# Stephens knuckle head build



## driller1432 (Jul 22, 2015)

Hello to all I'm currently building Jacks Knuckle Head V twin from the free plans that were generously provided for free. Many thanks to Jack&#128077;&#127997;Here are some pics of what is done so far crank, rods, cylinders, pistons. Has anyone built this engine? Currently working on heads will post more pics soon.
Steve
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## jimjam66 (Jul 22, 2015)

Got the popcorn ready - will be following this build closely!


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## Gerhardvienna (Jul 22, 2015)

Seat in first row preserved, I`ll stay tuned!
I love this old BigTwins, even as a model.
Regards
Gerhard


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## motorman46 (Sep 19, 2015)

Hi Steve,   very  nice work,   I too will follow your build  closely.   I just found the plans and downloaded them yesterday.   Jack did a fantastic job on the plans,   and it is remarkable that he made them available for free.   Please post pics and comments often. I am really excited to start this engine, but am in the middle of another build at present.   I am know  if I don't  finish it first I'll never get back  to  it. 
Julian


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## driller1432 (Sep 20, 2015)

Hey guys, almost have the heads completed. I'll get some pictures posted pretty quick. I moved to the heads before the crankcase because the heads seem to be the most challenging components to make. But I got them on first try with out screwing them up what a relief.
Steve


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## stevehuckss396 (Sep 20, 2015)

Looking forward to seeing the photos!


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## Draw-Tech (Sep 30, 2015)

Hi Steve
I am so jealous, they look sooooo good.
Here's a link to some of the vids. 
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdkcsw2IfOWdDSJorrhnq9A
Jack
Draw-tech


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## driller1432 (Oct 2, 2015)

Hey guys getting close to completing heads have to make rocker arm shafts and rocker box coversView attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1443791617.790443.jpg
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## Draw-Tech (Oct 3, 2015)

Hi Steve
Can't believe the progress you have made, all your work is awesome, I have to do all with lots of handle cranking.  If you need any help with the drawings, or find any oops, let me know.
Jack


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## driller1432 (Oct 5, 2015)

Finished rocked arm assemblies a couple of more holes for push rods and cut valves to length after lapping deburr and polish final cleaning and heads will be complete. All parts fit together very nice and snug dimensions are right on thanks Jack. View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1444051486.885391.jpg
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## Draw-Tech (Oct 6, 2015)

Hi Steve
What can I say, let people know the size your dealing with. Put a quarter in the pictures, and we can see how accurate this model is. again GREAT WORK!!!

Jack


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## Chiptosser (Oct 7, 2015)

Very Cool!!

Where did I miss the plan offering?

Always a pleasure to view other people's work.


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## Draw-Tech (Oct 7, 2015)

Chiptosser said:


> Very Cool!!
> 
> Where did I miss the plan offering?
> 
> Always a pleasure to view other people's work.


Hey Chiptosser
You can download the plans on the download page.
Jack
draw-tech


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## Rozlo (Oct 21, 2015)

Oh wow very good work Steve.  I just down loaded the plans also but like Jack it will be a lot of handle cranking for me.  Good job fit and finish look great.


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## driller1432 (Oct 21, 2015)

Thanks guys I too am a manual machinist, late 30s southbend 9 lathe grizzly mill with x power feed and dro. Here are photos of all pieces that were machined for heads 38 pieces per head not counting screws or springs. Assembled valve and springs in heads but springs coil bind with just about 1/16 valve opening so I'll have to take a bit more from floor of rocker box still lots of meat to work with. Then on to crankcase.View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1445482760.496957.jpg
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## Draw-Tech (Oct 22, 2015)

Hi Steve
I can't believe you got so much done, do you ever sleep? Please try to keep track of any adjustments you may need to fix. I started printing the engine in plastic, I will post some more pics soon. Here's one of the cylinder.
Jack


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## driller1432 (Nov 4, 2015)

Crankcase done , this engine is looking pretty cool I think I will make some small parts for a while before moving on to the cam box View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1446646133.615873.jpg
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## Draw-Tech (Nov 5, 2015)

I'm drooling!!!!


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## driller1432 (Nov 24, 2015)

Latest progress on build, cambox and cover complete as well as lifter guide plates next comes the innards bump stick up next.View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1448374130.553007.jpg
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## Davewild (Nov 24, 2015)

Beautiful work, I have to build this!!!!


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## Draw-Tech (Nov 26, 2015)

LOVE IT!!!

Jack


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## driller1432 (Dec 5, 2015)

First mock up of lower end of knuckle head engine here we have crank and rods to assemble 
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Crank trued up and ready to go in crankcase note all rotating parts employee boll or roller bearings
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Crank installed in crankcase end play +.005 
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No problem remove some metal here
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Then comes camshaft box which houses all gears and pulleys
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Roller valve lifters installed in lifter guides
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Next spacer and drive gears for cam and oil pump and distributor shaft
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Then the cam and distributor shafts
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Need to make another spacer for hereView attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1449372597.194394.jpg

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Then the jack shaft and belt
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Starter shaft and belt
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Guess that's maximum of photos I can upload for this post. I think this guy Jack just might know what he's doing OF COURSE HE DOES his plans are just awesome everything fits perfectly, gears mesh right, belts are tight, rotation is smooth, screw holes line up-just a little massage here and there. Next post we will put on pistons and cylinders bye&#129299;


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## Naiveambition (Dec 6, 2015)

I am very intrested in this motor and build thread. I hope to build this one also, and your thread is a great kickstart.

 I have noticed in your photos that you are using belt drive inside the case. And was wandering if this was your choice or do the plans specify them.? The real motor is using an all gear drive so,  Ease of assembly is the obvious choice,although I was under the impression the motor was scaled complete.

Great work and will be waiting for next weeks episode


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## 10K Pete (Dec 6, 2015)

Good grief those are some tiny little parts! Great looking stuff. Can't wait
for more.

Pete


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## Draw-Tech (Dec 6, 2015)

Hi Stephen

I just want you to know how excited I am about your build of my motor. It has been a long time coming for me to see it become a reality. This shows the world how good a machinist you really are, I wish that more of the younger people would take up where us older guys left off as conventional machinists, They have to remember we made the first CNC with a good old stand behind Lathe, and Miller.
    Again I want to thanks Steve for doing a great job this kind of talent you were borne into.

Jack
Draw-Tech


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## Draw-Tech (Dec 6, 2015)

Naiveambition said:


> I am very intrested in this motor and build thread. I hope to build this one also, and your thread is a great kickstart.
> 
> I have noticed in your photos that you are using belt drive inside the case. And was wandering if this was your choice or do the plans specify them.? The real motor is using an all gear drive so,  Ease of assembly is the obvious choice,although I was under the impression the motor was scaled complete.
> 
> Great work and will be waiting for next weeks episode



Hi Naiveambition

The reason for the belts is for the starter motor, which once running, with the use of a knife switch it  will turn into a 12 V generator. (Light a bulb or something.) This whole motor was designed from pictures,drawings,some actual dimensions from a real KH. Every part of this motor has to be made, oil line fittings, because could not find with the right threads, and tube size. The carburetor, total from scratch, so prepare to have a magnifier handy. It has a lot of Harley, and a little of me.

Jack
Draw-Tech


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## driller1432 (Dec 8, 2015)

Naiveambition

Jack said it all, when you get into the build you will understand all the thought and design Jack put into the design of this engine,  like how the oil from the top end drains back first down drain tubes on outside and also down pushrods tubes down to lifters
And lifter guides have small grooves to allow oil to pass through to crankcase thus oiling entire valve system. I don't know if Harley's work that way but it's little details like this that make Jacks plans great.
Steve


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## Rozlo (Dec 8, 2015)

Doing a great job.  Very good work.


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## Naiveambition (Dec 8, 2015)

Thanks for the response. I hope that I didn't come off as rude concerning the plans.  Was simply asking a question of why. . 

 I am duly impressed with the plans and the build itself.  So much so that my long term goal is to be able to trade this motor to a friend for a 69  olds cutlass.  And I think that with him being a big Harley fan, he will be super impressed with this motor and might be enough to win him over.


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## Hopper (Dec 9, 2015)

"This whole motor was designed from pictures,drawings,some actual dimensions from a real KH."

Surely the KH was a sidevalve (flathead) engine with four separate cams on four separate spindles each with its own gear? And the Knucklehead was designated EL and then FL? 

Nonetheless, wonderful drawings and some wonderful workmanship on display here. I stand in awe at both.

Might have to steal some of your methods and build me a model of my 42 WLA Flathead Harley engine. No rocker gear to mess about with. But machining the cylinders in one piece including the ports could be a challenge to this non-CNC machinist. But certainly do-able.

Doh!!! I just realized you were using KH to refer to Knuckle Head!!! Doh. Got it confused with the HD factory model designations. (K was  a 750 Flathead, KH was a 900 Flathead that morphed into todays XL Sportsters.)


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## driller1432 (Dec 9, 2015)

Naiveambition
I didn't think you were rude, not one bit. Thanks for your participation that's what makes all this fun sharing ideas,  opinions etc. I hope you are able to build it some day and to any one else that builds it I would love to share extra parts that I have left over i.e. O rings and other materials I had to buy in quantity . Thanks everyone 
Steve


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## chrispare (Dec 9, 2015)

The gears are they made or bought?


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## Rozlo (Dec 9, 2015)

I've been riding and working on Harley's for about 25 years now and that is a work of Art.  Jack you have done a great job at the design drawings I just down loaded them also and will start this project as soon as my shop is finished.  Stephen you are doing fantastic job I can't wait until I start. I've build a lot full size motors in the past mostly high HP but this is the coolest thing out there today.  I found a guy in Ohio that has build that V-twin that was in Popular Machinist way back in the day but its nothing compared to this build and design here.  Thanks guys you have inspired me to get off my ass and getter-done.


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## driller1432 (Dec 9, 2015)

Crispare 
The gears are purchased with some slight modifications to hubs


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## jkohlbrecher (Dec 9, 2015)

Hi...New to the Forum, been lurking in the shadows. But I couldn't let this go without comment. I worked at a local technical school for motorcycle repair for 18 yrs., the last 5 or so years in the Harley Early Model Program. We covered all the years from 1936 to 1999. To the point, aside from some internals, you really nailed this motor down. The heads alone would have scared me off if I were to try to duplicate them. I appreciate your work and I hope others well do so as well. Well done! You should be very proud...................Regards, jkohlbrecher


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## driller1432 (Dec 10, 2015)

Jacks just awesome!


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## Hopper (Dec 11, 2015)

Driller, where did you buy those tiny gears from for the cam drive?


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## Draw-Tech (Dec 11, 2015)

Hi All
Thanks for all the nice remarks, Naiveambition as Steve said questions create progress. We all are a world family to help each other when we can. (keep up the remarks) jkohlbrecher, thank you, I only wish I had a real motor to reverse engineer, it would have been more accurate. What can I say about Steve, (Just look at his work) Hopper I believe it was from http://www.sdp-si.com/ great place. Here is a sample of the parts of my V 12 radiator.
Jack
draw-tech


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## driller1432 (Dec 11, 2015)

Hopper
Jack is correct I purchased all gears belts and pulleys from Stock drive products If I remember right cost was about a $100.00 for all
Steve


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## Hopper (Dec 12, 2015)

Thanks guys for the pointer to SDP on the gears. A treasure trove of useful bits to be sure!


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## driller1432 (Jan 2, 2016)

It's a twingle I started to work on cam to crank timing after I made the flywheel and engine stand so I could roll the engine over so I focused on one cylinder piston going down intake open piston up fire then exhaust normal cycle then looked at other cylinder and it's almost right on the same combustion cycle! What this can't be right-----or can it after researching on the Internet for a while I found it will work it's called a Big Bang or twingle instead of the normal 315-405 firing interval it fires at 45-675. So both cylinders fire the at the same time or pretty close to the same time.  I never worked on V twins so all this is new to me. So Hera are more pictures of mock up. Oil pump installed 
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Starter/ generator
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Flywheel complete it was fun rolling the bar for the rim
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Pushrod tubes and push rods
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Distributor
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Die for making head gaskets
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 The engine rolls over so smoothly with so little effort (no rings on Pistons) I can't say it enough what an amazing set of plans Jack Draw-Tech has created. Back to the shop need to get some fuel & fire going, see if I can get it to backfire or run.  Still lots of small parts to make! Happy New Year to all.
Steve


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## gbritnell (Jan 2, 2016)

I don't know if the design intent was to make it a "twingle" or not but a Knucklehead engine doesn't fire both cylinders at the same time. At one time Harley went to what you're describing but it was only for racing. All Harley V-twins fire at 315 and 405 degrees. They have a waste spark for the cylinder that isn't under compression. 
gbritnell


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## Hopper (Jan 3, 2016)

Twingle? sounds bizarre. Probably worth checking with the designer on that one. Usually only works on twin-carb engines for racing. Otherwise the second jug starves for fuel mix. 

The engine is looking beautiful now. Awesome how quickly you have done all that work!

Keep us posted.


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## driller1432 (Jan 3, 2016)

Checked with Jack on firing interval and that's how he designed it to fire so I,m going with it. If it don't work I will make cam with conventional firing interval 315-405 which will be very easy to do with the design of cam i.e. Unsolder lobes make new shaft install lobes in new positions modify the dizzy What could possibly go wrong&#128165; Thanks guys


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## Hopper (Jan 5, 2016)

I might have to get my old Harley 45 out and retime the cams to run as a twingle. could be kind of fun. It has four separate cams on four separate shafts and gears so would only take an hour or so to do. Hmmm....


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## driller1432 (Jan 16, 2016)

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Camshaft redesign, well folks after getting the distributor put together and installed and rotating engine and taking a hard look at valve timing and ignition timing I'm not liking this twingle idea, so ( hopefully today) I am going to remake cam with conventional firing interval which will also make engine run opposite of what it is now. Then the flywheel will push air to engine and the little rope starter will be going in right direction.View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1452956982.785333.jpg


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## driller1432 (Jan 16, 2016)

Oops hit reply button before I was done. I will make cam lobes slightly larger which will move (angle) the lifters away from each other for more clearance between them. The way the cam is designed with keyed on lobes will allow me to move them around before soldering into place.
So it's time to get out the degree wheel and dial indicators. The engine has a long stroke of 1.250 so I should be able to increase duration of valve opening. I'm not an engineer so I can't    figure out on paper so I'll have to make a single lobe put on shaft and use degree wheel and indicators to check opening closing and duration. I
found a cam card for a full size knucklehead that gives me lobe center lines that helps a lot.


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## dethrow55 (Jan 16, 2016)

awsome im thinking of this build.will follow looks great.


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## t.l.a.r. eng (Jan 16, 2016)

Are the belts used for the starter designed to run in oil? 

Everytime I get oil next to one of those little toothed belts it turns into a disaster.

I boldly assume there is going to be oil in the crankcase.


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## driller1432 (Jan 16, 2016)

Yes there will be oil in crankcase belts are polyurethane with Kevlar cords oil resistance and 130# per 1/8 inch width breaking strength according to manufacture


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## Hopper (Jan 17, 2016)

That engine looks flat-out beautiful! True craftsmanship.
Here is a link to Andrews cams specs for Knucklehead cams, might be some help to you.
http://www.andrewsproducts.com/sites/www.andrewsproducts.com/files/catalog_pdfs/2014-page14.pdf


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## driller1432 (Jan 17, 2016)

Hopper thank for your kind remarks and the cam chart will help to figure out new cam I truly appreciate your help. I did not work on cam yet as I received tungsten rod to finish spark plugsView attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1453041497.693761.jpg

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## Bowtie41 (Jan 21, 2016)

I just dl'd the drawings.Thanks Jack!
Driller,I noticed in the first photo of your post that some of the holes "broke out".Is there a problem with the dimensions of the holes,did your drill/tap walk,or is the pocket oversize?I will start mine when the shop gets warmer.I haven't had a chance to peruse the dimensions.It will probably still seal fine,just be careful when assembling,but I wish to avoid the same dilemna.Thank You.


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## driller1432 (Jan 21, 2016)

Bowtie if your talking about the rocker box covers witch I think you are dimensions are very close so a little drill walk or flex could have cause that. The pocket curves in as it goes down so further down I have full thread so no concern to me. Also when I made those parts I had A HF round column mill not the best as quill   was a little sloppy on extension.


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## Bowtie41 (Jan 21, 2016)

I was.Thank You for clearing that up.When I get to that point,I may centerpunch before the centerdrill.


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## Rozlo (Jan 22, 2016)

Diller,
Where did you get the porcelain for your plugs?  Very good work on these, I've tried to get information on building plugs from others and they really dont want to help out.

Thanks
Bill


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## Draw-Tech (Jan 22, 2016)

Hi Guys 

Been offline for a while, Steve perfect as usual. Bowtie41, are you using a milling machine with an edge finder to drill the holes?  Rozio, if you drop me a PM I can send the files for the plugs. The ceramic is coreian counter top material, it burns but bvery slowly, nd easy to machine. Seals by compression
Jack
Draw-Tech


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## driller1432 (Jan 24, 2016)

Camshaft redesign completed and done installed in engine started on fuel system manifold and carb body in lathe 
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Got side tracked installed VFD on southbend 9 I like it
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Good to hear from you Jack
I'll try your method for making carb float i.e. Filling tube with sand or solder wrapping around rod a couple of wraps and cutting out best part thanks for the tip.

Thanks to everyone for nice comments


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## Rozlo (Jan 25, 2016)

Very cool never thought of that.


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## Parksy (Feb 1, 2016)

Amazing work driller. I hope one day I can achieve similar results in my future projects.

I have a question about a picture of your flywheel in post #42. What is the ring with the cut out? I see many people use this, but I don't understand how it works or what it actually is. 

Cheers


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## Hopper (Feb 1, 2016)

@ Parksy -- looks like a taper-lock fitting that clamps the flywheel to the shaft as you tighten those three socket head screws. But I may be wrong. The drawings are available to download in the plans section of this site and should reveal all.


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## driller1432 (Feb 1, 2016)

Hopper you are correct it's a split taper bushing in a hub and uses 6 screws, I only have 3 in for mockup
Steve


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## Parksy (Feb 2, 2016)

Thanks for that! I tried having a look for those plans but I couldn't find them. I don't suppose anyone has a link to them?


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## Brian Rupnow (Feb 2, 2016)

Try this
http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/downloads/draw-tech-297.html


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## driller1432 (Feb 8, 2016)

Carburetor main body all machined and silver soldered together now have to make adjusting needles and needle seat for float. Tried to bend brass tube for float in circle no luck too tight of circle 1/4 inch inside of float filled with sand and another with solder. I will make die and stamp out float in 2 halves and solder together hope that works 
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Thanks guys


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## 10K Pete (Feb 8, 2016)

That's a great looking carb body. Excellent and very tidy fabrication work.

Pete


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## Swifty (Feb 8, 2016)

Great job, looking very impressive.

Paul.


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## Hopper (Feb 8, 2016)

Awesome work, again. Can you get some of those tiny stick-on letters the locomotive modellers use to put the "LINKERT" on the side of it?

On the full size Linkerts, most of us have given up on the hollow brass floats and go with the "Rubber Ducky" floats made from Nitrophyl M, the plastic foam material that modern car floats are made from.

More info here
http://www.rogerscorp.com/ec/nitrophyl.aspx

Those guys apparently will sell you a sample piece for $40 big enough to make 8 full size Linkert floats. But I reckon your local car wrecking yard might be able to sell you an old float big enough to cut one model size float out of.

The brass floats are notorious for leaking, either from the get go or after some use and corrosion takes place. 
The original Linkert floats were cork and lasted for many decades. I still have one in use today, but it has been dried out and coated with expoxy since it got " waterlogged" in the 1970s.


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## dethrow55 (Feb 8, 2016)

that a great looking job. making the float in two halves should work well. Thm:Thm:Thm:


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## driller1432 (Feb 8, 2016)

Hopper thanks for the tip I suppose you could epoxy float hinge to nitrophyl and do you have to coat the nitrophyl with something after cutting and shaping? Thanks to the other guys for the compliments on work.


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## Hopper (Feb 10, 2016)

Driller, you would have to ask Rogers, the makers of Nitrophyl about that to be certain. I buy my Rubber Duckies already made up and the hinge bracket is already moulded into the float. 

If you could get hold of an old car float made from Nitrophyl you could play about with it and see how it reacts to gasoline if cut, and if epoxy will stick to it.

Or you might be able to buy a new float like this for $15 or less,
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Holley-116-...ash=item58c1c130af:g:xD0AAOSw34FVFfie&vxp=mtr

and play around with it.


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## gbritnell (Feb 10, 2016)

Great looking work on everything so far! Here's some information I have found about making carb floats. Many years back I built a carb that was featured in SIC magazine. That particular float was a hinged type and made from brass shim stock. The construction wasn't a problem but given the small size it really didn't have the leverage to seal the needle consistently.
My next float experience was when I built the Holt engine. The drawings recommended cork so I tried it but it was a real pain
mounting and sealing it so I ordered an automotive float made of whatever synthetic plastic material they are made from. It was easy to carve and shape but I had the same problem as with the brass float, it just didn't have enough surface area to provide enough leverage to seal the needle. What I'm getting at is with the small size of your carb you might have a lot of tinkering ahead to get the float to function properly.
Gbritnell


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## driller1432 (Feb 10, 2016)

The float dilemma will definitely take some experimentation on my part, I could see where it wouldn't have enough bouyancy to hold needle on seat.  Thanks guys for sharing your solutions


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## driller1432 (Feb 10, 2016)

This might work, fuel sender I replaced on jet ski has small round floats about the right diameter 

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## Hopper (Feb 11, 2016)

That looks like the perfect set up to play around with.


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## Bowtie41 (Feb 16, 2016)

I was thinking of a flat "torroid"?? shaped Float?Soldered up from 4 strips of thin brass or SS shim stock.Ultralight,and way more bouyant than copper tubing,as it's too thick.Here's a drawing I whipped up in paint.Hope it helps!


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## driller1432 (Feb 16, 2016)

This is a great idea and very doable thanks bowtie I'll make a float like this and let you know how it works out!
Steve


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## dnalot (Feb 16, 2016)

Hi

When I had a boat building shop I used microballoons ( tiny hollow glass spheres ) to make very very light weight fillers for filling voids in fiberglass. It was extremely strong when mixed with epoxy or fiberglass resin. It would make a very durable material to make floats with.

I am watching this build closely, as I would like to build this engine. I have to say your work is impressive, as I am impressed. 

Mark T


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## driller1432 (Feb 16, 2016)

Microballons I think I have some from R/C boat I built thanks for compliments on work


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## ddmckee54 (Feb 16, 2016)

Could you fill a built-up float with loose micro-balloons?  That way even if a seam leaked you couldn't lose much floatation.  As long as you didn't use any binder when installing the micro-balloons you wouldn't be adding that much extra weight to the float.  Of course if the seam split open wide enough you'd have micro-balloons throughout your carb/engine.

Just wondering,
Don


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## dnalot (Feb 16, 2016)

Hi



> Could you fill a built-up float with loose micro-balloons? That way even if a seam leaked you couldn't lose much floatation. As long as you didn't use any binder when installing the micro-balloons you wouldn't be adding that much extra weight to the float. Of course if the seam split open wide enough you'd have micro-balloons throughout your carb/engine.



The balloons when mixed with a very small amount of resin will be extremely strong. I used to make balls the size of a tennis ball and when cured I could hurl it as hard as I could on the ground and not chip it.

I would mold the float with a brass hinge cast into the part.


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## Hopper (Feb 17, 2016)

Be careful not to get too much solder on the brass strips if you go that route. Stuff is darned heavy. It might be worth making a simple die press a circular piece of shim into shape and then solder two together, two joint only and therefore 50 per cent less solder.

The die could be as simple as two flat plates bolted together with a piece of annealed brass shim in between. 
The lower plate would have a circular groove turned in it, the size and shape of the float. The upper plate would have a hole drilled and reamed directly above that groove so a punch with a raised ridge that fits in the bottom groove on the lower end of it. 

That's how the Indians make the full size repops for Linkert carbs. 
You can see below they lay a lot of solder on them and they are notorious for being heavy and prone to leaking.


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## Bowtie41 (Feb 17, 2016)

Hopper,
I agree,I was just thinking of something simple and no diework.But hell,he's in deep enough already,lol.Your solution is definately lighter than mine,but I'd dremel/file away as much excess as possible.For yours,I'd probably whip it up outta wood with a ball end mill for the female,and spray it with something as a mold release,and use Bondo or epoxy in it to make the male part.


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## ddmckee54 (Feb 18, 2016)

However you make it, use the thinnest material that you can find.  The calculations that I did, using 0.010" brass to construct a torus, showed that the volume of fuel displaced weighed only marginally more than just the brass used to make the torus.  My calculations were made using a torus with a 1"ID and a 2"OD, I also used the entire volume of the torus to calculate the fuel displaced.  You need it floating, not submerged, so it would be displacing much less volume and generating much less lift.

Don


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## Cogsy (Feb 18, 2016)

If the thing really is almost balanced with lift vs weight, it's not going to put much pressure on the needle and seat and will be unlikely to stop fuel flow I would imagine.


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## driller1432 (Feb 18, 2016)

The float that won't so guys I made a die out of plastic and stamped out float halves out of .010 brass the center would not draw out enough so had to solder strip to inside of float
View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1455848213.085062.jpg

View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1455848265.682119.jpg

View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1455848291.748865.jpg

Got it all soldered together cleaned most of solder off and a quick toss in water, good bye slowly  floated to bottom. This isn't going to work so nitrophyl is up next. View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1455848834.270350.jpg

Thanks all you guys for your help we will make something work!


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## Bowtie41 (Feb 18, 2016)

That looks awesome,Great Job!!:bow:If tearing is still a problem,anneal it(see youtube) 1st.


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## Hopper (Feb 18, 2016)

Try again with .005" brass shim? Half the weight. (Assuming your float "floated to the bottom" due to weight rather than a small leak. If the latter, a smear of epoxy in the right place should fix.)

You might get more of the middle part if you reduce the diameter of the guide pin and start with a smaller hole in the blank shim, allowing more metal to flow up into the inside wall.

That motor sure is looking purty. Looking forward to seeing/hearing the video of it running.


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## Hopper (Feb 19, 2016)

Can someone post a link to the full set of Knucklehead plans please? I dont seem to be able to find them, only a few individual pages in various threads. Probably just my computer illiteracy...


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## Bowtie41 (Feb 19, 2016)

From page 7 of this thread


Brian Rupnow said:


> Try this
> http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/downloads/draw-tech-297.html


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## driller1432 (Feb 19, 2016)

3D printer could a float be printed out    with a 3D printer?


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## Draw-Tech (Feb 19, 2016)

Hi Steve

Carb. looks great. I think if we can find a plastic that would not dissolve in gas, I can print it. I will try to dissolve some of the materials I have, maybe polypropylene. Does the float float? What about a ring of .005 brass, with good old cork bonded to it?
Jack
Draw-Tech


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## Hopper (Feb 19, 2016)

Thanks Bowtie. I knew it was somewhere but danged if I could find that link, or the downloads section. All good now, mate.


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## Hopper (Feb 19, 2016)

Doh! I spoke too soon. When I follow that link, I get a blank page. 
Also I can't see a download section of the forum anywhere.
Do I need to be a financial member to use the downloads, or do I have a computer problem?
I'm pretty sure I downloaded some of the drawings some time back, by following that link, but not anymore.


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## pickleford75 (Feb 19, 2016)

An old timer once told me that he made replacement floats out of balsa and coated with a sealer..... never tried it but who knows


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## crankshafter (Feb 20, 2016)

Same here . When I go to downloads it showing only a blank page.
cs.


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## ozzie46 (Feb 20, 2016)

(Same here . When I go to downloads it showing only a blank page.
cs.)

Same here too! What gives???


Ron


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## petertha (Feb 20, 2016)

If I understand the issue - anything you 'add' to the brass shim box shell like cork, foam, microbaloons..) is added weight. Added weight in any form is less buoyancy vs. a sealed box of air. So the options are:
- less dense shell material (aluminum? plastic?)
- larger footprint volume of float
- lighter gas filled float ...now THAT would be tricky 

So yes, if the sealed balsa shape weighted less than the brass box, it would be more buoyant all things being equal. Practicality wise, pros & cons, that's a different issue.


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## Draw-Tech (Feb 20, 2016)

Hopper said:


> Doh! I spoke too soon. When I follow that link, I get a blank page.
> Also I can't see a download section of the forum anywhere.
> Do I need to be a financial member to use the downloads, or do I have a computer problem?
> I'm pretty sure I downloaded some of the drawings some time back, by following that link, but not anymore.


Hi Hopper
I checked out the site, had same problem, I have sent a message to the administrators about the problem. 
JACK
DRAW-TECH


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## Bowtie41 (Feb 22, 2016)

Hey Guys,
Just looked and found same thing.For now try this link:
http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/search.php?searchid=865554

It list all posts Jack made to the Plans forum.I could narrow it down more,but it would take awhile(only 69 links),and there is so much good info other than prints to look at.

Jack,thanks AGAIN for sharing all of this!!!Can't wait til I get caught up here,if ever,to start a build of my own.


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## driller1432 (Feb 22, 2016)

Nitrophyl saved the day went to auto repair shop found floats for fuel level sender brought back to shop and easily shaped into float. Changed the hinge pivot point and made prongs that insert into float tested with bowel on with gasoline works great kinda crude for now but I know it will work
View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1456151418.880520.jpg

View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1456151495.025724.jpg

Now that I have basic design I'll refine and make another.
Thanks to all for your ideas!&#128074;


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## Draw-Tech (Feb 22, 2016)

Steve
Looks like a Beautiful Big Diamond to me.another great redesign by driller1432, shall be documented.
Jack


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## Hopper (Feb 22, 2016)

Great to see you sorted that out. Onward toward the test run video!


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## Bowtie41 (Feb 23, 2016)

driller1432 said:


> Nitrophyl saved the day went to auto repair shop found floats for fuel level sender brought back to shop and easily shaped into float. Changed the hinge pivot point and made prongs that insert into float tested with bowel on with gasoline works great kinda crude for now but I know it will work
> View attachment 81674
> 
> View attachment 81675
> ...


 
PLEASE edit post from"float tested with bowel on",to "float tested with BOWL on",lol:hDe:


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## Bowtie41 (Feb 23, 2016)

Lookin' Great,and easier than all the brasswork(sorry).Does that stuff have a "skin" to keep it from saturating that you will have to reseal,or can it be used "as is"?


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## driller1432 (Feb 23, 2016)

Morning guys glad to get carb out of the way - well almost a few more little bits to make. The nitrophyl at first looks like it has a skin but I think it's smooth from molding process I floated some in gas after machining for a few hours with no problem. Thanks to you Jack still having lots of fun with this build. Should be cranking this jewel up pretty soon, can't wait to try electric starter. I pressurized cylinders and valves leak a little so need more lapping on them I bought some fine compound to finish them off. 
Steve


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## driller1432 (May 20, 2016)

Hi guys been a while got side tracked building this with my son. 

View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1463751077.785405.jpg


Back to knuckle head build pretty soon


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## crankshafter (May 21, 2016)

Driller.
Waitin for the video of first startup on the Vtwin.
Nice car btw. I like the" tophat";-)
Cs


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## Draw-Tech (May 21, 2016)

Hi Steve

Nice Rod, Lucky Son!  great to hear from you, been busy myself, working on my conception of an Otto T-Head motor, and an all aluminum 3D print bed, for fast heat up and constant temperature on the whole plate, and an all aluminum Extruder. 

Great to have you back

Jack
draw-tech


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## driller1432 (Jul 20, 2016)

Hello guys......got to work a while on the knuckle head after about 5 months break .....so I made wood base and ignition box with cherry wood ....got fuel tank and stand made with a price of chrome steering column and brass..... Exhaust pipes made from stainless steel (spent 2 days making a mandrel tube bender) worked awesome....throttle controls done ! So the bottom end is all sealed up ready for oil, then I need to lap valves in and check for seal then I can do final assembly on heads then I can finish oil lines and put the ignition parts from S&S in distributer. Might be trying to start the engine soon.

View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1468994090.395961.jpg

View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1468994114.524327.jpg


And hello Jack .....this engine is awesome you should be very proud of your design and engineering what a great set of very detailed plans you have shared with us, I can't even imagine how much time you spent on the plans. Hats off to you sir!

Stephen


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## crankshafter (Jul 20, 2016)

Stephen
And the hat of for you
Verry nice work

CS


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## Rozlo (Jul 20, 2016)

That is awesome.  Simply amazing great job.  Cant wait to see a video of it running.
Bill


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## Hopper (Jul 20, 2016)

driller1432 said:
			
		

> ...Exhaust pipes made from stainless steel (spent 2 days making a mandrel tube bender) worked awesome..
> [QUOTE/]
> 
> A model-sized mandrel bender! Now that sounds interesting. Do you have any plans or pics, or links? Sounds like a fun little project I would like to try.
> ...


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## Draw-Tech (Jul 30, 2016)

Hi Steve
It has been my turn to have to work on stuff just to make a buck, but we have to pay for our play. Thanks all for the complements on the design,If you ever go to apply for a machinists job, bring that model, you won't have to say a word. I have been machining for now over 60 years, and I consider you to be a 1st class all around machinist. Again all we have to do is look at it with awe!

Jack
Draw-Tech


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## Bowtie41 (Aug 5, 2016)

Guess my compliments go double than Draw-Techs,as I only had 30yrs in before becoming disabled,lol.Every new pic you continue to impress!! :bow:


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## Bowtie41 (Aug 5, 2016)

The last co. I worked for before becoming disabled,we made stainless fittings for food and pharm co.'s among other things.When we bent elbows,etc.,we filled tubes with water and froze for sizes too small for our mandrel bender,then put in a foam cooler of liquid Nitrogen for a few before bending.No kinks from the ice,and the liquid Nitrogen makes SS bend like soft butter,(besides,dropping fruit,eggs,etc,soaked in N is awesome,lol).I think Airgas and others sell liquid N in small quantities.Hope this helps!


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## driller1432 (Dec 26, 2016)

Hey guys been a while so a few months ago I tried starting the knucklehead first with the electric motor from RC car

View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1482809471.499700.jpg



and confirmed what I thought all along not enough torque didn't even move at all, maybe it will work as a generator. So proceeded to use rope starter and it fired a few times before head gaskets started leaking, they are made from thin copper sheet  
.020 thick I had put copper coat on them but didn't last long. The copper sheet won't compress enough to close up the smallest of gaps.

View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1482810110.041698.jpg


So now I make gaskets from teflon sheet which should compress enough to seal all gaps. Then I try again. I,m sure I'll have to monkey around with carb it was flooding with gas but I have a new idea for float.

View attachment ImageUploadedByModel Engines1482810427.627051.jpg




Hopefully I get more time in the shop as I,m getting caught up on other projects.

Stephen


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## dethrow55 (Dec 27, 2016)

wow nice job. hope to see it run.


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## Draw-Tech (Dec 27, 2016)

Hi Steve
Glad to see you back. When you tried the copper gaskets, did you anneal the copper? To anneal copper to butter soft. go to a dark place and heat till you see a very dull red, and let it air cool. Also I would try .032 to maybe decrease the compression. The motor that I picked out, was a magna torque motor, I think I specked it out in the parts list.
Jack
P.S.Steve Drop me a line.


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## Bowtie41 (Dec 29, 2016)

I agree on the annealed copper.A friend had Ransome mower with an unknown make 3cyl diesel.He was having trouble starting it,so his SMARTER,lol brother told him to use starting fluid(BAD IDEA).which blew the head gasket.Since we never found a maker id(Not Continental or several others).I made new gaskets(1 + a spare) from copper sheet and annealed them,and it worked great.
For a starter,try a cordless drill,if it works,get a HF cheapie and gut it.That's what I did to my 1/5 scale RC monster truck


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## driller1432 (Nov 26, 2017)

Draw Tech knuckle head project completed hello to all, finally found some time to complete engine. I had to remake cam with more lift and duration and degreed each lobe individually .Then the carb where I couldnt find any thing to get the float to work so I lowered fuel tank and feed fuel into bottom of carb bowl fill tank to desired level and it runs for several minutes just fine until I feel it gets hot enough to shut down.

View attachment IMG_1119.jpg


View attachment IMG_1113.jpg


Ive got some video of engine running have to figure out how to upload.


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## Brian Rupnow (Nov 26, 2017)

Very beautiful engine, well done!!!---Brian


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## driller1432 (Nov 26, 2017)

https://nam01.safelinks.protection....HV98iNzhqqKfV1SeBUlNYO2M4ZSSgi+J4=&reserved=0

Link to video hope this works


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## driller1432 (Nov 26, 2017)

https://nam01.safelinks.protection....HV98iNzhqqKfV1SeBUlNYO2M4ZSSgi+J4=&reserved=0


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## driller1432 (Nov 26, 2017)

Link to video of one of the first runs. I donT have rocket covers on or distributer cover so you can see rotor spinning notice second cylinder starts hitting near the end Ill get more video of completed engine running its so cool to get it running and Jack from Draw-Tech the fellow who designed this engine has to be pleased to see it done and yes he has plans available.


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## driller1432 (Nov 26, 2017)

Thanks Brain
I learned a lot building this engine and really enjoyed it, of course now Im addicted to this hobby and continue to invest in
more tooling and gadgets
Steve


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## Brian Rupnow (Nov 26, 2017)

Driller 1432--be warned!! It'll take over your life if you let it. I built my first engine 7 years ago. I just finished my 24th engine this week.---Brian


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## stevehuckss396 (Nov 26, 2017)

Nice engine! You really did a nice job on her.


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## Herbiev (Nov 26, 2017)

Fantastic engine. Well done.


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## vederstein (Nov 26, 2017)

Beautiful Engine!

(I wish I had sufficient skill for that...)

...Ved.


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## Cogsy (Nov 26, 2017)

Beautiful engine. You did a great job!


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## Hopper (Nov 26, 2017)

Absolutely beautiful, absolutely beautiful.


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## ShopShoe (Nov 27, 2017)

That's amazing. I like the details. And of course, it sounds great!

Whatever you post next, I'll be reading.

--ShopShoe


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## Draw-Tech (Nov 27, 2017)

Steve
That is the best thing I have seen in years. You did such a great job on the motor, as I said you now own the serial # of 001.We have to hook up so we can document changes credited to you.I have some  ideas on the float.
   Again WELL DONE
One of these day,s maybe I'll get enough time to build #2  
Jack
Draw-Tech

:thumbup:


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## driller1432 (Nov 28, 2017)

Thanks to everybody for the compliments. And Jack thank you for the plans you are a extremely talented designer!  I like the mix of brass and aluminum really looks awesome. 
Steve


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## Draw-Tech (Dec 2, 2017)

Hey Steve
That video is awesome, maybe we can come up with a couple of megaphones for the exhaust. What are you going to build next? I,m thinking of starting a new design of a 1929 Harley 45. I have a pretty good  blueprint, that I should be able to scale. Not sure if I want Quarter, Half, or a Third scale.
Jack
Draw-Tech
 Link to Video https://nam01.safelinks.protection.o...%3D&reserved=0


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## driller1432 (Dec 4, 2017)

Draw-Tech said:


> Hey Steve
> That video is awesome, maybe we can come up with a couple of megaphones for the exhaust. What are you going to build next? I,m thinking of starting a new design of a 1929 Harley 45. I have a pretty good  blueprint, that I should be able to scale. Not sure if I want Quarter, Half, or a Third scale.
> Jck
> Draw-Tech





Jack you design it Ill build it and I might try to build 1/4 scale 426 Chrysler hemi Ive started some heads already but Ill start a new thread for that engine some day Ill retire and hopefully have as much time as I want to build engines
Steve


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## driller1432 (Dec 4, 2017)

Draw-Tech said:


> Hey Steve
> That video is awesome, maybe we can come up with a couple of megaphones for the exhaust. What are you going to build next? I,m thinking of starting a new design of a 1929 Harley 45. I have a pretty good  blueprint, that I should be able to scale. Not sure if I want Quarter, Half, or a Third scale.
> Jck
> Draw-Tech





Jack you design it Ill build it and I might try to build 1/4 scale 426 Chrysler hemi Ive started some heads already but Ill start a new thread for that engine some day Ill retire and hopefully have as much time as I want to build engines
Steve


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## dethrow55 (Dec 5, 2017)

simply incredable job. been watching this from the start. Sounds great .:thumbup:


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## driller1432 (Dec 6, 2017)

Thank you dethrone.


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## driller1432 (Dec 6, 2017)

Thank you dethrow55............auto correct


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## Bowtie41 (Jul 14, 2018)

I can't seem to find the plans.....may be a dumb newbie move........Help Please?


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## mayhugh1 (Jul 14, 2018)

Here you go...

https://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/threads/draw-tech.29067/

Terry


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## Bowtie41 (Jul 14, 2018)

mayhugh1 said:


> Here you go...
> 
> https://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/threads/draw-tech.29067/
> 
> Terry


Thank You Terry!!


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