BEGINNER - Where do I start?

[AR1911]

That little Emco would be an excellent choice if you can buy it at a decent price.
It would be a nicer lathe than the typical Asian minilathe.
This one even has the milling attachment and table, which is essential for most model engines.
I'd try to buy this one. In fact, if it were in the states I might be bidding on it.

 

[Tin Falcon]

First of all welcome to the forum
2nd I posted this thread to answer that very question. http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/index.php?topic=9413.0
Lot of info to read and digest.
The way I started was buying a 7X10 lathe I started making pen pencil sets on it. Later when money was available I got a band saw and belt sand and eventual a Mini mill. I knew from the beginning I wanted to build engines. I did have the luxury of being trained as a machinist by Uncle Sam.
If your living space and shop space need to coexist then build a box for the lathe when you get one and on for the mill then close the box and set aside when not in use.
Tin
Ps the PP Sets were sold and given as gifts the PP sets paid for my initial equipment.

 

[Babba]

I have been ebaying for few weeks now. Have a look at the following link lathe. I know somehow (ok mainly from price) that ML7 is a lot better than the following lathe but would this make a better first choice? Is it 7x10? The owner doesn't know. There are other similar type lathes on ebay as well. Is this similar to Clark CL500 without the drilling bit on top?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170581255161&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:GB:1123

Thanks

p.s. after a long time searching for a lathe on ebay I have found that most lathe sellers are based down south cost of England. Not many sellers up north

If you need referance info on a lathe you might be interested in then this site is awesome :

http://www.lathes.co.uk/emco/page3.html

This Unimat 3 is the smallest you'd want to go, as part of your 'discovery' process you need to ID what sort of stuff you could make on one. Google it, there's millions out there with lots of sites by owners making things . . . .

As for buying this particular one, my only alarm bell is the owner (allegedly) doesn't know what I'd consider basic info about it yet he knows it's in good condition !

Worst case scenarion is you travel all the way to Suffolk to pick it up & physically it looks nice but it's been so badly abused that it wouldn't cut butter.

Don't worry, personally I'd take the risk.

Emco's are sold in the UK by Pro Machine Tools Ltd (http://www.emcomachinetools.co.uk) & the Unimat 3's nearest successor appears to be the Unimat 4. This sells for £350 + P&P for the very basic machine, add at least another £100 for a starter selection of tooling.

I'd risk £250ish on buying this one (if I was in the market) & it would be interesting to see what it goes for. It's got 6 people bidding on it & it may go for silly money.

 

[Babba]

You might be able to pick this up for £50.

http://tinyurl.com/37rmou6

IF & it's a BIG IF it's economically salvageable then it might get you started & be a usefull learning experience.

 

[gazatteer]

Thanks, a lot of useful information, priceless.

So I admit, I don't know what is meant by 7x10, 7x12....I did say I was a beginner with nil knowledge/experience. Is the Emco (sold for £275) 7x10 (link in previous post) for future reference?

This does look good and the seller is based locally. The question is, is it salvageable? Would a beginner like me be able to salvage it?
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI....akeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:watchlink:top:en

Thanks again for the information. I will go through the links and read them, there's a lot of info there.

Thanks

 

[Tin Falcon]

So I admit, I don't know what is meant by 7x10, 7x12...

Sorry man sometimes get in the slang mode and forget it is not English.
7 x or 7 x 10,12,14,16 is a slang term for a Seig (Chinese made Mini lathe. a common import in most parts of the world.
the 7 is the theoretical max size in diameter if the material that can be machined. this is over the bed measurement.
the 10, 12 ,14... is the max distance between centers or the longest piece that can be turned across centers.
IIRC the 7x lathe is also called a C-2 by the manufacturer.

Now to confuse you more the first number in the uK is usually a distance from the bed to the center. so a 7" lathe in the US is a
3 1/2 " in the UK.
N0 stupid questions here. hope this helps.
Tin

 

[gazatteer]

: wot?

Tin, I had to read your post few times to understand the numbers. I hope the difficult bit is now out of the way.

It's confusing alright. 3 1/2" radius would give 7" diameter round bar, which seems to be a good size for a wheel for a model steam engine. All the other round objects will be smaller. I think most of the model steam engine's longest objects (rods) are less than 5" according to few plans that I have downloaded from the net.

Therefore, 7x10 lathe seems are reasonable size lathe for a beginner especially when pocket is not heavy.

 

[steamer]

Hi Gazatter,

Go with the biggest lathe your budget will stand....It's easier to do small work on a big lathe than big work on a little lathe.....a very technical description huh?


Dave

 

[Tin Falcon]

I have a 7 x10 that is what was available ten years ago 10" is not a lot when you add a drill chuck and a drill bit or reamer. the 12 or 14 are better IIRC some places are even selling a 16" version .
Tin

 

[gazatteer]

I have started to sell bits and bats on ebay. Hopefully, I will get enough money to buy Myford ML7. I'm not sure whether ML7s are 10, 12 or 14 but they look big and seem very popular on ebay.

I think it's difficult to manage budget in this field. I may be able to afford ML7 (just about after eBay sales, I think) but I still don't know what other tools I will require and what their cost will be.

There are a few lathes on ebay that need salvaging. Therefore, they may be going cheap but I am not sure whether salvaging is for a beginner and I think it's a diversion from my original objective, which is to build a steam engine.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250746527104&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140493869012&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250745724534&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=110627609425&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Some of the above are local therefore I will save on delivery. For this reason only I am considering them even though salvaging will be time consuming.

What do you think?

 

[chbeyer]

Hi,

go for the ML7 the other ones are more or less wrecked and need a lot of investment in form of money and experienced workmanship to get them back into working condition. As a beginner in metal working you will have enough doubts and problems operating the thing even when it is in 'normal' conditions. Be aware you will most likely spend the same amount of money on tools as you for the machine itself. And you are still missing a mill or a mill attachment you can get a nice z-axis though for not to much money for the ml7 ...

cheers
christoph

 

[gazatteer]

Thank you very much.

I think time has come to buy a Lathe. I have been looking at the following lathes on eBay:

Myford Super 7 http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330512247186&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Myford ML7 http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190484117579&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Myford ML7 http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300508847806&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Myford ML7 http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150540751813&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Boxford Lathe http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270685215853&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Could somebody give me advise has to which one of them is better for a beginner? Do you see any damage from the photos?

Thanks

 

[gazatteer]

I appreciate all the assistance I am getting. I know I may be asking repeating/stupid questions but believe me the answer are valuable.

The attached photos are of Myford, being sold privately. The owner has reduced the price me for and will sell it to me for £200. A lot less compared to eBay prices. The seller thinks it's a ML7 model but is not sure and it's not written on the lathe. It looks at similar to Myford ML7 to me. Could somebody please verify that this is Myford ML7?

This lathe has couple of problems. The handle on the toolpost has snapped off and the tensioning bar on headstock will need replacing. Are these big jobs and will they cost a lot of money? According to the seller they are small jobs.

Is this lathe for me, have I found the right lathe for myself?
OR should I stay away from this lathe because of tensionsing bar and snapped handle?

Thank you

 

[gazatteer]

This is another private sale.
Myford ML7

It includes 3 self centring and 4 jaw independent chucks plus faceplate. Comes with T slotted cross slide, a boxed extended T slotted cross slide, boxed swivelling vertical milling slide, boxed milling vice, tailstock full and half centres and set of change wheels plus tooling

This is being Myfold ML7 is being sold for £500.

What do you think? Is it worth it (for me, beginner)?

Thanks

 

[steamer]

It looks promising. I would bring someone who knows something about used lathes with you to inspect it prior.

Do NOT skimp on the inspection.

Dave

 

[gazatteer]

Thanks

I only know one person who knows about lathes and unfortunately he will not travel. These lathes are located over 200 miles away from my location. Some are over 400 miles away.

Steamer, which lathe looks promising?

Thanks

 

[Babba]

What you are looking at Gazatteer, are nowt more than pictures ont' t'internet.

Before you committ yourself to parting your hard earned on these particular pictures, I hasten to add that I too have lots of pictures of knackered & semi knackered lathes that I hope you would consider purchasing for sums not dissimilar to these.

Think of it as buying your first used car, trust me that there are far more sharks with much bigger jaws in the used lathe trade than there will ever be in the 4 wheel'd world.

Find someone who knows, tempt him with beer. Lead him into those places where people who don't know should NEVER go. He will guide you, lead you by the horns, to the very machine that has your name written deep within its castings.

Somewhere out there is a 2nd hand machine that will suit you, you have zero chance of coming across it unless you put some very serious effort into learning what to look for when buying it. Bypass all that serious effort & find yourself a man who's already been there, failing that, buy new.

 

[steamer]

Gazatteer,

The second one looks somewhat promising, but pictures can be very deceptive, so I am very reticent to give a recommendation on anything!

Like I stated and Babba has also pointed out, I would bribe a knowledgeable individual to come with you.

Additionally, you need to be patient, and be willing to walk away from your "dream machine".....
if it is not what you want.

I would also look/inquire with your nearest model engineering group.

I would also ask HERE as there are something like 5000 members!

The Model Engineering forum would also be a good place to stop and check out.

I would not buy a clapped out Myford because it's a Myford. A good machinist can work around the short comings of a worn out lathe, but I dare say it's not fair to have a novice work like that. Make sure what ever lathe you get is in good shape. You will have enough of a project learning how to use and take care of a good one, never mind a worn one.

Check the centers sockets for scores from the centers being spun.

Check for wear on the bed near the chuck. This is very common.

Look for signs of the cross slide being run into the chuck....that happens a lot....though not generally fatal, it may give an indication of how well the lathe was taken care of. ( kind of like looking at a used car and all four fenders are stove in....goes down the road good....but what else is wrong?)

Dings and dents in the ways or any where else

Mollyhocked wiring or "improvements"..... :

Most importantly, go with someone for the first 1 or 2 lathes you look at and have them teach you what to look for. Then you will know how to fish..... ;D

Dave

 

[coopertje]

Hi,

I am not sure what kind of project you have in mind, but maybe its wise to go for a new machine. They are not so expensive, Chinese made, not perfect but not bad also. Big advantage would be that you have a trusted starting point. As other people stated Its very easy to find rubbish, but harder to find a good used machine.

After some time of use you know more about the ins and outs of a lathe. Makes looking for a good used one a lot more easy. I followed this way and I am glad I did.

Good luck with your search and try to be patient, good work takes time!

Regards Jeroen

 

[gazatteer]

I understand what your saying but by the time I have found somebody it may be too late. I may lose interest by then.

No doubt that I was expecting you guys to give me advice/views on which is the better lathe. I would have purchased the lathe too (cheap or expensive) but instead I have advice that I did not expect. Though, your answer is not what I wanted to read/hear it is valid and right answer too. OK I admit it, it is the better answer and I thank you for it.

To be true, I feel I should go and buy the £200 lathe but then I think this field is unknow to me and the people who know the field are advicing me not to. :-\

Why am I persisting with buying a lathe, urgently or without advice? I don't know. I suppose I want start building something straightaway. I suppose this is the ill fever of a new hobby, one would like to start it straight away, without much thinking or advice. Then after few months, the interest is all gone.

Here is another stupid question. I'll by a car that starts, drives, no unexpected noises, no visible dents/damage and the engine is clean and dry. When buying a lathe surely you look for similar problems? Surely with a lathe you only look for visible damage, unexpected noise and whether the motor is running or not?

I think from above it feels as if I am still trying to get you guys on my side so that you can say go ahead and buy one of the lathes. :-X Am I lost or what?