority of work, a mill will get it done probably easier than a shaper.
I can't think of one job around here, other than internal keyways and splines, that the shaper would be better at doing.
But I still want one!
I can't see myself doing heavy cuts or large parts. Maybe a few V blocks, and the odd plate, and lots of keyways, but anything too heavy for a little shaper can be done on the mill.
So it's not much more than a practical ornament to me.
I think the alloy gingery machine with steel ways would most likely handle the internal keyways and splines, but a cast iron one would be better. Is it worth the extra work though?
If a smallish shaper turned up on marketplace for a reasonable price I would go that way. But they don't seem to be around.
Still undecided.

Personally, I don't see any need for a REASON to want whatever you want. The only thing I would be concerned about is the space it would take up. If you want to make one, that should be a lot of funs.

 

[awake]

I acquired a 7" South Bend shaper several years ago, and like you I wondered if I would really use it much. The answer is ... I use it a LOT, and now kinda wish I had a 12" shaper to handle those times when this one doesn't have quite enough length or width - though the footprint of a 12" shaper is way larger than a 7".

In general, when I need to flatten out or begin to square up stock, the shaper is my go-to tool. Yes, I could do it faster on the mill with a suitable endmill or my 2" carbide insert head ... but many times, the shaper gives a nicer finish with less stress on the tooling (especially for flattening a long narrow edge) ... and often it is quicker to set up on the shaper than on the mill ... and the tooling for the shaper is so much cheaper ... and I can let the shaper run while I am doing other things.

Here's an example from this past weekend to illustrate my typical use, including when I use the mill instead:

I needed a couple of 1.5" x 4.5" rectangles of 1/4" thick steel. These were destined to be welded on to the bottom of a piece of C-channel to serve as "feet" for a slip roller I am almost finished building. I had some 1/4" sheet that was a little over 4.5" in one dimension; I cut two pieces just over 1.5" wide using the plasma cutter - very fast and fairly smooth, but does leave an edge that needs to be cleaned up - and of course, not quite square. I put the pieces together, face to face, and put tiny tack welds on each side to hold them together for the subsequent operations. I did some initial cleanup on my recently built 2 x 72" belt grinder - how did I ever do without that?! - and then put the stack into the shaper.

The vise on the shaper was already set up to orient the pieces to be shaved lengthwise - if it hadn't been, it would have taken 30 seconds or so to reposition it. I adjusted the stroke length and start position, and set the step to 10 thou - maybe a minute or so to set all of this. Then I turned it on and let it run a couple of passes to give me one clean edge. I flipped the piece over in the vise, tapped it down, and ran a couple more passes to clean up that side. If I had needed the width to be precisely 1.5", I would have measured at this point, and then taken additional passes as needed. This operation is where the shaper really shines, and is arguably superior to the mill - a nice straight cut along the length, rather than a spinning cut that tries to deflect the workpiece to the side.

At this point, the stack is parallel on two sides, but I needed to square off the ends. I *could* used the shaper for this ... but since the little shaper does not have an automatic vertical feed, it would work best to reposition the piece on the side of the table, and that is not a quick and easy setup. Instead, at this point I transferred over to the mill, and quickly squared up the ends and brought it to length. I located the center and used that to locate and drill the mounting holes 1/2" from each end.

A few taps with a cold chisel separated the two pieces, and a little work on the belt grinder cleaned up the burrs. Done! And it almost took less time to do than it did to write this up!

 

[a41capt]

I love my little Atlas Craftsman 7B, and like Andrew said, fast, cheap tooling, and a wonderful finish. Will it replace a vertical mill? Nope, but as an adjunct it can’t be beat. Also, just like Andrew, I can set it and let it run while my mill is being utilized for another task.

John W

 

[patternmaker]

My reason for wanting to build a shaper is because I just want one.
Let's face it, for the vast majority of work, a mill will get it done probably easier than a shaper.
I can't think of one job around here, other than internal keyways and splines, that the shaper would be better at doing.
But I still want one!
I can't see myself doing heavy cuts or large parts. Maybe a few V blocks, and the odd plate, and lots of keyways, but anything too heavy for a little shaper can be done on the mill.
So it's not much more than a practical ornament to me.
I think the alloy gingery machine with steel ways would most likely handle the internal keyways and splines, but a cast iron one would be better. Is it worth the extra work though?
If a smallish shaper turned up on marketplace for a reasonable price I would go that way. But they don't seem to be around.
Still undecided.

I hope I am not out of line here, so at the risk of doing so, I will toot my own horn. I sell a casting kit to make a small shaper. We call it the "arm Strong" as it is hand powered. It is cast iron except for the aluminum handle and link. Check it out at martinmodel.com.

Gary Martin
Martin Model & Pattern

 

[awake]

I hope I am not out of line here, so at the risk of doing so, I will toot my own horn. I sell a casting kit to make a small shaper. We call it the "arm Strong" as it is hand powered. It is cast iron except for the aluminum handle and link. Check it out at martinmodel.com.

Gary Martin
Martin Model & Pattern

Seems appropriate to me!

 

[moose4621]

I hope I am not out of line here, so at the risk of doing so, I will toot my own horn. I sell a casting kit to make a small shaper. We call it the "arm Strong" as it is hand powered. It is cast iron except for the aluminum handle and link. Check it out at martinmodel.com.

Gary Martin
Martin Model & Pattern

Very nice!
It is a tad on the small side but would suit most of the jobs I would have for it.
I am guessing the freight cost to Australia would be at least as much as the casting kit though.
Tempting , all the same.
My first thought was, can I fit a motor to it.

Regards Chris

 

[patternmaker]

Very nice!
It is a tad on the small side but would suit most of the jobs I would have for it.
I am guessing the freight cost to Australia would be at least as much as the casting kit though.
Tempting , all the same.
My first thought was, can I fit a motor to it.

Regards Chris

The castings for the Shaper are $495. Shipping to your side of the world is $285. I have sent a few there. With a little ingenuity, I am sure you can fit a motor to it. Others have.

 

[Richard Hed]

The castings for the Shaper are $495. Shipping to your side of the world is $285. I have sent a few there. With a little ingenuity, I am sure you can fit a motor to it. Others have.

I don't know about Australia, but to the Philippines there are centers all over the country that send "balik bayan" boxes to the phils for about 100$. They put the boxes in a container, the box can be any weight but has to fit in the box, and the container is put on a ship. The ship is then sent to ports in the Phils which will usually take a minimum of 3 months. If hyou are in no hurry, this is economical. BUT, do they ship to Oz?

 

[moose4621]

That's a generous program that the Filipino gov't have on offer. Unfortunately it seems it is only applicable to travel to the Philippines.
https://bernepe.dfa.gov.ph/tourism-and-visa/balik-bayan-programI have a couple of small projects to get through before I launch into a major project like a shaper so I have some time to pitch a story to the minister of war and finance.

 

[tbar]

Hello, made this shaper about 2 years ago, works very well.
made most of the castings .250 or so larger.
Not much of a forum texting guy but do enjoy reading what everybody else has to say.

 

[moose4621]

Thanks for the reply tbar.
Very nice looking Gingery shaper.
How often would you use the shaper, and for what type of work?
Does it cut steel ok?

 

[Richard Hed]

Ah, what you have discovered is a different concept than what I am talking about.; This Balik Bayan that the government does is to attract tourists and theitr $$. Balik Bayan means "returning citizen". But I am talking about a "Balik Bayan BOX" . sorry about that. The box has nothing to do with the government (I thimpfks). It is just a matter of commerce.

One never knows if there is a program like this for other countries. The philippine one is purely invented by some Philippino entrepreneur (pity the French, they have no word for Entrepreneur)

 

[KellisRJ]

Moose, not what you are looking for and I suspect you are already familiar with this Acto shaper, but in case other's are not will post the link: Acto 6 inch hand shaper.

Ron