# 3020 CNC routing machine and Mach 3



## ilkleyal (May 7, 2012)

Hello, I'm new here

*Edited as I initially termed this a miller which caused some debate* 

Just bought one of these, it should arrive in the next week or so.

Yes, its Chinese and I'm taking a gamble but I am prepared to fix what needs fixing (if anything) 

I'm a time served CNC machinist and keen model maker/Flyer so am looking forward to making this little device sing.

Bought to machine airframe components in Balsa/Ply/CF/Aly and so on.

If they are OK, I may well consider bulk buying and offering them in an improved form to the UK market

I will be in touch with an update when I have it installed.

Al


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## John S (May 7, 2012)

It's a router, not a milling machine.


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## ilkleyal (May 7, 2012)

John Stevenson  said:
			
		

> It's a router, not a milling machine.




Bit negative of you

Actually, its capable of rotating a tool, has x y and z axis and can mill 3D shapes, I take the view that a "router" is simply a lightly constructed milling machine which it is of course.

its never going to take a 5mm cut in Aly at 40,000 revs and 20 metres a min

It will be used for mostly 2 d work, yes, and as such you might call it a router but it can and will in my hands be used as a milling/drilling machine. So there.......


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## lazylathe (May 7, 2012)

Bit aggressive for a third post...

Anyway if you look at your picture that you posted it clearly states "CNC Router"
Kind of gives it away...

These are sold as firstly CNC routers and engravers, capable of milling 3D parts.
Generally used for making signs etc with relief so that the words stand out.
Capable of 7cm of vertical travel with a smallish table.
Capable of 0.05mm repeatability, not too bad if it can keep it up constantly.
Not too sure of how rigid the machine is but it should be fine for woods and plastics.
You would most likely have to take very light cuts in any metals.

Good luck with it and keep us informed of what you can get it to do!
They have been discussed here and on many other boards before and the same conclusion has always been reached.

Andrew


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## ilkleyal (May 7, 2012)

lazylathe  said:
			
		

> Bit aggressive for a third post...
> 
> Anyway if you look at your picture that you posted it clearly states "CNC Router"
> Kind of gives it away...
> ...



Hi, Bit of fun, tongue in cheek, sorry if it was a tickle strong.

I accept all views willingly, I don't intend to make a V8 or anything with it  

Al


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## John S (May 7, 2012)

ilkleyal  said:
			
		

> I don't intend to make a V8 or anything with it
> 
> Al



Not big enough, you will be limited to a V7


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## Herbiev (May 7, 2012)

Definately a router but most members could upgrade this machine to their own requirements


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## John S (May 7, 2012)

Al,
They are not a bad machine but to cut costs they have cut corners, if you do a web search you will find plenty of posts giving details.

Given that many suppliers in China are making and selling these quality differs from supplier to supplier.

Main one I have read about is that the DC brushed spindle motor supplied with these is often a used spindle, I know of two that have packed in within a few days, just a point to note and check when you get yours.

Not a sour grapes post as I'm getting ready to purchase a larger 6040 model but these are a lot different, supported rails against unsupported, ballscrews against trapezoidal and a water cooled high frequency spindle against the DC one but it's twice as much money.

John S.


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## ilkleyal (May 7, 2012)

John Stevenson  said:
			
		

> Al,
> They are not a bad machine but to cut costs they have cut corners, if you do a web search you will find plenty of posts giving details.
> 
> Given that many suppliers in China are making and selling these quality differs from supplier to supplier.
> ...



Hi John, Thanks, yes I have researched them in detail and seen the Z axis problems, pathetic mounting for the plastic nut on the y axis, cable run problems and so on. All the sellers appear to claim they are in Portsmouth, they are not of course and are all actually Chinese vendors (probably one and the same) of all sorts of cosmetic tat and strange oddities like these machines.

Totally get the difference twixt the one I'm getting and the better ball screwed one, send me a link if you will please as I didn't see that. 

Ref the spindle, I fully expect it to be rubbish, Anything else would be an unexpected bonus so I plan to change it anyway. I also know about the lack of an earth on the "control" box and the live male pins at the back of same. This is what I was alluding to as things that might need fixing. The Chinese may have already sorted these problems out though so we shall see. 

Looking forward to it as it will be fun sorting it out and getting it up to a decent spec, I could of course see about better lead screws if necessary and I will be performing repeatability and accuracy tests on it as soon as its all installed and working. Once I have taken it apart and built it properly I intend to use only solid carbide so the structure needs to be rigid, If it isn't, I will make it so. you can look forward to a feast of photos and detail of the modifications.

Cheers

Al.


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## John S (May 7, 2012)

One of them is in Portsmouth, I ordered a TB6520 ? stepper board off them and it was here in 3 days with a Portsmouth postmark.

One 3040/ 3020 I know came thru just as quick, one thing dealing with these is forget the insane shipping from Portsmouth, it's just a way to keep ebay fees down and it will have already shipped from China to the UK anyway.

Main thing is, if it ships from Portsmouth you won't get hit by UK duties and VAT fees.


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## ilkleyal (May 8, 2012)

John Stevenson  said:
			
		

> One of them is in Portsmouth, I ordered a TB6520 ? stepper board off them and it was here in 3 days with a Portsmouth postmark.
> 
> One 3040/ 3020 I know came thru just as quick, one thing dealing with these is forget the insane shipping from Portsmouth, it's just a way to keep ebay fees down and it will have already shipped from China to the UK anyway.
> 
> Main thing is, if it ships from Portsmouth you won't get hit by UK duties and VAT fees.



Hi John

Yes, if you look at the listings they vary from 420 to around 340 for the machine with the balance applied as postage to total £508.00 in every case. I went for the 340 with the insane post at £168.00 as this will keep the import duty down if it actually does ship from China. It's the same base machine at 420 and 340 as you know and you are quite correct in why they do this. 

I have mailed them to see if they are shipping form China or Hampshire but as yet not had a reply.

I already have 2 orders for bespoke 3 phase motor mounts for model aircraft (we all fly with three phase brushless AC motors these days) so Im keen to get the machine installed and sorted out.


Regards
Al.


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## waynes world (Jul 30, 2012)

also when you get your machine expect it not to function properly with the blue box you will also need to spend more monies on a geko 540 controler setup to make it a decent reliable machine with no missed steps , i have the 6040 machine , anybody who has purchased one has suffered the same problems, a heads up for you


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## ilkleyal (Aug 30, 2012)

Well folks a few months on from taking delivery
I have used the machine extensively.

Failures have been limited to it needing a total rewire of the control cables. I ripped them all out and substituted quality 4 core shielded control cables after less than 2 hours use as the originals were all breaking up. They were garbage, that's a fact. The Z was faulty right out of the packaging and Y followed suit the next time I used the machine. 

Accuracy is fantastic, honestly way better than I expected and there is less than .001" of backlash in any of the 3 axis. 

Spiral milling which seems to be regarded as a problem for the supplied controller has been no problem, the spindle is fine at full revs for hours at a time and the stepper motors are all going very well. It really has been a great buy.

I have made quite a few videos and will post if anyone wants to see it spiral mill.

Al.


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## crankshafter (Aug 30, 2012)

Hi.
Yes,please post some of your videos.

Best reg.
CS


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## GeekBoy (Oct 20, 2012)

Hi, I bought one of these a week ago and am documenting it on a blog - http://geekboy.it/2012/10/my-new-cnc-router

I will have a video coming up very soon. I hope this may help or perhaps answer some questions.

Steve


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## GeekBoy (Oct 21, 2012)

GeekBoy said:


> Hi, I bought one of these a week ago and am documenting it on a blog - http://geekboy.it/2012/10/my-new-cnc-router
> 
> I will have a video coming up very soon. I hope this may help or perhaps answer some questions.
> 
> Steve



Video uploaded of milling a pocket in MDF using a CNC 3020 - http://geekboy.it/2012/10/cnc_pocket_milling_video

I hope to load more soon of etching a PCB.


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## GeekBoy (Oct 27, 2012)

GeekBoy said:


> Video uploaded of milling a pocket in MDF using a CNC 3020 - http://geekboy.it/2012/10/cnc_pocket_milling_video
> 
> I hope to load more soon of etching a PCB.



Finally, a new video of isolation milling a PCB using the CNC 3020 - http://geekboy.it/2012/10/cnc_isolation_milling_1


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## kvom (Oct 28, 2012)

That's quite a small cutter sticking out very far in both videos.  For a pocket like that I'd want as little sticking out from the spindle collet as needed, for rigidity, and as large a cutter as the router will handle given that material (MDF).


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## GeekBoy (Oct 29, 2012)

kvom said:


> That's quite a small cutter sticking out very far in both videos.  For a pocket like that I'd want as little sticking out from the spindle collet as needed, for rigidity, and as large a cutter as the router will handle given that material (MDF).



Thanks, that's actually really welcomed feedback! I am just starting out, and using the cheap cutters it came with (I have since ordered more for use on PCBs. What you say makes sense! My main challenge now understanding PCB-GCODE and alternative methods...

Anyway, thanks!


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## brazza (Oct 30, 2012)

Hi guys , i brought a 3040 cnc router back in 2008 , most likely one of the  first ones ,at the time i couldn't even find a single post about it on cnczone , Well it's been 4 years since then and it still goes , the blue box it comes with , THROW IT OUT!!! , don't waste your time buy some geckos or better quality stepper drives. I put a trimmer router on mine  a couple years back 
apart from the increase in  noise , best thing i have ever done it absolutely hoggs through aluminium (aluminum) , I use 1/4 carbide , .5mm-1mm cuts 400-750mm a minute , I manily use it for parts that can't be done  manually or for roughing followed by a cleanup on the mill . On a good day it will hold 0.01mm (only if you clock the runnout of endmill and add to the diameter) , a bad day and it's out 0.1mm or more none the less a usefull machine


cheers 
Brayden


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## ilkleyal (Nov 2, 2012)

Nice work geek boy

I am actually using mine now to make money, I replaced all control cables after a week as they were terrible. Mine was also packed exactly the same as yours. after 6 months of daily use, mine will hold0 .02 mm every time. thats 2 microns. I use it to make parts for model aircraft and some special parts for sale to private clubs and its used every day. Buy the cam bam licence, its well worth it although you will have found that if you don't shut it down on the computer, then one use can last you days and you have 40 uses. I also bought the mach 3 software and the 2 together are working a treat. I have been using double sided carpet tape since I started. The smooth stuff, not the rough stuff. Your pocket will be fine for location. I use a 100mm square pocket with the bottom right corner set at x0z0. All you do then is have a series of templates that you fit into the corner and hey presto.



The machine is now 100% reliable, the steppers are fine and the blue box has given great service. I think the fan is now failing but as the box's only moving part, thats an easy fix. 

Al


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## mu38&Bg# (Nov 2, 2012)

ilkleyal said:


> after 6 months of daily use, mine will hold0 .02 mm every time. thats 2 microns.



0.02mm is 20microns. That is still good for such a machine.


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## ilkleyal (Nov 3, 2012)

dieselpilot said:


> 0.02mm is 20microns. That is still good for such a machine.




Sorry, an embarrassing typo

yes, .020 is 20 microns
.002 is 2 microns, i'm an engineer and i'm feeling daft for not checking my typing before I posted.

I really do know what a Micron is, honest..........:hDe: I used to sell optical shaft scanning machines capable of measuring to better than a tenth of a micron or .0001 as well as vision CMM's for a living working in metrology sales.

I vow to be more careful with the keyboard

Al.


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## GeekBoy (Nov 6, 2012)

ilkleyal said:


> Nice work geek boy
> 
> I am actually using mine now to make money, I replaced all control cables after a week as they were terrible. Mine was also packed exactly the same as yours. after 6 months of daily use, mine will hold0 .02 mm every time. thats 2 microns. I use it to make parts for model aircraft and some special parts for sale to private clubs and its used every day. Buy the cam bam licence, its well worth it although you will have found that if you don't shut it down on the computer, then one use can last you days and you have 40 uses. I also bought the mach 3 software and the 2 together are working a treat. I have been using double sided carpet tape since I started. The smooth stuff, not the rough stuff. Your pocket will be fine for location. I use a 100mm square pocket with the bottom right corner set at x0z0. All you do then is have a series of templates that you fit into the corner and hey presto.
> 
> ...



Hi ilkleyal,

I took your advice and tried carpet tape in my pocket and the results are perfect, thanks!!!

I have been quite sick these last two weeks, but all these things I learn I will add to my blog. I have produced a few PCBs using the this method, it's great! I think for my needs the blue box is quite fine, I'm certain there are better setups, but this works great for me. I would be really interested to hear more about how you are using your CNC router to make money??


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## pengknight (Jun 30, 2013)

How much is it?


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## kadora (Jun 30, 2013)

Guys 
is possible to rebuild this router to 3d printer?
Would be good for casting patterns design ???


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## cfellows (Jun 30, 2013)

kadora said:


> Guys
> is possible to rebuild this router to 3d printer?
> Would be good for casting patterns design ???



I've wondered the same thing.  Seems like Z axis head room and travel would be the only concern.

I've recently began thinking about buying or building a 3D printer.  They sure seem expensive for what they are...

Chuck


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## cfellows (Jun 30, 2013)

Here's a posting you might find interesting.

http://www.engineering.com/3DPrinting/3DPrintingArticles/ArticleID/4999/2BEIGH3-A-Combo-3D-Printer-and-CNC-Machine.aspx


Chuck


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## kadora (Jul 1, 2013)

Chuck thank you for link.
In my country i can buy this router kits
http://www.agi.sk/katalog/cnc-stavebnice-a-zostavy
but routers are belt driven and i do not know
if belts are good for 3D job.
I would like to have soft material milling router which could be
easily modify to 3D printer /if it is possible/.
Then 3D printer prints from bottom up to top
but milling router mills from top to bottom.
Do i need two different softwares for printing and milling?
Kadora


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## cfellows (Jul 1, 2013)

I'm just learning about this myself, but I believe the you need different software that converts the drawing to machine movements.  Here is a web site dedicated to converting CNC routers to 3d printers.  It talks about an addon that's been created for MACH3.

http://cnc2printer3d.wordpress.com/software/

Chuck

Edit:  You also need software control for the 4th axis that drives the extruder...


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