# Maximat 7 Lathe



## Gerald Pierce (Jul 4, 2020)

I purchased my Maximat 7 new about 50 years ago. I only had to make two repairs. I replace one selector shift fork lever. I also had to replace the lead screw nut. The adjusting screw tab on the nut broke. Could not find a replacement.  I made a replacement nut from bronze on the lathe. This is a left hand 5/16 x 20 thread. A challenge but interesting part to make. 

Gerald Pierce


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## SmithDoor (Jul 4, 2020)

Looks like great lathe
The only way today to get good is buy old ones and fix.
They just do build that good any more.

Dave


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## goldstar31 (Jul 5, 2020)

SmithDoor said:


> Looks like great lathe
> The only way today to get good is buy old ones and fix.
> They just do build that good any more.
> 
> Dave



Might I disagree!  I have a Myford Super 7 with gear box and powered cross feed which NEW i.e. have been £3000( basic) which without ANY tooling whatsoever, will set people back a very cool £8 000 or perhaps 10 grand. Yes, I have one and a fitful of accessories both bought or made. A rather ethereal sum and I am certainly not alone in getting one. Writing as a former accountant, it is a sound investment and one which I have briefed my two holders of. Enduring Powers of Attorney and my future executers and beneficiaries- NOT to be sniffed at

From the practical and considerably cheaper Chinese Sieg C4 with variable speed motor and power cross feed and iron gears not plastic things from Deutschland, Deutschland  Uber alles, made out of plastic. I do have preferences!

Emco made lathes, if I recall, for the use of slave labour in Dachau Concentration Camp.
Not quite what one expects but true nevertheless.

So back to the Sieg, it is incredibly cheap- and refreshingly accurate. I've got one.


None of this dreary poor little boy peering through the steamy Christmas offerings- and wishing to be able to go in.   Apparently there is more about than it would seem at first glance.

My experiences on such things- of course.


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## tornitore45 (Jul 5, 2020)

I have a Sieg 9x20 and paid $1,000 with tax and shipment. A ridiculous low price.   Accuracy is more an operator factor than a machine characteristic.
I made several modification to improve practicality but no amount of improvement can overcame a bad design.  The Sieg design (Actually a copy of the Austrian Enco) is sound, and a solid performer for a 1000 bucks.
Miraculously, the machine has been turning out better and better part with less scrap since I got it as my first lathe.  I wonder why...


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## goldstar31 (Jul 5, 2020)

I had a 9200 which was one with a Myford 'nose' to accept my tooling.

At the price, it was a bargain but the lowest speed was 130 RPM which was too fast for my reactions.  a funny way to operate the motor and a  poor travel for the tailstock 'poppet'.  I changed the motor to 3 phase. As has been said, a good solid machine for the price.


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## SmithDoor (Jul 5, 2020)

My choice of good all around lathe is 9N A South Bend Lathes. 
My lathe has quick change gear box, Tapper attachment.
I have used South Bend Lathes for over 50 years. 
For hobby lobby it is very flexible and has lots of tooling.
All iron/steel gears and back gear.
Made in the USA too.



goldstar31 said:


> Might I disagree!  I have a Myford Super 7 with gear box and powered cross feed which NEW i.e. have been £3000( basic) which without ANY tooling whatsoever, will set people back a very cool £8 000 or perhaps 10 grand. Yes, I have one and a fitful of accessories both bought or made. A rather ethereal sum and I am certainly not alone in getting one. Writing as a former accountant, it is a sound investment and one which I have briefed my two holders of. Enduring Powers of Attorney and my future executers and beneficiaries- NOT to be sniffed at
> 
> From the practical and considerably cheaper Chinese Sieg C4 with variable speed motor and power cross feed and iron gears not plastic things from Deutschland, Deutschland  Uber alles, made out of plastic. I do have preferences!
> 
> ...


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## tornitore45 (Jul 5, 2020)

Same here. One of the best upgrades I did was to replace the motor wit a 3 Phase 1HP plus VFD   90% of the time I work on one of the pulley sheave.
Occasionally I need to move the belt for extreme RPM conditions.


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## SmithDoor (Jul 7, 2020)

I did that lathes using DC motors 
The DC motor speed range 60 to 1. The down side to DC is the cost
But speed control was great  60 RPM to1800 RPM.

Dave



tornitore45 said:


> Same here. One of the best upgrades I did was to replace the motor wit a 3 Phase 1HP plus VFD   90% of the time I work on one of the pulley sheave.
> Occasionally I need to move the belt for extreme RPM conditions.


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## Steamchick (Jul 9, 2020)

DC will - in theory - give better motor control and higher torque at low motor speed (max torque at zero rpm). But the digital motor controls on AC motors are now used for traction - electric cars, trains, etc. - because of the feedback of the back-EMF to the electronics giving more precise control for creeping from rest.... As far as I understand , anyway. (I worked at Nissan on LEAF, but not on motor control, so only picked up "rumours"). Maybe on the lathe you don't  need to "creep-from-rest"? I do that in the mornings to drag myself from bed, but when thread cutting with tap or die on the lathe I do it "by hand".


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## SmithDoor (Jul 9, 2020)

My self a good variable belt drive is best. But takes more work to install.
They are now using in cars.

Dave



Steamchick said:


> DC will - in theory - give better motor control and higher torque at low motor speed (max torque at zero rpm). But the digital motor controls on AC motors are now used for traction - electric cars, trains, etc. - because of the feedback of the back-EMF to the electronics giving more precise control for creeping from rest.... As far as I understand , anyway. (I worked at Nissan on LEAF, but not on motor control, so only picked up "rumours"). Maybe on the lathe you don't  need to "creep-from-rest"? I do that in the mornings to drag myself from bed, but when thread cutting with tap or die on the lathe I do it "by hand".


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## Steamchick (Jul 9, 2020)

SmithDoor said:


> My self a good variable belt drive is best. But takes more work to install.
> They are now using in cars.
> 
> Dave


First used in cars in mass production in the 1960s with rubber belts, and since the 1980s with steel belts (Nissan CVT). Very efficient compared to geared automatics.... But there is a variable speed lathe at my local Model Engineering club, dating from 1960s or 60s? I need training before I am allowed to use it. I think it uses opposing cones.., but I don't  know if belt or moving-idler to make the transfer of torque?


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## BaronJ (Jul 9, 2020)

Hi Guys,

Just in case no one has noticed, more and more motors are moving to three phase and electronic variable speed drive systems !  Also many motors that used brushes and commutators to supply power to rotating parts are now becoming brushless and don't actually have any electrical contact with any moving part of the machine.  Also being able to be easily speed controlled.

Some may have noticed a trend here.  Lack of copper !  Many new motors are starting to use aluminum wire for the winding, particularly BLDC (Brush Less DC) ones.

Also notice that this trend is towards reducing costs and increasing profit !


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## goldstar31 (Jul 9, 2020)

Steamchick said:


> First used in cars in mass production in the 1960s with rubber belts, and since the 1980s with steel belts (Nissan CVT). Very efficient compared to geared automatics.... But there is a variable speed lathe at my local Model Engineering club, dating from 1960s or 60s? I need training before I am allowed to use it. I think it uses opposing cones.., but I don't  know if belt or moving-idler to make the transfer of torque?



In the days of Yore- those Good old Days,  the average model maker's lathe was powered on line shafting- with a scrapped 1/4HP electric motor. Importantly, it all worked and there was nobody to ask silly questions and to get silly answers. This was the late and much lamented Don L Ashton- who wasn't an engineer but knew more engineering as his books on valve gear are still being used. So there. Don also was a world authority on tugboats, repairing musical instruments and composing music- when he wasn't re-building a full size locomotive.
He would bore me rigid at 3AM and I would be lulled into sleep.

So the other one was the much accepted Kenneth C Hart writing as Martin Cleeve on his epic 'Screwcutting in the Lathe and who hadn't enough money to take out a Patent but  drove half a Myford ML7 with line shafting and TWO motors- one a full horse power and the other a 1/3rd one. That was about 1953 if my memory serves me well.
He could cut metal on the lathe faster than his home made mechanical hacksaw.

So it has ALL been done- long before there was a glint in one's father's eye. 
Mine, incidentally was brazing up carbide bits- with his Decontamination Suit, tin hat and service respirator on a nail in the blacksmith's shop.

As I said- it's All been done and repeated and repeated.  Being an 'engineer'? Huh, I'made more things with a fountain pen. Enough o retire comfortably at 55-  far too late in life really!


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## fcheslop (Jul 9, 2020)

Electronic speed control on a small lathe  with short duration may well be OK but I would be concerned about the motors cooling on a long job.
CVT thought DAF did that in the 60s or at least I remember a few swearing lessons changing the belts
Nothing new just reworked re badge re branded  and ultimately recycled .
Never made enough from the fountain pen to retire early but became a thorn in big companies sides and they were glad to buy me out more than once


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## SmithDoor (Jul 9, 2020)

First time I saw  steel belts is equipment from 1950's
The variable belt transfer of torque.

Why did you need training on variable drive???

Dave



Steamchick said:


> First used in cars in mass production in the 1960s with rubber belts, and since the 1980s with steel belts (Nissan CVT). Very efficient compared to geared automatics.... But there is a variable speed lathe at my local Model Engineering club, dating from 1960s or 60s? I need training before I am allowed to use it. I think it uses opposing cones.., but I don't  know if belt or moving-idler to make the transfer of torque?


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## Gerald Pierce (Jul 9, 2020)

tornitore45 said:


> I have a Sieg 9x20 and paid $1,000 with tax and shipment. A ridiculous low price.   Accuracy is more an operator factor than a machine characteristic.
> I made several modification to improve practicality but no amount of improvement can overcame a bad design.  The Sieg design (Actually a copy of the Austrian Enco) is sound, and a solid performer for a 1000 bucks.
> Miraculously, the machine has been turning out better and better part with less scrap since I got it as my first lathe.  I wonder why...



"The Sieg design ( Actually a copy of the Austrian Enco)?  My Maximat 7 was made in Austria by EMCO Maier Corporation. I paid $795 in 1970. With geared headstock, taper roller bearings, and vertical milling/drilling unit  If you can get a copy today for $1,000 that is a ridiculous low price.


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## goldstar31 (Jul 9, 2020)

I got a SIEG C4 in excellent condition for just £350 and added a vertical mill drill attachment( new)

No great thing. At the end of the day, it is only a thing to help pursue one of my hobbies.

On the other hand, my  present Myford is an investment as well as a very practical piece of kit--- for which spares are still available.

Emcos, however they are presented, do not fall into this category and their price also reflects this.

OK,  I've got a top of the range lathe - plus a vst collection of accessories- which - tongue in cheek- is not in the same league game.


Hint, I studied cost accountancy, taxation  and whatever-- but not engineering- as is obvious. Myfords have 'je ne sais quoi' but - but I'm not alone in having this opinion.


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## Steamchick (Jul 10, 2020)

Hi SmithDoor, No real idea "why". but I was told that when the "new" (mechanical) variable speed lathe was fully commissioned, there would be training before anyone could use it. They do teach people with zero workshop experience to be passable modellers, so the context was a bit "global"... I haven't yet needed to borrow any of their lathes as my Cheap Chinese variable speed noggin (Chester DB7) does everything I need at a speed I am happy with. For tiddly stuff I use my old Unimat (Re-motored, because I over-worked it and the motor armature fried... Should have read all the instructions - e.g. "Stop for cooling after 10 mins of use"!). I want a bigger swing and more torque, but until I can knock through into next door and "borrow" their garage I just don't have the space for a bigger-bed lathe....


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## Gerald Pierce (Jul 10, 2020)

goldstar31 said:


> I got a SIEG C4 in excellent condition for just £350 and added a vertical mill drill attachment( new)
> 
> No great thing. At the end of the day, it is only a thing to help pursue one of my hobbies.
> 
> ...





goldstar31 said:


> I got a SIEG C4 in excellent condition for just £350 and added a vertical mill drill attachment( new)
> 
> Hello Goldstar31, apparently amateur machinist on this forum are satisfied with their purchases.
> 
> ...


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## SmithDoor (Jul 10, 2020)

I think I change to better motor.
I have heard of problem on some of mini Mills.
A good motor is needed on lathes and mills.
I would look for a better motor and controller.

Dave




Steamchick said:


> Hi SmithDoor, No real idea "why". but I was told that when the "new" (mechanical) variable speed lathe was fully commissioned, there would be training before anyone could use it. They do teach people with zero workshop experience to be passable modellers, so the context was a bit "global"... I haven't yet needed to borrow any of their lathes as my Cheap Chinese variable speed noggin (Chester DB7) does everything I need at a speed I am happy with. For tiddly stuff I use my old Unimat (Re-motored, because I over-worked it and the motor armature fried... Should have read all the instructions - e.g. "Stop for cooling after 10 mins of use"!). I want a bigger swing and more torque, but until I can knock through into next door and "borrow" their garage I just don't have the space for a bigger-bed lathe....


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## Steamchick (Jul 11, 2020)

SmithDoor, I would see what rating the lathe is meant to have - e.g. Motor power, speed, and look for a Permanent Magnet DC variable speed controlled motor and controller of the *same  *Max power and Max speed. Don't go bigger, or you'll exceed something that is a limiting factor in the design of the lathe mechanics. - It's not worth the money buying a bigger motor that damages the lathe!
Bearings (mainshaft) are a limiting factor for speed, also "balance" within chucks, faceplates, etc.
Bed, slides and guides are limiting factors for "stiffness" = how heavy and how fast you can cut metal. If you can't work as fast as you want with the current lathe, then changing the motor won't fix that. Change the lathe for something stronger - maybe bigger. - Or risk permanent damage to your precision instrument.
Usually, the safety of the machine from damaging itself is guaranteed by the manufacturer, by the size of the motor. They will never waste money putting on a motor that is big enough to damage the tool. - so you shouldn't. They are experts (not me!) so follow their principles.


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## SmithDoor (Jul 11, 2020)

I said buy a better motor and controller. I did not say buy bigger.
The low cost motors there put on machine tools is not up to job.
A good motor will make different.
The motor on small tools has SF  1.0 this type of motor is for fans.
Machine tools need at less SF of 1.15 I would look for  SF of 1.25 . The controllers lack 100% duty cycle at low speed and will over heat.

This all using the same size motor that works all time.

Dave



Steamchick said:


> SmithDoor, I would see what rating the lathe is meant to have - e.g. Motor power, speed, and look for a Permanent Magnet DC variable speed controlled motor and controller of the *same  *Max power and Max speed. Don't go bigger, or you'll exceed something that is a limiting factor in the design of the lathe mechanics. - It's not worth the money buying a bigger motor that damages the lathe!
> Bearings (mainshaft) are a limiting factor for speed, also "balance" within chucks, faceplates, etc.
> Bed, slides and guides are limiting factors for "stiffness" = how heavy and how fast you can cut metal. If you can't work as fast as you want with the current lathe, then changing the motor won't fix that. Change the lathe for something stronger - maybe bigger. - Or risk permanent damage to your precision instrument.
> Usually, the safety of the machine from damaging itself is guaranteed by the manufacturer, by the size of the motor. They will never waste money putting on a motor that is big enough to damage the tool. - so you shouldn't. They are experts (not me!) so follow their principles.


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## goldstar31 (Jul 11, 2020)

Sorry to p*** on your parade but I always understood that the 7 had a two speed--- and according to people who actually owned one- bloody expensive to replace when the motor fizzled out.

Way back in the days of the Dodo, I was offered one bust one for almost nothing. Actually I sold him an Axminster 9200, the 9x20. with the myford nose. 

Wasn't the Emco made in Mayrhoffen?  My ( late)  wife now, used to ski the Penken from there. Long before I arrived on the scene.

Am I right?


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## Bentwings (Jul 12, 2020)

goldstar31 said:


> In the days of Yore- those Good old Days,  the average model maker's lathe was powered on line shafting- with a scrapped 1/4HP electric motor. Importantly, it all worked and there was nobody to ask silly questions and to get silly answers. This was the late and much lamented Don L Ashton- who wasn't an engineer but knew more engineering as his books on valve gear are still being used. So there. Don also was a world authority on tugboats, repairing musical instruments and composing music- when he wasn't re-building a full size locomotive.
> He would bore me rigid at 3AM and I would be lulled into sleep.
> 
> So the other one was the much accepted Kenneth C Hart writing as Martin Cleeve on his epic 'Screwcutting in the Lathe and who hadn't enough money to take out a Patent but  drove half a Myford ML7 with line shafting and TWO motors- one a full horse power and the other a 1/3rd one. That was about 1953 if my memory serves me well.
> ...


One of the streetrods1 clubs I hang out with cruises the back roads.you would not believe the collections of just things that we see. We did see a full machine shop driven by line shaft just like the old days. He also had built a steam engine drive for it witthe engine built using all the machines.


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## Steamchick (Jul 13, 2020)

Fred Dibner - renowned Steeplejack in Bolton, Lancashire. UK, did the same to make a workshop (boiler, engine to line-shafting, belt-driven machinery) to re-build his traction engine, and lots of other stuff. His workshop may be a museum now... He did it that way to learn, and because he got it all for scrap or free.
As a steeplejack he was excellent - dropped hundreds of Tall chimney stacks and buildings without explosives or collateral damage. But although he was good at "Street mechanicing" as he called it, he admitted he needed advice from Engineers for the difficult stuff (When his work didn't work properly).


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## Steamchick (Jul 13, 2020)

I have a similar 7 - with 2 speeds. but invariably never need more than the "low speed" 80~1500rpm. from the variable speed controller for the motor. Only drawback s the lack of torque at lower speeds compared to my Mate's geared version which has "huge" torque at lowest gear (for the size of lathe). But for model work I don't need that much torque... rarely have a stall. Just careful size of cut, speed, feed, sharpness and tool selection, etc.
Only replacement parts needed so far = 1 "ON" push-button that blew-up!
K


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