# Advice on Reaching out for employment



## kcmillin (Sep 7, 2010)

OK, For about ten years I have been in the Siding/construction business as part of a LLP.

I have been machining for about 6 years, more so in the last two, and my skills are getting better and better with every project.

There is a company in my town who specialize in making prototypes and small run production for inventors. They also help with design and finding manufactures for these inventors.

Needless to say, I have been pondering the Idea of approaching them for employment for quite some time. It really sounds like a dream job to me. 

However, I have no formal training, I am a diesel tech college dropout and the last ten years just flew by.

My question is, how do I approach these small business owners with my proposal for employment? I have no real resume, other than the projects I have completed. I have $10-$15K worth of my own tools, thats gotta possibly help my chances, right?

Kel


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## kustomkb (Sep 7, 2010)

If you showed up with one (or several) of your fine engines that you have designed and built yourself, I think that is better than a resume any day.

It shows that you are not just looking for a job, but that you are truly passionate about machining.

Plunk one of them down on the owners desk and fire it up. They will be impressed.


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## b.lindsey (Sep 7, 2010)

I'm with Kevin, degrees are plentiful these days, passion isn't !! Definitely take one of your creations. Have they said what they are looking for? Best of luck to you...sounds like it could be a good opportunity.

Bill


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## te_gui (Sep 7, 2010)

One thing to keep in mind, and not trying to ruin your dream at all. The quickest way to ruin a hobby for some folks is to turn it into a profession, especially working for someone else with their own way of doing things. It is a huge plus that the shop you are considering is a short run proto shop. I'm fortunate that with 20 years in the trades both as a machinist and engineer, I only spent a couple months in a pure production environment making hundreds of the same part. I hated every minute of it, but it got me thru until a better position came along. I agree with others that in your case taking a "physical" resume of actual pieces will be your best approach. Most of these types are tinkerers at heart, and a well made model will hook their interest. Once you get in there, make friends with the grumpy old guy over in the corner (every shop has one), keep your mouth shut, and just listen. You will get more out of them, and their stories then any formal machine shop course if they are willing to share.

My two bits,
Brian


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## kcmillin (Sep 7, 2010)

Thanks for the thoughts Kevin, Bill, and Brian.

Brian, the prototyping aspect is a major factor in wanting the employment. A place where I can utilize my creativity is very important to me.

OK, there is a catch here. There is always a catch.

I have no Idea if they are hiring or not. I pretty sure not, but I don't know. I have been drooling over the thought for quite some time, I feel this place is calling me. They are local and I love where I live and never want to leave my town. 

How should I approach them, if they are not advertising for employment?

I gotta say the thought of going there and asking for a job seems a little strange, It will defiantly be a nerve racking experience, I have not been to a job interview in almost 12 years, and this will be no normal interview.

I guess I am just trying to get the courage to do it.

Kel


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## student123 (Sep 7, 2010)

Kel,

Without knowing the company, most of the advice I could give would be guesswork. I quickly looked back to one of your builds & (at a quick glance) it looks like you can do quality work quickly, which I think would be desirable, eg if clients wanted quick variations on prototypes. So you have a plus there.

You could always be a little forward : find a similar company miles away conatct them on the basis of you might move to the area & would they hire. Assuming they say no ask what sort of qualities they would look for. I've no idea if that would work , but it might help with the nerves if nothing else.

On the subject of nerves , we've all had them . i did hear somewhre that
going for a couple of interviews with other companies first might help there, get used to being questioned etc. 

I'm not so sure about offering to work for free, it might inadvertently come across as desparate. Maybe as a last resort ?? just my 10 c. - I've never tried it.

Much can depend just on the chemistry between people.
Of course find out what you can about the company first.

Kel, good luck, you have passion , I hope you get the job.

Mike


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## kcmillin (Sep 7, 2010)

Thanks again everyone for your thoughts. 

Well I went there today, brought in a few of my model engines, they had me setup in the conference room and all the guys came in to see. I felt a little awkward at first, but it was a real ice-breaker. 

I told them my intentions, looking for employment of some sort, they seemed receptive, and told me that I am the type of person they are looking for. (you know, not just looking for a job because I can, but because I really love the work)

 They are not looking for extra help at the moment, however, they do have my contact information and I seemed to have the approval of everyone involved with the company.

They have some pretty cool stuff going on in their shop, some real innovative stuff.


Here is a link to their website.
http://innovativesolutions-llc.com/

Thanks again

Kel


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## zeeprogrammer (Sep 7, 2010)

Best of luck Kel.
I think you did the right thing and did good too!
You didn't just go for an 'interview'...you did a demonstration.
Always nerve-wracking.


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## cidrontmg (Sep 7, 2010)

Kel, I can easily understand why you would love to work for that outfit, I would too! I hope you have already more than one foot inside, and soon join the force. 
 Thm:


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## DavidP (Sep 7, 2010)

Friend of mine trained as an instrument fitter, did 20 years and finished as a Squadron Leader with a desk job. 

When he retired he found a job as a fitter with the medical school at the ANU, and spent the next 20 years doing exacvtly what you aspire to - working with clever people to do one-off designs and builds. My favourite was sittining in his scap box. It was about 20mm dia and 30 long. Inside, it used a lens mounted on 3 differentially heated posts to aim a small laser. Finely controlled current applied to the posts caused them to heat and expand by a calibrated amount - really cool. He siad that there were many better fitter around - his job was to work collaboratively with the researcher to design the best widget for a particular experiment.

The uni jobs don't pay a lot, but they are interesting.


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## Artie (Sep 7, 2010)

Kel, I really admire what you have just done. That takes real balls (brass balls like we can run up on the lathe right?).

From your description you seem to have them interested, hooked, as a fisho would say. Well like a fisho, I think you should keep tension on the line.... even if they are interested by the time it comes to hire someone they may have lost your details etc etc....

I would KEEP IN TOUCH, invent reasons to do this... Ive no idea what but every few months (without making a nuisance of yourself), find a reason to say hello, or show the decision maker something that may interest him/her.

Important point, find out WHO the decision maker is. No point wasting your time with others.

We normally dont hire off the street, my industry requires an education qualification that isnt widely seen. Approx 8 years ago we had a young woman who just approached us, we met with her and she didnt have the quals. Some months later she dropped in to show me her first semester results. 5 months later she did the same with her second semester results..

We hired her.

She left us for bigger things only a few months ago... weve never regretted that decision.

Good luck mate.

Rob


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 7, 2010)

If you don't have a mortgage go for it. If you do, think long and hard. A job thats not fun but gives a steady paycheque puts a roof over your head. A fun job that isn't steady/secure will have you standing in that line down at the sally Anne waiting for your bowl full of mush.---Brian


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## kcmillin (Sep 7, 2010)

Thanks everyone for replying.

Rob, thanks for the advice, I love the fisho analogy. 

Brian, I have indeed considered this, and thank you for a reality check. My decision is not final by any means. I cannot see into the future, and stability is always nice, however my current career as a sider can easily dry up (knock on wood) especially when %95 of my work is new construction single family homes (in the united states) As of yet, the "recession" has not hit us very hard, in fact there is a housing shortage in the north western part of the state due to the oil-fields.(which is another option, but lazy union work is not my cup-O-tea.

Oh, I do have a mortgage, but at just over 400/m it is cheaper than %90 of the renting properties in the citi.


Kel


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## Blogwitch (Sep 7, 2010)

Well done Kel, it takes real grit to cold call like that, and I will tell you now, things like that do make an impression.

I am very lucky, and I actually do what your dream is. But I do it in my own shop.

I am actually back in my shop and working (after a fashion) and the reason I don't show it is because it is actually patent work that I am doing at this time.

You can in fact do it yourself, as long as you don't overstretch yourself with regards to equipment you have. It is no use saying you can do something for a customer, and then find you can't because you need to have a major plant or tooling purchase, and you can't afford it at the time.

If you think you can make a go of it yourself, it is a matter of hard work (you sometimes have to put in long hours, day after day), and getting yourself known.

The work is there, but you need to find it, or make yourself so well known, it comes to you.

Mine used to come mainly thru friends and contacts in business, and once you get known that you do a good job, you will find that sometimes you just can't accept everything that comes your way. Some came from the internet, so showing everything you get up to on websites helps. People wanting help to make something will soon get in touch if they think you can help them. A few years ago, I was even contacted by a US government agency because of what they saw when I posted it on here. I didn't accept it BTW, but did pass it on to someone who I thought would. It seems funny that the US government is interested in what we do, but it seems they are.

Scanning forums for people who require help in your particular field can be very lucrative. The word soon gets about, and you might find that you can get inundated with one particular type of work. I could be working 24 hours a day if I took on all the model steam engine refurbs that I have been asked to do. Most of those requests come from foreign parts, so the word does get about.

Nowadays I am medically retired, so anything that does come in goes to keep my shop stocked up, and I am very choosy about what I take on, I only do it if I think I will get enjoyment from it. If I really wanted to, I could pull a few strings and call in a few favours and I am certain that I could make a full time living at it.

I am not saying dive in and try to go full time on your own straight away, you are liable to fall flat on your face, but search out a few of those little jobs and see if it suits you. As mentioned before, there is great difference between doing it as a hobby, and attempting to put a crust on the table and keeping a roof over your head when there is someone in the background chomping on your a**e asking where his bits are. 

I was/am lucky that it suits me, until you try it, you won't know either way.

Best of luck trying to fulfill your dreams.


Bogs


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## kcmillin (Sep 7, 2010)

Thank you very much for your thoughts Bogs.

I have indeed done small projects for friends and am currently initiating a project for a local hobby shop. It is a start anyway.

I am most confident in my abilities thus far, but I have never had my work inspected, and I am no where near the level to be taking on large jobs. 

My intentions are to learn as much as I can, and then some more. Being able to apply my creativity will greatly improve if I surround myself with people who love the work as much as I do, and learn from them. 

That is why I Joined this forum, and I have not been disappointed, in fact my skill level has jumped a few notches in the 8 months I have been "Enrolled" in the HMEM "School for Model Engine Building"

Kel


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## Blogwitch (Sep 8, 2010)

Kel,

A few years ago, when nitro cars were all the rage, I cashed in on it.

I went to the local model shop and asked what problems they had when setting up their cars. The main concensus was fitting different gear ratios on the axle. I designed and made an ali hub that could take most of the different gearwheels that were then available. It was a matter of just making a disc that fitted to the axle with a load of holes drilled and tapped in it. Between the shop owner and myself, we made a bit of a killing, and I think I ended up making about 1500 of them over a short period. It is little short term jobs like that which can get you known.

Go into small shops locally that make things, say window blinds, and ask them if they need something to help make their job easier. I mentioned window blinds because I made some stretchers for one. When he curved the ali u channel hanging rail, it used to collapse slightly and the blinds wouldn't go around the corners. By making him up a couple of tools like a reverse toolmakers vice, he could widen out the compressed in walls. No more than a couple of hours work for 50 squid in my pocket. He was over the moon because it saved him hours of work.

Once you get known in your local area that you are willing to take on the odd little job, word soon gets around and small retailers will search you out to get those small jobs done.

Small jobs keep the wolf from the door, until the occasional big jobs come in.

Bogs


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## b.lindsey (Sep 8, 2010)

Kel,

Good for you !! Glad to hear it went well and I have no doubt they will remember you when and if something comes open. Best Wishes

Bill


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## shred (Sep 8, 2010)

Even if those guys aren't hiring, one day one of their friends or customers may come by and moan about how they can't find somebody.. then they'll say "hey, this guy that came by here.. give him a call". It's all about the networking these days.


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## kcmillin (Feb 7, 2011)

Well, I am in need of some powder coat, and the folks at this place have some. 

So this is a perfect opportunity to show my face again. 

Last time I was there I forgot to bring anything with my name on it, I had to resort to writing my name on a piece of paper. 

I figured a proper card would be a great thing to bring in. I then started thinking about my new found skill with the DRO and engraving letters in aluminum. 

So here is the "Card" I came up with. I engraved my name and phone number into a 2" x 3" x .1" thick aluminum plate using a manual mill equipped with a computer DRO. 







It will also have magnets on the back, to create a little usability and provide "Advertising" for myself.

I hope it isn't too much.

Kel


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## 1hand (Feb 7, 2011)

Keep after it kel, it will happen. I been trying for the last 3years to go in a totally different direction in work. What drives me to keep going, is the idea I can do it, and it will make a difference. Then the reality check comes along, and and I look a my 3 little kiddos and self employed wife, so haven't yet taken the leap. Some day when the time is right IT WILL HAPPEN.


BTW I currently work for Visa, Mastercard and on occasion Discover. :wall: When my employment here is done I'm Leaping! Thm:


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## Wrist Pin (Feb 8, 2011)

Kel
You have two things going for you.
One: the passion that everyone has already mentioned, (which may or may not temper once you are working for someone else, but you're aware of that).
Second: Very few machinists. Schools don't teach machine shop anymore. I have seen programs on TV about midwest manufacturers having trouble even finding candidates to train! Kids don't want to get dirty these days. They all want to be keyboard jockeys.


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## student123 (Feb 9, 2011)

Kel,

All the more satisfying to do it using a newly acquired skill.

Hope your visit goes well. 

Mike


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## kcmillin (Oct 3, 2011)

How's the old saying go? 

*"Perseverance is Everything" *

Well, today I helped support that phrase. It has been a little over a year since my first visit, and I have been back a few times since. 

Here is there website
http://www.innovativesolutions-llc.com/About Us.htm

Just last week I brought in my resume, and I also included a set of plans for my Tiny Inline 4, as it is indeed relevant for the type of work involved. 

I was told that perhaps in a few months they might have something for me, but today I got the call I have been waiting a long time for, and now tomorrow I will be going in to talk, and write up a temporary contract.

I am very excited, and also very nervous. I am not sure what to expect, but it sounds like I will be working on manual machines, helping them in a busy time. If all goes good, and I prove myself to to them, a more permanent job might be in my future.

I would like to thank everyone for your support, and words of encouragement, it really means a lot. What I learned on this website is priceless, and without a doubt has got me to where I am now.

Now with this incredible opportunity, I just might be able to change my status from amateur to professional.

Thank you all,

Kelly Kubischta


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## kustomkb (Oct 3, 2011)

Congratulations Kelly!

They'd be fools not to snap you up. I know they will be very impressed.

Have fun!


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## lazylathe (Oct 3, 2011)

Excellent news Kelly!!!
Congratulations and best of luck tomorrow!!!!

Andrew


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## cfellows (Oct 3, 2011)

Congratulations, Kel. I'd guess you gotta be excited! Hope it turns out to be everything you hoped for.

Chuck


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## kcmillin (Oct 4, 2011)

Thanks guys,

Less than an hour and I will be there. The butterflies are getting restless.

Kel


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## fcheslop (Oct 4, 2011)

Best wishes Kel and good luck
Frazer


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## tattoomike68 (Oct 4, 2011)

I hope you do well, sounds like you are a go get er. I hope they make you an offer you cant refuse.

Back in 1998 I put my resume online and the phone calls did not stop for a long time, I got calls to work in Korea, the US Mint and other contractors building nuclear power plants. Some offered $10,000 a month and 3 months off every year.

Some times you have to decide if big money is worth more then you staying close to home and being happy.

I chose to stay close to home and dont regret it a bit, big bucks wont make me happy, I like to have family and friends close by.

best wishes Kelly, you will do whats right for you.


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## student123 (Oct 4, 2011)

Great news Kel - congratulations!!

Very best of wishes in your new job.

Mike


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## kvom (Oct 4, 2011)

Maybe you'll be making "pumpkin gutters" all this month.  ;D


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## Maryak (Oct 4, 2011)

Kel,

Nice one :bow: and GOOD LUCK 

Best Regards
Bob


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## kcmillin (Oct 5, 2011)

Thanks again guys!

Well, yesterday went well, very well. After taking with the guys about policies and whatnot I was immediately put to work with a hand grinder to de-bur some parts, and spent the rest of the afternoon doing that.

I showed up today and finished what I had left from yesterday, then I was given a blueprint of a part and was sent to the manual lathe and got to do exactly what I was hoping for. I worked on a couple different projects today, including guide bushings for a 400 ton press, which is shaping up to be a pretty impressive machine.

All in all, I am having a great time, and it sure beats working in the weather. 
I feel quite lucky to have this opportunity, this is indeed a big risk on both sides, but I think I made the right decision.

Kel


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## lazylathe (Oct 5, 2011)

Great news Kel!!! ;D

I know that you will fit right in and get down to doing the work!!!

Congratulations!!!

Andrew


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## ChooChooMike (Oct 5, 2011)

Very cool using the advice from guys here and yer skills & model engines to get in the door. They're a lucky company to have you ! Thm:


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## metalmad (Oct 6, 2011)

Great going Kel
good luck ! 
Pete


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## Foozer (Oct 6, 2011)

kcmillin  said:
			
		

> All in all, I am having a great time, and it sure beats working in the weather.
> 
> Kel



Bismark, in the winter? Ya I think you made a good choice. 

Luck to you

Robert


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## tomfilery (Oct 6, 2011)

Kel,

Excellent news - best of luck in the new job!

I was very taken by your milled business card (on the previous page) and am going to ask a really dumb question, which will doubtless give all the senior members a laugh - how does the DRO allow you to do the diagonals and curved lines so smoothly? If I read correctly (which I might not have done) you said you'd milled the card manually - so I assumed that you meant the machine was not under cnc control. So, how the hell did you do it - or is it some secret destined to be kept forever from us mere mortals? 

Regards Tom


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## kcmillin (Oct 6, 2011)

Thanks a lot everyone, I have to say it is going better than I could have imagined. I was on a manual mill most of the day, and when the little blue light started blinking on the Fadal CNC machine, I would go over and reset the machine with a new set of parts. 



			
				tomfilery  said:
			
		

> So, how the hell did you do it - or is it some secret destined to be kept forever from us mere mortals?
> 
> Regards Tom




It is no secret, I actually made a write-up on the process in this forum.
http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/index.php?topic=12720.0

Kel


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## Blogwitch (Oct 7, 2011)

Well done Kel,

Perseverance and tenacity has really paid off for you.

Now just get in there and show them that you are worth every penny they pay you.

Prove to them that paper qualifications are not the be all and end all of manual engineering. 
OK, they are nice to have, but unless you have the ability to get it from your head to your fingertips, the qualifications are not worth the paper they are printed on.

You have that ability.

Good luck on your new dream venture, and I hope everything works out OK for you.

John


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## ref1ection (Oct 7, 2011)

It's good to hear that the career change has worked out for you. Made the change about a year ago myself. Amazing how much easier it is to get up in the morning to do what you enjoy doing. Enjoy.

Ray


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## kcmillin (Oct 7, 2011)

Thanks Bogs, and Ray.

I am learning that you need to be pretty tall to run a bridgport type milling machine. :big: 

Kel


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## kvom (Oct 7, 2011)

kcmillin  said:
			
		

> Thanks Bogs, and Ray.
> 
> I am learning that you need to be pretty tall to run a bridgport type milling machine. :big:
> 
> Kel


At least for changing tools with a manual draw bar.  ;D


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## rake60 (Oct 7, 2011)

Congrats on the job change Kel!

I'm sure you will enjoy the machining as a professional as much as you do as a hobbyist.

A manual machinist with a few years experience can go just about anywhere in this
country and find a job that pays better than most others.

Rick


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