# T head engine by Brian



## Brian Rupnow (Jul 6, 2021)

Today seen the beginning of a new engine.---The design phase, at least. After recently seeing  an Upshur T head coming together on  HMEM and a post by Vederstein about  building a T head engine I thought that would be an interesting engine to design and build. I'm in no rush to start building, but I know how that generally works. I spent most of today bringing the design along to this stage, and will probably finish up the cylinder head tomorrow.


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## Vietti (Jul 6, 2021)

Older Gravely garden tractors with the Gravely T head engine might be something to look at if there is one near you.  They also had a nifty oil pump that supplied the entire drive train, the Rolls Royce of garden tractors!


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 7, 2021)

Great progress made this morning. I decided to keep the engine air cooled. I think the grooves in the cylinder and cylinder head look good.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 7, 2021)

Okay---We've got a carburetor, carb adapter, heavier crankshaft and an exhaust system. Also a set of tappet guides and two very long valves, riding in valve cages. Tomorrow I will stick a set of points and an ignition cam on it, and probably a gas tank.


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## jkimberln (Jul 7, 2021)

Don't go too fast on this one....I'm not quite done with the last one  I see the flywheels are the same as the last one and I hope the gears are 24 DP since I now have a gear hob for my hobbing machine.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 7, 2021)

I only ever use 24dp gears, because I have a complete set of cutters that size. And no, I won't be hurrying.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 8, 2021)

The Tee Head engine design is finished. Fortunately, I was able to sneak the ignition points and condenser in behind one flywheel (which is hidden in this model), without offsetting the flywheel any. I also added a gas tank and a pleasant looking mounting bracket. None of the detail drawings are made yet, but the design is finished, so detail drawings are pretty simple now.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 8, 2021)

-I added some valve springs for you.---Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 9, 2021)

Now we have an oil filler tube for the wet sump, a drain, and some totally awesome gear guards. Other than keeping your fingers out of the gears, these gear guards cut down a lot of the noise from the gears meshing.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 11, 2021)

I was getting bored. Oh Oh--I'm having machining withdrawal. I haven't built anything since I made a set of rings that worked. I went and seen my favorite material guy and paid $25 for a piece of 6" x 1" x 12" long piece of aluminum.  A couple of days drilling, tapping, counterboring, sawing, and milling work has yielded the main frame of my t-head engine. I have a visiting grandson from out of town, so might not machine anything more for a few days. Damn, I like a day spent in my shop!!!


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## Gordon (Jul 11, 2021)

You make me feel inadequate. You seem to be able to machine parts in just a fraction of the time it takes me. The parts also seem to come out looking good and without mistakes.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 11, 2021)

Gordon---You don't have to be a really good machinist to do what I do. You just have to be a little bit crazy.---Brian


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## Gordon (Jul 11, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Gordon---You don't have to be a really good machinist to do what I do. You just have to be a little bit crazy.---Brian


If being a little bit crazy were the qualification I would be over qualified.


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## Gordon (Jul 11, 2021)

Actually I know why my projects take so long. I am too cautious and do not take aggressive enough cuts and I am too easily distracted. After so many years of having to make good time in order to make money I have finally at a point that I can just kind of diddle around. I find it very liberating and it took me quite a while to get to that point.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 12, 2021)

I hate chain drilling!!! The original plan was to bolt this part to the faceplate and bore it out to the required size. Sadly, my lathe which is supposed to swing 12" really only swings about 11 1/2" so, it has been chain drilled instead. Now to knock the piece out and smooth up the resulting mess. I hope that I can tie this part to my rotary table to clean everything up.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 12, 2021)

I would have had to build some more fixturing to mount this on my rotary table. This is where my oscillating drum sander really pays for itself. The curved area is non critical, just a visual thing, and this took about five minutes on the oscillating drum sander.


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## CFLBob (Jul 12, 2021)

The layout of the drill holes looks like _that_ was done on a rotary table.  

Was that done manually or by calculating X and Y values to set the hand wheels?


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 12, 2021)

No rotary table work in that at all.  That was all drilled on my mill, using my DRO's. The two 1/4" holes near the bottom were drilled and reamed with the two pieces clamped together. Two dowels were inserted to lock the two plates to each other, and all holes were drilled and the profiles machined while locked together. One plate is drilled and tapped, one plate has clearance holes and counterbores. The way to do that is to put the tap drill thru both pieces. Then the clearance and counterbores are put in to the correct depth, then the hole is threaded. That way everything is a perfect match. I am a firm believer in using layout dye, and all of my holes are marked out before going near the mill. Once set up on the mill and the piece is located using my edge finder, I use the DRO's to position things. If they don't match up with what I have previously marked out, that lets me know if something is wrong before I make a mistake. If I had to count turns and partial turns of the handles it would take me at least four times as long.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 12, 2021)




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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 13, 2021)

Well, so far, so good. The cylinder base mounts to the main chassis. Depending on what my wife has planned for me today, I might even get a cylinder up there.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 13, 2021)

We have a cylinder. It is pretty, it fits where it's supposed to, and after honing the bore with a 3 stone brake hone it measures about 1.001" bore. That's all for today folks. I will get some mounting holes drilled in the cylinder tomorrow.---Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 14, 2021)

Due to the way this engine is constructed, the swing of the con rod would hit the side of the cylinder bore on it's way to bottom dead center. This cavity in the bottom of the piston aligns with the cavity in the bottom plate which bolts to it, to give clearance for the swing of the connecting rod.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 14, 2021)

And---The miserable piggy of the day award goes out to this cylinder head. It is finished except for the cutting of the cooling fins, but I've managed to put in an entire day on this part. Some days you eat the bear----Some days the bear eats you!!! The bear eat me today on this part, but I'm pleased with it.


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## werowance (Jul 15, 2021)

just posting so that i am "subscribed" to this build and get notifications of updates on it.

looking good Brian.


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## Gordon (Jul 15, 2021)

FYI At the top right corner of the thread you can click on "watch" I just discovered that recently.


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## werowance (Jul 15, 2021)

i did not know that.  thank you.

but still good to let Brian know we are watching.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 15, 2021)

Today I built the cylinder head for my engine. I still have to put the slots in the cylinder head and plate right below it to make cooling fins.  The only aluminum part left to build now is the gas tank mount. So, I basically have a whole engine here in six parts. Tomorrow I hope to cut the cooling fins and make the gas tank mount, then it will be on to mechanical things.


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## SirJohn (Jul 15, 2021)

Brian did I miss something but Is that a second cylinder sitting on the bench beside your project?
John


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 15, 2021)

Yes, it is a cylinder, but no, it has nothing to do with this current engine. It is a cylinder from a different engine. I am neck deep in small i.c. engine parts here.


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## phred (Jul 16, 2021)

Hi Brian,
Just saw the news about Barrie, hope you and yours are safe and well.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 16, 2021)

We are safe and well here. The tornado was on the far side of town. Had some very heavy rain here but that's all. 
We now have "fins" in the cylinder heads. They were cut in using a 0.094" slitting saw. I have to go now and introduce myself to Mr. Lawnmower and Mrs. Whippersnipper. My yard is starting to get a bit jungly with all the rain we've been having.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 16, 2021)

Today I went to see my nut and bolt guys, and replenished some shcs that I was getting low on. Also bought the two shoulder bolts that will support the cam gears. Found time to make a gas tank mount. Now all of the aluminum parts of the engine main body are finished. Tomorrow I may dive into the mechanical parts.---Brian


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## Sprocket (Jul 16, 2021)

Saw something about a tornado in Barrie, Ontario. Was it anywhere near you?


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 16, 2021)

It was on the other side of town from where I lived.---Wife and I were over there driving about 5 minutes before the tornado touched down. Unbelievable rainfall, but we were out of there just minutes before the wind damage.


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## vederstein (Jul 17, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Today seen the beginning of a new engine.---The design phase, at least. After recently seeing  an Upshur T head coming together on  HMEM and a post by Vederstein about  building a T head engine I thought that would be an interesting engine to design and build. I'm in no rush to start building, but I know how that generally works. I spent most of today bringing the design along to this stage, and will probably finish up the cylinder head tomorrow.



Brian,

I'm sure you'll have no problem with this engine.  My issue was getting the valves to seal any you've done so many gas engines that portion should be cake for you...

Ved.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 17, 2021)

Here I am, waling away on a piece of 2 1/2" diameter hot rolled to make the 50 tooth gears from. The o.d. of those gears is 2.166" x 1/4" thick plus 7/8" diameter hub on one side.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 18, 2021)

Got up nice and early this morning and cut both 50 tooth gears. Everything worked out nice, no extra teeth. Maybe I'll do the 25 teeth gears tomorrow. It has been a lovely day here, had a family birthday party for my daughter and I  out in my backyard. There are twelve of us now in the family. I'm the oldest at 75, Davy's the youngest at 1 1/2 years.


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## Gordon (Jul 18, 2021)

Brian: 
A couple of kind of an unrelated questions:

-What do you use to index gears when you cut them? I frequently use my spin indexer but that works only for 1 degree increments or evenly divided into 360 so I would tend to go for 48 tooth and 24 tooth.

-I assume that the alum box with the switch and handle is an ignition box. I assume that it contains an automotive coil and condenser hooked to a 6 volt or 12 volt battery to work with automotive points.


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## SirJohn (Jul 18, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Got up nice and early this morning and cut both 50 tooth gears. Everything worked out nice, no extra teeth. Maybe I'll do the 25 teeth gears tomorrow. It has been a lovely day here, had a family birthday party for my daughter and I  out in my backyard. There are twelve of us now in the family. I'm the oldest at 75, Davy's the youngest at 1 1/2 years.


Brian, when you get time I would be interested in knowing what equipment is required to cut gears. Bevel  gears obviously must use a different technique and cutter?   You seem to make it sound so simple but I am thinking it is only be because you know what you are doing, but it is still a machining mystery to me.
John


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 18, 2021)

I cut my gears using a rotary table with indexing plates and  a set of 8 different gear cutters, which are mounted to the spindle of my vertical mill. Each gear cutter covers a range of pitch diameters, so it is not a "one size fits all" kind of thing. There are charts available for a rotary table telling which index plate to use and how many turns and part turns of the handle on the rotary table to move it thru the correct number of degrees of arc to yield the correct number of "teeth" for a specified pitch diameter. It sounds far more complex than it really is.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 18, 2021)

Gordon---Your very close about the ignition box. It contains a 12 volt coil and an on/off switch, and wire leads which are attached to a 12 volt battery. The points and condenser are mounted on the engine, and there is a cable with an alligator clamp at each end to run from the chassis of the engine down to the negative post on the battery.


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## Gordon (Jul 18, 2021)

I have a similar setup except that I have the condenser in the box and a gel battery inside the box. Actually I have two of them. I have a 6v and a 12v. The 6v battery is probably 5+ years old and I will have to change the battery because it will not hold a charge. I also have terminals to provide 6 volts when I use something like a TIM 6 ignition.


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## Gordon (Jul 18, 2021)

I have used this idea several times for odd gear teeth. I have had good luck and the plates are not that difficult to make.

When using my rotary table I tend to forget how many turns etc and end up getting to the last tooth and have a gap or cut a partial tooth. 









						5C Spindexer Indexer
					

A few weeks ago I proposed a follow along project on my YouTube channel oxtools. A viewer suggested an interesting problem involving indexin...




					oxtool.blogspot.com


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 18, 2021)

My rotary table has a set of bronze, adjustable "fingers" that are spring loaded against the face of the divider plate. You adjust them to uncover the number of holes that you want that are not a full 360 degrees of rotation. For instance, the 50 tooth gear I just cut was a result of turning the handle on the rotary table one full turn and 16/20 of a second turn. Every time I cut a tooth, I would advance these "sector fingers" so they were up against the engagement pin.--This automatically tells me which hole I must engage with the pin every time I advance the rotary table handle.---This is probably the worst explanation of this process that has ever been written down, but unless I do something really strange, it ensures good gears every time.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 18, 2021)

Holy Gas Tank, Batman---Were going to try something a little different. I've made about two dozen gas tanks. Many had the end plates silver soldered in place. A roll of silver solder costs about $100 here.  Then I found out that I can J.B. Weld the endplates in and they never leak, but you have to be aware of your construction procedure and have any other soldering or welding finished before you use the J.B. Weld. Tomorrow, I am going to Tig weld the endplates into this tank. Of course there will be a bit of prep work first, probably a counterbore in each end of the pipe, and endplates made with a decent chamfer for the weld to fill. I'll let you know how that turns out.


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## GailInNM (Jul 19, 2021)

SIRJOHN,
You mentioned cutting bevel gears in a previous post.
Miter, bevel and skew bevel gears can be cut with the same standard involute cutters used for spur gears. They have a different tooth form than the commercial bevel gears that can only be cut by a generating process, but are just as effective. The process is not a lot more difficult than tat for cutting spur gears.
We had a thread on cutting them about 10 years ago. It is at:





						Bevel Gear Cutting With Involute cutters
					

I have recently purchased a set of 48DP 14.5 degree involute gear cutters.  Are there any formulas for the required dimentions of the blank, like there is for standard gears?   What should the major diameter be? And how do you determine what the major diameter is?  Are the angles arbitrary?  Can...




					www.homemodelenginemachinist.com


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 19, 2021)

Damn, I just lost an entire post.---Here we go again. The tig welding turned out very nice. No, it's not the perfectly overlapping "fish scale" pattern that a professional welder would lay down, but it works for me. A bit of clean-up on the lathe and it should be a beautiful thing. I simply can not afford the $$$ for brass, so I will be painting the gas tank and the flywheels in some complimentary colour.


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## LorenOtto (Jul 19, 2021)

Looks good to me.  Keep up the good work.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 19, 2021)

And it's a lovely thing, what a bit of lathe and file work will do to finish off a welded gas tank.


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## awake (Jul 19, 2021)

Brian, I made my only gas tank to date as a TIG weldment - works just fine.


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## CFLBob (Jul 19, 2021)

That's like a night or day difference in appearance.


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## Larry G. (Jul 19, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> And it's a lovely thing, what a bit of lathe and file work will do to finish off a welded gas tank.


That looks like the perfect candidate for some homebrew anodizing.
There are many articles and videos online.
The equipment and supplies are trivial and inexpensive.
Rubber gloves and protective glasses highly recommended.

Larry in Rutherford, NJ


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## Larry G. (Jul 19, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> My rotary table has a set of bronze, adjustable "fingers" that are spring loaded against the face of the divider plate. You adjust them to uncover the number of holes that you want that are not a full 360 degrees of rotation. For instance, the 50 tooth gear I just cut was a result of turning the handle on the rotary table one full turn and 16/20 of a second turn. Every time I cut a tooth, I would advance these "sector fingers" so they were up against the engagement pin.--This automatically tells me which hole I must engage with the pin every time I advance the rotary table handle.---This is probably the worst explanation of this process that has ever been written down, but unless I do something really strange, it ensures good gears every time.



A corollary to "the worst explanation" is that you CANNOT use your common calculator to determine the correct number of turns and holes.  
You MUST use proper fractions.
Ask your kids in elementary school for help, as long as they don't yet allow calculators in class.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 20, 2021)

The outer diameter of the crankshaft bearings have been coated with J.B. Weld and located in their bores. Before it has had any chance to set-up, a 1/2" diameter cold rolled shaft has been ran thru both bearings, and the two halves of the crankcase have been reassembled with locating pins and bolts. The two 25 tooth gears were finished this morning and then slid over the ends of the shaft to make sure that they mounted and meshed properly with the camshaft gears.---They do!!!


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## Gordon (Jul 20, 2021)

Larry G. said:


> A corollary to "the worst explanation" is that you CANNOT use your common calculator to determine the correct number of turns and holes.
> You MUST use proper fractions.
> Ask your kids in elementary school for help, as long as they don't yet allow calculators in class.


I just ordered a set of three plates for my rotary table. Is there a chart available which would give settings or some type of calculator or a formula? So far I have not found anything. I can find some for 40 turn tables but mine is 90 turn.


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## awake (Jul 20, 2021)

Gordon said:


> I just ordered a set of three plates for my rotary table. Is there a chart available which would give settings or some type of calculator or a formula? So far I have not found anything. I can find some for 40 turn tables but mine is 90 turn.



The formula is fairly straightforward. Here's how to derive it: For a gear with N teeth, you need your table to rotate 1/N revolution each time. Meanwhile, it requires 90 turns of the input handle to achieve 1 revolution of the table (this is for your 90-turn table - change 90 to 40 or 60 or whatever the ratio is for any given table). Thus, you need to turn the input handle 90 / N turns each time. Work this out as a simplified fraction, as was noted above.

Example: You want to make a 48 gear tooth on your 90-turn table. You need to turn the input handle 90 / 48 times per tooth.

90 / 48 = 1 + 42 / 48 turns = 1 + 7 / 8 turns (simplify the fraction), so 1 complete revolution of the input handle plus 7 / 8 of a complete revolution. Do you have a division plate with 8 holes? No? How about something with a multiple of 8, maybe 16 or 24? Let's say you have a 16-hole plate. 16 x 7/8 = 14. So the final answer is, for each tooth, you need to turn 1 + 14 / 16 revolutions. To accomplish that, you will set the sector arms to expose 14 + 1 holes - 1 for the pin to start in, and 14 more for the fractional turn. Turn the input handle until you can drop the pin in the first hole exposed by the sector arms. Take your first cut. Now turn the input handle one complete revolution and then turn it further until the pin drops in the last hole exposed by the sector arms. Move the sector arm assembly so that this hole is now the first hole exposed. Make your next cut. Rinse and repeat.

Consider how this would work for a gear with > 90 teeth. Let's say you need to cut a 100-tooth gear. Once again, the formula is simply 90 / N = 90 / 100 = 9 / 10. Thus, you need to turn the input handle 9 / 10 of a revolution each time. You will need to find a division plate with holes that equal a multiple of 10 - perhaps you have a 20-hole plate. 20 x 9 / 10 = 18. Set up your sector arms to expose 18 + 1 holes, allowing you to move the pin 18 holes from its current location. This time you will not turn a complete revolution plus the fraction; you will only turn the fraction.


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## Gordon (Jul 20, 2021)

Thanks. I think I understand. I will have to go over that a couple of times but it sounds pretty straight forward.


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## skyline1 (Jul 20, 2021)

Gordon try this one it worked for me
CGTK - Dividing Head Calculator

I have a 90 to 1 too with a full set of plates and I wanted to cut a 20 DP 65 tooth.  It's a replacement bull wheel for an ML7, I can't find one anywhere, mortality rate on them is very high, it's a known design fault on these lathes.

I tried all sorts of permutations and I couldn't find an answer but this calculator managed to solve it.

You need to set it to custom and enter your ratio and a list of your division circles

Best Regards Mark


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## bb218 (Jul 21, 2021)

Think of it this way, if you have a 36 hole plate if you go every 40 holes you will end up with 36 divisions.  With the 90 table every 90 holes around a 36 hole plate will give 36 divisions.  Likewise in the example with the 65 tooth and a 90 turn table with a 65 hole plate every 90 holes would give 65 teeth. Since the chance of having a 65 hole plate is slim find a number that will divide into both the 65 divisions and the 90.  5 will work so, divide the 65 by 5 and the 90 by 5 so with a 13 hole plate every 18 holes would give 65 divisions.     Mike


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## skyline1 (Jul 21, 2021)

Thanks Mike

Divide by 5 "Doh" I must do some more practice with fractions !

Sadly my plates start at 15, which is infuriating. If I only had a thirteen.

according to the calculator 39 also works (it's 3 x 13) it gives 1 turn and 15 holes or 54 holes (3 x 18) and I do have a 39 hole plate.

Best Regards Mark


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## djswain1 (Jul 21, 2021)

Gordon said:


> I just ordered a set of three plates for my rotary table. Is there a chart available which would give settings or some type of calculator or a formula? So far I have not found anything. I can find some for 40 turn tables but mine is 90 turn.


Brian great Job you are doing there yet again.
I hope you don't object too much to these replies to Gordon in the middle of your thread.

Gordon l used my "new to me" rotary table and dividing plates for the first time at the weekend.
It came with some instructions and has the 90:1 ratio. See the attached pictures.
Cheers, Dave.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 21, 2021)

Things are going to slow down for a little while. One of my old customers has come foreword with a request for some new welding fixtures for one of the big three automotive companies. It's design only stuff. Fabrication will be done elsewhere. I'm not sure just how much work there will be, but probably not much.---It would be nice if there was a couple of weeks work---that would buy me a new metal cutting bandsaw. My current bandsaw is an old woodcutting saw that I modified to cut metal. It works, but it is painfully slow.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 22, 2021)

The welding fixture is completely designed and sent to my customer, who has to go to his customer for "design review". After that has happened I will complete it and make detail drawings.---Now--Back to my own stuff. I finished the welding fixture design about noon today, and spent the rest of the day machining valve cages. In a perfect world, they would be a press fit into the head. In the real world, you can't press them too hard because they are made of brass. So, they are coated with #638 Loctite and lightly pressed into place with my shop vice. After they set up for 24 hours or more I will drill the intake and exhaust port thru the cylinder head and the valve cages at the same time. I have not used my special valve guide cutting tool yet to prepare the seats to mate with the valves. That is just about the only thing left to do to the valve cages. I will make the valves later today or perhaps tomorrow. I did stop by my metal suppliers today and picked up a foot of 1 1/2" diameter "stress-proof steel to machine a one piece crankshaft from.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 23, 2021)

Todays nifty trick was to machine a pair of tappet guides. They set between the 50 tooth gears and the sides of the engine frame. They have a 7/8" clearance hole on center to clear the cams, and there will be a 5/16" i.d. sintered bronze bushing pressed into the hole in the top of them to guide the tappets which ride on the cam. The cam is attached to the side of the 50 tooth gear.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 24, 2021)

I had to take my chainsaw over to my oldest son's place and play "Johnny Lumberjack" this morning and take out a couple of big trees for him. This left me with a bad case of "lazyitis" this afternoon, so I made two parts for my engine that didn't require a lot of thought. The brass part is the adapter for the Traxxas carburetor, the aluminum piece is the exhaust.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 24, 2021)

Ah Heck---I couldn't wait to see how they looked on the engine, so I tapped the cylinder head and installed them!!!


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 25, 2021)

I ran into something a bit strange yesterday. When I threaded the ends of the exhaust and carb adapter for the engine yesterday, the parts were held in the lathe chuck and the die was held in a collet in the tailstock chuck. No problems were encountered, I even ran a standard 3/8"-16 nut up the thread to ensure that everything was Kosher. When the cylinder head was tapped 3/8"-16 it was held in the milling machine vice and threaded by hand with a tap and standard handle. After screwing things together yesterday afternoon, they were crooked!! It doesn't show in the picture I posted, but they were quite visually crooked. I didn't want the Loctite to set up, so I disassembled things. This morning I held the cylinder head in my mill vice and a tap in the milling machine spindle and turned the spindle by hand, and the tap was cutting metal. I ran the tap in until it bottomed out, removed it, and cleaned up the ends of the cylinder head. I then held the inlet (carb adapter) in the chuck of the milling machine, applied a bit more Loctite and turned the spindle until the shoulders on both pieces were touching each other. I must have had the tap turned at an angle when I first threaded these parts. I would stand and deny that I would make such a dumb mistake, but I can't figure out what else it could have been.


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## CFLBob (Jul 25, 2021)

Thanks for the confession.  I personally learn more from reading about mistakes than just marveling at well-machined parts.  

Do you think something like one of those tap guides that's basically a clearance hole in piece of thick stock to keep the tap perpendicular would help?  Those seem to depend on the work having nice flat surfaces to sit it on.  You mentioned the cylinder head being on the mill the first time you tapped it; would something held in the spindle to indicate being perpendicular help?


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 25, 2021)

It hasn't been a horrible morning, but it sure as heck hasn't been productive. I have one valve to show for it. Beside the valve sets a piece with a 0.1875" hole reamed thru it to check the valve stem for when it is exactly the right size. I can't even begin to tell you why it took so long, but suffice it to say, I've never sanded on anything in my life as much as that valve stem to bring it down to size. I did use a live center in the tailstock to keep the outboard end from flexing while the valve was machined. Maybe tomorrow I'll get lucky and make another valve.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 25, 2021)

Bob--Most times, if the tapped hole is deep enough, the tap will pull itself straight as it goes in.  These holes were very shallow, and consequently they stayed a bit crooked.  I never use tap guides, and I seldom put a tap in the mill quill. Sometimes that comes back and bites me.


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## CFLBob (Jul 25, 2021)

After breaking off too many taps I started trying to tap on the mill, usually with the drill chuck holding a 1/8" dowel pin.  That size because it fits in the tap wrench when its holding smaller taps and it will touch the top of the tap.  Most of those have a square section with a point in the middle.  I've used that to make sure it stays perpendicular for the first couple of turns.  It sounds like this might keep me safe.


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## Richard Hed (Jul 25, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> I ran into something a bit strange yesterday. When I threaded the ends of the exhaust and carb adapter for the engine yesterday, the parts were held in the lathe chuck and the die was held in a collet in the tailstock chuck. No problems were encountered, I even ran a standard 3/8"-16 nut up the thread to ensure that everything was Kosher. When the cylinder head was tapped 3/8"-16 it was held in the milling machine vice and threaded by hand with a tap and standard handle. After screwing things together yesterday afternoon, they were crooked!! It doesn't show in the picture I posted, but they were quite visually crooked. I didn't want the Loctite to set up, so I disassembled things. This morning I held the cylinder head in my mill vice and a tap in the milling machine spindle and turned the spindle by hand, and the tap was cutting metal. I ran the tap in until it bottomed out, removed it, and cleaned up the ends of the cylinder head. I then held the inlet (carb adapter) in the chuck of the milling machine, applied a bit more Loctite and turned the spindle until the shoulders on both pieces were touching each other. I must have had the tap turned at an angle when I first threaded these parts. I would stand and deny that I would make such a dumb mistake, but I can't figure out what else it could have been.


Many years ago (probably before you were born) I happened to have bought a thread gage from Sears.  The 3/8ths - 24 was the single gage I used the most.  I kept getting the wrong reading and was wondering what was wrong to the point of I started kicking things.  This went on for months.  When I used someone else's gage, there didn't seem to be a problem but I didn't really realize what was happening.  I thot it was my own mis use or misteaks or wat ever.  Well, one day I happened to have another thread gage and I compared the two 3/8-24 gages.  The Sears one was WRONG!  I was so shockt that I recheckt it on other gages.  The other gages all agreed with each other but not the Sears one.  so I tood the set back to Sears and the fellow there did not believe me, so I demonstrated it with his other, in store gages.  He, like myself, could not believe it.  Sears had somehow gotten a gage that was stamped with "24" on it which was incorrect.  After he realized that I was correct, he handed me a new one and took the old one probably to send to quality assurance.

My point is that "sh*t happens" and some times it's simply inexplicable.  You already know this, of course, but some times it's misery loves company.  LOL


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 25, 2021)

And as the sun sets into the golden west, two valves are finished. The second valve went quicker than the first, but with that extra long stem both valves required more attention than I have ever given to a valve before.


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## LorenOtto (Jul 26, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> I ran into something a bit strange yesterday. When I threaded the ends of the exhaust and carb adapter for the engine yesterday, the parts were held in the lathe chuck and the die was held in a collet in the tailstock chuck. No problems were encountered, I even ran a standard 3/8"-16 nut up the thread to ensure that everything was Kosher. When the cylinder head was tapped 3/8"-16 it was held in the milling machine vice and threaded by hand with a tap and standard handle. After screwing things together yesterday afternoon, they were crooked!! It doesn't show in the picture I posted, but they were quite visually crooked. I didn't want the Loctite to set up, so I disassembled things. This morning I held the cylinder head in my mill vice and a tap in the milling machine spindle and turned the spindle by hand, and the tap was cutting metal. I ran the tap in until it bottomed out, removed it, and cleaned up the ends of the cylinder head. I then held the inlet (carb adapter) in the chuck of the milling machine, applied a bit more Loctite and turned the spindle until the shoulders on both pieces were touching each other. I must have had the tap turned at an angle when I first threaded these parts. I would stand and deny that I would make such a dumb mistake, but I can't figure out what else it could have been.


Brian, I always use a spring loaded tap guide when tapping anything on the mill.  It keeps things lined up straight.  I haven't had a broken tap since.  Good luck.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 26, 2021)

Loren--I very seldom break a tap. If the hole is a reasonable depth, the hole seems to pull the tap straight as the tap goes in. I am very careful when tapping to back the tap out half a turn after every full turn and break the chip before tapping deeper. I seldom have a problem with a hole being tapped crooked unless it is a shallow hole. This case it was a shallow hole and yes, I must have held the tap crooked when I tapped it.  I have since set everything up in the milling machine vice and held the tap in the mill chuck to re-tap the threads straight. Very little metal was removed. I then loctited the threaded part, held it in the spindle chuck and used the mill spindle to turn the screw in part, then left it 24 hours for the loctite to set up. All is well now.---Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 26, 2021)

Today, the crooked carb adapter and exhaust have been straightened. I hunted around in my box of assorted springs, and come up with two likely candidates for valve springs. I made two brass stepped bushings which fit over the end of the valves (which are shown in place with "handles" still in place) and retain the valve springs when they are compressed. I still have to cross-drill the ends of the valves for 1 mm pins that hold the spring retainers in place. Not a whole lot to show for a days work, but then I didn't work on the engine most of the day. It was a beautiful 88 degree sunny day here today, and I didn't feel like doing much!!


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## werowance (Jul 27, 2021)

Brian, i was thinking about the valves/tappets and wanted to ask,  there isnt any lash or adjustment for them is there?  maybe just file/sand the tip if they are to tight but thats all right?  if i remember right thats the way an old briggs and stratton push mower engine would be like?


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 27, 2021)

werowance--This is what sets between the cam and the end of the valve stem. This is how you adjust the valve lash.----Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 27, 2021)

Today was a semi quiet day, finishing up little things. The valve seats were cut with my special George Britnel tool. (Actually a larger version of my original tool for valves with 1/8" stems). The valves were lapped into the seats using first 320 grit paste, then 400 grit paste, and finally with 600 grit paste. Then the "handles" were cut off the valves because they were no longer needed. A bronze endcap for the exhaust system was turned, drilled and loctited in place. I found that I had screwed up the design of the valve cages, by not leaving a "tit" of material on the end of the cages to register the springs on. I fixed the design drawing, but rather than remaking the valve cages I turned a couple of "add on" bushings to the end of them with a cavity on one end to fit the o.d. of the valve cages and a cavity on the other end that the o.d. of the valve spring would fit into. The rods hanging out the end of the valve cages are temporary, just in there overnight to ensure correct positioning of the bushings until the loctite sets up. If you don't have this spring locating feature, the spring will ride against the side of the valve stem and cause problems. Tomorrow I will probably make the tappets. I picked up a piece of 01 steel yesterday, long enough to make the tappets and the cams from. ----Both tappets and cams will be flame heated and quenched in oil to harden them.


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## Thommo (Jul 27, 2021)

Looking brilliant Brian. Great to see something a little different being made. Are you going to make the plans available once the donk is finished?


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 28, 2021)

Yes thomo, a complete plan set will cost $25 Canadian funds.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 28, 2021)

Today was tappet day. Doesn't look like much, but these were all machined from a length of 3/4" diameter 01 steel. They will be flame hardened and quenched in oil, as will the cams when I make them. The cams are almost the only remaining part of the valve train to be machined.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 28, 2021)

The tappets have been heat treated and assembled and installed in the bushings in the tappet guides. The valves are ground and cut to length, assembled with springs and keepers. I have a couple of sewing needles installed as temporary cross-pins, until I see how everything fits together. I may have to cut one coil from the springs, but I won't hurry to do that. They can always be shortened later. I'm very happy to see that the valve stems line up properly with the tappets.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 29, 2021)

Today I have prepared a piece of 01 material to make two cams from. The length of the piece is determined by the depth available in the three jaw chuck which is attached to my rotary table. The center diameter is determined by the maximum bore inside the chuck. The diameters at the ends are equal to twice the 0.382" dimension on the drawing, which determines the size of blank to cut the cam from. The material is just long enough to grip in the three jaw chuck with 3/4" of material stuck up above the chuck jaws. The cams will be .688" long, which should keep the cutter above the chuck jaws. I go a little bit crazy every time I make a cam, because I don't do it often enough to remember all the set-up steps. Attached are the picture of the prepared stock, a drawing of the cam, and a model of the milling machine cutter and the cam in their relative positions on the milling machine. The milling cutter will be turning clockwise, and the center of the mill spindle will be offset from the centerline of the rotary table chuck by 0.346" and 0.200" which, as you will notice on the drawing is the centerline of the flank radius. This should give the cams being cut a 99% chance of matching the drawing. Every time I do this, I write myself a bunch of notes on how to do the set-up, and then read thru all of my notes before I do it again.


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## Sprocket (Jul 29, 2021)

Brian,
Have you got a picture of the milling cutter? Side view preferably, I'm having a little trouble visualizing this.
Thanks
Doug


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## awake (Jul 30, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> The length of the piece is determined by the depth available in the three jaw chuck which is attached to my rotary table.



Brian, are you using a tailstock to support the piece? If so, that should let you use a longer piece. If particularly long, you can support the middle (or near where you are going to cut) with a machinist jack. And apologies if I am telling you what you already know!


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 30, 2021)

Awake---You're teaching your granny to suck eggs. The axis of the workpiece is vertical.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 30, 2021)

Today was not a good day. I fought the cams and the cams won. The cutting tool slipped in the holder. The stock slipped in the chuck.
I was overwhelmed by a hoard of zombies. I was bitten by a rabid bat. I was stung by a murder hornet. My day has turned to crap. Perhaps a different approach to making cams will be investigated.


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## Richard Hed (Jul 30, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Today was not a good day. I fought the cams and the cams won. The cutting tool slipped in the holder. The stock slipped in the chuck.
> I was overwhelmed by a hoard of zombies. I was bitten by a rabid bat. I was stung by a murder hornet. My day has turned to crap. Perhaps a different approach to making cams will be investigated.


But did you die?  If not, then how would you know if you had fun?


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## Jasonb (Jul 30, 2021)

Sproket, this is the type of setup 






As the blank is moved around the base diameter if formed by a series of 4 deg facets ( or however much you turn the table)


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 30, 2021)

My theory was great. My practical application, not so much. The cutting tool shown in that layout was absolute nonsense. All that is important there is the centerline of the spindle and the cutting edge of the tool. In reality, the cutting edge of the tool faces in towards the center. Here is a picture of the set-up.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 30, 2021)

Okay, maybe it's time for some wheeling and dealing. Any of you CNC guys out there want to make me a couple of cams as shown? Surface around outside has to be good quality finish and 3/8" center-hole must be reamed to 3/8" finished size. There are other holes to go in but I can do them later, and I can do the hardening later.  In return, I will send you a complete set of detail drawings to build this engine.----Brian


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## werowance (Jul 30, 2021)

Brian, i have always like your drawings because you always add extra mesurements from different points of view whreas alot of drawings make you have to calculate from one point only and add or subtract to get what you should have if you decide to come at it from a different way.

that said im just curious what the 2 - .346 numbers are?


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 30, 2021)

Werowance---the .346 and the .200 are the centerline of the flank radii.


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## oldengineguy (Jul 30, 2021)

Brian  Is a short video tutorial possible? I'm sure this works as you have made many engines, but I can't figure out how to do this . Thanks  Colin


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 30, 2021)

Oldengineguy---This is very difficult stuff to get your head around. I don't have a video tutorial, but there is a video tutorial by our departed friend Chuck Fellows. Be aware that Chuck is running his mill in reverse. This is dangerous if your boring head has a screw on shank, because it may unscrew itself in the middle of the job. I do this job by running my mill clockwise and you can see from my previous picture what the tool in the boring head looks like. To do this job correctly, the mill spindle must be offset from the chuck holding the part by an amount equal to the offsets given in the cam drawing for the centers of the flank radii.---Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 30, 2021)

A kind gentleman in the USA has volunteered to cnc the cams for me. I am moving ahead working on the crankshaft.---Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 30, 2021)

I like to make my one piece crankshafts from 1144 stress proof steel. It moves very little while machining, far less than mild steel or cold rolled steel. The only catch is, it is not available in flat-bar. This means that you buy a round piece and machine a flat-bar from it, before you can actually start to machine the crankshaft. I always start by machining one side off in the milling machine, so you have a flat reference to machine or saw away the other side. In this case, I had to machine to a depth of 0.531". Next step will be to saw off the other flat, or flip it over in the milling vice and machine away the other side. Milling is probably as fast as sawing, because my sawblades are always a bit dull, and you end up having to machine that sawed side anyways to get it flat. My mill seems comfortable with 0.015" depth of cut, so that is a lot of cranking back and forth to take off 0.531".


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## Sprocket (Jul 30, 2021)

Jasonb,
Thanks. That makes sense now.
Doug


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## Gordon (Jul 31, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Today was not a good day. I fought the cams and the cams won. The cutting tool slipped in the holder. The stock slipped in the chuck.
> I was overwhelmed by a hoard of zombies. I was bitten by a rabid bat. I was stung by a murder hornet. My day has turned to crap. Perhaps a different approach to making cams will be investigated.


I have always just centered the cam on the rotary table and used an end mill. Move the spindle .302 radius plus 1/2 the cutter dia and turned the table through a 240° arc. (360-120) Then moved the mill table .346X and -.200Y plus half the cutter dia and start cutting at where the 240° arc stopped. Obviously done is steps, not all in one cut.

I will have to study the other method.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 31, 2021)

Gordon---That sounds very interesting. I will have to try that method.----Brian


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## Jasonb (Jul 31, 2021)

Gordon, your method if fine for cams with flat flanks but the other method is needed for radiused flanks or use something like CamCalc if the cam has to be held horizontally ( long multiple cam shaft) as you can only reach down so far with it held vertically. 

The method was described in Model Engine Builder and I first used it on the Hoglet cams, now its a doddle on the CNC which also does the nose radius


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## Steamchick (Jul 31, 2021)

Great stuff!
I learn such a lot from these discussions.


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## Gordon (Jul 31, 2021)

OK You had me doubting myself so I tried it in Cad. It also cuts the flank. You have to offset for cutter radius.


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## awake (Jul 31, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Awake---You're teaching your granny to suck eggs. The axis of the workpiece is vertical.


First, you poke a hole in one end of the egg, then ...


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 31, 2021)

Having a lazy day today. When I was reducing the 1144 roundstock for my crankshaft from round to flat the other day, I noticed that the cut was different in one direction than the other in the X axis. This is a sure indicator of a mill being out of tram. I tore down my set-up and got out the steel brake disc that I use for tramming the mill.  Using my coaxial indicator I trammed the mill, then replaced the mill vice and part being worked on. Then I used a 2" face mill to mow away the other side of the round stock, and ended up with a flat bar of 1144 stress proof steel to make a crankshaft from. Not a lot of actual progress, but now I have the material to go ahead and start machining a crankshaft tomorrow.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 1, 2021)

I'm about half way done with the crankshaft. So far, so good. I nailed the center diameter right on, and I'm about 0.001 oversize on the one end thats been turned. That last 0.001" will come off with a 220 grit sanding strip. Now I turn the part end for end, put my "lathe dog" on the finished end, and turn the remaining end to 1/2" diameter. I always triple check myself when I'm about to start carving on a crankshaft.  I've heard far too many "Cut off the wrong piece" stories, and believe me, it's easy to do.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 1, 2021)

It's suppertime, and I have a finished crankshaft. It needs a couple of keyways, and I will add them tomorrow.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 1, 2021)

Crankshaft is in, dummy shaft is out. Crankshaft turns easily, nothing crashes. This is always a milestone event for me, because there are so many tolerances that can add up to cause some kind of internal interference with the crankshaft. I'm not going to put keyways in until I'm absolutely sure what I'm doing for flywheels. If I was rich instead of good looking, I'd buy a pair of flywheels, but at $35 each American, plus the difference in our dollars, plus tax, plus shipping, I'd be paying $100 for two flywheels.


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## Richard Hed (Aug 1, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Crankshaft is in, dummy shaft is out. Crankshaft turns easily, nothing crashes. This is always a milestone event for me, because there are so many tolerances that can add up to cause some kind of internal interference with the crankshaft. I'm not going to put keyways in until I'm absolutely sure what I'm doing for flywheels. If I was rich instead of good looking, I'd buy a pair of flywheels, but at $35 each American, plus the difference in our dollars, plus tax, plus shipping, I'd be paying $100 for two flywheels.


Geez, Brian, We all know you are good llooking but it's the rich women that DON'T know you are.  You need to find one and SHE will pay for it, I'm sure.


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## CFLBob (Aug 1, 2021)

Brian,  do you know of a tutorial on making a crankshaft that way?  

I've seen bits and pieces but not enough to know how start from a steel bar and end up with a usable part.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 2, 2021)

Bob---Here's your tutorial.---Brian





						Making a one piece crankshaft from 1144 stress proof steel
					

All of our engines need a crankshaft. Crankshafts can be machined in one piece, or built up from separate sections of steel press fitted or Loctited  and pinned together. If you do build a crankshaft and it is "true" with little run-out, then your flywheels won't wobble when the engine runs. I...




					www.homemodelenginemachinist.com


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## Richard Hed (Aug 2, 2021)

CFLBob said:


> Brian,  do you know of a tutorial on making a crankshaft that way?
> 
> I've seen bits and pieces but not enough to know how start from a steel bar and end up with a usable part.


Joe Pie also has a vid on this.


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## CFLBob (Aug 2, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Bob---Here's your tutorial.---Brian
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks, Brian!  

I sure didn't mean for you to write one today, but it sure seems like you did.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 3, 2021)

Today I am going to make an aluminum piston. Nothing exotic here, maybe the skirt is a bit longer than usual, but other than that it's a plain old piston. We are going to run cast iron rings on this piston, and this time we are going to make the rings a bit thicker at 0.045" to be an exact match with what George Trimble did in his article on how to make piston rings. The ring radial width will stay at 0.039" same as the rings I made earlier in the summer.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 3, 2021)

We have a piston!! Everything went well, piston fits cylinder as I had hoped. I almost had a conniption fit when I went to cut the ring grooves. I couldn't find the special cutter that I had ground for me. I looked in all the usual places, and couldn't find it. Then I cleaned up all my work surfaces and I couldn't find it. Then I looked in all the unusual places, and I found it. Now I remember putting it in an unusual place and thinking "Now, I'll keep that separate so I'll know where to find it next time I need it."  Growing old gracefully!!!


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 4, 2021)

Today was connecting rod day at my house. I don't have much to say about it, but it has eaten up about six hours of my time. It turned out fine. Now I'm going to wash up, then go down to PartSource and pick up a sparkplug, ignition points, and a condenser.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 5, 2021)

This morning the engine is assembled to check for clearances. Happily, nothing crashes, and the crankshaft can make a full rotation with the connecting rod attached without any clearance issues. This almost completes the major components of the engine, and now it will be a simple matter of installing the cams to complete the valve train. Thanks for having a look.---Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 5, 2021)

Today was ignition points, condenser, and ignition cam day. It also was finish the gas tank day. Everything went as planned. I am going to paint that gas tank and the flywheels, so I probably won't do very much cosmetic work on the brazed joints on the gas filler neck and out-spout. A bit of gloss paint hides a multitude of sins!!


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 6, 2021)

I spent the day working on a real job, but tonight I'm having a close look at this engine. I think that other than the flywheels and gear covers, everything is finished. I'm waiting for my cams to arrive, and there is a bit of finessing to connect the cams to the large gears. I don't need the gear covers to start the engine, so this could get exciting pretty soon.  I'm still on the fence regarding the flywheels, but I want to go down to my nut and bolt store and look at something. They have a bin full of casters down there, and I remember seeing some large aluminum casters with rubber bonded to the outer rim. I have some double extra strong schedule 80 pipe here, and if I could machine the rubber off those aluminum casters and put some heavy wall pipe around the aluminum, it might make some nice flywheels.


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## SirJohn (Aug 8, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> I spent the day working on a real job, but tonight I'm having a close look at this engine. I think that other than the flywheels and gear covers, everything is finished. I'm waiting for my cams to arrive, and there is a bit of finessing to connect the cams to the large gears. I don't need the gear covers to start the engine, so this could get exciting pretty soon.  I'm still on the fence regarding the flywheels, but I want to go down to my nut and bolt store and look at something. They have a bin full of casters down there, and I remember seeing some large aluminum casters with rubber bonded to the outer rim. I have some double extra strong schedule 80 pipe here, and if I could machine the rubber off those aluminum casters and put some heavy wall pipe around the aluminum, it might make some nice flywheels.


Brian, what diameter are the flywheels?  I have some steel casters that I bought from Princess Auto that might work, 3" dia. with 1 1/2" flange and 4" dia. with 2" flange.  I would give them to you but the postage might cost more than they are worth.   
John Leeds


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 9, 2021)

Thanks for the offer Sir John---I will have a look at my own Princess Auto here in Barrie.---Brian


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## almega (Aug 10, 2021)

How about this for iron casters to be used as flywheels? You get four for a somewhat reasonable price. You may have to do some work to disassemble and perhaps true up and balance, but it seems like a pretty good way to save time and get something that saves a bunch of time and money compared to making from a cast blank.








						CCVINTAGE-5S-SET-OF-4
					

Caster Connection – manufacturer of casters and wheels, fosters great relationships with clients by offering them peace of mind with our solutions.




					casterconnection.com
				



BTW - I can sympathize with you about being good looking but not rich. It is a curse a few of us are saddled with. I guess we all have our crosses to bear.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 10, 2021)

A *HUGE* Thank you going out to Sid from New York and to Laverne Karras from Keswick for the cams they CNC machined for me. Both sets arrived today in the mail, and they are simply marvelous. These cams are just about all I need to finish the t-head engine. Guys, I really do appreciate it.--I will use the cams Sid made on this current engine, and the ones Laverne made will be saved for my next engine.-Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 10, 2021)

Yes, even I get tied up with other things and machining has to take a back seat. I have however, found the time to make my oil filler spout and drain. It's pretty simple. You take both plugs out, and add oil to the sump until it starts to run out the bottom hole. When it does, then the oil is at the correct level.


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## a41capt (Aug 11, 2021)

almega said:


> How about this for iron casters to be used as flywheels? You get four for a somewhat reasonable price. You may have to do some work to disassemble and perhaps true up and balance, but it seems like a pretty good way to save time and get something that saves a bunch of time and money compared to making from a cast blank.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That looks like a real interesting option for cast iron flywheels.  Their comment “Each vintage caster is unique, with different details and _may_ include intentional imperfections (i.e. nicks, scrapes, rust/corrosion, blemishes) for aesthetic purposes.” Makes me wonder how balanced they are and how true they will run “right out of the box” though.

Thanks for the link!
John W


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 11, 2021)

Someone was asking how I would attach the cam to the large gear. Here it is. The # 4 socket head capscrew goes thru the cam and threads into a tapped hole in the gear. The two 1/16" drills which you can see will be replaced by 1/16" diameter drive pins, which pass thru zero clearance holes in the cam and the gear and are held in place by Loctite.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 11, 2021)

Today was a fun day, attaching the cams to the large gears and reassembling everything to see the valves going up and down. It doesn't sound like much, but I've spent the entire day doing it. I'm well pleased with todays work.---Brian


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## Thommo (Aug 11, 2021)

G’day Brian, the TEE is looking great, so nice to see an unusual engine being made. Just thinking, In the video it looks like you have had to make a fair effort to turn it over? Is it very tight or does it just look like it?


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## Steamchick (Aug 12, 2021)

awake said:


> First, you poke a hole in one end of the egg, then ...


And Sometimes Grandma forgets things...
And for those of us who "divn't na" (local phrase), we all get to learn. So keep on keeping on!
Thanks boys..
K2


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## Steamchick (Aug 12, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> I think that other than the flywheels and gear covers, everything is finished.  I'm still on the fence regarding the flywheels, but I want to go down to my nut and bolt store and look at something. They have a bin full of casters down there, and I remember seeing some large aluminum casters with rubber bonded to the outer rim. I have some double extra strong schedule 80 pipe here, and if I could machine the rubber off those aluminum casters and put some heavy wall pipe around the aluminum, it might make some nice flywheels.


Hi Brian,
I bought a "flywheel" off e&@y... but it turned out to be either a wheel or maybe a well knocked around idler puller for a flat belt.... So for that engine I used a brass investment casting of a proper wheel "copied" from someone's machined flywheel of a Victorian pattern... You could see the original machining of the rim - until I did my own machining on it to look the part... It was well out of balance, but I secured it at the right place to almost exactly balance the engine (Double-acting steam table engine) - which now runs "very nicely, thankyou"..
So you can use out-of balance wheels to your advantage... with a bit of suck-it and see....
K2


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 12, 2021)

Brand new engines are always a bit "stiff". After it runs for the first 15 minutes all of that stiffness goes away. Remember, when you machine something, although it looks very smooth, at a microscopic level the surface is all peaks and valleys. It's stiff right now because all of the sliding and rotating parts are riding on those microscopic peaks causing drag. After the first run, the tops wear off those microscopic peaks, and the engine becomes very smooth.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 12, 2021)

Well Rats!!! This morning I drove to everywhere in Barrie that sells casters, looking for a caster with an aluminum hub and flange with a cast in place outer sleeve of rubber or nylon. Princess Auto had exactly what I need, but not in the size I wanted. If I could have found the right size of caster I would have removed the outer nylon or rubber and mounted a steel outer rim to create "instant flywheel". Since I couldn't find what I wanted, I will now resort to making my own flywheels from what stock I have on hand.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 12, 2021)

I think the summer heat may have driven me mad. I just ordered a pair of 4 1/2" cast iron flywheels from Martin Models in the USA. I checked out what material I had to make these flywheels, and I do have it, but seem to be suffering from a case of "lazy ar$e".  If I hadn't picked up the recent design contract for a couple of welding fixtures, I'd have made the flywheels from what stock I have. My good wife just informed me that any money coming from the small design contract should be spent on "Toys for my hobby" and I'm not going to argue with that!!--Brian


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## Steamchick (Aug 13, 2021)

Tell her how much you appreciate her... and spend a little of your earnings on her as well... - I call it "regular maintenance"... 
K2


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## bb218 (Aug 13, 2021)

skyline1 said:


> Thanks Mike
> 
> Divide by 5 "Doh" I must do some more practice with fractions !
> 
> ...


You need a hole plate that will divide evenly into 65, only 2 options that I see that is 65 hole plate or a 13 hole plate.  With the 13 plate in will go into 65  5 times and 90/5 = 18 so with a 13 hole plate every 18 holes will result in 65 divisions.   I am not sure how a 39 hole plate could work.


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## awake (Aug 13, 2021)

bb218 said:


> You need a hole plate that will divide evenly into 65, only 2 options that I see that is 65 hole plate or a 13 hole plate.  With the 13 plate in will go into 65  5 times and 90/5 = 18 so with a 13 hole plate every 18 holes will result in 65 divisions.   I am not sure how a 39 hole plate could work.


If you need a 13-hole plate but you only have a 39 hole plate, no problem - multiply the number of holes needed to move in the 13-hole plate by 3. Let's "unpack" the example above, assuming the worm gear ratio is 90:1 and you want to make a 65 tooth gear:

Turns of input handle per tooth = 90/65 = 1 & 25/65 = 1 & 5/13. (These are the numbers already shown above, but just showing a bit more of how they can be calculated - the general formula is [worm-gear-ratio] / [desired-number-of-divisions], then simplify the fraction. Look for an index wheel that has the denominator of the simplified fraction as a factor. In this case, 13 is a factor of 39, so we can use the 39 wheel.)

So the basic answer is, turn the handle 1 & 5/13 times per tooth ... but you don't have a 13 index, you have a 39 index. No problem: multiply the fraction by 3/3: 5/13 * 3/3 = 15/39. So now you have your final answer: set up the sector arms to allow a movement of 15 holes on the 39 hole index. (The sector arms will span a total of 16 holes - 1 for the pin to start in, and 15 more for it to move). For each tooth, make one complete revolution plus 15 holes as indicated by the sector arms, then reset the sector arms. Cut, rinse, repeat.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 13, 2021)

I am now at the "What do I do next" phase of this build. The only outstanding things are the flywheels, the gear cases and the rings and the gaskets. I don't really want to do anything on the cast iron rings until the flywheels have been machined and mounted. This leaves only the gear cases to be machined, so that is where I will start my next round of machining. the two gear cases will have a slight difference, because one has to be cut away on the bottom side to clear the ignition points. This will mean purchasing a foot of 2 1/2" x 1" aluminum flatbar. I'm beginning to get enquiries from old customers about design work. I don't really want to turn them down, because if it worked out right I might buy a real vertical metal cutting bandsaw. The saw I have now is an old wood cutting bandsaw that I modified to cut metal


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## Gordon (Aug 13, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> I am now at the "What do I do next" phase of this build. The only outstanding things are the flywheels, the gear cases and the rings and the gaskets. I don't really want to do anything on the cast iron rings until the flywheels have been machined and mounted. This leaves only the gear cases to be machined, so that is where I will start my next round of machining. the two gear cases will have a slight difference, because one has to be cut away on the bottom side to clear the ignition points. This will mean purchasing a foot of 2 1/2" x 1" aluminum flatbar. I'm beginning to get enquiries from old customers about design work. I don't really want to turn them down, because if it worked out right I might buy a real vertical metal cutting bandsaw. The saw I have now is an old wood cutting bandsaw that I modified to cut metal


For gaskets I have been very glad that I purchased a Silhouette Plotter several years ago. There probably are other plotters which work as well. You make a DXF drawing and load it into the plotter. You usually have to do some minor rescaling. It makes everything precision and will cut out 1/16 dia clearance holes and weird configurations easy to accomplish.


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## propclock (Aug 13, 2021)

Sorry if you covered this before, I am intrigued about the  Silhouette Plotter  
Did you get the 3 or 4 model and what material  do you use for gaskets?  
Thank you.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 13, 2021)

Gordon--my gaskets are never very complicated. Since I have the parts which need gaskets in 3D cad, I just print them out at one to one scale and glue them to  a cardboard cereal box or to a roll of 0.030" waterpump gasket. I have a leather punch here on which I can select the hole size I want for bolt clearances, and I have made a lot of my own different larger punches. Everything else gets cut out with a pair of scissors or a scalpel.


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## Gordon (Aug 13, 2021)

propclock said:


> Sorry if you covered this before, I am intrigued about the  Silhouette Plotter
> Did you get the 3 or 4 model and what material  do you use for gaskets?
> Thank you.


I am not sure about 3 or 4 but it is a Portrait model. I just use standard automotive gasket material. Usually 1/32 thick or sometimes .015. I have used Teflon also. Any of them require cutting 2 or 3 times. Just restart without removing the material.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 13, 2021)

Decided to get up off my lazy butt and actually do something this afternoon. I purchased some 2 1/2" x 1" aluminum bar, cut it to two lengths, laid the outline on it with a template, then set it up in my milling vice and used the DRO to position things accurately. The template helps me figure out what I'm doing, and gives me a visual check, to see if my DRO is giving me the same information. The 0.201" bolt holes were drilled and a 1/2" drill ran thru at the appropriate centers. Next trick will be to mount the pieces one at a time in the four jaw lathe chuck and bore the blind cavities that the gears fit into as well as the thru holes where the gear hubs stick through.


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## skyline1 (Aug 14, 2021)

awake said:


> So the basic answer is, turn the handle 1 & 5/13 times per tooth ... but you don't have a 13 index, you have a 39 index. No problem: multiply the fraction by 3/3: 5/13 * 3/3 = 15/39. So now you have your final answer: set up the sector arms to allow a movement of 15 holes on the 39 hole index. (The sector arms will span a total of 16 holes - 1 for the pin to start in, and 15 more for it to move). For each tooth, make one complete revolution plus 15 holes as indicated by the sector arms, then reset the sector arms. Cut, rinse, repeat.



Thanks Awake 1 turn and 15 holes on a 39 hole plate exactly the same answer as I got. The key to this is that 39 is 13 x 3 so for every 1 hole you would go on a 13 hole wheel you go three holes on a 39 hole.

Brian, well done on the incredible speed at which you are building this engine, It's almost ready to run now in a matter of weeks, an amazing feat, I wish I could do things that fast

Best Regards Mark


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## L98fiero (Aug 14, 2021)

skyline1 said:


> Thanks Awake 1 turn and 15 holes on a 39 hole plate exactly the same answer as I got. The key to this is that 39 is 13 x 3 so for every 1 hole you would go on a 13 hole wheel you go three holes on a 39 hole.
> 
> Brian, well done on the incredible speed at which you are building this engine, It's almost ready to run now in a matter of weeks, an amazing feat, I wish I could do things that fast
> 
> Best Regards Mark


Realistically, if you don't have the dividing plate you need one could print the required 'plate' and paste it on an existing one and make a new one, it would take a little care  because there are no holes but the gear reduction would reduce the error on the generated plate.

Brian, you really do move with your builds!


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## skyline1 (Aug 14, 2021)

L98fiero said:


> Realistically, if you don't have the dividing plate you need one could print the required 'plate' and paste it on an existing one and make a new one, it would take a little care because there are no holes but the gear reduction would reduce the error on the generated plate.



That gives me an idea !

I wonder if I could 3D print a plate, I could have any number of holes I wanted and my 3d printer is pretty accurate, 

The plastics used in 3D printing are remarkably tough and resilient I have made many "real" structural components with one. Has anyone tried it ? 

I might even be able to 3D print the actual bull wheel, I have heard of people making replacement gears for minilathes by this method and plastic gears are increasingly being used nowadays.

Best Regards Mark


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 14, 2021)

First I bore the blind hole for the big gear---then I bore the blind hole for the small gear. Then after much sanding, filing, and sanding some more I have an awesome set of gear guards.


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## Nerd1000 (Aug 14, 2021)

skyline1 said:


> That gives me an idea !
> 
> I wonder if I could 3D print a plate, I could have any number of holes I wanted and my 3d printer is pretty accurate,
> 
> ...


I've done 3d printed change gears for my Sheraton lathe (needed for cutting metric threads) and template for the indexing fixture of my Atlas mill. I cut the gears for my Webster using the 3d printed template gears and they worked perfectly (even wear on all the teeth after running). The change gears aren't so great, the teeth hold up fine but the keyways of the stud gears soon get damaged due to the plastic being too soft.


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## skyline1 (Aug 14, 2021)

I'm 3D printing an experimental plate to try but I don't want to hijack the thread so if it is successful I will open a new thread about it with some pictures and the STL file.

Brian It looks like you have only the flywheels left to do. What kind of ignition do you intend to use ?

Best Regards Mark


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 15, 2021)

Same 1976 Chrysler points and condenser----same as I always use.


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## skyline1 (Aug 15, 2021)

So a conventional coil then not electronic


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## Mike Ginn (Aug 15, 2021)

propclock said:


> Sorry if you covered this before, I am intrigued about the  Silhouette Plotter
> Did you get the 3 or 4 model and what material  do you use for gaskets?
> Thank you.


I have been using the Silhouette cutter for many years.  Originally using Design Master as the interface between dxf and the Silhouette but unfortunately this no longer works due the licencing and obsolescence.  Using dxf with Studio Design was a real pain.  I tried Inkscape with little success.  The main problem with Studio and dxf is scaling but there are commands to change the scaling.  There are other issues so I generated the procedure below which I find works.  It is based on surrounding the required shape in a box of known size in AutoCAD or other dxf apps.  I then scale the drawing in Studio so that the box is the correct size.

Happy to provide more info.

If anyone has a better method, I would love to hear about it!


Cutter – Silhouette SD from eBay
Silhouette Studio Design Edition version 4.1
Create dxf file in AutoCAD 2000 format – this is my default format for greatest flexibility.
DO NOT JOIN lines – if joined expand.  (If joined the cutter makes many small cuts)
Make sure there is a box around object of known size in inches
In Studio Designer File/Open/select file – takes time to load
Using arrow in top left corner select box and content
Right click object and select - Make compound path
Open transform panel – 3 vertical lines on RH menu
Double click to Select the 45deg line (takes time)
Close padlock
Type the correct width of the box into one of the boxes and click the second box to see the new value, apply
If necessary, move object using the single up/down/left/right arrows
Select Send and then send.  Cutting lines are in Red
For thin card set to single cut, for gasket material 0.25mm select 2 cut.  Use FLEXOID Gasket Paper 0.25 thick – from eBay
Note that 1 cut is the default


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## Gordon (Aug 15, 2021)

Mike Ginn said:


> I have been using the Silhouette cutter for many years.  Originally using Design Master as the interface between dxf and the Silhouette but unfortunately this no longer works due the licencing and obsolescence.  Using dxf with Studio Design was a real pain.  I tried Inkscape with little success.  The main problem with Studio and dxf is scaling but there are commands to change the scaling.  There are other issues so I generated the procedure below which I find works.  It is based on surrounding the required shape in a box of known size in AutoCAD or other dxf apps.  I then scale the drawing in Studio so that the box is the correct size.
> 
> Happy to provide more info.
> 
> ...


I just load the DXF file and highlight it which shows the various dimensions. Pick some know dimension and rescale the file. For instance if something which should be 2" shows as 2.2" just resacle the entire drawing to 2.2/2 and check to make sure that it is correct. I am not sure why but it is not consistent. Sometimes it is oversize and other times it is under size. On one file 2" may show as 2.2 and the next time 2" may show as 1.9". I have been told that there is some setting which automatically corrects this but I have not found it and it is not important enough to me to spend the time finding the secret. I just always rescale. Always use a mat and keep notes on what worked unless you use it often enough to remember every time. I mainly use it for gaskets so it can be weeks between uses.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 15, 2021)

Hey Guys---Please start your own thread to discuss things that are not related to this engine build.---Brian


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## Gordon (Aug 15, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Hey Guys---Please start your own thread to discuss things that are not related to this engine build.---Brian


My sincere apology. I had no intention to hijack your thread. I will be more cautious in the future.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 15, 2021)

Gordon--that wasn't aimed at you. The gear guards certainly will protect fingers. Oddly enough, that's not the real purpose I put them on there. I find that exposed spur gears make a terrible lot of noise. It seems that if they have a guard made of brass or aluminum (not sheet metal) around them, it quiets them down a lot. and they certainly make the engine look more robust. I am now at the point where I have nothing left to make except the cast iron rings. Earlier this year I did a thread on making my own cast iron rings. There was a great deal of trial and error, but I finally did successfully make a set that worked very well on one of my 1" bore engines. I made a lot of notes about what I did, and I still have all the fixtures I used. This engine is also a 1" bore, so I'm hopeful that I learned enough from my previous ring making exercise to do it again. I'm still waiting to hear from the flywheel people---they are supposed to contact me when the rings are shipped.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 16, 2021)

Okay, here's what we've got going. Thats a piece of 1 3/8" diameter grey cast iron in the chuck. The o.d. is turned down to the diameter of the cylinder, not the piston. My rings are going to be .038" (1 mm) thick radially so the inside is drilled out to 0.925" diameter. The o.d  of what will become the rings is polished with a fine whet stone, or a piece of 400 grit paper backed up by a file or piece of flat-bar. This time my rings are going to be 0.045" thick, and my specially ground cut off tool is 0.038" wide, so .045 plus .038 plus .003" to have a bit extra length equals 0.086", so thats how far I advance the carriage before taking another cut. The rod held in the tailstock chuck is something to catch the rings as they are parted off. I have to remember that each time I cut a ring off, I have to deburr the outside and inside diameter of the piece held in the chuck, so that at least one side of the ring is deburred.---It is remarkably easy to forget that step. Each ring will now be measured with my micrometer to make sure it is the right thickness, and then held in a fixture with a 0.020" deep x 1" diameter recess. It is then slid around in a figure 8 on a piece of 600 grit paper until it reaches the magic 0.045" thickness. Then it is fitted into the piston ring groove to make sure that it actually will go down to the bottom of the groove.  My chuck has about 0.003" total indicated runout, so I cut off a bunch of rings while in this set up, because if I take that piece of round stock out of the chuck, I will never get it back in the same spot, and I don't want to make rings that are not truly concentric.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 16, 2021)

We're up, up and away!! I managed to harvest ten rings. They were all deburred both sides, and the faces were sanded on 600 grit paper attached to a cast iron surface plate until they were 0.045" to 0.043" thick. They were all spread over a .150" diameter pin and sandwiched and clamped between two sides of a heat treat fixture. They are now in my heat treat oven, soaking at 1100 degrees for three hours. I decided that I didn't really like the "cleaver" that Trimble designed and I built, because it seemed to bend the rings a bit when it cleaved them. I ended up using a sharp cold chisel to "break" each ring, then filed the ends with a points file until they had the correct 0.004" end gap when installed in the cylinder.


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## Steamchick (Aug 17, 2021)

Hi Brian, I am curious to know if the radial force of the ring on the bore is "just a feather more than contact", a "real spring pressure" or moderately between? I.E. what is the gap outside the bore (I can't guess?), and you use 0.004" gap when fitted in the bore? (I would guess about 0.001" per 1" of bore, so ~0.001" for your 1" bore engine? I would have expected 0.004" on a 3 ~ 4" bore engine?). Modern car engine thinking is that the minimum radial force is all that is needed as the rest of the working contact pressure comes from gas pressure acting at the back of the rings during compression and firing strokes.
- Except for oil wiping rings, that need higher initial pressure (and the contact point is exceedingly narrow to achieve that) to break the oil film and wipe to the bore's apparent surface. (I.E. all the microscopic high spots on cross-hatching).
But I don't know what is best for models like yours?
Keep up the excellent work!
K2


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## Steamchick (Aug 17, 2021)

Oh, another item (It takes the brain a few moments to think of the second question!): You talk of the Trimble "cleaver" causing some distortion at the cut? Is this "curling inwards"? Not knowing the Trimble tool's direction of "cut", it sounds like you are talking of distortion to the curvature of the outside diameter, next to the ring gap? I would have imagined a "cleaving hit" - as with a cold chisel - to be applied with the ring resting on a surface plate as the anvil, and the striking face being a flat face that is either the top or bottom face of the installed ring. (I would put it on the bottom face - at a guess? - but I can think of alternative reasons for this to become the top face?).
But maybe my imagination is on the "wrong planet" for your explanation?
Thanks,
K2


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## Gordon (Aug 17, 2021)

I wonder if the cleaver would work better if one side was flat and the other side had a sharp cutting edge. I can see how the rings could be distorted if the two cutting edges were not perfectly aligned. Actually that is what you are doing with your chisel on a hard surface.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 17, 2021)

I let the rings cool overnight in the heat treat oven, then this morning I brought the heat treat fixture into my office and disassembled everything. The rings and fixture look rather grotty, but they will all clean up nicely with a small brass brush and running water. You can see that all of the rings have now taken a "set" with the end gap at 0.150" which is the diameter of the post in the heat treat fixture.
I will give the rings one or two small swipes on 600 grit paper to get any residue off the flat surfaces, and give the inside of the rings a bit of deburring with my Dremel tool, then pick out the two I like best and install them on my piston.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 17, 2021)

Rings are cleaned up and two of them installed on the piston. I don't have a small ring compressor, so I used a trick I learned on one of the forums. Took a piece of 2" round steel x 1" long, drilled and reamed a 1.000" hole through it, then put a 25 degree taper on one side and sanded the transition smooth. Set it on top of the cylinder, started the piston with rings thru it. The 25 degree angle compressed the rings to 1" and the piston sticking out thru the bottom fit into the engine cylinder to line everything up. A few careful taps with a soft faced hammer and the piston with rings slid right into place. Hooked up the con rod to the crank journal, and everything goes round and round very smoothly.


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## CFLBob (Aug 17, 2021)

That would have been interesting to watch.


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## skyline1 (Aug 17, 2021)

Wow piston rings look pretty tricky both to make and fit. Would Viton 'O' rings be an option on this engine and how do they compare with piston rings.

 I guess valve lapping and timing is next then you are pretty much ready to go

Best Regards Mark


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## Larry G. (Aug 17, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Okay, here's what we've got going. Thats a piece of 1 3/8" diameter grey cast iron in the chuck. The o.d. is turned down to the diameter of the cylinder, not the piston. My rings are going to be .038" (1 mm) thick radially so the inside is drilled out to 0.925" diameter. The o.d  of what will become the rings is polished with a fine whet stone, or a piece of 400 grit paper backed up by a file or piece of flat-bar. This time my rings are going to be 0.045" thick, and my specially ground cut off tool is 0.038" wide, so .045 plus .038 plus .003" to have a bit extra length equals 0.086", so thats how far I advance the carriage before taking another cut. The rod held in the tailstock chuck is something to catch the rings as they are parted off. I have to remember that each time I cut a ring off, I have to deburr the outside and inside diameter of the piece held in the chuck, so that at least one side of the ring is deburred.---It is remarkably easy to forget that step. Each ring will now be measured with my micrometer to make sure it is the right thickness, and then held in a fixture with a 0.020" deep x 1" diameter recess. It is then slid around in a figure 8 on a piece of 600 grit paper until it reaches the magic 0.045" thickness. Then it is fitted into the piston ring groove to make sure that it actually will go down to the bottom of the groove.  My chuck has about 0.003" total indicated runout, so I cut off a bunch of rings while in this set up, because if I take that piece of round stock out of the chuck, I will never get it back in the same spot, and I don't want to make rings that are not truly concentric.


Chamfering of the BACKSIDE of the rings is demonstrated by Mr. Crispin using a "trumpet chamfering tool" in his very well done video;



The application and the processes are different but the techniques are still applicable.
His tool & cutter grinder and profile projector could be replaced in a pinch with a Dremel tool, a steady hand, and a hand lens to check the progress.
Trepanning the stock rather than reducing it to dust is another interesting  variation in the process.
Congratulations on the successful rings!

Best regards,
Larry


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 17, 2021)

Skyline1--Cast iron rings are something new for me. I have about twenty engines running Viton rings because they are fast, easy, and work very well in most cases. I have tried and failed to make proper cast iron rings in the past, so this summer I spent considerable time and effort making cast iron rings that work. I learned a lot, and am still in the learning process.---Brian


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## skyline1 (Aug 18, 2021)

Yes it's quite a process and not always successful I believe

I had the opportunity to visit Welworthy Piston Rings in the U.K. many years ago, where they make piston rings  from tiny little ones to huge monsters for marine engines and the like. I found the process both fascinating and a little intimidating. Their heat treatment plant was amazing !

Such is the difficult nature of making them that even Welworthy with many years of experience have a high scrap rate on small ones (up to 50% IIRC) so you are not alone in losing a few along the way.

Out of interest, I found out during this visit, that the really large ones need to be specially supported during transport and fitting because until they are safely in their grooves they can actually break under their own weight.

So congrats on your ring success any I hope your flywheels turn up soon It will be nice to see the first run soon

Best Regards Mark


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## bdolin (Aug 18, 2021)

Do you ever measure the horsepower or torque output of your engines?


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## Gordon (Aug 18, 2021)

Larry G. said:


> Chamfering of the BACKSIDE of the rings is demonstrated by Mr. Crispin using a "trumpet chamfering tool" in his very well done video;
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That is a very interesting take on making and heat treating rings. The trepanning could be replaced by just doing a final bore. I wonder how his heat treating fixture performs compared to the Trimble fixture. 

I have been remaking some rings using the Trimble method and I have not been too successful. If I put the finished ring in the bore and shine a light I seem to be able to see light almost all of the way around with only a few spots actually tight against the bore. Also the rings seem to vary .002 in thickness both before and after rubbing them on wet/dry sandpaper. He uses oil on the sandpaper. I wonder if that would make a difference.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 18, 2021)

No, I never do a HP test on my engines. The best result for me is that the engines run!! I have thought about making a device to measure horsepower, but  it's not something that I really feel like building.


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## skyline1 (Aug 18, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> The best result for me is that the engines run!!



Seeing something run under it's own power that you have built (and in your case designed) yourself is a great satisfaction. 

I think you, like myself, also enjoy the development and evolution that can come from initial poor results or even outright failures ( I've had many)

In small scale engineering like this things often don't work out quite as the accepted rules say they should. With so many square and cube laws involved our machines are often quite different from full size, and Model Engine builders have developed some very strange techniques indeed to achieve the desired results.



bdolin said:


> Do you ever measure the horsepower or torque output of your engines?



To some just seeing them work is quite sufficient, they are not interested in the cold, hard, mathematics of horsepower and efficiency but others are quite interested in these things. "each to their own" such is the nature of this hobby it spans quite a range of activities and interests.

Small scale "model" Dynamometers are quite feasible at this scale and actually fairly straightforward to build, there are a number of designs online I found this one quite interesting dynamometer (friction torque meter) by zhwang168 

I worked with old "swing frame" electrical Dynos at one time and have often thought of making a working model of one.

Best Regards Mark


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 18, 2021)

Today has been a day of cleaning, sanding, and chasing down tight spots. I am always somewhat amazed at how much dirt these little engines make in the final moments of assembly prior to running. A ton of grey sludge seems to come off all of the aluminum parts and even from the cast iron parts. Today I installed the gasket that fits between the two halves of the crankcase and the gasket that fits between the top of the crankcase and the underside of the cylinder assembly. Tomorrow I will make the head gasket and probably make a gasket to put between the cylinder top plate and the cylinder body itself. I haven't heard a peep from the folks at Martin Model about shipping my flywheels, but I see that they have put the charge on my Visa. in a perfect world, I would receive the flywheels before I finish everything on the engine, but it's getting tight. I will set the ignition and valve timing tomorrow, and then there really isn't anything left for me to do. (I say that with tongue in cheek, because I never know until the very last minute if my valves are going to seal or not).


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## Steamchick (Aug 19, 2021)

Years ago, you paid for goods when received... COD. But  plastic cards and computers are designed so you pay instantly, so a bank or other can have you money invested for days before the payment gets to the recipient... and before you get your goods.
Ho hum....
K2


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 19, 2021)

Actually I phoned the guy yesterday to see what was going on with my flywheels. They had been shipped out on the 8th of august, but nobody had let me know.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 19, 2021)

All right!!!  Engine is timed, both valves and ignition. I didn't use a degree wheel. I set my crankshaft at whatever angle I want in my 3D program, then measure down from the top of the cylinder to the top of the piston. Then I set my vernier for that distance, turn the engine by hand in the correct direction until the piston touches the depth gauge end of the vernier.  Then I loosen off the screws in the crankshaft gear on the side I am timing and rotate it until the valve just begins to open (this is quite visible because the cylinder head is removed).  Ignition timing is set to about 5 degrees before top dead center. I always go a little crazy doing the timing, because I have to remember which side I am putting the starter fixture on, and then remember which side of the engine I'm working with and knowing that on the far side of the engine the crankshaft will be rotating in the opposite direction.


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## Steamchick (Aug 20, 2021)

What an explanation Brian. I was expecting you to say you determined the valve opening by cam because you had a Pipe connected and blew on it till you could feel the pressure drop when it opened! Or a DTI on the valve head... 
I used to do the ignition timing on my Yamaha motorcycle with a DTI + extension down the plug-hole to piston crown. The book said it should be fully advanced and fire at 1mm Before TDC. Easy!
K2


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 21, 2021)

Today I milled keyways into both ends of the crankshaft, finished making gaskets, and mounted the cylinder head and sparkplug. At this point, turning the engine over be hand, I can't really tell if I can feel compression or not. That is not unusual, because my new engines are a bit stiff. Tomorrow we are having a family birthday party for my second oldest granddaughter who is turning 14 and my mother who is turning 101.  There isn't much more that I can do to the engine now until my flywheels come.---Brian


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## SirJohn (Aug 21, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Today I milled keyways into both ends of the crankshaft, finished making gaskets, and mounted the cylinder head and sparkplug. At this point, turning the engine over be hand, I can't really tell if I can feel compression or not. That is not unusual, because my new engines are a bit stiff. Tomorrow we are having a family birthday party for my second oldest granddaughter who is turning 14 and my mother who is turning 101.  There isn't much more that I can do to the engine now until my flywheels come.---Brian


HAPPY BIRTHDAY to your mother Brian, that is a milestone that not many of us ever reach.  Hope she is well and enjoys the party.
John


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## Steamchick (Aug 22, 2021)

Enjoy the party and "Happy birthday to both girls!"
The best news today!
K2


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 22, 2021)

Party doesn't start till later in the day. I decided to perform the old, tried and true, "Blow yer Guts Out" test on the engine. This is a simple diagnostic test. You have to sacrifice a spark plug, by chipping out all of the porcelain and soldering a small tube to the sparkplug to which a piece of flexible gas line is attached. This lets you put the other end of the tube in your mouth and "Blow yer Guts Out". In a perfect world, when the engine is at top dead center on the compression stroke and both valves are fully closed (as verified by seeing daylight between the valve stem and the valve lifter), then you shouldn't be able to blow at all. If you can blow, and the air comes out of the exhaust system, then your exhaust valve is leaking. If you cover the end of the exhaust with a finger and you can still blow, then probably your intake valve is leaking. If you cover the intake and the exhaust with your fingers and can still blow, then your rings are leaking. (you have to remove the oil filler plug for the ring test). From what I see today, the exhaust valve and the intake valve are leaking a little bit. The rings don't seem to be leaking at all.  This doesn't surprise me at all, and it is a simple operation to pop off the cylinder head and the top part of the cylinder assembly which has the valve cages in it. A little more dressing with 600 grit aluminum oxide paste will probably fix any current valve leaks.


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## Steamchick (Aug 23, 2021)

I have done the same on motorcycle engines and car engines (before fitting manifolds). I now use an old fridge compressor as it is easier on my lungs (I need the air for my body).
I also use the modified 14mm spark plug body as a connection for a compression test... With a tyre valve screwed in as a non-return valve. 
Brian would need a smaller non-return valve for his plug body!
But before fitting cylinder heads I always check valves are tight by pouring an egg-cup of pertrol, paraffin or turps substitute into the intake and exhaust ports to see if the valves are tight - or not. You can often see the witness marks of the fuel seeping through to know where the seat needs a tad more lapping.
K2


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## skyline1 (Aug 24, 2021)

I like your temporary flywheel it looks like an old washing machine pulley


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 24, 2021)

Actually, that is a purpose bought 8" v-pulley. I have bored the hub out to 3/4" and have a variety of split bushings ranging from 5/16" i.d. to 1/2" i.d. to use in it. This lets me rotate the crankshaft and get things set up properly before I finish the flywheels.---Brian Rupnow


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## skyline1 (Aug 24, 2021)

Great idea, you can fit it to more or less any size shaft


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 24, 2021)

After a bit of redressing the valves with 600 grit, everything seems to be sealing okay. Today is going to be an "at the beach" day with one of my grandsons, but I had time this morning to redress the valves. Now it's simply a matter of waiting for flywheels. They were shipped to me on the 8th of August. 16 days and counting---


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## Gordon (Aug 24, 2021)

Have you received a tracking number? I have found that frequently suppliers submit a tracking number but do not actually deliver the package to the actual shipper for several days. This happens frequently with third party shippers. Your package may also be held up at the border.


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## Steamchick (Aug 25, 2021)

Aha! - To cross the border the flywheels will probably need 10 days in Quarantine....
I'm not sure about tracking numbers... all too often they say the goods are shipped when the orders are just raised, then don't complete shipping until days after I have the goods.... Pony Express was more predictable!
Excellent work as usual Brian. Keep on keeping on!
K2


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 25, 2021)

We took our second oldest grandson and went to the beach yesterday. My God it was beautiful. A lovely lake, bright sunshine, hot temperatures around 80F. Beach wasn't crowded, water was clear. I sat back in my beach chair between swims and thought----My God, if I had to do this every day, I'd go stone crazy. I wish it wasn't so. If I could be happy doing that, I'd sell my house in Barrie and buy a house on a beautiful fresh water lake in the Muskokas, about 30 miles north of where I am. My wife thinks she would like that, but I'm sure that after a couple of months she would be as crazy as I am.  I know!!  Thirty years ago I bought a cottage on one of those beautiful lakes. It was in pretty rough shape. I worked every day for a year on it, with help from our two boys, and we made it a lovely cottage. The week after we finished it I was going nuts trying to find something to do.---So we sold it.  Been down that path before---


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## Steamchick (Aug 25, 2021)

Good thoughts Brian....
We all need 3 basics: health, shelter, sustenance.
But we all need 3 things for our instinctive needs: occupation ( for mind and body), companionship (from humans or "surrogates"), and reward (e.g. money, "like" comments on these posts, or other interest in what we are doing, money, satisfaction with our achievements, money, etc.).
The lake-side had plenty of "occupation" for your needs while you were fixing it up, until you "occupied" it....when you had the reward of completion when you achieved the occupation of the space... Without any further "occupation" to use your mind and body, the boredom drove you away. Maybe you should have built a workshop on the side? Or taken up fishing? Or knitting?
Cheers my friend.
K2


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## skyline1 (Aug 26, 2021)

Gordon said:


> I have found that frequently suppliers submit a tracking number but do not actually deliver the package to the actual shipper for several days. This happens frequently with third party shippers.



Yes, EBay suppliers are notorious for it, very shoddy practice but increasingly common.

Hurry up flywheels Brian is getting engine withdrawal symptoms (We all are I think)


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 26, 2021)

This morning, for something to do, I hooked up the battery to my coil and sparkplug tester to verify that the timing was right where I wanted it to be----it was. I started checking around for Traxxas 4033 carburetors and concluded that I didn't have any, so I ordered three new ones from Ebay. I can and have built my own carburetors in the past, but the 4033 Traxxas carb works so well on these 1" bore engines that it isn't worth the bother to build my own carbs.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 26, 2021)

Moving on up---Thirteen years ago, when I first started building model engines, I needed a bandsaw. Metal cutting bandsaws were simply beyond my price range, so I bought a 16" vertical wood cutting bandsaw for $200 and added a second jackshaft and pulleys to slow it down to metal cutting speed, and it has served me faithfully.--It does the job, and does it very well but it's slow. I recently had an old customer come forward and ask me to design a couple of welding fixtures for one of the big three auto companies, and this will leave me with a few thousand dollars that weren't earmarked for anything. I've spent the morning on the telephone calling used machinery dealers, and I may have found a good used metal cutting bandsaw that was designed to cut metal, not wood. This is rather exciting for me, and I'm waiting for a call back from someone in Toronto right now. So----If it works out right, I may have a real, honest to God metal cutting bandsaw in my garage.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 26, 2021)

My flywheel showed up in the mail today, and it's a beautiful thing. Only problem is, I bought and paid for two flywheels, not one. I have let Gary at Martin Model know that I've only received one, and I'm sure he will make it right.


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## CFLBob (Aug 26, 2021)

Gee, I happen to be building a model that needs a 4-1/2" flywheel and I've been thinking about getting a cast flywheel instead of the shop built approach.  Do you have the company and contact information handy?  

Here, private message, email, whatever.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 26, 2021)

Martin Models---Gary--Reasonably priced and based in Oregon


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 26, 2021)

Well Sir!!!--That looks nice. The keyway is going to be problematic. My keyseating set has an insertion tool for hubs that are 1" long, while this actual hub is 1 1/4" long. If I try to put a keyway into this hub with my current set up, it will break the broach, to the tune of $100 per. Tomorrow I will machine a longer insertion tool. The proportions of this flywheel are about perfect. Somebody asked if this engine really needs two flywheels. Perhaps not, from a purely mechanical standpoint, but for the sake of art, it needs two. I have never envisioned this engine with only one flywheel.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 27, 2021)

Every day we get a little closer. Keyway and grub screws are in flywheel, and a starter hub has been turned and installed. Jeez, I wish I had the other flywheel!!!


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## Gordon (Aug 27, 2021)

Will it run with only one flywheel?


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 27, 2021)

Probably.---I'm waiting for a few carburetors that I ordered out of USA


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## Gordon (Aug 27, 2021)

You obviously have more patience than I do. I would be borrowing a carburetor from another engine and trying to start the new engine. I would not be showing others however until I was sure that it was going to work.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 27, 2021)

Tomorrow my wife is having a benefit yard and bake sale to aid in the fight against Parkinsons disease, and I have been told that I WILL help. She only does this every three or four years, and it takes up a whole day (with two months of preparation). Today I went to Toronto and bought a used DoAll industrial metal cutting bandsaw and the VFD required to run it--It is huge, and I haven't even started to figure out how I will get it out of the back of my truck. We are having two grandchildren sleep over tonight to help drag all the yard-sale treasures out of my basement, storage area and garage and get them set out in the driveway early in the morning.


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## gbritnell (Aug 28, 2021)

What carbs did you order and from who?


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 28, 2021)

I ordered Traxxas 4033 carbs from Ebay, not sure exactly who.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 28, 2021)

The yard sale/ bake sale was very successful.  Children and grand children all showed up and helped drag about two thousand pieces of valuable junk out into the front yard and driveway. At the end of the day we had about one thousand pieces of junk left and about $550 profit, which all goes to the Parkinsons foundation. Good wife will spend the next two weeks harassing all of the cheap and free places that help the poor to take the last thousand pieces of junk off our hands. I found time for some measuring. My garage door opening  is 82" high clearance from the floor. The area where I would like the bandsaw to fit has 84" clear from the floor to the underside of a boxed furnace duct. The bandsaw is 72" tall. I don't know how high my cherrypicker engine hoist will reach, and I'm too tired to find out tonight. Tomorrow will tell whether "Rupnow Hoisting Service" is going to be able to get some daylight between the bottom of the saw and my truck bed, or if I'm, going to have to pay some money to get a real hoisting service to come and see me.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 28, 2021)

GBritnell---The carbs were purchased from trumpet-1 on Ebay


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## Vietti (Aug 28, 2021)

Brian,

As you probably know some wreckers have a boom that extends and lifts.  Would easily lift the saw and may be able to insert it a ways into your shop.  They are also a cheap way to transport machine tools short distances.

Much cheaper than a rigger.  Good luck and I'm jealous of your new saw.

John


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## Makin chips (Aug 28, 2021)

A couple (3 or 4)pieces of pipe under the machine and you can roll the saw into place only lifting it enough to place or remove the pipes.


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## Thommo (Aug 29, 2021)

A few carbs, how many are you going to run on it Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 29, 2021)

I ordered three carbs, because I use them up quickly. Thanks for the tip about the wrecker trucks--I hadn't thought of that.---Brian


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## Gordon (Aug 29, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> I ordered three carbs, because I use them up quickly. Thanks for the tip about the wrecker trucks--I hadn't thought of that.---Brian


I have used wrecker trucks to move machines in the past. Some will give you a price break if you let them do it on their schedule when they are not doing something else. For you it is not really important that they show up at a specific time. Sometime today will usually work for you.


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## gbritnell (Aug 30, 2021)

Brian I did a search for trumpet-1 on ebay but all that came up was trumpet parts. Could you be a little more specific. 
gbritnell


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## SteamChEng (Aug 30, 2021)

gbritnell said:


> Brian I did a search for trumpet-1 on ebay but all that came up was trumpet parts. Could you be a little more specific.
> gbritnell



First one listed when I searched for Traxxas 4403.  This should work:

Traxxas 4033 Carburetor Pro complete assembled  TRX Pro.15 6.0mm bore TRA1 20334403308 | eBay

Cheers!


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## danallen (Aug 30, 2021)

gbritnell said:


> Brian I did a search for trumpet-1 on ebay but all that came up was trumpet parts. Could you be a little more specific.
> gbritnell


I'll jump in here because l looked up the Traxxas  4033 carburetors after Brian mentioned them. They are available from multiple sellers on Ebay all for about the same price - about $35.


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 30, 2021)

george---















*Thanks Brian, your order is confirmed.*



We’ll let you know when your order ships via the Global Shipping Program.​




View order details​






*Traxxas 4033 Carburetor Pro complete assembled TRX Pro.15 6.0mm bore TRA1*








​ 


*Item price*: US $104.85 (3 x US $34.95)*Order number*: 23-07519-73755*Item ID*: 143677838851*Seller*: trumpet_1 (15733)







Your seller trumpet_1 has left you a message:

Thank you for your purchase. Corona2020 Update: We are shipping orders on time however please be advised that your... 
View full message 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	














 

Estimated delivery:Tue, Sep 07 - Tue, Sep 14







 

Your order will ship to:brian rupnow
1095 carson rd.,
barrie, ON L4M4S5
Canada


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## Brian Rupnow (Aug 30, 2021)

Okay--All bandsaw reference has been moved over to a new thread titled "DoAll Bandsaw for Brian". I heard from my flywheel guy in Arizona and he is shipping my second flywheel out today. My new Traxxas carburetors are supposed to get here on 07-September. This build will continue, hopefully to a happy conclusion after I get these two parts. I will use the intervening time to get my new bandsaw set up and running.---Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 2, 2021)

Having a quiet day today. Can't do any more on the new bandsaw until my electrical friend comes over to wire up the VFD. Can't do very much on the t-head engine until my second flywheel comes or my carburetors come.---However, one thing I needed for the engine was a "starter spud" that fits into my variable speed hand drill for starting the engine with. So----This is my big machining contribution for today.---A starter spud!!!


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 2, 2021)

Yayyy---My carburetors showed up!! Went to take out the garbage and there was the package laying on my front step. Here's a little something to chew on---these carb's are $36 each, American. I bought three. That comes to $108 American. By the time I paid shipping, tax, and the difference in our dollars, it cost me $176 Canadian. Sure ain't cheap to live in the land of the polar bear!!!---Brian


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## Vietti (Sep 2, 2021)

Brian, 

Is there a reason you don't use a one way or sprang clutch on your starter?  They are easily sourced and not expensive.

John


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 2, 2021)

Yes john, but when I make them, they are free!!! My version works, and works very well. There is more time than money around here.---Brian


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## Steamchick (Sep 3, 2021)

Hi Brian, 
I was half-expecting a c lever curved slot auto-disconnect - and a view of the miller showing the set-up for that weird shape... But you seem happy to start the engine and simply pull the drill-spud out to disconnect from the straight slots you have...?
John (Vietti): do you have a preferred supplier of the one-way or sprag clutch? (For us lesser mortals who have to buy more complicated bits!).
Ta,
K2


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## Vietti (Sep 3, 2021)

K2,

Buy mine from BOCA bearings here in FL.  Not much help since you are in the UK, but I think any large bearing supplier should have them.  
Lately I've been adding electric start to my engines and the one way clutches are vital.  Kids at the shows, of all ages seem to get a real kick out of pushing the button and starting an engine.

Good luck, John


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 3, 2021)

Vietti--can you send me a link to wherever you buy your electric starters please.----Brian


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## Vietti (Sep 3, 2021)

Brian,

Have not bought any for a while but they all came from ebay.  I think they are all surplus motors from battery drills, a little over 2" in dia.  Just find ones whose size you like, have a voltage you favor and pay attention to the RPM.  They seem very forgiving re voltage so voltage can be varied to suit rpm.  Cheap too at around $10.  Some come with a gear that's hard to remove.  End up cutting 1/2 way through and splitting.  If you have a junk drill, salvage the motor or buy a cheap used one at the junk store.  

Most have a 1/8" shaft so I simply loctite a suitable, usually 1/4" shaft over it, looks shakey but so far no failures.  For the remote start button I use a small solenoid made for Chinese scooters etc.  The starter drive is 1/8 round belting, small chain or best yet are the small G2 toothed belts/pulleys.  I tried gear drive but getting a large sprocket for the crank shaft is difficult and was really noisy.  The starter is on a pivot so tension can be adjusted.

Its nice to start the engine without grabbing the drill etc.  If you remember the video of the Silver bullet I posted, it has an electric start.

As I said, letting the spectators start the engine really delights them, I guess they feel more involved.

I'm a fan and happy to answer any questions I can.

John


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## Vietti (Sep 3, 2021)

To find them on ebay type in 12 volt motors or as a sample, Mabuchi motor, $8, free shipping from US


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## Charles Lamont (Sep 3, 2021)

Steamchick said:


> do you have a preferred supplier of the one-way or sprag clutch?



Got mine, 8mm bore, from https://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 3, 2021)

My second flywheel arrived today. As soon as it came, I grabbed it and ran down to my lathe and machined it. It's a beautiful thing!!!--Still needs a keyway and grub-screws, but maybe tomorrow-----


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## Ghosty (Sep 3, 2021)

Brian, So you will have it running in an hour
Cheers
Andrew


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## ShopShoe (Sep 4, 2021)

Brian,

I think it looks "right" with two flywheels. You've got the artistic eye design skills as well as the engineering skills. 

I always look forward to new posts from you.

And, congratulations on the Do-All. I'm following that as well.

--ShopShoe


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 4, 2021)

This is the part where I never know what is going to happen next. The second flywheel has been keyseated, grub-screwed and installed. I have had some engines start right up at this point, amazing and delighting me. I have had engines that ran, but needed considerable tweaking before they ran well. And I have had engines that wouldn't run at all, because something was out of adjustment, the valves leaked, because I had machined something wrong, or perhaps the small engine Gods were just messing with me.---Wish me luck!!!---Brian


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## CFLBob (Sep 4, 2021)

Well, of course I wish you luck, but I saw you checked the valves for leakage earlier in the week, so that one's probably good.  

Plus, I've got to believe your experience at what to double or triple check has gone up enough that every engine goes a little faster than before.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 4, 2021)

Okay---this one isn't going to take right off and surprise me. Fuel is getting ignited, cylinder is getting warm from firing. I'm not feeling a lot of compression here. The old "oil down the sparkplug hole" trick isn't bringing the compression up any, so this infers that the rings are doing their sealing alright. I will check again to make sure that there is daylight between the valve stem and the lifter when the lifter isn't up on the cam. (this will hold the valve open and no compression will be developed.) Since it does seem to be firing more or less consistently when driven by my electric drill, I will now put an electric motor to driving it, and see if the valves will seal up from the pressure created by the engines firing. if it wasn't firing at all, I wouldn't do this.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 4, 2021)

It seems that I have a leaking exhaust valve. Rather than screw around with everything bolted to the engine, I have made a "dummy cylinder" to bolt the cylinder head to. It is an exact copy of the cylinder, but without the center hole for the piston. First thing to check is whether the valve can be rotated into a position that doesn't leak. That technically shouldn't happen, but it sometimes does. Without changing anything on this set up, I can seal the leaking exhaust with my thumb and thus check the intake valve for leaking. I know that I used this same piece of equipment with the "blow yer guts out" test to see if the valves were leaking or not. They didn't seem to be then, but everything gets handled a great deal between that test and when the engine is finished. Today I will test things at 40 psi.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 4, 2021)

Compression has improved. Engine is now firing regularly along with power drill as I attempt to get it to take off and run on it's own. Cylinder is getting hot from firing. I am now going to take my degree wheel and check the ignition timing. The common knowledge out there is that four cycle engines should fire about 20 degrees before top dead center. Lots of puffs and snorts from the engine but haven't found the sweet spot yet.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 4, 2021)

No joy today.  Very, very close, but no engine running on it's own. I'm having some kind of compression issue, and I think it is in the valves. Tomorrow I will reset the valve timing with my degree wheel, but my gut is saying it's a valve sealing issue.


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## oldengineguy (Sep 4, 2021)

Brian; A sprague clutch  or one way bearing is cheap $6-8 CDN. available from Canadian Bearings  (branch in Barrie).Much easier on drill ,wrist and engine. When its hard to start it just overruns the drill rather than having to stop and reinsert the pin in the slot. Colin


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## johwen (Sep 4, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> No joy today.  Very, very close, but no engine running on it's own. I'm having some kind of compression issue, and I think it is in the valves. Tomorrow I will reset the valve timing with my degree wheel, but my gut is saying it's a valve sealing issue.


How about your Valve spring, does it have enough tension to seat the valve each time? cheers. John ( love your build Brian)


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 4, 2021)

Johwen--The valve springs don't have to exert a lot of force to close the valve. Once the valve gets near the seat, the expanding fuel charge will force the valve into it's seat and seal ---IF--the valve and seat are machined correctly. Hi revving engines need very strong valve springs, in order to get the valve closed in the very limited time that is available to move the valve from open to closed.--On low revving engines like this one, springs don't have to respond so quickly.


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## petertha (Sep 4, 2021)

I'm interested in your choice of carb (the Traxxas 4033 for RC car). Coincidentally I was going through a list of RC (aircraft) methanol fuel carbs for my radial engine with coincidentally similar barrel orifice (6mm). I didn't think to look at RC car/buggy as aircraft carbs seem to be slimmer & slimmer pickens. 

Are you running gasoline? Is it mostly about the orifice size? (you mentioned possibly other carbs). Does the low & high speed needle valve adjustment provide you the adjustability to require? Just curious.


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## Jasonb (Sep 5, 2021)

My engines tend to run a 5 to 10deg BTDC, your 20deg sounds a bit early to me particularly for these slow running types.

that way you are more likely to get all the explosive force pushing the piston down, too early and that force is pushing down on the piston while it's still coming up and on it's own the engine does not have the power to overcome that. Also tends to cause more backfires but you won't be seeing that pushing it round with an electric drill, I see it more as mine get started by flicking the flywheel or a short pull cord.

*EDIT* I just looked at what hamilton Upshur suggests for his Tee Head and it says "_a little Before TDC_" which I would take as less than 20deg


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## dsage (Sep 5, 2021)

Brian:
You should consider using the Sprague clutch type starter. Or at least a curved slot in the hub.
It is likely that the engine needs / wants to spin faster than the starter to run. Your direct connection starter will be holding it back. The clutch will allow it to speed ahead of the starter once it starts. Or with a curved slot it will kick the starter out when it runs.
All of my engines run much faster than my starter drill and will not respond to being forced to a specific rpm.
Another alternative is a friction cone type starter like model airplanes use. Simple to make.
P.S. a faster motor direct connected will also not help for the reverse reasons (forcing the engine to run faster than it wants).


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 5, 2021)

The valve timing was initially set using measurements from the top of the cylinder down to the top of the piston, taken from my 3D model when the crankshaft was positioned at the correct number of degrees before top or bottom dead center. I will certainly check the valve timing again with a degree wheel just to be absolutely sure of it.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 6, 2021)

Okay Kiddies---It's showtime. Yesterday I had worked my way right into a snit trying to get this engine to run. I was almost at the point of making a new piston with a viton ring to get more compression. I decided that before changing anything, I would bring the engine in from my big garage and use a degree wheel to set the valve timing exactly "on spec" and to reset the ignition timing to about 12 degrees before top dead center.--I discovered that the grub screws in the gear which drives the exhaust valve had backed off and the exhaust valve timing was way out of whack.  So, in the end, I really didn't change anything. The engine runs very well, and after playing with it a bit as "final tuning" I will reinstall the gear covers and clean everything up.   If you would like to build this engine, I sell a complete plan set of engineering drawings, including detail drawings and assembly drawings for $25 Canadian funds, paid to Paypal to [email protected]    Thank you to everybody who followed the build, and thank you for your posts and the information you have given me.---Brian Rupnow


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## Gordon (Sep 6, 2021)

Just like every one I have built. Right down to the end and it will not run until you discover one minor adjustment that you missed and then everything is good.  Congratulations on a job well done.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 6, 2021)

Thank you Gordon. I'm very happy that it runs.


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## CFLBob (Sep 6, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> I decided that before changing anything, I would bring the engine in from my big garage and use a degree wheel to set the valve timing exactly "on spec" and to reset the ignition timing to about 12 degrees before top dead center.--I discovered that the grub screws in the gear which drives the exhaust valve had backed off and the exhaust valve timing was way out of whack. So, in the end, I really didn't change anything.



Translation: I thought I was wrong but that was a mistake.  

Congratulations, Brian.  Good to see it running.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 6, 2021)

If I'm bored next week, I may make a cooling fan for it. This won't be anything new, it will be very similar to the cooling fan I made for my vertical engine. These fans put out a lot more wind than you would think. When the engine is running at 1000 rpm, the fan is turning at about 5600 rpm.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 6, 2021)

Thank you guys. Here is the true story of the cam and valve timing that I use for all of my gasoline engines. This cam is longer than the most cams are, but the profile is exactly the same. I use the same profile for both intake and exhaust valves. I use this profile for flathead, T-head, overhead valve and overhead cam engines. It works fine for all of them. You can see on the drawing that only 120 degrees of this cam has any effect on the lifter or pushrod. Since there is a 2:1 ratio between the camshaft and crankshaft, that means that this cam actually has 240 degrees of influence on the engine. I set my exhaust valve to begin opening 40 degrees before the piston reaches bottom dead center on the power stroke. Due to the cam profile, the exhaust valve will begin closing 20 degrees after top dead center on the intake stroke. The intake valve begins to open 15 degrees before top dead center on the exhaust stroke, remains open throughout the entire intake stroke, and closes 45 degrees after bottom dead center on the compression stroke. The ignition timing is set to spark 12 degrees before top dead center on the power stroke.


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## johnmcc69 (Sep 6, 2021)

Congratulations on another fine runner Brian!

 Outstanding work!

 John


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 6, 2021)

Tomorrow I am going to try something new. In the attached model, you can see that there is a blue fan shaft support plate setting on top of an existing gear guard. There is no good way to bolt this onto the gear guard. I have modelled a completely new gear guard which has the fan shaft support integrated into it, but I don't have material to make it that way. Tomorrow I am going to buy some "alumiweld" brazing rod and attempt to weld that blue piece to the existing gear guard. I can buy two rods for $10 at Canadian Tire. If I fail, I'm only out $10. It would probably take about $15 worth of material to make a new one piece gear guard combined with fan shaft support. I've been wanting to try this method of welding aluminum, but haven't had any real reason to until now. I will let you know what happens.---Brian


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## ShopShoe (Sep 7, 2021)

Brian,

I gotta like this one. It runs nicely and I'm sure it will sound better when the gear covers are back. Congratulations on mastering the cast iron rings: Your skill set just continues to improve and your engines incorporate more interesting features as you go. 

I'm always watching your projects of all types.

Thank You for posting.

--ShopShoe


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## werowance (Sep 7, 2021)

nice to see it running Brian.  excelent job.  and do please post on the alumina weld rod.  ive often wondered about it as well.


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## awake (Sep 7, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> You can see on the drawing that only 120 degrees of this cam has any effect on the lifter or pushrod. Since there is a 2:1 ratio between the camshaft and crankshaft, that means that this cam actually has 240 degrees of influence on the engine.



One key bit that I find helpful to add to that last statement: 240 degrees of influence throughout all four cycles, i.e., _across 720° of crank revolution_. I say this only because I have to do a lot of thinking and re-thinking and thinking yet again to keep all of this straight. A particular place where this becomes especially confusing for me is when plans call for something like 40° BTDC for setting a cam - is that 40° on the crankshaft, or on the camshaft? And if it is 40° on one, what is it on the other? Half the time I multiply the wrong way and wind up with a mess ... 



Brian Rupnow said:


> Tomorrow I am going to buy some "alumiweld" brazing rod and attempt to weld that blue piece to the existing gear guard. I can buy two rods for $10 at Canadian Tire. If I fail, I'm only out $10. It would probably take about $15 worth of material to make a new one piece gear guard combined with fan shaft support. I've been wanting to try this method of welding aluminum ...



I seem to recall that you got a TIG welder a year or so ago. Does it have AC, or DC only? If AC ... might be the perfect time to work on TIG welding aluminum. Or not - I have to confess that I upgraded to an AC/DC TIG welder a couple of years ago so that I could add aluminum to my repertoire, but thus far the little bit of experimenting I have done has mostly shown me how far I have yet to go!


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## a41capt (Sep 7, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Okay Kiddies---It's showtime. Yesterday I had worked my way right into a snit trying to get this engine to run. I was almost at the point of making a new piston with a viton ring to get more compression. I decided that before changing anything, I would bring the engine in from my big garage and use a degree wheel to set the valve timing exactly "on spec" and to reset the ignition timing to about 12 degrees before top dead center.--I discovered that the grub screws in the gear which drives the exhaust valve had backed off and the exhaust valve timing was way out of whack.  So, in the end, I really didn't change anything. The engine runs very well, and after playing with it a bit as "final tuning" I will reinstall the gear covers and clean everything up.   If you would like to build this engine, I sell a complete plan set of engineering drawings, including detail drawings and assembly drawings for $25 Canadian funds, paid to Paypal to [email protected]    Thank you to everybody who followed the build, and thank you for your posts and the information you have given me.---Brian Rupnow



Congratulations on another successful engine Brian. A great runner!

John W


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 7, 2021)

This is one of the gear guards with the new fan shaft support tab setting in place beside it. I chickened out on using the 'alumiweld' brazing rods and instead went to my welding supply shop and bought some 3/32" aluminum rod to use with my tig welder. I will practice a bit on some scrap aluminum pieces, and then weld the two pieces in the picture together. Tig welding with aluminum is a skill I have to develop, and I might as well start now. I will post the end results of this tig welding.


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## dsage (Sep 7, 2021)

The trick,  for TIG welding aluminum is:
CLEAN CLEAN and CLEAN again. Brush it with a stainless wire brush (never steel), wipe it with Acetone, let it flash and weld it immediately after cleaning.
Way more picky than steel in that regard. The throttle pedal is key.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 7, 2021)

Well, there we have it. My first tig weld on aluminum. Aluminum is definitely a different kind of thing to weld than mild steel. One of the biggest problems was that the people who sell this welder in Canada are a bunch of morons. They sell the welders in Canada but don't have any kind of technical help. I called Toronto and asked for a tech help guy, and they shuffled me around from person to person, and finally I got a guy who moaned and groaned like he was in hard labour birthing an elephant, and after about ten minutes I said "Tell me the truth. You've never welded anything in your life, have you." He reluctantly told me that no, he wasn't a welder but he had read a lot of manuals.  I hung up and called the company in Orillia that sell these machines, and got a bit of help from them. I had first tried to weld with the frequency control button off, because I didn't know any better. Once I had it turned on, things got marginally better.  What I found was, that my welds were majorly ugly.---Like really ugly!! I kept at it until I could see that I was getting penetration on both pieces, and since the welds were so ugly, I laid down a lot more weld than I needed to, so that when I ground 90% of it off the part wouldn't have craters in it. It really doesn't look too bad.  The good thing here is that this part will be pretty well hidden behind the fan and the flywheel, so if it's not exactly a work of art it won't matter that much. There must be an awful lot of practice involved between what I did today and those guys on Youtube who are tig welding aluminum and "stacking dimes".


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## a41capt (Sep 7, 2021)

dsage said:


> The trick,  for TIG welding aluminum is:
> CLEAN CLEAN and CLEAN again. Brush it with a stainless wire brush (never steel), wipe it with Acetone, let it flash and weld it immediately after cleaning.
> Way more picky than steel in that regard. The throttle pedal is key.


Agree completely.  Been TIG welding aluminum since 1971 (qualifications for airframe welding cert in Uncle Sam’s canoe club) and clean is the name of the game!  Aluminum oxide melts at a much higher temperature (and therefore later) than the aluminum substrate, and that’s where most folks get into trouble.  While they wait for the surface puddle to form, the aluminum is already at the melting point and falling away.

Vigorous scrubbing with a DEDICATED and CLEAN stainless steel brush is the only way to ensure clean surfaces, follow with acetone, and immediately begin welding as soon as the acetone evaporates.  Newer TIG machines with a decent pedal and the right cup and tungsten really make the weld easier than the old 60 cycle rectifier machines did waaay back when.  Set your balance a bit more on the cleaning side, get at least 1 second of pre-flow on your argon (post flow on aluminum isn’t as critical, but at least a second is best), increase the frequency to better than 120, and set pulse if you’re slow on your filler routine.

Good luck, and there’s no substitute for burning a ton of rod in practice!

John W


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## stragenmitsuko (Sep 8, 2021)

don't forget to chamfer before welding , and imho the best electrode to use is 2% lanthanated .


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## Steamchick (Sep 8, 2021)

Most interesting!
Brian, as the original Chicken, and have mastered using zinc and aluminium rods for 'soldering' aluminium, I understand your reluctance to try the Alumiweld, but I reckon it is easier than TIG. But, I do not have a TIG welder and have never tried it. Simple stick welding (steel)is the limit of my welding skill. I have employed a dozen or more Aluminium MIG Welders on contracts (decades ago).. though they would not let me strike an arc! - sensible!
So CONGRATULATIONS on tackling TIG welding of Aluminium and succeeding.
K2 (The original Ken Chicken!)


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## ShopShoe (Sep 8, 2021)

To add to what Steamchick said above,

I don't do TIG, although I wish I did sometimes. I tried Alumiweld several years ago during my car-restoration years.

I found that the product did work as advertised, and I was able to get what I wanted from it. However, I also decided that much more aluminum work would call for getting the TIG, and that's where I stopped. I think that I was able to use the Alumiweld well because I had a whole lot of experience with Oxyacetelene, MAPP, and propane torches and could weld, braze, and solder just about anything all right with careful flame control.

Either approach has a learning curve.  If I had TIG, I'd go that way.

--ShopShoe


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## Ken1 (Sep 8, 2021)

Nice Maskin, I´m from sweden ,I´m trying to see if I can make a motor myself. I Have Lathe and mill, I like this site.


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## LorenOtto (Sep 8, 2021)

Ken1 said:


> Nice Maskin, I´m from sweden ,I´m trying to see if I can make a motor myself. I Have Lathe and mill, I like this site.


Welcome - the fun is in the doing!


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 8, 2021)

I spent this morning working on a real job (to pay for my DoAll bandsaw). Then I spent this afternoon running all over town trying to buy stuff that nobody in Barrie carries. Then I machined the little bits and pieces that make up my fan.  My local bearing supply shop has changed their policy to a $25 minimum charge for anything bought at the store. They have lost me as a customer. The sealed bearings in the picture are 3/16" i.d. router bearings from Busy Bee Tools.  My friend the electrical wizard is coming tomorrow to help me sort out the bandsaw VFD. next thing for the engine is to make a fan blade.


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## dsage (Sep 9, 2021)

Try Bearings Canada (online).


			https://www.bearingscanada.com/
		


(Not to be confused with Canadian Bearings - generally a rip off.)

Great prices, good stock and just about anything you'll need. I've had great success with them. They might be up your way. Not sure if they have a store. They ship by Canada Post at good rates.


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## oldengineguy (Sep 9, 2021)

dsage: you are right, it is Bearings Canada in Mississauga. Their web site is easy to navigate. They are the company I dealt with a few years ago when I needed a  bearing for my Panther Pup. Time sometimes confuses the memory. A look at their site to-day shows one way bearings at about $12-14. Makes a great way to crank an engine.   Colin


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## dsage (Sep 9, 2021)

Closer than I thought (to me). Such is shopping on line. I could probably stop by if they had a bricks and mortar store. I'll have to check and save the post.
That's where I get my one-way bearings and other related items too.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 9, 2021)

Today I machined a fan, and done something dumb. The fan and pulley are silver soldered together, and the hub has a recess for two ball bearings and a spacer. They are in a blind hole, and all of my reamers have a chamfer on the end. To get around having a chamfer in there, I cut the counterbore with a 3/8" endmill. Dumb move. A 3/8" endmill cuts a hole about 0.010" oversize, enough to make the hub go all "wobblycock" on the bearings. My fix is to mount the fan and hub in the 3 jaw chuck, and mount the fan shaft and bearings in the tailstock chuck. Liberally coat o.d. of bearings and spacer with J.B. Weld, then advance the tailstock ram until everything is where it should be linearly. If I've lived a good clean life (Ha-Ha), everything should be aligned when  get up tomorrow.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 9, 2021)

By the time I pay for shipping to Barrie from Toronto, there is no financial advantage to buying bearings online.


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## dsage (Sep 10, 2021)

Bearings Canada ships by Canada Post. That's about as cheap as it gets.
For you - six bucks maybe. +/-.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 10, 2021)

This morning I brought all the drawings up to date and saved them as .pdf files. There are 43 drawings, and some have multiple sheets, so there are about 50 drawings in all. Each component has a detail sheet, and the main overall assembly has parts lists and identifying part numbers and bills of material. I have a bit of finish work to complete on the fan components, but the drawings are complete and included in the package. I sell a complete set of these drawings for $25 Canadian funds, paid to Paypal to [email protected]  ---Brian


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## L98fiero (Sep 10, 2021)

Do you have a place where all your plans are available?


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 10, 2021)

Now, for something a little different----I had trouble cutting the cams for this engine on my manual mill. The main reason for this was the extreme overall length of the cams. I appealed for someone with CNC capabilities to make me a set of cams in exchange for a set of engine plans. Sid stepped up and machined a beautiful pair of cams for me, but doesn't want the plans. He asked that a free set of plans be given to someone else who wanted them. Okay, I'm going to do that. The only stipulation I would ask for, is that whoever gets the free plan set must start a thread on building the engine and post it here for us to follow. So, who will it be?--If you want a complete set of engineering drawings for this engine, and will post a thread on this forum to show us your progress, then let me know. I am going to send a free plan set to whoever speaks up first, as long as they can meet my conditions.----Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 10, 2021)

L98Fiero-No, I don't, although I will try and put something together this coming week.---Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 10, 2021)

Today was painting day. I picked up a can of orange Tremclad paint, because that was the only color that I hadn't used already. The fan can be flat back, it's not that important. The aluminum gear covers didn't really need to be painted, but there were enough dings and low spots in them that I filled all the low spots with J.B.Weld yesterday, sanded it smooth this morning and gave them a double coat of aluminum paint. I wish there was a filler that matched the raw aluminum color exactly, but if there is I don't know about it. Now, it seems like I've worked myself out of a job for the time being, so the rest of the day will be spent doing not much---Ahhhh


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 11, 2021)

So here we have the engine dressed out in all of it's pretty colors. I had to get my good wife to take the pictures with her cell phone. Right now it is taking better pictures than my $700 digital camera. I will post one more video of this engine running, and then, as Bugs Bunny would have said--"That's all folks!!!"


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 12, 2021)

Question--do you have to have a special tool to insert helicoils? I have a couple of 10-24 threaded holes in my aluminum cylinder head that are getting kinda funky. I can buy a bag of helicoils for $12, but I I buy a "helicoil kit" the price shoots up to $45


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## gartof (Sep 12, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Question--do you have to have a special tool to insert helicoils? I have a couple of 10-24 threaded holes in my aluminum cylinder head that are getting kinda funky. I can buy a bag of helicoils for $12, but I I buy a "helicoil kit" the price shoots up to $45


Yes, you need the correct  tap to prepare the hole for the coil and the driver tool to engage the tang at the bottom of the coil to turn it into the hole  then you use a punch to knock the tang off.


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## Ghosty (Sep 12, 2021)

Brian, The kit comes with a drill bit, tap and installation tooling, usually have 5 or 10 coils in the kit as well.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 12, 2021)

After painting and reassembling the engine, it looks lovely but it won't start. It won't start because it has lost compression at the valves.
It started and ran fine earlier this week. The painting process didn't involve any of the things that would make the valves leak.  Valve timing and ignition timing have been checked, and they are "spot on". The only difference between this engine and other engines I have built is the exceptionally long guided area of the valve stems. I have a theory that the longer contact area is creating enough friction on the valve stem to keep them from closing properly. First and easiest thing to try will be stronger valve springs. If that doesn't fix things, then my other idea can be seen at the right hand valve in the drawing. The lower portion of the guide area of the valve cages would have a clearance from the valve stem, and an inserted, concentric supplementary guide Loctited into the very bottom. This may well be the reason that Vederstein couldn't get the valves to seal on the t head engine that he built.


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## Gordon (Sep 12, 2021)

Try putting some lube on the valve stems to see if that works before making new parts. If the valves are sticking in the guides some penetrating oil should fix the problem for at least a short time.


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## johnmcc69 (Sep 12, 2021)

Great looking engine Brian! I really like the orange touches & the black fan, it seems to really "Pop" out.
 What will you do for a finished base? (If any..)

 John


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 12, 2021)

John---I never put a finished base on any of my engines. Once they run properly, they go up on the shelf "as is".


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## Ghosty (Sep 12, 2021)

Brian, this is what is in the re-coil kits, I have several.
Cheers
Andrew


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 12, 2021)

Ghosty---After I thought about this long enough, I determined that I can Loctite 1/4" steel plugs with an internal #10-40 thread into the far side of the aluminum piece and avoid buying helicoils----I think.


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## L98fiero (Sep 12, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Question--do you have to have a special tool to insert helicoils? I have a couple of 10-24 threaded holes in my aluminum cylinder head that are getting kinda funky. I can buy a bag of helicoils for $12, but I I buy a "helicoil kit" the price shoots up to $45


In your situation you'd need the helicoil tap, generically it's an STI tap, and you can use a 10-24 screw and file the end down by filing off the last thread along it's minor diameter so that it creates a 'hook' for the tang to catch on for a driver, for just a few helicoils it will work and then like gartof said, use a punch to knock the tang off.


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## johwen (Sep 13, 2021)

Hi Brian,
Like I said before Up your valve spring pressure slightly to overcome the drag on the valve stem or slightly increase the stem clearance easy done.. Cheers Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 14, 2021)

I dipped into the Rupnow fortune today and bought a 10-24 Helicoil kit which comes with all the necessary drills, taps, etcetera and about 40 inserts in different lengths for $116.00. While I was picking up the kit, I picked up some very heavy, bull-doggy looking compression springs to be used as valve springs. The valve springs I have on the engine now are 0.026" diameter wire size. The new ones I bought are 0.049" wire size. They are also larger in overall diameter, so tomorrow I will machine new valve cups that go on the valves to center the springs. This business of valves sealing one day good enough for the engine to run, and then not sealing the next day is ridiculous.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 15, 2021)

The Helicoils worked great. I have never used them before and I must say, they work fine and don't require a lot of work to use them.  I did machine new spring cups and install them and the heavy valve springs on the engine, but it didn't really help. I then took the cylinder head off the machine and ran a 0.200" diameter drill up from the bottom side of the valve cages, about 0.6" to cut down on the amount of friction between the valve stems and the valve guide portion of the valve cage. I took the heavy springs and cups off and put the originals back on. I reground the valves. Nothing really helped get my compression back.  Something I have noticed over the years--When the seat portion of the valve cage gets too large, it is almost impossible to get a good valve seal. I'm stumped at the moment. I may machine new valve cages and reface the valves in the lathe, more or less starting over again with the valve sealing issue. I have rechecked the valve and ignition timing, but they are fine.


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## SirJohn (Sep 15, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> The Helicoils worked great. I have never used them before and I must say, they work fine and don't require a lot of work to use them.  I did machine new spring cups and install them and the heavy valve springs on the engine, but it didn't really help. I then took the cylinder head off the machine and ran a 0.200" diameter drill up from the bottom side of the valve cages, about 0.6" to cut down on the amount of friction between the valve stems and the valve guide portion of the valve cage. I took the heavy springs and cups off and put the originals back on. I reground the valves. Nothing really helped get my compression back.  Something I have noticed over the years--When the seat portion of the valve cage gets too large, it is almost impossible to get a good valve seal. I'm stumped at the moment. I may machine new valve cages and reface the valves in the lathe, more or less starting over again with the valve sealing issue. I have rechecked the valve and ignition timing, but they are fine.



Brian, do you make the valve angle and the seat angle the same?  If I remember correctly, there should be a couple of degrees difference so that there is a minimum contact point.
John


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 15, 2021)

No John--I cut the valve seat at a true 90 degree included angle. the valves are machined to have a 92 degree included angle.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 16, 2021)

I spent all of yesterday flogging a dead horse. Today I am going to make new valve cages and loctite them into the head. A close visual inspection of the existing valve cages shows that the seat area has become too large because of repetitive lapping to get a good seal on the valves. Also, due too the method I used when making them, the seat area is not perfectly centered on the guide area. I tried to take picture to post here, but my digital camera can't get a shot which shows it clearly.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 16, 2021)

So, here is a family picture. The cylinder head with new valve cages pressed and loctited in place, the old valve cages which have been pressed out (You can see the excessively large valve seat area in the picture), along with valves, keepers, and springs. I haven't used my special tool for cutting new valve seats into the cages yet, I'll wait until the Loctite dries 24 hours. I am now using my wifes old digital camera, as it takes pictures much more clearly than mine. Design review came back to my customer today on the welding fixtures I designed, and it looks like I will have a full day tomorrow just making all the changes.


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## animal12 (Sep 17, 2021)

So , I'm trying to learn some of the lingo here , the parts that your calling the " valve cages " would those be the same as valve guides ? What are you folks using for valve seats on engines like this ?
thanks
animal


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## propclock (Sep 17, 2021)

We usually refer to a valve cage as both the guide and seat and port. 
Typically Loctite in place or press fit. This so the valve is not
seating directly on the soft aluminum.


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## animal12 (Sep 17, 2021)

OK , thanks . I'll be doing some digging around here for some time to get somewhat on the same page , or even just in the same book .
thanks
animal


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 20, 2021)

It's been a wild and crazy two weeks since I first had this engine running. I have been very busy changing my shop around to make room for a big DoAll Bandsaw and preparing to sell my smaller metal cutting bandsaw. Strangest thing---the engine ran fine before I painted the flywheels and gas tank, but after the paintjob I couldn't get this thing to run for love nor money. These engines are not terribly powerful, and I was having enough interferance between the large timing gears and the aluminum casings over them to keep the engine from running on it's own. The engine ran again on it's own for the second time about 3:00 this afternoon, and I've been chasing down interferences and tight spots until about 20 minutes ago. The small carburetors from Traxxas are just right for these engines I build, but the throttle is very loose so that it can be operated by a servo. I don't use servos to control my engines, and the default setting is for the carburetor to open the throttle wide open just from engine vibration if I don't have something connected to that throttle. Tomorrow I will post a better video out in my main garage where there is lots of natural light with the garage doors open, and I have a better hook up for the engine throttle.---And yes, that little 10 blade fan being ran from the flywheel by a rubber o-ring puts out an amazing amount of air over the cylinder.---Brian


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## payner (Sep 21, 2021)

Brian . Are you interested in having a look at the servo and tester I was telling you about , I can't remember the exact cost but about $15.00 - $20.00 . A lot cheaper then $150.00 for a complete RC system.
Bill 
PS . Engine looks and sounds great .


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 21, 2021)

Bill---I would be interested in looking at them.---Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 21, 2021)

So this is it kiddies. The engine is completely finished, runs the way I like, and looks pretty too. I had a few problems with valves not sealing, but new valve cages were made and the problem was fixed. This has been an interesting engine to build, and it is similar in many respects to the flathead engine I built ten years ago. Complete plan sets are waiting to be sent out to anyone wishing to build this engine.($25 Canadian funds), contact me. Thanks to all who have followed and commented on the forums as this engine came together.---Brian Rupnow


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## payner (Sep 21, 2021)

Brian . Here are a couple of pictures one is almost full right and the other is almost full left and it stays where you position it .
.




4.8 volt battery pack , servo , tester .
Bill


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## mnay (Sep 21, 2021)

Bill,
I would be interested in knowing where you purchased those parts.  I see many options but have a hard time knowing which parts would work together.
Thanks
Brian,
Nice result as usual on the engine.

Mike


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 21, 2021)

Thanks Bill---I don't think I will bother with the servos.---Brian


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## payner (Sep 21, 2021)

mnay said:


> Bill,
> I would be interested in knowing where you purchased those parts.  I see many options but have a hard time knowing which parts would work together.
> Thanks
> Brian,
> ...


I will see if I can find a link and post it , there is also a model railway supplier that sells a unit to control 1 to 4 servos that can be programmed with throws and speed of travel . I have several of these on my model train layout .
Bill


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## payner (Sep 21, 2021)

Mike . Here is a screenshot of the item on Banggood, mine was slightly cheaper and looks different but if you pock around on the site you can find different manufacturers. I've never had any problems with them or Aliexpress.


Bill


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## mnay (Sep 21, 2021)

Thanks Bill.
Sorry to interrupt your thread Brian.
Mike


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## William May (Sep 23, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Thanks Bill---I don't think I will bother with the servos.---Brian


Hey, Brian! How do we send you the $25 for the plans? Do you have Paypal?  Friends and Family? I bought another set of plans from you for another engine, and they are VERY nice plans!
Thanks!
Bill


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 23, 2021)

Paypal---send $25 to [email protected]. They will notify me, then I send the files to you.---Brian Rupnow


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## William May (Sep 23, 2021)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Paypal---send $25 to [email protected]. They will notify me, then I send the files to you.---Brian Rupnow


Thanks!
Any reason I couldn't do the crankcase as a casting? Or any of the other parts? I like to cast stuff.


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## Brian Rupnow (Sep 23, 2021)

You can do anything you want to. I don't use castings for anything I make, so can't really advise you on what you can and can't cast.---Brian


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## Brian Rupnow (Jan 19, 2022)

This is the T head engine I designed and built a few months ago. I finished the engine, tuned it to run and took a video. Then it went up on the shelf. Yesterday I had some free time, so I got it off the shelf, down to my work area, and made up a spring return bracket and a throttle extension handle with a return spring. I started it up, adjusted the idle, and then let the engine run until it ran out of fuel. I had my office door open while this was happening so I didn't gas myself. Actually, I went into my machine shop and worked on something else until I heard the engine quit.


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## almega (Jan 19, 2022)

Sir, you do some awesome work up there in the frozen north. I only wish I had the time to develop half of your skills. How many of these do you have on shelves?


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## Brian Rupnow (Jan 19, 2022)

Probably about fourty, but about 18 of them are steam engines.


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## Steamchick (Jan 20, 2022)

Brian, have you considered doing a video of all the engines? I am sure many of us will enjoy seeing the whole gammut of your work. And to listen to your dulcet tones describing them - and why you made them - would keep us all feeling warm when the garage is too cold for working.
K2.


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## awake (Jan 20, 2022)

Ooh - a video of all of them running at once would be quite a sight (and sound)!


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## Brian Rupnow (Jan 21, 2022)

That's not going to happen fellows. If you notice, all of my i.c. engines are powered by an "ignition box" which sets next to them. That same ignition box runs all of my i.c. engines, because a  12 volt automotive  ignition coil costs about $50 here.


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## Richard Hed (Jan 22, 2022)

Brian Rupnow said:


> That's not going to happen fellows. If you notice, all of my i.c. engines are powered by an "ignition box" which sets next to them. That same ignition box runs all of my i.c. engines, because a  12 volt automotive  ignition coil costs about $50 here.


You can wind your own, they are only a coil.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jan 22, 2022)

Richard---Yeah, I think I'll taKe a couple of hours and ten thousand feet of copper wire and wind my own coils. I only need 19 more.


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## CFLBob (Jan 22, 2022)

Brian Rupnow said:


> That's not going to happen fellows. If you notice, all of my i.c. engines are powered by an "ignition box" which sets next to them. That same ignition box runs all of my i.c. engines, because a  12 volt automotive  ignition coil costs about $50 here.



The other way to show all your engines running is to edit a video that shows all of them running, one at a time, combining 20 videos into one long video.  Or people could go to your YouTube channel and look at them.  I'm assuming you have at least one video of all of them.

Probably easier than winding 19 more coils, if you have the software.


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## Richard Hed (Jan 22, 2022)

Brian Rupnow said:


> Richard---Yeah, I think I'll taKe a couple of hours and ten thousand feet of copper wire and wind my own coils. I only need 19 more.


I've seen automatic wire winders on utub that the users built themselves.  It takes a small motor and a rev counter.


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## Gordon (Jan 22, 2022)

I agree with Brian. Why would he want to run more than one engine at a time? I have actually had good luck using coil over plug for Ford vehicles. You can buy eight of them for about $35 on ebay.


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## jamesmattioli (Jan 23, 2022)

Brian Rupnow said:


> That's not going to happen fellows. If you notice, all of my i.c. engines are powered by an "ignition box" which sets next to them. That same ignition box runs all of my i.c. engines, because a  12 volt automotive  ignition coil costs about $50 here.


Ciao io uso questo kit di accensione,  molto piccolo e economico 








						Ignition Spare Part for Hit and Miss Engine PartDefault Title
					

Ignition Spare Part for Hit and Miss Engine Part Features:1, Specialized For: Blue Hit and Miss Engine (Product ID: 33ED2674139 )2, It is used for engine ignition. One end is connected to the spark plug. One end is connected to the engine. One section is the 6-11.1v battery connected to the JST...




					www.enginediy.com


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## Harglo (Jan 23, 2022)

Brian Rupnow said:


> That's not going to happen fellows. If you notice, all of my i.c. engines are powered by an "ignition box" which sets next to them. That same ignition box runs all of my i.c. engines, because a  12 volt automotive  ignition coil costs about $50 here.


Re these spark coils. In general the secondary is in the area of 25,000 turns of wire so small you can hardly see it.  
Harvey


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