Help with Great Grandfathers models

[taff224]

Evening all,

I recently returned from my Aunt's house where she has been clearing out some boxes from my Grandmother...you can see where this is going can't you.

My Great Grandfather used to scratch build model engines (we think he started post WW1 upto and through WW2) - some of his best stuff is with my Mother's cousin and is really nice work. But my Aunt recently found a whole set of his early work, which are mainly stationary engines/pumps from what I can work out.

They are mainly brass, I think scratch built and in general they seem in good condition. Can anyone identify any of the items (he may have used published plans) or suggest the best way to get them back up and running.

Thanks

Chris

 

[Tin Falcon]

What a family treasure to find . Thank you for sharing
Non of the models look familiar.

Most of the engines look like steam engines

I would gently check and see if the engines turn freely by hand . Do not force .

You may need to do some dissemble and cleaning . Consider getting a gunsmiths screwdriver kit.
these kits come with tips in many sizes that precisely fit the screw. do not use a screwdriver with a poor fit in these old engines as they will likely bugger the screw heads.
remove as few fasteners and parts as possible.

You may be able to run the engines on compressed air but make sure there is not grit/corrosion inside the cylinder that could score the cylinder.
Proceed carefully and slowly. these engines need to be treated with respect.

also do some research in the popular mechanics magazines they often had engine plans in them and it was a popular magazine of the time.
And before I forget please post an introduction tell us a bit about yourself your home shop (if you have one) and your interest in model engines. and last but not least location .
Tin

 

[taff224]

Thanks for the swift reply.

I'm checked them all for movement and they are all suprisingly in good condition, move very easily with no rough patches or noise.

I'll look into getting a set of tools and see what i can do to sort them out.

Anyone got any suggestions on air supplies or bast way to clean up the exterior brass?

Thanks

Chris

 

[wagnmkr]

What a treasure to find. It also looks like your GGF was a pretty good craftsman from what I can see.

As Tin said, these truly deserve some respect.

Cheers,

Tom

 

[Tin Falcon]

Import compressors are cheap . And all the big box stores will be getting in there Chrismas stock if you are very patient and wait til January ther'e are likely to be deals. but even at current prices they are not bad .

I did some online looking you can get cheap compressors for $60-80 US but they may not be worth bring home. The power mate 1 gallon from home deptot had very poor reviews. I have had good results with Dewalt brand tools this one is about $130 and has mostly good reviews .

As far as clean up IMHO just clean off the dirt gently I would not disturb the patina.

a few drops of starret instrument oil and wipe off the excess. And if the engines are free and no gritty feelings it may be Ok to try running on a few psi of air. I would hate to see you break off a screw taking it apart if there are not any issues. and you can check compression by putting a finger over an exhaust port and Turing the fly wheel. You may need to check both directions .
Tin

 

[lennardhme]

Put them in a sonic vibrator to clean.
please dont destroy the p[atina - took years to make.
Leonard

 

[lennardhme]

An addendum....
whatever cleaning agent you try, use it on the base first to ensure its not too agressive.
My choice would be Methylated Spirits.
Leonard

 

[Tin Falcon]

The last one looks like a cylinder and possibly pump from a waling beam engine.
Tin

 

[Henry]

Nice jewels, I will also keep the patina IMO, brush them gently with hot soapy water I will remove only rust if needed and the dust.

Like has been said, try before en areas without any problem and go from there to the most exposed areas.

The one in the 5th picture looks to me like a CI motor I think that it has a spark plug, the Fourth one looks like a steam radial.

 

[Tin Falcon]

I did not realize you are from the UK when I posted the compressorI was thinking USA.
tin

 

[Rivergypsy]

Hi,

Now I've very envious of those - nice one!

That 3 cylinder radial rings a bell for some reason, but I can't remember quite where I saw it, whether it was on here, in ME or on the web. I'll have a nose to see what I can find.

For what it's worth, yes they do have a lovely patina, but I'm sure your great grandfather would have kept them highly polished, and clean smooth working surfaces will improve their running ;o)

 

[Rivergypsy]

Similar, but 5 cylinders - http://modelenginenews.org/ed.2006.04.html#t3

 

[taff224]

You are right, the ones that were on show were shined within an inch of thier lives. I must try and get some photos from my cousin as he has them now.

Hi,

Now I've very envious of those - nice one!

That 3 cylinder radial rings a bell for some reason, but I can't remember quite where I saw it, whether it was on here, in ME or on the web. I'll have a nose to see what I can find.

For what it's worth, yes they do have a lovely patina, but I'm sure your great grandfather would have kept them highly polished, and clean smooth working surfaces will improve their running ;o)

 

[SeanG]

You will get lot sof good info here, but another route to follow is to take the models along to your local Model Engineering society, the lads there will be able to asses the condidtion of the models in the flesh as it were.

If you go to one in the area your GGF used to live there is a possibility that someone there may remember him (I haven't done the maths there!)

I know there is a society in Swansea and Cardiff, there is one in Bristol (I'm in the Bristol one). Another option is to contact SMEE who have members all over the country.

Those are beautiful models, you are very lucky to have them, I send much envy your way

What was your Great Grandfather called? its also possible he was published in the model engineering press??

Sean

 

[taff224]

Thanks for the reply Sean.

I do need to get to a group sometime, if nothing else just to prove to the wife that I'm not the only person mad enough to think about this as a hobby..

My G Grandfather was called Edwin Short and lived in and around Port Talbot all his life, he died in 1972 so there may be someone around who does remember him. He was definitley still working on models through WWII as my Grandmother remembers him making them then.

Both he and his father were tin workers, which I assume is where the skills to do this came from.

 

[Gedeon Spilett]

This lovely collection of engine reminds me the style of blue prints of steam engines and pumps By TW Geary that I've seen in "Workshop Masters and their Projects...". A selection of old papers on model engineering, dating between WWI & WWII mostly, and published in 12 issues between nov 1989 & oct 1991 (Tee publishing UK, CL Deith Editor. Unfortunately, many drawings are poorly reproduced, and the origin of the articles are not given and appears rather broad (Model Engineer or its clones or close relations...).
For the small (?) two-stroke engine, not being made in brass, check first for inside corrosion by removing the plug, and proceed to the usual soaking in WD40 before testing for free running and compression...
Wow, a very nice set of engines you have got !

 

[Wizard69]

As others gave said much envy your way. You have a nice diverse set of engines there.

It is good to hear that you are considering getting into model making your self, it looks like your GGF set a high benchmark for you. I can't help much at all with identification as I'm new to the world of machining hobbies and even more so engines. However they do look like steam engines to me. As far as getting into the hobby, be forewarned getting started is a budget buster, at the very least you need a lathe, bench grinder and a bunch of tools and instruments.

As for patina or polish, I can see both sides of the equation and can see why their is conflicting advice here. The right answer might be both. That is keep the patina aged model where the patina adds character the way they are. Polish the engines that would most benefit from a clean up. With a little effort a couple of those models would look absolutely fantastic all bright and shinny. In the end though it is up to you.