Looking for a decent mini lathe in EU

[Scott_M]

Hi Laukejas
Welcome to the forum !

While the use of tapered bearings is the way it should be done, are you sure that it is a deal breaker?
With the loads and types of cuts you can take on mini-lathe are they really necesarry? I would not think so. I have a Sherline lathe with standard type bearings, It has never given me any trouble and can do very precise work. But to be honest I never really take any heavy cuts on it. I have 2 other larger lathes for that.
There are many here that do some pretty impressive work on the China mini lathes.

Also think about the future, ( you will want a bigger lathe sooner than you think ) And when you get situated in more shop friendly residence you will probably get one.

Yes I agree that a spindle should have tapered bearings but , I don't think it would be a deal breaker on your first lathe.
The first big lathe I worked on back in the 70's didn't even have ball bearings, it had babbit bearings and was pretty darn accurate.

Just some thoughts

All the best in your search. Please keep us posted on what you decide to get.

Scott

 

[laukejas]

Can you find a Myford ML7 over there.??

Looks like a beautiful machine, but no, no listings nearby, just one in the UK at twice my budget...

 

[laukejas]

Hi Laukejas
Welcome to the forum !

While the use of tapered bearings is the way it should be done, are you sure that it is a deal breaker?
With the loads and types of cuts you can take on mini-lathe are they really necesarry? I would not think so. I have a Sherline lathe with standard type bearings, It has never given me any trouble and can do very precise work. But to be honest I never really take any heavy cuts on it. I have 2 other larger lathes for that.
There are many here that do some pretty impressive work on the China mini lathes.

Also think about the future, ( you will want a bigger lathe sooner than you think ) And when you get situated in more shop friendly residence you will probably get one.

Yes I agree that a spindle should have tapered bearings but , I don't think it would be a deal breaker on your first lathe.
The first big lathe I worked on back in the 70's didn't even have ball bearings, it had babbit bearings and was pretty darn accurate.

Just some thoughts

All the best in your search. Please keep us posted on what you decide to get.

Scott

Thank you, you raise some valid points. However it is very unlikely that I'll ever have the space for anything bigger. Here in Lithuania we are poor AF, space is at a premium, I only have my apartment and a small garage for half a car that is already cramped with other essential tools and machines. No chance of getting any larger space within my lifetime, it's just the reality. Every tool and machine I buy, I have to optimize for space. Like, when I bought a table saw, I had to grind off 5mm from the edge of the table to make it fit into the only possible space. So as far as lathe goes, my apartment is the only place for it, and can't have anything here that I can't readily carry from room to room with my bare hands... Which is why I'm taking this purchase so seriously.

With my previous experiences, it seems that bearings do make a massive difference, almost more than anything else. But I could be wrong, I don't consider myself a pro. Even if you are right, judging from various reviews, there is still a huge difference in quality between all these mini lathes, so I still want to maximize my chances of getting the best bang for the buck... Right now, my primary candidate is Holzmann Ed 300 Eco, which appears to be the same design as HBM 210 vario, with some nice features, like a cover for the leadscrew and more accessible carriage lock nuts, but minus the quick tool change post (will have to buy that separately). No idea about the bearings though, called the local reseller who repair these lathes, and even they didn't know.

 

[SmithDoor]

Yes, thank you, but like I said, I am looking for EU options. None of the US brands/resellers are available here in the EU. I know that Harbor Freight does QA on these Chinese lathes, but that doesn't help the quality of whatever we are getting here.

Harbor Freight and has gears on drive that is noisy.
If look back side photos on some mini lathes have a leaver high and low good chance it has gear noise.
Some will replace with plastic gear then fined out to small and the gear teeth are gone.

Sometimes I look on the repairs and see what was the problems are.

For me a I have a Harbor Freight less than mile from from home. They had lot in stock but gears noise what stop me.

The other is size and weight.
If moving around under 150 pounds. Length is under 30" I put in a 36 cabinet

Dave

 

[SmithDoor]

Yes, thank you, but like I said, I am looking for EU options. None of the US brands/resellers are available here in the EU. I know that Harbor Freight does QA on these Chinese lathes, but that doesn't help the quality of whatever we are getting here.

Here is a Hobby Armoire just give .
There was on a shown mini lathes about 5 years ago but can not fined today. .
If living in apartment or in home without a garage this would .
You find a lot Armoires 36" wide and little work for a good top on some you a hobby Armoire for engines

Dave

 

[SmithDoor]

Looks like a beautiful machine, but no, no listings nearby, just one in the UK at twice my budget...

If look history of manufacturing some engine the equipment they was very little 130 years ago.

When thinking they had a shop full equipment.

1. lathe
2. mill
3. automatic gear cutter
4. drill press
5. planer
6. line boring machine

Now what really had starting out.

1. lathe
2. camle back drill press
3. bench grinder

The lathe had attachments and other

1. gear Dividing/cutting attachment
2. milling attachment
3. tee slots on carriage of lathe for line boring

FYI I had a 3 car garage with space behind the garage Great.

Then moved one car garage now just right for wife's car.
Now I had to adjust to it all.

Dave

 

[laukejas]

Some updates. I found another local reseller that is actually very knowledgeable about the lathes they sell. I was able to find out a lot of useful info, which I'll put here for everyone's reference.

Option 1, Holzmann ED 300 ECO (the one I mentioned several times in this thread) has plain spindle ball bearings after all. Austrian company, but it's still made in China, with some quality control. Priced at 920€ with VAT. Specs:

motor power s1 W 400
motor power s6 W 560
voltage 230V 50Hz
overall dimensions mm 760x230x254
distance between centers mm 300
center height mm 90
max. overhang mm 180
turning speed min-1 50-2500
spindle bore mm 20
spindle bore MK3
tailstock taper MK2
metric thread range mm / r 0.5-2.5
max. tool holder cross-section 8
net weight kg 40
gross weight kg 48

Option 2, Holzmann ED 300 FD - a larger, heavier and higher quality variant. Has tapered roller bearings. Priced at 1186€ with VAT. Specs:

motor power s1 W 450
motor power s6 W 630
voltage 230V 50Hz
overall dimensions mm 740x390x370
distance between centers mm 300
center height mm 90
max. overhang mm 180
turning speed min-1 50-2500
spindle bore mm 21
spindle bore MK3
tailstock taper MK2
metric thread range mm / r 0.5-3
inch thread 8-44
net weight kg 60
gross weight kg 65

Option 3, OPTIMUM TU1503V - an actual German-made lathe, much higher quality, but also significantly smaller and lighter. Also has tapered roller bearings. Priced at 1052€ with VAT. Specs:

Motor 450 W
Power supply 230V
Center height 75 mm
Max. workpiece 150 mm
Center distance 265 mm
Revolutions 120-3000 min-1
Spindle taper MK3
Spindle bore 11 mm
Tailstock taper MK1
Tailstock stroke 30 mm
Metric thread 0.5-1.5 mm/U
Max. tool size max.12 mm
Dimensions 560 x 320 x 290
Weight 23 kg.

All three options have steel gears.

Sorry for different format on specs, I took them from Lithuanian PDFs and put through an auto translator.

So now I'm considering between option 2 and 3. It's a shame that option 2 is much larger than option 1, it would become a real issue keeping and using it at my apartment, otherwise I'd definitely go for option 2. But these 740x390x370 dimensions are just massive. Meanwhile, as far as size goes, option 3 is ideal for my space, even though it's lack of weight is seriously concerning - I will definitely need some kind of concrete block, clamping it to a dining table won't be enough. Also, the tailstock uses Mk1, which is quite unusual, almost all mini lathes use Mk2, so this might present some issues in the future when I want to buy upgrades... Or maybe not. The spindle bore is also tiny compared to option 2. The really appealing thing is that this lathe is not a Sieg descendant, but an independent, German-made high quality machine, at least it is claimed to be so.

What do you guys think?

EDIT: After some more research, it seems that option 3 (OPTIMUM TU1503V) isn't as good as that reseller implied. It is still Chinese, even though better quality that Sieg descendents. But it has lots of poor reviews, has no quick lock for tailstock, no easy access for carriage lock, longitudinal carriage handle is in a very bad position, but worst of all - I have no idea how I missed it - it doesn't have a compound rest. That, coupled with other issues I mentioned (small spindle bore, low weight, weirdly dimensioned tailstock) pretty much disqualifies it. So I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and go with option 2 (Holzmann ED 300 FD), despite it's size. At least it's fully featured, has tapered bearings, and enough weight to be able to expect at least some quality.

EDIT 2: TU1503V has a bigger brother, TU2004V, which is equivalent to Holzmann ED 300 FD in terms of features, no-nonsense build, and probably better quality, but even larger and is around 1600€, which is slightly above my budget. But maybe someone here will have use for it or at least some comments.

EDIT 3: Found a nice comparison of Sieg VS Optimum lathe (the 2004V): . Maybe it is worth it after all...

 

[packrat]

The photo I found , looks like a nice lathe, it did not have a USA price, so cant compare that

 

[SmithDoor]

Some updates. I found another local reseller that is actually very knowledgeable about the lathes they sell. I was able to find out a lot of useful info, which I'll put here for everyone's reference.

Option 1, Holzmann ED 300 ECO (the one I mentioned several times in this thread) has plain spindle ball bearings after all. Austrian company, but it's still made in China, with some quality control. Priced at 920€ with VAT. Specs:

motor power s1 W 400
motor power s6 W 560
voltage 230V 50Hz
overall dimensions mm 760x230x254
distance between centers mm 300
center height mm 90
max. overhang mm 180
turning speed min-1 50-2500
spindle bore mm 20
spindle bore MK3
tailstock taper MK2
metric thread range mm / r 0.5-2.5
max. tool holder cross-section 8
net weight kg 40
gross weight kg 48

Option 2, Holzmann ED 300 FD - a larger, heavier and higher quality variant. Has tapered roller bearings. Priced at 1186€ with VAT. Specs:

motor power s1 W 450
motor power s6 W 630
voltage 230V 50Hz
overall dimensions mm 740x390x370
distance between centers mm 300
center height mm 90
max. overhang mm 180
turning speed min-1 50-2500
spindle bore mm 21
spindle bore MK3
tailstock taper MK2
metric thread range mm / r 0.5-3
inch thread 8-44
net weight kg 60
gross weight kg 65

Option 3, OPTIMUM TU1503V - an actual lathe, much higher quality, but also significantly smaller and lighter. Also has tapered roller bearings. Priced at 1052€ with VAT. Specs:

Motor 450 W
Power supply 230V
Center height 75 mm
Max. workpiece 150 mm
Center distance 265 mm
Revolutions 120-3000 min-1
Spindle taper MK3
Spindle bore 11 mm
Tailstock taper MK1
Tailstock stroke 30 mm
Metric thread 0.5-1.5 mm/U
Max. tool size max.12 mm
Dimensions 560 x 320 x 290
Weight 23 kg.

All three options have steel gears.

Sorry for different format on specs, I took them from Lithuanian PDFs and put through an auto translator.

So now I'm considering between option 2 and 3. It's a shame that option 2 is much larger than option 1, it would become a real issue keeping and using it at my apartment, otherwise I'd definitely go for option 2. But these 740x390x370 dimensions are just massive. Meanwhile, as far as size goes, option 3 is ideal for my space, even though it's lack of weight is seriously concerning - I will definitely need some kind of concrete block, clamping it to a dining table won't be enough. Also, the tailstock uses Mk1, which is quite unusual, almost all mini lathes use Mk2, so this might present some issues in the future when I want to buy upgrades... Or maybe not. The spindle bore is also tiny compared to option 2. The really appealing thing is that this lathe is not a Sieg descendant, but an independent, German-made high quality machine, at least it is claimed to be so.

What do you guys think?

EDIT: After some more research, it seems that option 3 (OPTIMUM TU1503V) isn't as good as that reseller implied. It is still Chinese, even though better quality that Sieg descendents. But it has lots of poor reviews, has no quick lock for tailstock, no easy access for carriage lock, longitudinal carriage handle is in a very bad position, but worst of all - I have no idea how I missed it - it doesn't have a compound rest. That, coupled with other issues I mentioned (small spindle bore, low weight, weirdly dimensioned tailstock) pretty much disqualifies it. So I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and go with option 2 (Holzmann ED 300 FD), despite it's size. At least it's fully featured, has tapered bearings, and enough weight to be able to expect at least some quality.

EDIT 2: TU1503V has a bigger brother, TU2004V, which is equivalent to Holzmann ED 300 FD in terms of features, no-nonsense build, and probably better quality, but even larger and is around 1600€, which is slightly above my budget. But maybe someone here will have use for it or at least some comments.

EDIT 3: Found a nice comparison of Sieg VS Optimum lathe (the 2004V): . Maybe it is worth it after all...

Some updates. I found another local reseller that is actually very knowledgeable about the lathes they sell. I was able to find out a lot of useful info, which I'll put here for everyone's reference.

Option 1, Holzmann ED 300 ECO (the one I mentioned several times in this thread) has plain spindle ball bearings after all. Austrian company, but it's still made in China, with some quality control. Priced at 920€ with VAT. Specs:

motor power s1 W 400
motor power s6 W 560
voltage 230V 50Hz
overall dimensions mm 760x230x254
distance between centers mm 300
center height mm 90
max. overhang mm 180
turning speed min-1 50-2500
spindle bore mm 20
spindle bore MK3
tailstock taper MK2
metric thread range mm / r 0.5-2.5
max. tool holder cross-section 8
net weight kg 40
gross weight kg 48

Option 2, Holzmann ED 300 FD - a larger, heavier and higher quality variant. Has tapered roller bearings. Priced at 1186€ with VAT. Specs:

motor power s1 W 450
motor power s6 W 630
voltage 230V 50Hz
overall dimensions mm 740x390x370
distance between centers mm 300
center height mm 90
max. overhang mm 180
turning speed min-1 50-2500
spindle bore mm 21
spindle bore MK3
tailstock taper MK2
metric thread range mm / r 0.5-3
inch thread 8-44
net weight kg 60
gross weight kg 65

Option 3, OPTIMUM TU1503V - an actual. German-made lathe, much higher quality, but also significantly smaller and lighter. Also has tapered roller bearings. Priced at 1052€ with VAT. Specs:

Motor 450 W
Power supply 230V
Center height 75 mm
Max. workpiece 150 mm
Center distance 265 mm
Revolutions 120-3000 min-1
Spindle taper MK3
Spindle bore 11 mm
Tailstock taper MK1
Tailstock stroke 30 mm
Metric thread 0.5-1.5 mm/U
Max. tool size max.12 mm
Dimensions 560 x 320 x 290
Weight 23 kg.

All three options have steel gears.

Sorry for different format on specs, I took them from Lithuanian PDFs and put through an auto translator.

So now I'm considering between option 2 and 3. It's a shame that option 2 is much larger than option 1, it would become a real issue keeping and using it at my apartment, otherwise I'd definitely go for option 2. But these 740x390x370 dimensions are just massive. Meanwhile, as far as size goes, option 3 is ideal for my space, even though it's lack of weight is seriously concerning - I will definitely need some kind of concrete block, clamping it to a dining table won't be enough. Also, the tailstock uses Mk1, which is quite unusual, almost all mini lathes use Mk2, so this might present some issues in the future when I want to buy upgrades... Or maybe not. The spindle bore is also tiny compared to option 2. The really appealing thing is that this lathe is not a Sieg descendant, but an independent, German-made high quality machine, at least it is claimed to be so.

What do you guys think?

EDIT: After some more research, it seems that option 3 (OPTIMUM TU1503V) isn't as good as that reseller implied. It is still Chinese, even though better quality that Sieg descendents. But it has lots of poor reviews, has no quick lock for tailstock, no easy access for carriage lock, longitudinal carriage handle is in a very bad position, but worst of all - I have no idea how I missed it - it doesn't have a compound rest. That, coupled with other issues I mentioned (small spindle bore, low weight, weirdly dimensioned tailstock) pretty much disqualifies it. So I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and go with option 2 (Holzmann ED 300 FD), despite it's size. At least it's fully featured, has tapered bearings, and enough weight to be able to expect at least some quality.

EDIT 2: TU1503V has a bigger brother, TU2004V, which is equivalent to Holzmann ED 300 FD in terms of features, no-nonsense build, and probably better quality, but even larger and is around 1600€, which is slightly above my budget. But maybe someone here will have use for it or at least some comments.

EDIT 3: Found a nice comparison of Sieg VS Optimum lathe (the 2004V): . Maybe it is worth it after all...

They both look good .
First seen with tapered roller bearings made in Germany.

The German do a better job on tools. The Chinese is the best price.

If not looking price the German-made is the winner .

Price then it is Chinese made

Dave

 

[Bazzer]

Hi, I've had 2 years of experience working on old USSR lathes, but now I need a mini lathe for my home hobby projects, something that I could carry around and clamp down to a heavy table in the living room (don't have a shop). So probably around 40-60kg for the machine. 7x12", 7x14" or 7x16" would be ideal. Plan to turn aluminum, brass, stainless steel (304 or 316) - I know that last one is problematic for mini machines, but I'm okay with taking very light cuts. My budget is 1500€. Don't need fancy stuff like DROs, but "basic" features like:

1. Compound rest (with lock);
2. Proper and easily accessible locks on carriage and cross slide;
3. Tapered spindle bearings (it's a shame this has to be specified);
4. Quick lock on the tailstock;
5. Compatibility with common accessories;
6. No plastic gears, and proper autofeed design that doesn't wear out the leadscrew.

Now I've done my research, and there are lots of good suggestions for US brands, but very little for EU. Most mini lathes here seem to be Chinese clones of one another, for example:

Sieg S3
VEVOR 7'' x 16''
Proxxon PD 250/E
TM 210 x 400 Vario
Warco Super Mini Lathe 350
Bernardo Hobby 300 Vario
HBM 210 Vario

And so on. They are all near identical judging from visuals and specs, just different branding and paint. Unfortunately many don't specify the stuff like I mentioned, for example whether they have plain or tapered bearings. I am not sure if any of them are better than any others. For example Vevor has the most features and most powerful motor, but also a reputation for being a gamble in terms of quality/defects. Proxxon seems well reviewed, but weights just 11kg, so there is zero hope for rigidity. HBM also has very nice features, but almost impossible to get in my country (Lithuania) and very few reviews, so it's difficult to tell how good it is.

I know that in US, some companies that sell these Chinese clones do additional quality control, like Precision Mathews, so buying from them you can expect full features and much better quality, but I can't find if there is anything similar in the EU, and which brands are more reliable.

I've also researched the option of buying metric variant lathes from US, like Taig or Sherline, but the shipping costs and taxes exceed the price of these lathes, and while I believe they have good quality, they also lack many of the features I'd like to have. I also researched local options, like buying used, visited various machine shops, but there is nothing - my country is very small, there isn't much going on here, machine shops are very few and none of them deal with mini lathes, only the big stuff like in my former workplace.

Can anyone suggest, are there any better alternatives under 1500€ in EU with my requirements? If not, are any of these Chinese lathes better than the others? I'm okay with modifying them after purchase if just a few things are missing, but if I have to replace bearings or something else as big, it will turn into a painful project. Would really appreciate any feedback. Thanks!

Get your self a second hand EMCO Compact 5, you will not be disappointed, you will find one in Germany easily.

The quality is really good and you can still get all the parts to keep it going (not that I have needed any).

I don't think Optimum are made in Germany, it is not really possible to make a lathe in Germany for those prices.

 

[Roger Taylor]

I would hold out for a used Enco or Prazi. Both are excellent quality Austrian and German machine tools.