# CNC machine



## djjones (May 9, 2013)

Hopeing to build my own little steam loco and need a cheap cnc, dont know much about them but  ive been looking to get a nice cheep cnc machine for a while that looks pretty sturdy and not made out of wood,
my mate told me of this thing on the net called kickstarter and i found this on it. Perfect coz i live in wales but has anyone heard of this? Its on kickstarter and you search for oscnc, anybody know whats good value for money


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## MuellerNick (May 9, 2013)

> anybody know whats good value for money



Hahaha! What a crap! Do you intend to build your locos out of balsa wood?
This is the typical crap of someone who has neither the slightest idea of machining nor engineering.

Sorry for the rant
Nick


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## jwcnc1911 (May 9, 2013)

I second what nick said. Cheap... cnc... you get what you pay for.  I gave $10,000 even fir my last one...  it was cheap to run brackets and one offs.  Google "price of dmg" see what comes up.  Buy you a Sherline and put steppers on it.  And people seem to be confused. It doesn't just build it's own fixture and start making what you envision.


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## MuellerNick (May 9, 2013)

Looks like djjones just registered here to make a little advertising for that contraption.
From time to time I read at HSM. And -oh wonder- the same thread (also first post, registered also in May) where "a friend told him" about that POS.

Nick


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## aonemarine (May 9, 2013)

Its over priced for what it is. I dont see it being able to do much more than cut wood, or put a marker in it and draw lines.


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## johan jorez (May 9, 2013)

on the dutch cnc forum the same story 
http://www.cnczone.nl/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=7766&p=75158&hilit=kickstarter#p75158
i think its intend to work in air


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## dnalot (May 9, 2013)

13 years ago I wanted a CNC for woodworking. After looking around I decided to build one. It has been the most satisfying project of my life and it's useful to boot. Two years ago I had to move it so at the same time I upgraded it to a 4 axis machine and built a new control with very high resolution. It now works very well on wood and nonferrous metals. The machine has been bullet proof requiring only a little cleaning once in a while. The router itself is what needs work now and again. The router spins at 10,000 to 21,000 RPM and will go through bearings. 

The motors are steppers and they drive a zero backlash lead screw.  The controllers are Geckos with microsteping. 

The large table is 26" x 48" and the small table is 11" x 14" and is where I do my metal work.  The forth axis can swing 9" diameter by 38" long stock.  Z travel is 8". 

As my interests now are moving to metal working I have added a 13 x 36" metal lathe and a X 3 milling machine to my shop in the past year.


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## doc1955 (May 9, 2013)

jwcnc1911 said:


> I second what nick said. Cheap... cnc... you get what you pay for. I gave $10,000 even fir my last one... it was cheap to run brackets and one offs. Google "price of dmg" see what comes up. Buy you a Sherline and put steppers on it. And people seem to be confused. It doesn't just build it's own fixture and start making what you envision.


 

I have to agree and laugh some times at how some think just because you have a CNC you can build what ever you can dream up. I agree it does make some things easier but if you have no clue how to do it on a convetional machine you will have more challenge with a CNC. To me a CNC helps when you want to make multiples of parts but on just 1 part convetional will work just fine. Just my 2 cents worth.


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## Bastelmike (May 9, 2013)

doc1955 said:


> To me a CNC helps when you want to make multiples of parts but on just 1 part convetional will work just fine. Just my 2 cents worth.


Hi doc,

there are some things that should be mentioned about how useful is cnc.

Obviously its useful to make multiples, but for one offs there are some advantages too.

On a lathe, CNC will enable to do some things easily, You can't do on a conventional. Complicated contours, tapers without time consuming setup. You can turn any radius on a part or even a ball contour. Making a tapered thread.
But in general, CNC on a lathe has not too much value for model builders with just 1 part to make.

IMO CNC on a mill is much more important and useful. There are a lot of situations where a CNC is important for a model builder.

Complicated surfaces like turbine blades are impossible with a conventional mill.
A lot of radii have to be machined for typical model engines. Instead of using a rotary table using CNC control is convenient, time-saving and gives higher precision.
Circular milling is a procedure to machine precise large holes without time-consuming use of boring bars/heads. While precision is lower, circular milling saves time and is easier than setting a boring bar to exact diameter.

Me personally, I have two conventional mills, but I'm still looking for a CNC mill. I'm not going to buy a CNC lathe as I don't consider it as really useful for my builds.

Mike


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## RonGinger (May 9, 2013)

I think this is an interesting small machine. It is not being promoted as a replacement for a Bridgeport- it is a desktop mill for making printed circuit boards by isolation milling. It also says you can cut things like machinable wax for molds for candy. In the FAQ section it asks about cutting steel, and the answer is 'not at a speed you would want to wait for'

So I dont think they are over rating it. It is an attractive package. I wish it said more abut the electronic control

It is not cheap. There are other small machines - one Ive looked at is the Zentoolworks http://www.zentoolworks.com/index.php See their 7x7 unit for about $400

So my bottom line is its an interesting machine, nicely packaged, I can see an artist or craft person having one on a desktop. Its not a CNC machine for a model engineer.


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## aarggh (May 9, 2013)

It is a cute machine and would generally be handy to have, but given the construction I'd have to wonder how good the machine would be at isolation trace milling. I highly suspect the results would not be very repeatable, or high enough resolution to be of much use there. I have a couple of smaller machines specifically for this purpose, and for isolation milling you need really high rigidity, zero flex, and no run-out to get good results. This machine looks more suitable for general sign making than anything else. Except it is way too over priced compared to the numerous Panther's, Sable's, Zen's, 3040's, etc out there.

cheers, Ian


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## Tin Falcon (May 9, 2013)

Mr Jones:  first of all it would be of great help to all if you posted an introduction. Please tell us a bit about your self your shop and your interest in model engineering. 

first off CNC is a wide open term . what kind of machine are you looking for. 
the project you show is for a router. routers are used by woodworkers for model making  a milling machines is much more useful. Also what experience do you have. Unless you are familiar with cnc from work or school, starting out with manual machines is preferred.  As others have said cnc is not some magic bullet you still need fixtures and tooling sometimes more tooling than with a manual machine. 

also cheap cnc not the best Idea. and cheap is a relative term. 
a flimsy machine will flex and cause errors in dimensions . Cheap electronics  fry with the least bit over voltage. 

read my thread on getting started in cnc . it will give an idea of what is needed for cnc. 

Tin


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## Henry (May 9, 2013)

He is only a spammer, doing a promotion of his cheap  CNC machine, he is spamming  in different forums with almost the same words.


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## Wizard69 (May 10, 2013)

jwcnc1911 said:


> I second what nick said. Cheap... cnc... you get what you pay for.  I gave $10,000 even fir my last one...  it was cheap to run brackets and one offs.  Google "price of dmg" see what comes up.  Buy you a Sherline and put steppers on it.  And people seem to be confused. It doesn't just build it's own fixture and start making what you envision.



I had to go look an again I have to agree that machine would have a tough time with wood.   Frankly I've seen routers designed around wood, often MDF, that look far more capable than that machine.   The belt drive is a complete joke too.   

By the way I'm not implying that belt drives are useless on CNC machines just that that arraignment is a joke.  

Sadly what I think we got here is somebody that wants to get a business going but has no idea what is involved in a decent router type CNC machine.  I have nothing against somebody trying to enter the machine tool market but you would think that they would have practical experience and maybe some design experience.


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## Wizard69 (May 10, 2013)

RonGinger said:


> I think this is an interesting small machine. It is not being promoted as a replacement for a Bridgeport- it is a desktop mill for making printed circuit boards by isolation milling. It also says you can cut things like machinable wax for molds for candy. In the FAQ section it asks about cutting steel, and the answer is 'not at a speed you would want to wait for'


The problem as I see it is the belt drives for the axis, even for circuit boards I see problems with the skinny belts.   I'm not against belt drives for positioning systems but they generally need to be much wider than the load might imply and kept taught.  


> So I dont think they are over rating it. It is an attractive package. I wish it said more abut the electronic control
> 
> It is not cheap. There are other small machines - one Ive looked at is the Zentoolworks http://www.zentoolworks.com/index.php See their 7x7 unit for about $400
> 
> So my bottom line is its an interesting machine, nicely packaged, I can see an artist or craft person having one on a desktop. Its not a CNC machine for a model engineer.



Well certainly not a model engineer working with hard materials like balsa.   &#128523;

This machine might be able to run a router in wood but I can't see somebody being aggressive about it.


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## aarggh (May 10, 2013)

If you were using it for v-carving signs (which is very low load), somewhat slowly, I don't see why it wouldn't do a very good job of that, and be more than adequate for that purpose, or simple engraving work would also be ideal. Hogging, machining, and especially circuit boards, I don't think so. So I have no problem at all with the machine design, or the belts given that purpose. So long as the machine is not heavily loaded, or feeds/speeds set too high, the belts while far from ideal, should also last reasonably well. Bearing all that in mind, the biggest problem with the machine is the ridiculous price given the design and construction materials! There's a multitude of far better and beefier machines out there at the same or better price. But then again, I have almost the exact same issues (and others) with the CNC Shark/Pro, and yet they sell by the thousands it seems, so maybe the seller has a winner on his hands?

cheers, Ian


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