# Sieg X2 Mill? and lathe?



## lazylathe (Feb 11, 2011)

Hi all,

I have been offered a Sieg X2 mill for quite a good price.
It is just the mill with no accessories.
On the plus side it is brand new, only unpacked but not yet cleaned.
It still has the cosmoline grease on it so it has never been used.

I know a lot of you have these mills and was just looking for some feedback before i go ahead with the purchase.
Good and bad points would be appreciated.

For the price of the mill i do not think i should give it up.
The guy is wanting $400 for it.
For that price i may get the Myford vertical slide and a vice if i am lucky!
So i think it would save me some money in the long run.

Any thoughts appreciated!!!

Andrew


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## vedoula (Feb 11, 2011)

people are happy with it I hear.
I do not have this mill (I have a smaller one from Sherline) -- so cannot comment. 

How much do these go for usually?


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## imagineering (Feb 11, 2011)

FWIW, I have an SX3 which I have converted to 4-Axis CNC. 
Great machine for the price, (I don't know where in the World you are though, NZD$ AUD$, USD$??).
There is a contributor to this site, SpudEvans, who has converted an X2 to CNC, who's Thread may be of help.
ArcEuro in the UK have a 'strip-down' tutorial on the SX3 which you may also find usefull.

Murray.


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## rake60 (Feb 11, 2011)

Is it an R8 or MT#3 spindle taper?

If it's an R8 I'd buy it in a heartbeat as a back up for my own.
If it's an MT#3, I'd pay the extra for a new one with an R8 spindle.

Just my personal opinion.

Rick


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## lazylathe (Feb 11, 2011)

I am in Canada so $CAD.

The X2 is the mini mill of the bunch.
But i do not plan on doing anything too large as i need to learn a lot before i embark on any complex projects!

Thanks for the info i will check him out!

Not too sure about the spindle, i am waiting for him to reply!
My thoughts were the same! R8 and it comes home!

Andrew


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## Steelmaster (Feb 12, 2011)

At that price it would come with me regardless of whether it had an R8 spindle.

I have one of these mills with an MT3 spindle and it is a very capable little mill/drill, I don't think that R8 is really an advantage on these smaller mills as a lot of the tooling for R8 is on the big side.

I have just bought a DM45 with an R8 spindle, so I know the difference.

Never had a problem either with using the MT3 spindle on the X2 or getting the MT3 tooling I wanted.

The only spindle I would really steer clear off, on any mill, is an MT4 spindle, very hard to get tooling for that either here in Oz or in the US.


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## js2112au (Feb 12, 2011)

Sieg X2 is what I've got and I'm very happy with. 

Can't say I'm any great expert engineer as it's my first time using a mill/drill, but I am fussy about my tools and making sure they work the way they are supposed to. 

Yes it's Chinese, but it's solid, engine and gearbox run smooth and quiet, electronic variable speed works well and the high/low gear select comes in handy. The table movement is smooth and accurate and you can lock the movement of every direction. What I consider most important is there's absolutely zero play in the main shaft and chuck. You want a precisely placed hole or an accurate mill, you'll get it!

The head does have a tendancy to want to drop a little. There's a counter spring that gives it some lift but the spring tension isn't adjustable and you have to keep an eye on it. You can lock the head movement and/or switch to a micro dial to maintain accurate height.

$400 is a good price!! I just checked the latest conversion between CAD and AUD and they're about level pegging. I paid $870 for mine new a few months ago, so you've definitely got a great bargain there.

I looked hard at kitting my lathe with a vertical slide for milling. I'm glad I spent the extra on a separate mill/drill. There's been a number of times I've taken a piece of a job from the lathe to the mill and vice versa, without having to spend time re-tooling the lathe.

James.


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## don-tucker (Feb 12, 2011)

Had one of these for a year now,it is the one with the larger motor and longer x travel but baisicaly the same it has No 3 mt,I wouldn't be without it,a surperb machine for model making and at that price a snip.
Go for it you wont reget it.
Don


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## spuddevans (Feb 12, 2011)

I have a X2, and am converting it to CNC at the moment. For what it is I like it, I do wish it had a greater table movement range (but then I guess whatever size mill I'd have, I'd still want a greater range!!! )

With a few easy mods the X2 is transformed into a much better beast, the main one I would recommend is a belt drive conversion ( I made my own for very little money, but you can buy a kit ), but the air-spring mod is also worthwhile too. My next mod will be to stiffen the column with some steel plate bolted on the back, from what I've read this makes a good difference.

But even without these mods, the X2 is still quite a capable machine, before I did any mods to mine I milled steel without any problems, and just yesterday I was milling titainium on it.

As to the whole MT3 vs R8 debate, If it matters to you then LMS do a conversion kit that allows you to change the spindle. I have been happy enough with MT3 for the moment, maybe if I wanted to make a pneumatic tool changer along the lines of a Tormach system, then I might change over to R8, but until then I'm happy enough with MT3.


One thing if you do buy an X2, most likely the head will not be correctly alligned parallel to the column, I showed how I did it in my X2 CNC conversion thread. Once that is done tramming can be done accurately.

As long as you keep within its limits, the X2 is a well capable machine.


Tim


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## Kmot (Feb 12, 2011)

I have an X2 from Sieg. I also own all the mini mill DVD's produced by Swarfrat ( www.swarfrat.com ) and in those tutorials he routinely proves the X2 is fully capable of .0005" tolerances. Not a bad machine, really.


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## milotrain (Feb 12, 2011)

Do it and don't look back. If you find it's too small and you are "in the money" and you get a bigger mill then you have a great candidate for smaller projects without having to untool the larger one, or an ideal candidate for a CNC conversion.

$400 from a guy down the street is worth at least an extra $150 in shipping and taxes, so it's a really solid deal.


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## Metal Butcher (Feb 12, 2011)

Hi Andrew. If its an R-8 than I would buy it if its checks out to be OK. Latter on 'if' you have a need, you can always buy a bigger mill in addition to, or instead of, by selling it off. Any tooling you buy (R-8) will be usable on your next mill and easy to come by.

Man! how do you find all these good deals!

-MB


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## lazylathe (Feb 12, 2011)

I have a friend whose friend is in the woodworking/metalworking business.
He comes up with bits every now and then!
And also a lot of time spent on craigslist and the local Kijiji hunting for deals!

It can be quite time consuming at times!
And most of the time the machines i go and look at are in a terrible state...

I have a lead on a 7" Southbend shaper too and and AMMCO without a motor...

So many tools so little time!!!

Andrew


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## Metal Butcher (Feb 12, 2011)

Well... that explains it!

Its good to have a friend, who has a friend, that's friendly and helpful. Is your friend, who has a friend, looking to make more friends? because I would love to have a friend, that has a friend, that's friendly enough to help out. 

I think I just made my self dizzy! Rof}

So... When are you going to pick up the mill? ;D

-MB


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## John Rudd (Feb 12, 2011)

I have a Conquest mill from Chester(not the one they supply now... similar to the Warco one wit the 550w motor)

Very capable machine, I've run mine with 20mm end mills on steel!!! Although mine has a belt drive conversion.....


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## lazylathe (Feb 12, 2011)

MB,

Not sure when i will pick it up... :-\
Being winter in Canada and we had some snow most people are out snow mobiling around!
I am still waiting for a response from the guy, maybe i will hear from him tonight and be able to pick it up tomorrow!
Or it may only be next weekend...

Anyway it gives me a chance to clean up the workshop and organise things.
I did manage to find my first thimble engine i made!
After a year of storage the thing still does not work!
Pesky elves must be on vacation again! :big:

I think that i will make that my first project once i get the mill.
Fix the engine up and get it running.

I can fix you up with my friends friend who is actually very friendly! ;D
Unfortunately he mainly finds stuff in Canada...
The guy makes custom planes and just sold a 21" handmade jointer plane for $10 000!!! 
Now he wants to buy a bigger bandsaw with a 24" throat...
If you are interested you can have a look at some of their work here:
http://www.sauerandsteiner.com/

Andrew


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## lazylathe (Feb 12, 2011)

He thinks it is an MT3, anyway still a good deal!

Then he goes on to tell me he bought the mill and a mini lathe at the same time.
Lathe is still in the crate and i can have both for $800 CAD!!
Now i am thinking if i really need a mini lathe as well!!!! ???

Anyone interested in an X3 for $1000?
When i pick up the mill i will take some pictures for any interested parties!

Andrew


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## Anko (Feb 13, 2011)

i had the warco version of the minimill, the 550w i think, but mine is Einhell, very good machine, but still a chinese machine, is like a blank machine, lots of mods and thinks to take care, the sieg mini mill seems more well made that mine, is just my opinion, is a great machine to learn!, and for the price seems to me like a gift! (here we i live all is doble priced)

about the r8 vs mt3, i never owned yet a r8 machine, just me, but i sayd that mt3 has is advantages, like i can use my milling tools in the lathe and viceversa, and best, i can make my owns mt3 shank tools in the lathe for my mill

ofcourse bigger is better, but a mini mill is very nice for small work!!

saludos!


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## lazylathe (Feb 14, 2011)

I have found out that the new lathe in the crate is a 7X12 from Harbour Freight.
The one that they have on backorder for the moment.

A sieg C2-300 mini lathe if i am not mistaken.

So for now i will go with the MT3 and just tool up for that machine.
Also thinking about setting it up for cnc sometime in the future!
That will allow me to play with Solidworks and actually make something!
I have free access to my boss's brothers engineering company and they have all the software you could ever need!

Anyone out there with this lathe that has any input??

Andrew


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## js2112au (Feb 14, 2011)

Yes, that's the model lathe I have.

I've no basis for comparison as it's the first metal lathe I've used on about 30 years, but what I can tell you is this:
As most lathes are probably like from new, it's factory adjustments are not too good so I found myself spending a lot of time straightening bits up. Once that was done I've had no problems with it and it's been a lot of fun.

The motor is quite sensitive to any kind of jamming which to me is a good thing - it won't start if there's any more than normal resistance on the chuck. You'll get the fault light come on. All you have to do is switch off, make sure the chuck turns freely and switch on again. The motor has never cut out on me while doing normal turning so the safety isn't over sensitive, but it has stopped the motor very quickly when I've done something stupid.

Don't trust the graduations on the handwheels. Both my dial gauge and calipers say they're wrong.

The auto-feed screw works well and the lathe came with a bunch of gears for doing different thread pitch. They're fiddly to change but work fine. You just need to keep the auto-feed screw clean as it has no cover.

The standard C2 has a big black metal plate at the back for catching chips & shavings. One of the best things I ever did was take it off (3 screws)
I'm no experienced machinist but I've gotten used to the lathe and really enjoy using it. apart from those few small considerations I've mentioned it does everything I want it to do and probably a whole lot more that I haven't learned about yet. For me it was a great purchase.


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## Joel779 (Feb 15, 2011)

Hello all,

I'm just getting into this machine tool thing, purchased an 8x14 lathe from HF, and just got shipment of my SX3 the other day. I'm going to be building this up to CNC with ball screws etc etc.

The question I have for the group is how much of a limitation is the spindle speed for this machine. I have a friend with a Taig and he is continually telling me how much problems I will have with such a slow spindle speed. 

I am primarly interested in scratch building G1 live steam locomotives, so a lot of stuff I do will be small size. What is the smallest mill bit I can expect to work on brass with this machine?  I know there are hoops that guys jump through to get higher speeds but I would like to avoid this if the machine will work for my needs.

Thanks a bunch.

Joel


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## spuddevans (Feb 15, 2011)

Joel779  said:
			
		

> What is the smallest mill bit I can expect to work on brass with this machine? I know there are hoops that guys jump through to get higher speeds but I would like to avoid this if the machine will work for my needs.



Hi Joel,


I have the X2 which is the small brother of your SX3, before I converted to CNC the smallest endmill I succesfully used was 2mm. I did try some 1mm carbide endmills but was a little too heavyhanded with the Z-axis feed and snapped them.

However, since converting I am very happy to use 1mm endmills as I have greater control over depth of cut and feed speeds. This tells me that it is possible (with care ) to use such small bits even on a manual machine if you are easy on the dials.


Tim


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## lazylathe (Feb 18, 2011)

Bugger! 
Looks like the mill and lathe deal may fall through....
The guy is not responding to any e mails...

Oh well the hunt starts from the beginning again....

Andrew

Well it looks like it is still on!!
Something came up and he had some family matters to take care of.
So next weekend it is!
Filled this weekends workshop time with stripping an Atlas 618 and preparing it for a clean and paint!
 For anyone thinking of doing this, it is a LOT of work!!
Be prepared to spend a long time if you want to do it correctly!

Mine came from a school and the kids decided to paint it silver without taking anything apart... :-\
One good thing that came from it is that i now have a contact in the metal tooling world!!! ;D
The guy repairs compressors and is often in schools and universities and gets to choose equipment as part payment!
I gave him my long list and he already knows of a few sources!! :big:

Andrew


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