# Another Flame Eatter



## Gazzaleach (Jan 23, 2013)

_Hello Guys,
                I started this build before i joined this forum and thought it looked simple to build with my limited knowledge i downloaded the plans from Jan Ridder!
Now today i did a little search on this forum and had several hits for this engine and various other`s and was horrified to read that this is no engine for the novice like myself. I have already machined all the large parts this includes the cylinder which from my reading has to be to a very close fit? I have attached some pictures of my cylinder i think my fit should be ok but any advice would be great.

Many thanks Gaz _


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## JaamieG (Jan 23, 2013)

Don't stop now, the first project vary from person to person! So far Your work looks good and you have done what i think is the most difficult part.
I'm not the right person to judge what it is the right project to start since I have done more or less the same like you. I like it, I start it.
I am a novice and as a start I made the Debbie 2-stroke engine (Jan Ridders design). It has been an invaluable journey and i learned a lot and understood where I'm good and where I'm definitively not good.
It took me a long time and still I have to finalize it to really say: I've done it. Why I chose it? Because this was my child dream since I discovered how a 2-stroke work.
At the end most of us do this hobby for its own satisfaction and not to compete with others. Isn't it?
If it doesn't work it is very frustrating but ok, You can always redo the parts when you have mastered the skills.

Cheers,
Giacomo


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## Gazzaleach (Jan 23, 2013)

Thank you giacomo,

I forgot to add that I did buy the bearings form the crankshaft support posts but I find there is too much friction slowing the flywheel down, I thought about making some bronze bushes and remaking the crankshaft from silver steel would this be ok? 

Cheers gaz


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## Omnimill (Jan 23, 2013)

It took a while to get mine running but I got there in the end. If the bearings are too stiff remove any shields/seals and wash the grease out and they'll be fine. The only lubricant you can use on these engines is graphite powder.


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## chucketn (Jan 23, 2013)

Omnimill, by graphite powder, do you mean like the stuff you spray into car door locks to keep them from freezing?

Chuck


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## Omnimill (Jan 23, 2013)

chucketn said:


> Omnimill, by graphite powder, do you mean like the stuff you spray into car door locks to keep them from freezing?
> 
> Chuck



No, I just use the stuff from pencils when I sharpen them. One of my favourites is a Noor Hardtmuth automatic with 5.6mm leads. It has a built in sharpener in the cap. Just sharpen it and tip the contents into the engine bore and work it round a bit!

Ok, don't google Chuck , here it is!

http://www.cultpens.com/acatalog/Koh-I-Noor-5640-Automatic-Pencil.html#a11654



Vic.


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## PeterB (Jan 24, 2013)

You have already done the hard part (the cylinder). If you can make the rest of the parts with same precision then you will get the most exact flame-eater with internal valve on earth :bow:

I got my flame-eater ready for some days ago. And I was very carefully when i built it. It took some time but I can't say it was difficult.
You can see my engine here.


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## Gazzaleach (Jan 24, 2013)

PeterB said:


> You have already done the hard part (the cylinder). If you can make the rest of the parts with same precision then you will get the most exact flame-eater with internal valve on earth :bow:
> 
> [/URL]



_Hi cheers for all the help guys i think my piston and cylinder fit where just a stroke of luck i used an 18mm reamer to size the bore then honed it with a small blue-point brake cylinder hone, and the pistons where some very light cuts to size.

I tried the ball bearings with no seals or grease and they seem no better but i did try the graphite from a pencil on my pistons and they are now free as a bird but still hold compression well. 

I hoping to have all the parts made by this weekend and have a try at starting it.

cheers Gaz_


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## Omnimill (Jan 24, 2013)

I found mine started easier if I warmed the engine up a little first Gaz.


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## Gazzaleach (Jan 24, 2013)

I will keep that in mind many thanks omnmill.

Gaz


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## Omnimill (Jan 24, 2013)

My build is here if it's of help:

http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/f31/another-jan-ridders-flame-eater-8428/


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## Gazzaleach (Jan 25, 2013)

_Cheers omnmill I was unable to find the link for the engine running?. I also really like your setting tool for your Tangential Tool holder I had a set RH/LH given to me for christmas and really enjoy using it.

I had hoped to complete the engine today but due to Mitsubishi l200 taking up my day trying to find a wiring fault, there's always tomorrow and now I have a few more pennies to put towards a DRO for my lathe 

Cheers Gaz_


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## Omnimill (Jan 26, 2013)

Sorry about the link.

http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee286/Arbalist/M2-Computer.mp4


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## Gazzaleach (Jan 26, 2013)

Not to worry I thought I was going mad, I spent two hours today machining the crankshaft support pillars just one hole left to tap and it broke so retire to the house for calm down

Cheers gaz


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## Gazzaleach (Feb 28, 2013)

Ok the engine is all complete now, I purchased some new bearings locally which was great as the ones from eBay where pants. I've moved away from the original design and made my own bearing support posts and fuel cell.
As of yet it will not run it meets all of jans requirements and does try to go but it's unable to maintain the speed, now I've gone for I different size flywheel to increase weight as my one was made from steel and I'm using meths as the fuel?
Bit stuck as to why it will not run I've set the wick in the correct position as said before everything is free.

Anyways I don't really want to waste much more time on this so it will make a nice looking paper weight.

I will upload some pictures later of the finished model

Cheers Gaz


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## Omnimill (Feb 28, 2013)

Ordinary meths is not the best thing to run it on as it's only about 90% proof I think? The best stuff if you can get it is 99% Industrial Meths:

http://www.reagent.co.uk/industrial-methylated-spirits

It will give you a far better chance of getting your engine running. Wick size and flame position is very important as well.

Don't give up! It takes many folks quite a while to get these things to run but once they do they seem fine!


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## Gazzaleach (Feb 28, 2013)

Cheers vic, 
                I am using a 6mm wick I can increase to 8 or 10mm. Cheers for the link on the meths ill see if I can find it locally if to what about propane burner? 

Cheers Gaz


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## Gazzaleach (Feb 28, 2013)

Had a little more time today and changed the wick to a 10mm but still no joy so maybe it does need the 99% meths so will apply for the paper work then order (hopefully)

below is a picture its not yet fully complete still needs the final finishing work but  will do for now. All the material used was recycled so there are some knocks and marks which will come out with a little polishing.

cheers Gaz


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## Cogsy (Mar 5, 2013)

Don't give up, you'll get it to run.

I use normal off-the-shelf meths in mine and it runs fine. I can attest that wick position is critical, and you should try it all over the place. Even minor adjustments can make a huge difference. With mine, the wick must lay flat against the cylinder very slightly in front of the port. Much off this and it won't run at all.

Also, check and recheck your valve timing. Make sure the valve shuts by BDC, and doesn't have too much further it can travel or it will be sucked down the bore which robs some precious vacuum power, as well as adding extra work to be done by the piston driving it back up again.

I spent many hours flipping mine over and over, getting burnt fingers as I made adjustments so small I wasn't even sure I was making them, and getting completely frustrated, until mine finally burst into life. Keep at it, you will get there!


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## Gazzaleach (Mar 5, 2013)

Cheers Cogsy,
                    I shall keep at it, is there a certain a amount of running in required before hand?

cheers Gaz


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## rleete (Mar 5, 2013)

It should turn over with very little friction, but you should feel the vacuum as you turn is over.

Also, it takes a bit of warming up before it will run.  Let the flame sit there for half a minute before you try to turn it over.


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## PeterB (Mar 6, 2013)

Gazzaleach said:


> Cheers vic,
> I am using a 6mm wick I can increase to 8 or 10mm.



Hi Gazzaleach
I took some pictures of mine flame eater so you can see the size of the flame.
I changed the design of the bearing support. Instead of drilling holes, I used the mill so I now can move the flywheel and adjust the position of the piston. It was a smart ide because it make big differense on the engine.

My first atempt to start the engine was a success, but it took ca 2 minutes to warm it up so it could begin to run. When I changed the flywheels position it started immediatly (when the engine was cold).


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## Gazzaleach (Mar 6, 2013)

Cheers guys, 

Peterb now that you have moved your flywheel where is bdc on your engine ie from end of piston skirt to the end of the cylinder, I have a massive flame just lie that as said it does try and run, if you move the flame away the sound changes and the rpm drop very quickly.

Cheers Gaz


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## PeterB (Mar 6, 2013)

Here is a pic that shows the positon of the piston and valve when the piston is in the cylinders bottom.
The friction must be very low. My engine will turn up to 13 times when i flip the flywheel without any fire. And when I adjust the flywheel/piston, I can get the engine to reverse when it is running. So the posibility to adjust the piston is very good.


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## PeterB (Mar 6, 2013)

Gazzaleach - I can see on your picture that your burner is locked in possition. That´s not good. You must have the possibility to move the flame. It seems like the flame/air mixture must be very exact. The temperature is not the same on the flame so the distance of the flame to the inlett must be variable.

When i run my engine I must move the burner several times to compensate the difference in temperatur in the flame so I got the right mixture.

When I've cleand the piston, valve and inside of the cylinder the engine behave different and I must adjust the valve again to get a nice run.

I think this information is good for you so you know that this engine is tricky


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## PeterB (Mar 6, 2013)

And here is a pic and a video so you can see when the flame sucks in to the cylinder.


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## Gazzaleach (Mar 8, 2013)

Thank you peterb for going to all the trouble, I dont think friction is a problem on my engine as its free and i do have vacuum it has to be the flame and position, i fixed my in place following images of others but its no hassle to make a new fuel cell so that it can be adjustable.

I will post an update shortly.

cheers Gaz


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