# Look what was in the Loft, a BTM lathe



## tmuir (Mar 26, 2008)

This watch makers lathe was my great grandfathers which unfortunately was given to me when I was 14 years old with no instructions and no-one to show me how to use it.
So of course I broke it and it was stashed away for the next 20 odd years until I dragged it out again the other day.

For those that don't know the BTM lathe is a copy of a German lathe as for some odd reason German lathes were hard to obtain in the UK during the early to mid 1940s. ;D

Well enough chat and time for some pictures.






The complete kit with some pliers placed on the bench to give you some idea how small this lathe is.

The box of goodies.





A close up of the chuck and tool rests.









A close up of the offending part that made it be put away 20 odd years ago.
This little pin has the smallest diameter offset from the rest so when it is rotated it locks the top slide at the angle you want to set it at.
Its hard to see in the photo but its bent at the end because as a stupid kid I just forced the top slide to what ever angle I wanted and bent it.
Once I get my dial indicator which I've got on back order at my local shop it should be a quick job to turn up a new pin on my new lathe and then I can see about restoring the rest of the lathe.

If anyone has some good tips about what is the best oil to use to prevent further rust and what is the best way to remove the very minor surface rust of the parts they would be greatly appreciated.


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## cfellows (Mar 26, 2008)

See if you can find a book on Horology. I have old one at home that is all about using a watchmakers lathe and all the attachments. I'll get the title and author for you when I get home tonight.

Chuck


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## tmuir (Mar 26, 2008)

Is the book your thinking of
'The Watchmaker's and Model Engineer's Lathe, A Users Manual' by Donald De Carle?
I've got a copy of that and it is good but if you know of another one I would be interested.


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## cfellows (Mar 26, 2008)

My book is called Practical Benchwork for Horologists. It was written by Louis and Samuel Levin, ostensibly from the Levin Lathe company. It was published in 1950, is hardbound, and has 381 pages. I did a google search and found this site that has several copies of the book for sale:

http://www.alibris.co.uk/search/books/qwork/5276696/used/Practical%20benchwork%20for%20horologists

Chuck


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## tmuir (Mar 27, 2008)

Thanks for that.
I've written the title down and will see if I can track a copy down locally.


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## rake60 (Mar 27, 2008)

Here's a link to a page with a little bit of history on your lathe.
http://www.lathes.co.uk/btm/

Rick


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## tmuir (Mar 29, 2008)

Thanks for the link.
I'm told my Dial Indicator should be in on Monday so hopefully next week I will find time to make a new locking pin for it.


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## steamer (Mar 31, 2008)

That doesn't look so bad to make..Straight forward turning with an eccentric at one end ...give it a go, you have nothing to lose.


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## gilessim (Mar 31, 2008)

I was given a box of bits for a lathe similar to yours ,Shaubel I think these are, I've seen quite a few watchmakers lathes like that on ebay here in Italy and they go for quite a price! ,try searching "tornio da orologiaio" on ebay and see what you get.

Giles


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## tmuir (Mar 31, 2008)

gilessim  said:
			
		

> I was given a box of bits for a lathe similar to yours ,Shaubel I think these are, I've seen quite a few watchmakers lathes like that on ebay here in Italy and they go for quite a price! ,try searching "tornio da orologiaio" on ebay and see what you get.
> 
> Giles



I know, I looked into what it was worth a while back and I know its worth more than my big lathe. 
I did toy with the idea of selling it but as it was my great grandfathers I decided I would rather restore it and use it especially as I have most of the basic watch making tools and watch repair books dating back to the 1890s.

I've already seen how useful it would be to help me finish off small parts after I've parted them off on my big lathe so I'm looking forward to fixing it.


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## gilessim (Apr 1, 2008)

tmuir  said:
			
		

> I know, I looked into what it was worth a while back and I know its worth more than my big lathe.
> I did toy with the idea of selling it but as it was my great grandfathers I decided I would rather restore it and use it especially as I have most of the basic watch making tools and watch repair books dating back to the 1890s.
> 
> I've already seen how useful it would be to help me finish off small parts after I've parted them off on my big lathe so I'm looking forward to fixing it.



I was tempted to get one ,in fact I put in a bid but someone got there first!, I do have a little Taig ,aswell as a bigger lathe, which I use all the time for tiny stuff, it's super precise so it's fine for me, so I can't really! justify another small lathe!

I didn't mean to say that you should sell it! ,just that it's a very nice and valuable item! especially as it was your great grandfathers, I have some squares and other tools that my grandad made in 1910-1911 from old files and stuff when he was an apprentice and I still use some of them.

My Great Grandfather was Mr.Brown of Brown and May of Devises UK, they made stationary engines and traction engines, there are still 30 or so around the world some in Aus. and NZ I think, my mum still has some old drawings and plans!

Giles


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## alan2525 (Apr 22, 2008)

tmuir  said:
			
		

> This watch makers lathe was my great grandfathers which unfortunately was given to me when I was 14 years old with no instructions and no-one to show me how to use it.
> So of course I broke it and it was stashed away for the next 20 odd years until I dragged it out again the other day.
> 
> For those that don't know the BTM lathe is a copy of a German lathe as for some odd reason German lathes were hard to obtain in the UK during the early to mid 1940s. ;D
> ...



You could try a rust remover for the most corroded parts, something like Evapo-Rust. Are you going to spend a while restoring the lathe, if so it'd be nice to get an idea of how it's put together, take it apart and get familiar with how it functions and get it all painted up and fettled!

Things like chucks can be dissasembled and re greased, should be a fun little restoration job! As far as lubing it all up, I'd use a medium weight way oil, but any light oil will do the trick, just make sure it has some on it, that'll stop it rusting again.


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## shred (Aug 1, 2009)

As mentioned in another thread I noticed New England Brass and Tool had a 'Garvin' RCMT round-insert lathe profile tool (http://brassandtool.com/Metal-Cutting.html). I'd been eying them since Bogs first raved posted about them but they're not as easy to come by in the US as across the pond.. 

Anyway, I got the '8mm' size to try out. 8mm is the shank size. US readers can think '5/16" toolbit'-size. The insert is an 0602 RCMT; approximately 6mm diameter, available at some tool places and occasionally on eBay.  You get the holder, 1 insert and wrench. The quarter is not included and shown for scale, The usual plastic telescoping box is included but not shown. It's not a complex toolholder- no insert seats or funky angles or anything, so it wouldn't be difficult to make one if you were so inclined and had the inserts, but this one is well made and not very expensive.



8mm is the larger of the two shanks offered. It fits in my Taig toolpost as well as any larger lathe, so I'm not sure who the 6mm version is aimed at. The 8mm looks a little small in my 12x36 BXA/200-size QC toolpost, but seems to work ok.

Here's my first doodling around with a scrap of 1" 12L14 rod. No chatter even on full width cuts. It's super easy to turn a nice decorative cut, flare or transition, and the surface finish is nice as well.


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