# Straight 8



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 2, 2010)

With the Peewee running I have decided to revisit a project that I started 3-1/2 years ago. It is the first attempt at an engine that i ever made. First starting out I thought I was the only one out there doing this. I found out about clubs and NAMES shows and quickly learned how poor a design it was. I am going to attempt to improve some things and see if i can get this thing to fire.

I wanted to build a straight 8 because it would be unlike any of the other engines i saw (replica engines, conley). I was trying to make it look somewhat like the 1932 Bugatti but not quite. I have some of the parts made and some things will need to be remade. One of those things is the cylinder block. The new block will have good cylinder liners and water jackets.

No laughing about me cleaning up between pics. If i didn't, you wouldn't be able to see the parts.

Pic 1 shows the cylinders being drilled. I would have drilled bigger but that is the largest drill i have.

Pic 2 shows the bores. The bores are 3 tiers. The bore will be larger above the water jacket so the liner will drop 3/4 of the way in before pressing. 

Pic 3 shows the head bolt holes

Pic 4 shows the water passage holes. There will be 4 passages that will transfer water to the head.


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## Deanofid (Feb 2, 2010)

Great start, Steve. This should be an exciting thread.
Thanks for starting it off with the nice pics!

Dean


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## hobby (Feb 2, 2010)

Good looking job.
Thanks for those pics.

Don't laugh about the cleanup?, 
I have my portable shop vac sitting right on my workbench next to my mill, after every couple operations, I sweep up the table, and the workpiece. ;D


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## Diy89 (Feb 2, 2010)

Nice! I always had a soft spot for the straight 8. Dad had one in an old pontiac. What a great sound!


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## cobra428 (Feb 2, 2010)

Steve,
Very Nice start! Bore? Stroke? Please!

Tony


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 2, 2010)

cobra428  said:
			
		

> Steve,
> Very Nice start! Bore? Stroke? Please!
> 
> Tony



It will be a .850 bore and a 1.062 stroke. That block is 8.250 long. Cylinder bores are 1" on center. 4.823CID


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## cobra428 (Feb 2, 2010)

Steve,
Should have nice pizazz. :bow:

Tony


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## cfellows (Feb 2, 2010)

Wow, great project, Steve. I, too, always had a soft spot for straight 8's, especially the old Buick's with overhead valves. Gonna be a great project!

Chuck


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## NickG (Feb 3, 2010)

Wow, never seen a model straight 8! I sense we are in for a treat here!  :bow:


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## CMS (Feb 3, 2010)

Off to a good start and hope it turns out as good as the Peewee. But I do have to comment about one thing, and that's the space between the cylinders. Think maybe the head gasket will be a challenge on its own.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 3, 2010)

CMS  said:
			
		

> Off to a good start and hope it turns out as good as the Peewee. But I do have to comment about one thing, and that's the space between the cylinders. Think maybe the head gasket will be a challenge on its own.



Once the liners are in, there will be well over 1/8 inch between the barrels


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## gbritnell (Feb 3, 2010)

Hi Steve, nice looking start on the block. At times I had thought about doing something like this but I always looked forward to the crankshaft and cringed a little. Maybe someday.
George


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## kustomkb (Feb 3, 2010)

Not wasting any time eh?

That's what we like to see. I look forward to your progress!


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## SAM in LA (Feb 3, 2010)

CMS  said:
			
		

> Off to a good start and hope it turns out as good as the Peewee. But I do have to comment about one thing, and that's the space between the cylinders. Think maybe the head gasket will be a challenge on its own.



You can use a copper "O-ring" around each cylinder as the Head gasket.

SAM


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## Bill Mc (Feb 3, 2010)

Hi Steve - I am so happy to see you describing your build of a straight 8 with lots of photos. I have always admired the Buick and Oldsmobile straight eights of yore. A friend of mine had a 1952 Olds straight 8 OHV with the 'super drive' automatic transmission. It was a real good engine with lots of torque and could outperform my '52 Olds with a V-8 and standard automatic transmission. Good luck on your build and I will be watching as you progress. - Billmc


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## Lorenz (Feb 3, 2010)

That's impressive!

How do you make the crackshaft?
And where is did the crankshaft be supported? because the length off it,

Greetings!


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 3, 2010)

Lorenz  said:
			
		

> That's impressive!
> 
> How do you make the crackshaft?
> And where is did the crankshaft be supported? because the length off it,
> ...



There is another section that the crankshaft resides in. This section bolts on the top of that piece. The crankshaft is pressed up. It is made fron 17 pieces all pressed and keyed together. If it prooves to be to weak, i will try to turn a one piece and make some shell bearings. (oh boy)


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 3, 2010)

Well I made it thru this one without disaster.

Pic1 is the cutting of the waterjackets. I plunged a .750 key cutter into the bore to desired depth. Then i moved .125 off center and moved in a .250 square staying .125 off center. Does that make sense? Then I moved .175 off center along the X and Y axis both pos and neg. This pattern gave me enough overlap with the cylinder next door that it created a passage between the bores. Water should flow into the side plate thru the entire block and up into the head in 4 places.

Pic 2 the block was rotated 180 degrees and the mounting holes are drilled. These 12 holes are to attach the block to the crankshaft support section.

Pic 3 is the head bolt holes being counterbored. This block has to be bolted to the head before the block is attached to crankshaft support. These counterbores hide the head bolts to make this possible.

Pic 4 shows the block assembled with the lower block/crank support.


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## SAM in LA (Feb 3, 2010)

Very impressive.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 3, 2010)

SAM in LA  said:
			
		

> Very impressive.



Thanks! Still have some work to do as far as threaded holes for the side plates. I think im going to cnc those. Between both sides there are 76 holes to make and i dont want to misplace one.


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## deere_x475guy (Feb 3, 2010)

GO STEVE!!!!!!...can't wait to see this one. :bow:


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## Deanofid (Feb 3, 2010)

That's great, Steve. 
It looks like you have the pistons and rods done, too. You holdin' out on us?

Dean


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 4, 2010)

Deanofid  said:
			
		

> That's great, Steve.
> It looks like you have the pistons and rods done, too. You holdin' out on us?
> 
> Dean



Not holden out, read the first post in this thread. Pistons are going to be scraped and the rod will be reused.


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## ironman (Feb 4, 2010)

Steve, that block is really looking great. Haven't seen a straight 8 since my Grandpa's 52 Buick. Maintain your patience and keep up the superb work.  More pics please. ironman


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## ironman (Feb 4, 2010)

Steve, are the plans to this engine available? Forgot to ask in previous post. ironman


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 4, 2010)

ironman  said:
			
		

> Steve, are the plans to this engine available? Forgot to ask in previous post. ironman



No plans available. The engine is still under development. That's fancy speak for "I don't know what i'm doing".


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 4, 2010)

Wow!

76 holes with 0-80 threads (38 each side) spot drilled, drilled, tapped, bottom tapped and deburred. The only thing left is to cut a hole of some kind thru the side of the block somewhere to pump water from the radiator into the block. I'm going to let that go for now because I am still unsure how and where i'm going to do that.

I used the CNC to spot and drill the holes. I didn't want to take a chance of reading the drawing wrong and putting a hole in the wrong spot. I also wanted to maximize the depth of the hole without breaking thru into the bore for the sleeve. I drilled .010 less than breaking thru. All the other work was done manually.


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## Jack B (Feb 4, 2010)

Hi Steve
Great project your work is special. Now I know why you need a tapping block. I think you will like it.        Jack B.


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## hobby (Feb 4, 2010)

Very nice work.
     @
Very Nice build pictures.,

This is nice to watch the progress on.


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## zeeprogrammer (Feb 4, 2010)

stevehuckss396  said:
			
		

> 76 holes with 0-80 threads (38 each side) spot drilled, drilled, tapped, bottom tapped and deburred...



There's a song in there somewhere.

Very nice project. Very interesting.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 4, 2010)

zeeprogrammer  said:
			
		

> There's a song in there somewhere.



I think it's by ZZ Top.


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## crankshafter (Feb 5, 2010)

hi Steve.
I like your work very much. I'm checking in 4-5 times a day just hoping for new pic's and wright-ups. :bow:

Waiting to hear the straight 8 singing your song.
 Thm:
Crankshafter


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 5, 2010)

crankshafter  said:
			
		

> hi Steve.
> I like your work very much. I'm checking in 4-5 times a day just hoping for new pic's and wright-ups. :bow:



Thanks Crank. I hope to get the inspection plates done tonight so i can get the hole in the cylinder block for the coolant.


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## kvom (Feb 5, 2010)

Steve, why do you always choose the easy builds?  ;D  :bow: I'll be following along.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 5, 2010)

kvom  said:
			
		

> why do you always choose the easy builds?



Well. This really isn't all that hard. The engine has alot of flat spots. The intake manifold is basiclly a box. Nothing hard except the motor mounts. Everything else is doable. There is just alot of holes!!


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 5, 2010)

I made the inspection plates today. Didn't take any photo's. Just some simple milling and drilling. Alot of it!!! Having worked out all the water passage problems I think i'm going to modify the head for water passages.


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## cobra428 (Feb 5, 2010)

Steve,
It's looking good buddy! Crank? 90 90 90 90?

Tony


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## slick95 (Feb 5, 2010)

Steve,

Very nice. Look forward to your next posts... 

Jeff


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 5, 2010)

cobra428  said:
			
		

> Steve,
> It's looking good buddy! Crank? 90 90 90 90?
> 
> Tony



Yes


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## gbritnell (Feb 5, 2010)

Now that's a crankshaft!!!!!!
gbritnell


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## zeeprogrammer (Feb 6, 2010)

Neat! This is a fascinating engine.

I saw an earlier pic with some pistons in the background. Are they for this engine? How about a closer pic?


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 6, 2010)

zeeprogrammer  said:
			
		

> Neat! This is a fascinating engine.
> 
> I saw an earlier pic with some pistons in the background. Are they for this engine? How about a closer pic?



Those pistons will be in the scrap pile. I changed the bore from .875 to .850 to increase the thickness of the sleeve. I plan to ream the new slugs with a press fit wrist pin and float on the rod. I also want to put cast iron rings on the pistons instead of the viton orings. I do intend to reuse the rods and wrist pins.


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## gbritnell (Feb 6, 2010)

Hi Steve, another way to use full floating wrist pins is to drill them out and leave them a little short in the piston, then make up some Teflon plugs for the ends of them. 
George


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 6, 2010)

gbritnell  said:
			
		

> Hi Steve, another way to use full floating wrist pins is to drill them out and leave them a little short in the piston, then make up some Teflon plugs for the ends of them.
> George



That is how the old ones are done. I prefer to have a press fit in the rod and float the piston. I'm past that on this one.


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## cfellows (Feb 6, 2010)

Wow, that's a nice crank. Is it all pressed and pinned together? Are those ball bearing races on there?

Chuck


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 6, 2010)

cfellows  said:
			
		

> Wow, that's a nice crank. Is it all pressed and pinned together? Are those ball bearing races on there?
> 
> Chuck



Yes it is and yes they are!


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 6, 2010)

I got the head converted to water cooled. The head needed slots milled in it to transfer the coolant along it's length. I decided to mill them using CNC because of the enormous setup time for a manual operation. It would have required 8 seperate setups and the 1/32 endmill would be a problem in the big slow mill. In the CNC mill the slots took an hour. 

I poked a 1/8th endmill into the head to line up the water transfer between the head and block.

Next the transfer slots were cut. If you look close you can see them following the curve around the combustion chambers.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 6, 2010)

Next I drilled the holes that transfer the water from the right side of the head to the left. I then flows along the head again and thru the holes out the top. The top passages and hole to bolt the flanges down were drilled.

Made it thru without screwing it up!!


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## steamer (Feb 6, 2010)

Looking great Steve! :bow: Did you draw this one up?

Dave


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 6, 2010)

steamer  said:
			
		

> Looking great Steve! :bow: Did you draw this one up?
> 
> Dave



I drew the plans about 4 or so years ago. According to the date on my photos, I made the first piece June of 2006. Hard to believe I have been doing this stuff 3-1/2 years already. Seems like yesterday.


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## crankshafter (Feb 6, 2010)

Steve 
This is some kind of art. NICE. Overhead cams, who who ;D ;D
I'm looking forward to see the rest, Specialy how you will make the head-gasket.
CS


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 7, 2010)

crankshafter  said:
			
		

> Steve
> This is some kind of art. NICE. Overhead cams, who who ;D ;D
> I'm looking forward to see the rest, Specialy how you will make the head-gasket.
> CS



I will most likely make a few punches and just punch out the head gasket. I made the peewee gaskets the same way. It will be made from .010 thick teflon sheet. I'm a long way away from that right now.

Funny you said something about it, I just drew up the gasket friday.


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## cfellows (Feb 7, 2010)

Just keeps getting better and better, Steve. That head is going to be a hard act to follow!

Chuck


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## chuck foster (Feb 7, 2010)

very impressive steve :bow:

is this engine going to feature a "hot" cam or is it going to be just a nice mild cam?

chuck


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 7, 2010)

aermotor8  said:
			
		

> very impressive steve :bow:
> 
> is this engine going to feature a "hot" cam or is it going to be just a nice mild cam?
> 
> chuck



Thats a good question. When i made the cams for this build I copied the lobes from a Olds 330 camshaft. I dont know the specific details about the copied cam. Have to wait and see what happens.

I used the old milling machine/ rotary table method and it took me hours and hours. I used to come home from work and cut 3 lobes a night. Wont do that again.


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## Deanofid (Feb 7, 2010)

Looking very impressive, Steve. Excellent work.

Sorry for the silly question about con rods/pistons.

Dean


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 7, 2010)

Deanofid  said:
			
		

> Sorry for the silly question about con rods/pistons.



The only silly question is the question not asked. If you see something you would like to know more about or just doesn't look right, Ask! That's why we are all here.

Sorry if i made you feel like your question was silly. I hope i never make someone feel they shouldn't ask a question.


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## CallMeAL (Feb 8, 2010)

Beautiful work! I wondering to myself, how you get the ball bearings on the the bump sticks?


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 8, 2010)

CallMeAL  said:
			
		

> Beautiful work! I wondering to myself, how you get the ball bearings on the the bump sticks?



You make 17 seperate pieces. Some are just a disc and some have a crank throw and a race in the center with a square milled on the end. The disks have a square milled in the center. The piece with the crrank throw is pressed into the disk using the square to index the throws at 90 degrees from each other. Oh yah, dont forget to slip the bearings on as you go. Ask me how i know! :-[


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## gbritnell (Feb 8, 2010)

Hi Steve, I think what CallMeAl was asking was how you got the bearings on the camshafts?
George


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 8, 2010)

gbritnell  said:
			
		

> Hi Steve, I think what CallMeAl was asking was how you got the bearings on the camshafts?
> George



OOOHHH!!!


What I did there was got a bearing with a 3/8 ID. Then i made the cam with a base circle of .25 and a .080 lift. So from the back of the base circle to the top of the lobe is only .330. The bearings go right over the lobes. I am not to happy with the cam being so thin but the bearings support the shaft close to the lobe. Hopefully there wont be alot of flex in the shaft leading to broken pieces.


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## NickG (Feb 8, 2010)

Amazing stuff! Just a small and fairly insignificant question, when you tapped all those holes then 'bottom' tapped, does that just mean a tap that has the lead in taper bit ground off to get right to the bottom of the hole or do you get special taps like that?

Cheers,

nick


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 8, 2010)

NickG  said:
			
		

> when you tapped all those holes then 'bottom' tapped, does that just mean a tap that has the lead in taper bit ground off to get right to the bottom of the hole or do you get special taps like that?



Hello Nick. I have a normal (plug) tap to start and then went back with a bottom tap to catch the bottom of the hole. Needed all the thread i could get. Nothing special about them, just two different "standard" taps.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 8, 2010)

Today I managed to do a small bit. I drilled the final hole in the cylinder sectoin to let the water in. After that I rebored the holes in the Crank support. I suspected something was wrong and i was correct. The holes were running off to one side. When I made the original holes the vise must have been skewed. The holes are perfectly aligned with the bores in the cylinder now.







I also had dropped the part at one time and crushed one of the corners. I grabbed a corner rounding endmill and put a 1/8 radius on the top edge to hide the boo boo.






I started making cylinder liners. If you remember back I bored the cylinder block thru at .930 and then bored the area above the water jacket .940. I did this so that the liner will drop into the bore all but about 3/8 of an inch. This should make the liner alot easier to press in. I did all the OD work first creating 2 bosses that match the cylinder block.






The liner was bored to .050 undersized and parted off. The piece was rechucked and the opposite end was faced to .025 oversized. When the liners are installed the top of the block will be cut to bring the cylinder liners down to the block surface. The final bore will also be cut.






The finished piece ready to be pressed.






Drops right in ready for the press.


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## deere_x475guy (Feb 8, 2010)

Yep....this is definately going to be another great build Steve..... ;D


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## Maryak (Feb 8, 2010)

Guys,

You've confused the hell out of me with your tap nomenclature, (not that it's a difficult task). ;D

In Oz and probably the UK a set of say, BSW/NC, taps consists of 3 taps:

1 - Taper, used to start the tapping process and has a fairly long lead of less than full size threads at the start of the tap.
2. - Intermediate, used after the taper tap and has about half the lead of a taper tap of less than full size threads at the start.
3. - Plug, Full size threads all the way and used to provide threads to the bottom of a blind hole.

I am correct in saying your plug tap is my taper tap and my plug tap is your bottoming tap ??? ???

Thanks for sorting me out.

Best Regards
Bob


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## joeby (Feb 8, 2010)

Maryak,

 Ours our taper, plug, and bottoming. So Your intermediate is our plug, and your plug is our bottoming.

Kevin


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 8, 2010)

deere_x475guy  said:
			
		

> Yep....this is definately going to be another great build Steve..... ;D



The only reason i'm doing this is to bring inspiration to those who haven't finished there Webster.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 8, 2010)

joeby  said:
			
		

> Maryak,
> 
> Ours our taper, plug, and bottoming. So Your intermediate is our plug, and your plug is our bottoming.
> 
> Kevin



Yes! What Joe said!


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## Maryak (Feb 8, 2010)

Thanks Guys,

You've intermediately plugged and bottomed me out.  :bow: :bow: 

Best Regards
Bob


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 8, 2010)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> Thanks Guys,
> 
> You've intermediately plugged and bottomed me out. ;D
> 
> ...



Good one!! Hahahhahhaa!! Laughed like H33L!


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## deere_x475guy (Feb 9, 2010)

stevehuckss396  said:
			
		

> The only reason i'm doing this is to bring inspiration to those who haven't finished there Webster.



Webster????? What's a Webster??? :big:


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 10, 2010)

Managed to finish 3 more liners yesterday. Hope to have all finshed after work today.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 10, 2010)

Not much to report right now but i did manage to get the cylinder liners finished and ready to be pressed in. I had been using my milling machine as a makeshift press but now that i have the Bridgeport that's just not going to happen. So now i'm on the hunt for a semi good sized arbor press to do these types of things. Until then I will move on to something else but I don't know what.

??????????????


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## NickG (Feb 11, 2010)

amazing work Steve well done.

Nick


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## kvom (Feb 11, 2010)

You could press these with the vise jaws. But an arbor press is nice to have. I bought the 1-ton Palmgren model at Enco, but a larger one would have been preferable.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 11, 2010)

kvom  said:
			
		

> You could press these with the vise jaws. But an arbor press is nice to have. I bought the 1-ton Palmgren model at Enco, but a larger one would have been preferable.



That's what will happen but i want to see if i can find one first.


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## shred (Feb 11, 2010)

kvom  said:
			
		

> You could press these with the vise jaws. But an arbor press is nice to have. I bought the 1-ton Palmgren model at Enco, but a larger one would have been preferable.


Yeah, I have a little 1/2 ton arbor press and needed to press something not too long ago and it wasn't doing the job so I poked in the Kurt documentation. Ye cats, it'll squeeze 3 tons. That did it.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 11, 2010)

If my vise jaws were deep enough, It would be done right now.


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## mu38&Bg# (Feb 11, 2010)

How much of an interference fit do you have? Heating the block and freezing the liners not enough to get the job done?


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## deere_x475guy (Feb 11, 2010)

stevehuckss396  said:
			
		

> Not much to report right now but i did manage to get the cylinder liners finished and ready to be pressed in. I had been using my milling machine as a makeshift press but now that i have the Bridgeport that's just not going to happen. So now i'm on the hunt for a semi good sized arbor press to do these types of things. Until then I will move on to something else but I don't know what.
> 
> ??????????????




Sounds like you to take a road trip...we can do it in my shop real quick...


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 12, 2010)

deere_x475guy  said:
			
		

> Sounds like you to take a road trip...we can do it in my shop real quick...



Thanks Bob but I think i'm gonig to buy a new one after work today. I was hoping to score something from craigs list or Ebay. There has been nothing on Craigslist and all ebay has is junk chinese.


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## cobra428 (Feb 12, 2010)

Hi Steve,
Engine is "looking good"!

I bought a small arbor from HF for $29.00 a while a go. Never used it. It's to heavy to pick up, so I use my drill press for light pushes. I just saw the price went up on them. That's like my horiz band saw. Got it at 79 now 250.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=3552

Tony


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 12, 2010)

cobra428  said:
			
		

> Hi Steve,
> Engine is "looking good"!
> 
> I bought a small arbor from HF for $29.00 a while a go. Never used it. It's to heavy to pick up, so I use my drill press for light pushes. I just saw the price went up on them. That's like my horiz band saw. Got it at 79 now 250.
> ...



No offense but i have never had any luck with any of the cheap chinese products. I would perfer to pay 3 times more and use it for the rest of my life.Every HF or the like product i buy is usually in the trash in a year or 2 and never seem to work the way it should. I am going to KBC tool after work and get a good press USA made press and never have to buy another one. Might also keep so poor guy working also!


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## cobra428 (Feb 12, 2010)

stevehuckss396  said:
			
		

> Might also keep so poor guy working also!



Your absolutely right. 

A friend of mine used to say that only a rich man can afford to buy cheap tools. A poor man has to buy good tools so he don't have to keep buying them over and over.

Tony


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 12, 2010)

cobra428  said:
			
		

> Your absolutely right.
> 
> A friend of mine used to say that only a rich man can afford to buy cheap tools. A poor man has to buy good tools so he don't have to keep buying them over and over.
> 
> Tony



There is alot of trth to that. I used to buy cheap stuff and found myself buying more, and how do you feel when you break a 3 dollar tap off in a part you have 7 hours into. I now buy the 12 dollar taps and I dont stand at the bench wishing i didn't have to make another 7 hour part. It just never works out for me so i'll spend the extra cabbage.


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## cobra428 (Feb 12, 2010)

Yeah Steve,
Taps, reamers etc I buy good stuff. I just figured how many times will I use the arbor? Once a year....maybe.

Tony


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## kvom (Feb 12, 2010)

In have a 20T shop press, so between that, the vise, and the arbor press I'm set up.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 12, 2010)

cobra428  said:
			
		

> Yeah Steve,
> Taps, reamers etc I buy good stuff. I just figured how many times will I use the arbor? Once a year....maybe.
> Tony



I went in the back and I checked out what they had in stock. The 30 dollar press was first. It was a piece of crap. The mesh on the gears was so bad that it actually made a kerchunk noise as i moved it down and surged. I paid the money for the good stuff. The casting was much nicer and the movement was smooth as silk.


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## cobra428 (Feb 12, 2010)

Congrats on your new toy!

Tony


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## Twmaster (Feb 12, 2010)

What did you end up with Steve? I had one of those cheap arse Chinese arbor presses. Took it back the next day as it was just as awful as you mentioned.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 12, 2010)

Twmaster  said:
			
		

> What did you end up with Steve? I had one of those cheap arse Chinese arbor presses. Took it back the next day as it was just as awful as you mentioned.



It is made by Dake in Grand Haven, MI. 1-1/2 ton. I bought it because it is of high quality and it is made in my home state of michigan and this state is struggling real bad right now. Trying to help out the local guy and the local economy. Well that and I really really really like it!!


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## Twmaster (Feb 12, 2010)

Thanks Steve. I'm familiar with Dake. Couple of the local members of our metalworking club have their big hydraulic presses.

After having too many unhappy experiences with Chinese tooling I do my best to not buy inferior stuff. I do own some chinese stuff. I have a nice little 2" screwless vise that is dead nuts square as far as I can tell. Other than that there is little left in my shop from offshore.


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 13, 2010)

Got the block finished up. I used a q-tip and painted the surfaces that make contact with the green loc-tite. Green is a very thin liquid that creeps into very narrow gaps. Then using the new arbor press and a small aluminum ram tool that i made, I rammed the liners in. I broke the lower edges of the liner steps with a piece of sand paper so they slid in real nice but it did take a little force.












Over to the mill where i milled the extra .025 off the tops of the liners to bring them down to the deck height.







The bores were finished up in the mill. I like boring in the mill because the sleeves are installed and I dont have to worry about damaging them during the installation. Also the boring head gives me the best chance for a straight bore with minimum taper and the size between all cylinders should be very close because the boring head gets set and all 8 holes are bored. Cant do that on the lathe, well i cant!







With a little debur and a puff of air and she is all ready to be honed. The finish is so nice off the boring bar that very minimum honing will be needed.


----------



## cobra428 (Feb 13, 2010)

NICE! 

Tony


----------



## chuck foster (Feb 13, 2010)

looking good steve  Thm:

chuck


----------



## arnoldb (Feb 14, 2010)

Looking very good indeed Steve !

Regards, Arnold


----------



## gbritnell (Feb 14, 2010)

Hi Steve, that is one sweet looking block. What do you hone with? I use a brass lap type tool charged with abrasive grit.
George


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 14, 2010)

gbritnell  said:
			
		

> Hi Steve, that is one sweet looking block. What do you hone with? I use a brass lap type tool charged with abrasive grit.
> George



Have not honed it yet. I am thinking i'm not going to. The finish is very nice and shiny. If i hone it the finish will get courser. It is almost a mirror finish now. It is better right now than the peewee was after i lapped it.


----------



## Artie (Feb 14, 2010)

Steve, firstly let me say that Im watching this build with mucho interest, its fascinating. A job well done. 

Honing....... honing is done to purposefully roughen the surface slightly to hold oil while the rings bed in, critical on full sized engines, not sure how important this is on miniatures. And finally to allow the bores to be finished to an exact size, again, critical when the pistons are made to an exact tolerance and the bores are then made to match, we usually do this the other way round in our hobby.

My apologies if this was known, before I chipped in.

Again, loving it.

Artie


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 14, 2010)

Artie  said:
			
		

> honing is done to purposefully roughen the surface slightly to hold oil while the rings bed in And finally to allow the bores to be finished to an exact size



Hi Artie!

The trend today is to finish the cylinders to an almost mirror finish. Bob Shores recommended the cross hatch be polished out. As for size, I bored in the mill and double stroked each hole meaning I took a cut then a spring cut in each bore. Top to bottom on the bores and difference between bores is well in spec now. 

As bad as my rings are, they will never bed in anyway Hahahha!! 


Thanks Artie!!


----------



## cfellows (Feb 14, 2010)

More nice work, Steve. By the way, what kind of cutter do you use in that boring head?

Chuck


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 14, 2010)

cfellows  said:
			
		

> More nice work, Steve. By the way, what kind of cutter do you use in that boring head?
> 
> Chuck



Boring bar with a 3/4 shank. It has a carbide tip with a nice big radius on the end. Not sure but looks like .0625 radius. I did it free hand so I really dont know.


----------



## deere_x475guy (Feb 14, 2010)

Damn fine work Steve.!!!!!!


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 14, 2010)

"Lap to a mirror finish. Do not leave herringbone scratches to retain oil for the piston. Rarely does a piston lack oil, the PROBLEM is to prevent oil migration from the oil pan, around the piston and into the combustion chamber."

Bob Shores


----------



## NickG (Feb 15, 2010)

That's quite interesting, sort of makes sense. You'd think the piston would also bed in faster without oil being retained in those surfaces too. On full size engines when you're running them in they used to suggest using crappy oil. But with todays cars, there don't tend to be any major running in instructions, well you don't have to change the oil after 500 miles, then after 1000 miles etc, so that suggests the bores are a good finish to start with. I guess with any kind of running the bores get polished to a mirror finish anyway.

Seems like this could be one of those subjective topics, i've never needed to hone or lap a bore on any of my engines yet, always had better results without but I haven't made an i.c. engine yet.

Nick


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 15, 2010)

NickG  said:
			
		

> Seems like this could be one of those subjective topics, i've never needed to hone or lap a bore on any of my engines yet, always had better results without but I haven't made an i.c. engine yet.
> 
> Nick



When i made the sleeves for the Peewee, i did the whole job on the lathe. I even bored to finish size -.002. Then when I pressed them in, The bores were finished with a lapping tool. In that case the bores were out more than .0005 from top to bottom and the finish was not so good. In this case, the finish is smooth as a babys but and very little taper if any. Why fix it if it aint broke.


----------



## Artie (Feb 15, 2010)

Ive ben thinking about the honing thing and now have 'a theory'. In the full sized item the rings are forced quite hard against the cylinder walls and when being bedded in even harder by slow revs and high load (high cylinder gas pressures pushing the rings outwards). The hone marks are there to hold oil to protect the surfaces during this period.

Little engines are never going to be loaded to that level and also never run for any appreciable length of time. Give these to points. I wouldnt hone either. As you say get a good smooth finish and go.

Keep it up mate.

Artie


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 15, 2010)

Artie  said:
			
		

> As you say get a good smooth finish and go.



Also need to make sure there is no taper from top to bottom. I have measured mine a few times and the difference is only a tenth or two. If there is more than a few tenths, personally I like the lapping tool to remove the taper.

Have to be round, straight, and shiny!


----------



## joeby (Feb 15, 2010)

I'm not entirely convinced that the honing is done to hold oil.

 When engines are mass produced, from castings that are probably still "green" how much out 
of round are they. How about rings, one size doesn't easily fit all.

 A lot of years ago I worked on small engines for extra money, many of them were the aluminum bore B&S. If you didn't hone them, the rings would have a really hard time seating.

 Could it be possible that the honing created a little "traction" to get wear started?

 Would it also be possible for the newer engines to not need honed because of better control in manufacturing creating better fitting parts?

Kevin


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 15, 2010)

Started on a set of pistons today. I make the pieces long and turn a diameter on the end so there will be something to hang on to.








The piece is chucked and the OD is turned and the ring grooves are cut. My target was .8495 - .850. I managed to hit the target 8 times in a row. 2 of them were so close i rubbed them with some paper rather than take a chance of cutting under size.












The pieces were flipped upside down and I sat and watched the mill clean out the bottoms.












Tomorrow I hope to get them cross drilled and installed on the rods.


----------



## gbritnell (Feb 15, 2010)

Hi Steve, first off, you're making great progress on this mini monster. Second, do you have any problems with all the chips getting on the Z axis leadscrew?
George


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 15, 2010)

gbritnell  said:
			
		

> do you have any problems with all the chips getting on the Z axis leadscrew?
> George



Not at all G. I was only stroking Z .650 down. The ball nut was about 5 inches above the "dirty part of the screw. The screw will be cleaned and blown down before i bring the head back down. Normally the screw is hidden but Z is almost all the way up exposing the lower few inches.


----------



## deere_x475guy (Feb 15, 2010)

Gang, he did all this today while giving me cam and Mach3 support....Nice job Steve it's looking great!

Here's a couple of Karma points for you!


----------



## rake60 (Feb 15, 2010)

Beautiful build Steve! :bow:

This thread is at the top of my "check it first" list.

Rick


----------



## Rustkolector (Feb 15, 2010)

Steve,
I am really enjoying your build. A little rambling about cylinder bores. In my opinion the cylinder finish is not as important (provided it is reasonably smooth) as the straightness of the bore, and the piston rings. I have gotten good straight bores with lapping. The last engine I built, I had the cylinder finished on a Sunnen pin hone. This cylinder was absolutely straight (by my measuements). This engine has great compression, and has never burned oil with 20+ hours of use. I have always had trouble measuring 10ths accurately with telescoping bore gauges, so I have resorted to using gauge blocks for more accurate cylinder bore measurement. With a good bore measurement, I have been making better rings. I follow the Trimble method (ring radial thickness, etc.) with only a few shortcuts. You should find that these rings will seal very well initially,and quickly improve. I use straight mineral oil for ring break-in. Friction modifiers in motor oils do a wonderful job of reducing friction in an engine, but they also slow ring seating of low tech CI rings. Ask any small aircraft mechanic.  

You can also consider plateau hone with one of those dingleberry hones. It doesn't open the bore measurably. They are used by speed shops after cylinder boring.  http://www.goodson.com/technical_support/tech_library/PlateauHoning.php

Jeff


----------



## m_kilde (Feb 16, 2010)

Hi Steve

I too must say it is a very interesting build to follow - thank you for sharing.

Kind of mass production and still you will end up with only one engine ;D


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 16, 2010)

m_kilde  said:
			
		

> thank you for sharing.
> 
> Kind of mass production and still you will end up with only one engine



Your welcome.

That is the bad part of a multi-cylinder engine. You have to make alot of everything. Any body that has built a motor with 8 or more cylinders, My hat is off to them. This is why I built the CNC milling machine.


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 16, 2010)

Well today was another awesome day in the garage. We have pistons!!

I hate drilling into anything round because, well, it sucks. I never seem to hit center or my drill seems to drift so i came up with this solution so i could "measure once, cut 8 times". I grabbed the smallest piece of square stock i could find. I turned 2 diameters on it, one being the diameter of the skirt ID - .002 and the same length as its depth. I also turned the smaller diameter .002 smaller than the second step way down in the deepest part of the piston recess. 







Then i put it in the mill and milled off enough material so the center was left and was .248 wide. That makes the width .002 less than the slot in the piston.







The piston went on about 3/4 of the way and with a few light taps, it slid right on. I didn't even need to hold it on there but i still used my thumb just in case. Knowing it would work and knowing the large square surface is the bottom of the piston, I found center and that edge and laid out the hole and drilled it .010 larger than the wrist pin.







Then one after another I slid them on and spot drilled, drilled and reamed all eight pistons.












After that step was done I rechucked them in the lathe and parted them off.






I dont have a collet to fit the pistons so i wrapped them in a piece of paper to keep from scuffing them up. If you were wondering what the 3rd ring groove is for. That groove is the top of the piston +.005. I faced the top of the piston until the groove was gone and then took .005 more. The top edge was broken with a piece of 320 grit paper.







All that was left was to debur the wrist pin holes and FINISHED!! Wooohooo!


----------



## chuck foster (Feb 16, 2010)

looking good steve :bow: :bow:

i have always had trouble drilling wrist pin hole's, but after seeing the way you did it ........... i think my problems are over ;D

thanks for letting us look over your shoulder and watch a master at work Thm:

chuck


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 16, 2010)

aermotor8  said:
			
		

> i have always had trouble drilling wrist pin hole's, but after seeing the way you did it ........... i think my problems are over



I hear you. I have tried a few things like the v block and stuff. Never seem to get things right. I like this way. I will be doing pistons this way again. Seems to go good and timely.

Thanks Aero!


----------



## zeeprogrammer (Feb 16, 2010)

Awesome.
This is a cool engine.


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 16, 2010)

zeeprogrammer  said:
			
		

> Awesome.
> This is a cool engine.



Thanks Zee. I just hope it runs. It is my own design and well, You know.


----------



## cfellows (Feb 16, 2010)

stevehuckss396  said:
			
		

> Thanks Zee. I just hope it runs. It is my own design and well, You know.



Steve, I've no doubt you'll get it running. Might be hard to get it to idle at under 3,000 rpm's or so, but I'll bet it'll run!

Chuck


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 16, 2010)

cfellows  said:
			
		

> Steve, I've no doubt you'll get it running. Might be hard to get it to idle at under 3,000 rpm's or so, but I'll bet it'll run!
> 
> Chuck



Gee's I hope it idles lower than that. I have a good sized slug of metal for the rear of the crankshaft. Most people thought the Peewee wouldn't idle well and it does.


----------



## Twmaster (Feb 17, 2010)

Steve, that method for cutting the wrist pin holes is brilliant! 

I can't wait to see more of this great engine.


----------



## NickG (Feb 17, 2010)

Wow, brilliant stuff Steve. What sort of clearance is there between cyl and piston? Presumably this must be carefully calculated being two different metals?

I would have thought it would be easier to control the speed with more cylinders making the whole thing run smoother, but I guess time will tell!

Nick


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 17, 2010)

NickG  said:
			
		

> Wow, brilliant stuff Steve. What sort of clearance is there between cyl and piston? Presumably this must be carefully calculated being two different metals?
> 
> I would have thought it would be easier to control the speed with more cylinders making the whole thing run smoother, but I guess time will tell!
> 
> Nick



I was shooting for .001 - .0015 under size. I can plug the liner with my thumb and put the piston in the bore. The piston just sits there and wont move until i pull my thumb off and the piston falls thru into my hand. Fit is good.

Everybody kept telling me that the flywhel is to small on the peewee and that thing idles fine. It will never idle at 500rpm but shoot. Sounds OK to me! So I guess we will see but for now, this is what i'm trying.


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 21, 2010)

After working 29 hours over Friday and Saturday, I was thinking it was time to do something that required very little brain power. I had the gcode finished for some plates that go on the inspection plates. I ended up breaking a 12 dollar bit mostly due to my head being in a fog but it went quite well. I used a .020 end mill and the 2 plates took about 4-1/2 hours to cut. I used the time to clean up around the garage.


The two plates are about 2" wide and 1" tall. Details are cut in .025 deep and the oval is .005 short of cutting thru. I should be able to press the plates right out.


----------



## gbritnell (Feb 21, 2010)

Boy that CNC stuff is great, isn't it?
George


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 21, 2010)

gbritnell  said:
			
		

> Boy that CNC stuff is great, isn't it?
> George



It's even better when you build your own machine.


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 22, 2010)

Here they are after the first coat of paint.


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## ironman (Feb 22, 2010)

Steve you really do some beautiful machining. My hat is off to you. Keep up the fabulous job. Love your building posts. Just thought I would give you some recognition. I personally have never seen a model straight 8. Be happy to see it run. ironman


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 22, 2010)

ironman  said:
			
		

> I personally have never seen a model straight 8. Be happy to see it run. ironman



I have only seen one and never seen it run. That is one of the reasons I picked this as a project. I make some rings today and am trying to get my head around the heat treating fixture. I would also like to see it running!!!

Thanks!


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 24, 2010)

Made my head gasket today. I made a fixture from some 1/8 inch aluminum. I was able to sandwich some teflon sheet between the 2 pieces of the fixture and drill out the holes and used a razor blade to slice the holes out for the cylinders. Figured while i was at it I would make a spare. Now that the template is made it takes just a few minutes to make a gasket.


----------



## 1hand (Feb 24, 2010)

stevehuckss396  said:
			
		

> After working 29 hours over Friday and Saturday, I was thinking it was time to do something that required very little brain power. I had the gcode finished for some plates that go on the inspection plates. I ended up breaking a 12 dollar bit mostly due to my head being in a fog but it went quite well. I used a .020 end mill and the 2 plates took about 4-1/2 hours to cut. I used the time to clean up around the garage.



Steve;

Great Job. Thm: How long did it take you to make the "program" for the CNC to cut them inspection plates?

Matt


----------



## wes (Feb 24, 2010)

This is an interesting engine. Great job! Hats off. Where did you get the plans?


----------



## zeeprogrammer (Feb 24, 2010)

I can bet there's a bunch of people saying they wish it was them posting this thread.


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 24, 2010)

1hand  said:
			
		

> How long did it take you to make the "program" for the CNC to cut them inspection plates?



Hi Matt!

I ass/u/me you are talking about the Bugatti emblems. The code took about 30 minutes. Would have been about 1/3 of that time but LazyCam is a bit figgy and didn't want to pocket around all that text. Finally got it to work.


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 24, 2010)

wes  said:
			
		

> This is an interesting engine. Great job! Hats off. Where did you get the plans?



Thanks Wes!

I drew up the plans myself. I started on it about 3 years ago. Now that i have built an engine with water system and cast iron rings on the pistons, I'm changing this engine to have the same thing. Trying to upgrade using what I have. If I started over I would do things a bit different but not much.


----------



## cobra428 (Feb 24, 2010)

Looking Good Steve
Man you moving along on it!

Tony


----------



## Tad Wicks (Feb 25, 2010)

Boy, between you and gbritnell I think that I will go and throw rocks at my junk ;D, no not really. Looking at the Bugatti emblem, I would probably spell it wrong :       Great job, very impressive, I look forward to more. Tad


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Feb 25, 2010)

Tad Wicks  said:
			
		

> Boy, between you and gbritnell I think that I will go and throw rocks at my junk ;D, no not really. Looking at the Bugatti emblem, I would probably spell it wrong :       Great job, very impressive, I look forward to more. Tad



I'm not exactly on the same plain as G but i do want to be him when i grow up.

Thanks Tad!


----------



## arnoldb (Feb 25, 2010)

Awesome progress Steve :bow:

Kind regards, Arnold


----------



## kendo (Feb 25, 2010)

Hi Steve
        I've been watching this post for a while now, it just keeps getting 
        better. really nice piece of CNC work on them plates, they look 
        fantastic. Looking forward to the rest of the build.

                   Ken


----------



## NickG (Mar 4, 2010)

zeeprogrammer  said:
			
		

> I can bet there's a bunch of people saying they wish it was them posting this thread.



Too right, amazing stuff Steve :bow:


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 4, 2010)

Thanks! 

Life has been crazy so nothing has been happening out in the garage. Hope to get back at it next week.


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## stevehuckss396 (Mar 15, 2010)

Ironman!!

You are correct about the slow down. I have been reading alot about piston rings. I decided to get a front loader kiln to use as a heat treating oven. It was ordered over the weekend so I wont see it for a while. 

I have made the rings and the fixture to George Trimble's specs. The article is layed out over 3 issues of Strictly I.C. numbers 7-9. Covers a ton of theory and all the math to design the fixture. The fixture changes with the size of the ring. 

There is some newer theory about the temperatures used to stress relieve the rings. Lower temps are used but have to be controlled between 475 - 525C for as much as an hour. I'm going to go that route because the lower temps almost eliminate the need for anti scalant. 

Also I took on a club build of a 5 cylinder air engine. 10 members made a few pieces each and this saturday we will assemble and debug. Hope to have that running at NAMES.

Also tried to modify the carb on the peewee so it would lean out a little at idle. Screwed that up and now I might have to make a new carb.

Also need to make some kind of air manifold for NAMES so i can run a few air things. It never ends. After NAMES things should ramp back up again. Maybe sooner.


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 28, 2010)

The oven made it here friday so the rings are progressing. I split all the rings with a pair of wire nippers. They work very well and give a nice clean crack. Then I loaded up the rings on the fixture. 











There are 2 methods that I have read about. One is to heat the rings to a glow and let cool. This method requires that an anti-scalant be used to protect the rings from forming scale on the surface. The second method is to heat the rings to just below 1000 degrees for about 30-60 minutes. The lower temp will keep scale at bay but requires an oven with temp control that most people don't have. It is said to be less destructive to the rings to heat to a lower temp.

The first batch I used some brown paper and aluminum foil as the antiscalant as a test. The second batch went right in with no protection. Other than a slight color difference, I could not tell a difference in surface finish. I cooked the rings for 1 hour at 950 degrees.







I have some work to do still. I need to make a small tool to hold the rings and polish the sides and then do some gap setting. If these work well, The peewee may end up with a new set also.


----------



## kcmillin (Mar 28, 2010)

stevehuckss396  said:
			
		

> You make 17 seperate pieces. Some are just a disc and some have a crank throw and a race in the center with a square milled on the end. The disks have a square milled in the center. The piece with the crrank throw is pressed into the disk using the square to index the throws at 90 degrees from each other. Oh yah, dont forget to slip the bearings on as you go. Ask me how i know! :-[



How do you mill square holes in the crank disks?

I am verry impressed with this engine. I love the fact you designed it yourself. I too design my own engines, well as much as my knowledge will allow anyway. Nothing like this so far. I beleive you just set the bar a little higher, or lower if your into limbo. 

How did you determin the correct position for the cam lobes? Is there a rule of thumb that one can follow when desiging a cam?

thanks 

Kel


----------



## steamer (Mar 28, 2010)

Steve!

Awesome looking build man! love what your doing!  I really need to get an oven...but I need a bigger shop first...

Dave


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 28, 2010)

How do you mill square holes in the crank disks?

*I used a very small endmill to keep the radius in the corners to a minimum and then relieve the corners of the square part going into the square hole.*

How did you determin the correct position for the cam lobes? Is there a rule of thumb that one can follow when desiging a cam?

*I make my cams based on real cams. My exhaust lobe always leads the intake lobe by 110 degrees. I typically use 280 degrees duration. I make the flank radius about 2 times the base circle. Then I go to the Model Engine News site and run my numbers thru the camcalc program to double check my numbers.*


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 28, 2010)

steamer  said:
			
		

> Steve!
> 
> Awesome looking build man! love what your doing! I really need to get an oven...but I need a bigger shop first...
> 
> Dave


Just do what I did and buy a tiny one. The hot box is only a 6 inch cube. Fits almost anywhere.

Thanks Steamer!


----------



## steamer (Mar 28, 2010)

its called the "Hot Box" ?

Who makes it?

Dave


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 28, 2010)

steamer  said:
			
		

> its called the "Hot Box" ?
> 
> Who makes it?



It's called a pottery kiln and it's made by paragon. They have a unit specifically for treating metal and you can inject gas into the oven but they are 3 times the money.

http://www.clay-king.com/paragon_q11a.html


----------



## kcmillin (Mar 28, 2010)

Can a kiln like that be used to melt aluminum in a steel crucible?

would rather buy that than make one.

kel


----------



## shred (Mar 28, 2010)

kcmillin  said:
			
		

> Can a kiln like that be used to melt aluminum in a steel crucible?
> 
> would rather buy that than make one.
> 
> kel


Yes it can, but the consequences of a crucible failure (which seems to happen much more often than I'd like, from what I read) are not pretty at all.


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 29, 2010)

kcmillin  said:
			
		

> Can a kiln like that be used to melt aluminum in a steel crucible?
> 
> would rather buy that than make one.
> 
> kel



I would think it can. It can go to as high as 2350F


----------



## cfellows (Mar 29, 2010)

shred  said:
			
		

> Yes it can, but the consequences of a crucible failure (which seems to happen much more often than I'd like, from what I read) are not pretty at all.



I would think the likelihood of a crucible failure in an electric kiln would be pretty remote. The Nichrome or Kanthal heating elements, which are usually rated up to around 2300 deg F would fail first. Steel melts at something over 2700 deg F. 

Having said that, I would use steel that is at least 1/8" thick. 

Chuck


----------



## kcmillin (Mar 29, 2010)

Thanks Guys. Ive been throwing around the idea of making a trash can forge for some time. But I like this oven idea much better, and I can do it inside.

thanks

kel


----------



## steamer (Mar 29, 2010)

Thanks for that Steve, I'll check into it!

Dave


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 29, 2010)

Your welcome Steamer. 

Thanks to everybody for the positive comments.

I spent some time polishing the rings and getting them to size. Now I can get going on this thing!!


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 30, 2010)

I have the rings completed. I got the ring gap set and installed all the rings. I only broke 2. One I broke just to see what it would take and the other when i tried to remove it. 

I played around with an abrasive wheel today. I got a plate finished and broke the wheel half way thru the second one.


----------



## gbritnell (Mar 30, 2010)

Lookin good Steve. The engine turning sure sets off the emblem.
George


----------



## zeeprogrammer (Mar 30, 2010)

Wow. Nice.
Don't know what to say beyond that.


----------



## Deanofid (Mar 30, 2010)

What Zee said sounds good!
(I dunno what to say either. It's beautiful.)

Dean


----------



## ksouers (Mar 30, 2010)

How do you whistle in a text environment ???

Whew!

Nice!


----------



## potman (Mar 31, 2010)

Oh My.....Oh My...........Oh My !!!!

This is craftsmanship of a caliber befitting the name in the logo.

In absolute awe,
earl...


----------



## steamer (Mar 31, 2010)

Damn Bubba!  That's Purty!


Looking Great Steve!

Dave


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 31, 2010)

Howdy everbody, Bubba here! Haahaha!! Bubba?


Thanks everybody!


I dont know how to whistle in text. That is a good question.


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 31, 2010)

Good day in the garage!!

I managed some progress today. With the rings being fitted I pressed the pistons onto the rods. Then the pistons were inserted into the cylinder bores (not without a fight) and the head got bolted to the block.







The crankshaft was done but i spent some time drilling and pinning the individual parts together. 













The assembly sits on the oil pan for safe keeping.


----------



## chuck foster (Mar 31, 2010)

looking good steve, it will be running in no time!!!!

what are you going to use for a carb?

chuck

when i grow up i want to be steve huck :big:


----------



## stevehuckss396 (Mar 31, 2010)

aermotor8  said:
			
		

> looking good steve, it will be running in no time!!!!
> 
> what are you going to use for a carb?
> 
> ...




I'm going to try a Walbro if i can figure it out. It will feed thru a fake supercharger. Little suckers have alot of adjusting screws!


----------



## Maryak (Mar 31, 2010)

Steve,

Words fail me and that says it all. :bow: :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## steamer (Mar 31, 2010)

Keep it up "Bubba!"...I do mean that with love and affection

  I'm digging that crankshaft....Is the bench long enough to work on it? ;D

Dave


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## gbritnell (Mar 31, 2010)

Steve, I got my hands on a very tiny Walbro for my 302 engine. I contacted a couple of the members of the BAEM club and asked them how they used the Walbro carb and what if any modifications needed to be made to it. I was told to buy the lowest pressure electric fuel pump (2-4 lbs) to start with. The only modification needed for the carb was to make an adapter plate and reduce the size of the venturi. 
 In all my searching I found some very good information on the functioning of these little carbs. The PDF files are too big to post so drop me a note at my email address and I'll send them to you. 
 I'll let you know how I make out with mine. I'm just finishing up the fuel tank, it's an aluminum 'Moon' type tank. 
George


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## radfordc (Apr 1, 2010)

Walbros like the one you show have a diaphram pump built in. The idea is to take crankcase pressure pulses and drive the diaphram so as to pump fuel into the carb. Without the pressure pulses the carb doesn't work.

Charlie


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## ariz (Apr 1, 2010)

steve that crankshaft is terrific   

the whole engine is astonishing :bow:

I can't imagine the sound that it will have when it will run, but remembering your last build, it would be fantastic


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## cfellows (Apr 1, 2010)

Steve, it really looks like you're pushing the envelope on this one. I really like it.

Chuck


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## gbritnell (Apr 1, 2010)

Steve, I don't want to hijack your thread by adding carb information so I'll start another on the subject.
George


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## BobWarfield (Apr 1, 2010)

This has really been an exceptionally interesting project. Thanks for sharing it!

Cheers,

BW


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## stevehuckss396 (Apr 1, 2010)

steamer  said:
			
		

> Keep it up "Bubba!"...I do mean that with love and affection



Yeah I know! Cracked me up!!


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## stevehuckss396 (Apr 1, 2010)

BobWarfield  said:
			
		

> This has really been an exceptionally interesting project. Thanks for sharing it!



Thanks Bob!

I like your turners cube picture.


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## kustomkb (Apr 7, 2010)

This is going to be a pretty serious engine.

Thanks for the great documentation.


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## stevehuckss396 (Apr 7, 2010)

Did some tinkering in the garage today. I installed the timing case. Then the cam boxes and shafts went on. These 2 camshafts took many nights to make. I use to cut 2 or 3 lobes a night. I used a 67 oldsmobile cam as a template so the exact specs are unknown.








Next goes the timing gear. This equipment might get replaced with some bevel gears and shafts. This way i can drive the water pump and maybe some day, the blower. When I started this thing I would have never been able to pull off something like that so the belt was within my skills.







All the covers go on.







The intake looks alot like the original in the photos that i have. and the blower will be fake. 






The exhaust is put together with the wrong solder. When it falls apart I plan to reassemble with silver solder. There will also be a horizontal pipe to collect exhaust from the 2 vertical pipes and send it to the rear.






Cheers!


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## 1hand (Apr 7, 2010)

Thats going to be a real looooker........Love the headers!

Matt


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## ironman (Apr 7, 2010)

Steve, that is a fabulous looking engine. Your talent and skills are super. Ironman


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## zeeprogrammer (Apr 7, 2010)

Those are some cool looking pics.
I mean...
Those are some cool looking pics.
Neat.


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## gbritnell (Apr 7, 2010)

Hi Steve, boy that thing is sure looking great. Are you going to have the parts at NAMES? I'd like to see it.
George


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## steamer (Apr 7, 2010)

What George said!

Even chicks are going to dig this one Bubba! ;D :bow: :bow:

Dave


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## steamer (Apr 7, 2010)

Ya know Steve, I just saw the mike's in the foreground and got an appreciation of size.

This thing is small!......that makes it even more cool in my book!

Dave


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## stevehuckss396 (Apr 7, 2010)

gbritnell  said:
			
		

> Hi Steve, boy that thing is sure looking great. Are you going to have the parts at NAMES? I'd like to see it.
> George



Yes G it will be there for sure. Wont be making much progress between now and then. I have to make some air valves. I have 6 air engines I want to run.


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## stevehuckss396 (Apr 7, 2010)

steamer  said:
			
		

> Ya know Steve, I just saw the mike's in the foreground and got an appreciation of size.
> This thing is small!......that makes it even more cool in my book!



I thought it to be large by model standards.


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## steamer (Apr 7, 2010)

As a straight 8 .....I think it small.....but I'm ham fisted ;D

Great looking job of it Steve , in all seriousness.

Dave


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## SBWHART (Apr 8, 2010)

Hi Steve

I've been quietly watching this engine take shape fantastic work, the belt driven cam as given me confidence for an engine design thats been slowly germinating in my head.

One ? I may have missed this, but what ignition system are you planning on using:- glow plugs ???

Cheers

Stew


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## stevehuckss396 (Apr 8, 2010)

SBWHART  said:
			
		

> what ignition system are you planning on using:- glow plugs ???



Hi Stew!

If you look back at the photos you will see 2 distributors to the rear of the engine driven by the cams. I am going to pick up an ignition from S/S at names in a few weeks and put some magnets somewhere. I have Uncle Dale Detrich on high alert for 8 spark plugs.


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## NickG (Apr 14, 2010)

Steve I can't believe how much progress you've made on this since I last checked in. It is fantastic, it is quite large for a model. Prob asked this before but what does cc work out as in cc? I can't get a feel for ci as a unit!

Cheers

Nick


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## stevehuckss396 (Apr 14, 2010)

NickG  said:
			
		

> Steve I can't believe how much progress you've made on this since I last checked in. It is fantastic, it is quite large for a model. Prob asked this before but what does cc work out as in cc? I can't get a feel for ci as a unit!



You have to remember that alot of the parts were made years ago but the project is getting a major revamp.

.850 bore X 1.0625 stroke = 4.8233CID
.079 Liters 

79cc?

Does that sound right?

Thanks Nick!!


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## Ed T (Apr 14, 2010)

Just something to prepare yourself for (not really). My dad had a Bugatti for a few years before WWII. He used it to get to work which was an adventure. The starting ritual involved installing the "starting" plugs. Starting the engine and letting it and all 20 quarts of oil warm up for a while. Then change over to the "running" plugs and go to work. Times have changed. Hopefully, you won't need two sets of plugs.


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## stevehuckss396 (Apr 14, 2010)

Ed T  said:
			
		

> Just something to prepare yourself for (not really). My dad had a Bugatti for a few years before WWII. He used it to get to work which was an adventure. The starting ritual involved installing the "starting" plugs. Starting the engine and letting it and all 20 quarts of oil warm up for a while. Then change over to the "running" plugs and go to work. Times have changed. Hopefully, you won't need two sets of plugs.



Is that why they had a set of plugs screwed into the firewall?


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## Ed T (Apr 15, 2010)

Not sure, but that would make sense. Or as much sense as the starting plug-running plug ritual could make.


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## NickG (Apr 20, 2010)

Steve,

Yep those calcs work out! :big: should be quite a powerful thing!

Cheers

Nick


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## mayhugh1 (Feb 6, 2013)

gbritnell said:


> Steve, I got my hands on a very tiny Walbro for my 302 engine. I contacted a couple of the members of the BAEM club and asked them how they used the Walbro carb and what if any modifications needed to be made to it. I was told to buy the lowest pressure electric fuel pump (2-4 lbs) to start with. The only modification needed for the carb was to make an adapter plate and reduce the size of the venturi.
> In all my searching I found some very good information on the functioning of these little carbs. The PDF files are too big to post so drop me a note at my email address and I'll send them to you.
> I'll let you know how I make out with mine. I'm just finishing up the fuel tank, it's an aluminum 'Moon' type tank.
> George


 
George,
How did your test with the Walbro work out? I tried removing the 2 check valve flaps from the pump membrane so gas could flow unobstructed to the main fuel inlet from a gravity feed bowl. This didn't work and so my next thought is to make a small external fuel pump to keep the fuel in the main fuel inlet under 3-5 psi pressure which I think is what you were going to try. After studying the Walbro PDF, though, it seems that this will likely drastically change the operation of the carb as it meters fuel into the carb throat. It will effectively change the spring force, inlet lever spacing, timing and speed of reaction of the diaphragm. And if the carb ends up working at all it might be pretty inconsistent and difficult to tune. Until I studied the Walbro info, I didn't realize that the pressure pulses of each crank cycle were, in addition to pumping fuel into the fuel inlet, also used to gate fuel into the metering circuits on each crank cycle and the metering circuits were designed accordingly. I can see how the RC enthusiasts can use these carbs successfully since their single cylinder engines generate the same pressure pulses that the Walbro is expecting but on a V8 or in my case an H9, I'm not sure how we can use them. - Terry


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## starnovice (Feb 17, 2013)

So, Steve what was the conclusion on this engine?  Did you get it to run?

Pat


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## stevehuckss396 (Feb 17, 2013)

starnovice said:


> So, Steve what was the conclusion on this engine?  Did you get it to run?
> 
> Pat



Not yet. Still a work in progress. I pick it up once in a great while. Make a few pieces and then put it away again.


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## starnovice (Feb 17, 2013)

I understand, some projects are just like that.


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## canadianhorsepower (Feb 17, 2013)

mayhugh1 said:


> George,
> How did your test with the Walbro work out? I tried removing the 2 check valve flaps from the pump membrane so gas could flow unobstructed to the main fuel inlet from a gravity feed bowl. This didn't work and so my next thought is to make a small external fuel pump to keep the fuel in the main fuel inlet under 3-5 psi pressure which I think is what you were going to try. After studying the Walbro PDF, though, it seems that this will likely drastically change the operation of the carb as it meters fuel into the carb throat. It will effectively change the spring force, inlet lever spacing, timing and speed of reaction of the diaphragm. And if the carb ends up working at all it might be pretty inconsistent and difficult to tune. Until I studied the Walbro info, I didn't realize that the pressure pulses of each crank cycle were, in addition to pumping fuel into the fuel inlet, also used to gate fuel into the metering circuits on each crank cycle and the metering circuits were designed accordingly. I can see how the RC enthusiasts can use these carbs successfully since their single cylinder engines generate the same pressure pulses that the Walbro is expecting but on a V8 or in my case an H9, I'm not sure how we can use them. - Terry


 
All you have to do is simply put one small vacuum line from your crank case close to a piston skirt and your in business. make sure that the pulsation hole is plug on the intake side of the carb
cheers


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