# steam engine build



## boatmadman (May 5, 2010)

Towards the end of last year I treated myself to a small milling machine - a Seig x2 with dro, and power feed.

Then I thought, what to do with it?

So, I set to on a steam engine build, plans of which came from the paddleducks website by Bogstandard, who used to use this forum.

Now, he recommended making a spare for every component, but, I am hoping for a 50% success rate in this project, so I am building two engines alongside each other.

The pics show the story, it all started as a lump of cast iron turned into 2 cylinder blocks, then some brass bar made the cylinder caps, pistons and bottom glands. Then some more bar was hacked and chiselled into crossheads.

Slow progress, but so what!!


Ian


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## boatmadman (May 5, 2010)

Next come bearing blocks

I started out with a length of bronze as you see in the first picture, and after several hours of hacking, sawing, swearing, filing and drinking coffee, I ended up with the items in the second picture. These are the bearings for the engines, they are not quite finished yet, they need a cosmetic cut just to make them prettier.

Ian


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## boatmadman (May 5, 2010)

I gave the bearings a nice cosmetic cut today, the first pic shows them with a set of crank web blanks.

The second pic shows one set of ten webs almost finished.

Ian


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## boatmadman (May 5, 2010)

So, this morning I went out to the workshop thinking to have a practise with my shiny new slitting saw, ready to do a cut on the crankwebs.

Not to be! I mounted the arbor and saw, ran it up to the test piece only to find it wasn't running true. Investigations found that the R8 arbor had been machined too long at the top, preventing the taper from engaging properly. :wall:

So, a call to the supplier and a replacement is on its way.

Meantime, I decided to have a go at the cylinder base and crank base plate.

The picture shows the results.

Ian


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## boatmadman (May 5, 2010)

The replacement arbor turned up today, hows that for service? Chronos is the company involved.

So, off to the workshop tonight to finish the crankwebs. First the slit was cut in each web, then holes for the locking screw were drilled and tapped in each web, then, finally, dry assembled, and guess what ---- it rotates Thumbs up (still needs a little fettling yet though)

Have to admit to being somewhat chuffed, as this is the first time I have attempted anything like this.

Anyway, here are pics, sorry a bit blurred.

Ian


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## boatmadman (May 5, 2010)

Well, I spent the morning fiddling, fettling and polishing, and now I have one crank complete, except for eccentrics, and it even rotates! Need a little bedding in, but it will be ok.

Ian


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## boatmadman (May 5, 2010)

And then there were two. 

(only loose assembled at the moment)


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## boatmadman (May 5, 2010)

Today I made the con rods, top end pins, crosshead guides and one set of stands.

I then drilled and tapped one block for the glands and engine plate and assembled the lot.

The pics show the current status of one top half, waiting for a material delivery to get to the same position with the second engine.

So far, things look promising, both cranks rotate, and, in today's assembly, the pistons and crossheads move ok, a little stiff, but they havent been fully adjusted yet, so they should be ok. ( I hope!!)

Ian


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## Blogwitch (May 5, 2010)

Goodness me Ian, looks like you have hit the ground running and haven't stopped yet, are you doing a marathon?

That is coming along real well at the moment.

I made two when I first designed and made them, one I kept as standard, and the other I let my imagination run a little wild on it.

Even now, when I put a bit of air thru them, they both still behave faultlessly.

I get a great deal of satisfaction seeing someone else building one, especially if they are not too experienced, as it really shows that with a little bit of perseverance, and using a few techniques they have never tried before, a slightly complicated engine is well within their reach.

Good luck with the rest of the build.

Bogs


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## Philjoe5 (May 5, 2010)

Wow, nice work Ian. The pictures are great, keep them coming.  :bow:



> Slow progress, but so what!!



I'm not seeing the slow part ;D

Cheers,
Phil


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## gbritnell (May 5, 2010)

Great work Ian. It looks like you'll have a 100% success rate. You have all the hard parts done so it should be a walk in the park from here. Keep the pictures coming.
gbritnell


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## boatmadman (May 5, 2010)

Thanks for the comments fella's.

I have learnt a huge amount just from reading forums, and asking questions, but, putting into practice is really satisfying - especially when the bits fit together and go round and round and up and down - but not at the same time yet!

Ian


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## Troutsqueezer (May 5, 2010)

Looking fine. So how long have you been working on it thus far?

Did you buy your X2 already equipped with the DRO & power feed.

-T


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## boatmadman (May 5, 2010)

I started this project around the third week in February, the idea is to run alongside another build so give a bit of variation.

The other project is a model anchor handling tug, Bourbon Orca, built from my own design to look like the real ship. 

Its my own design because the owners and builders wouldnt let me have a lines plan of the full size ship, so, I thought, design my own using free software off the interweb.

I got the mill complete and running with the dro and power feed, without those, I doubt I would have attempted this project.

Ian


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## Maryak (May 5, 2010)

Ian - Alias "Speedy Gonzales" :

You don't mess about and very nice work it is. :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


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## ironman (May 5, 2010)

Ian, I forgot to ask on the MBM forum but do you have in mind a boat for this engine? Thanks, ironman


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## boatmadman (May 6, 2010)

I haven't got anything in particular in mind for these engines, but a good sized tug might be an idea, except it will hide all the machinery.

This is a looooooong way off yet of course, as I also have in mind building my own boiler, for which I have a book on order for a bit of light reading!

After my current boat build, I have an open type steam launch hull and a twin wobbler plant waiting to be married up.

Too many projects - not enough time :-\

Ian


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## boatmadman (May 14, 2010)

Ok, now, I have been looking at the eccentric drawings and Bogs's instructions.

Whilst the process is explained clearly enough, one area I am unclear about is how to machine a 4mm wide 14mm diam. surface between 2 "flanges" 18mm diameter?

I had in mind using a parting tool, bringing it down to size , winding out, move along the width of the tool and bringing back down to size, repeat until the desired width is reached.

Your thoughts/ other suggestions please Gents.

Ian


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## shred (May 14, 2010)

boatmadman  said:
			
		

> Ok, now, I have been looking at the eccentric drawings and Bogs's instructions.
> 
> Whilst the process is explained clearly enough, one area I am unclear about is how to machine a 4mm wide 14mm diam. surface between 2 "flanges" 18mm diameter?
> 
> ...


I think that's what I did. I have some inherited lathe bits that are like short, fat parting tools and thus don't flex much at all. Some thin right and left turning tools might also get you there.


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## Deanofid (May 14, 2010)

I missed commenting earlier, Ian... sorry!
It sure is coming along nicely. Anything new?

Dean


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## boatmadman (May 20, 2010)

And then there were two )

Closely followed by steam chests, not quite finished, waiting for a 2mm slot drill and 6mm machine reamer to arrive.

Ian


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## bentprop (May 20, 2010)

Looking good,Ian.I have a half built one sitting on the bench waiting for some brass flat to make the bedplates.I should get off my fat hump and do something :big:
I had intended to put this engine in a 30% enlarged version of MB's "Rose" launch,but thought it would be too big for that.
Looking forward to more progress,it might convince me to get back to working in mine. :-[


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## Deanofid (May 20, 2010)

Steam chests are looking good, Ian. Lots of locating work in those things!
Looking good.

Dean


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## boatmadman (Jun 1, 2010)

Managed to finish the steam chests, then went on to make the steam spindle couplings, the steam chest blanks and the eccentric webs.


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## 4156df (Jun 1, 2010)

Ian,
Really nice work on the steam chests. I'm looking forward to watching your engine come together.
Dennis


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## boatmadman (Jun 7, 2010)

_HELP please_

Whilst tapping an m2 thread into one of the steam chests for the spool valve gland, the tap snapped right inside the hole.  :wall:

Is there any way of extracting the broken part, or am I just gonna have to make a whole new steam chest?

Ian


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## Deanofid (Jun 7, 2010)

Well, darn it, Ian. Don't fret too much, there is a way to get it out. You are going to have to hunt 
around for some stuff called alum. It's a chemical, and when mixed with water, you can soak your
brass piece in it, and it will eat away the tap without damaging the brass.

Alum is also called aluminum potassium sulfate. It's often used in food preservation, so you may have
to go to a place like a health food store, or a store that sells canning supplies, or maybe a pharmacy. 

Mix it to a saturate solution with water, and put your piece in it for a few hours to a few days, depending
on temperature, the composition of the tap, etc.

Dean


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## mklotz (Jun 7, 2010)

If local sources fail you, you can buy alum from these folks...

http://www.americanspice.com/catalo...type&_ssess_=193b20eb27f12084a73f696adfe8ae14

You can accelerate the reaction by gently heating the solution and providing some form of agitation around the offending tap - I've used an aquarium pump.

After a day or so of soaking, pull the part out of the alum solution and use a pick to dislodge whatever pieces of tap have been weakened by the chemical reaction so that the solution can reach fresh metal.


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## Tin Falcon (Jun 7, 2010)

You can also check your local swimming pool supplier 
https://secure.hosts.co.uk/~poolandspachemicals.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Water_Treatments_8.html
Tin


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## Deanofid (Jun 7, 2010)

I don't see any alum there, Tin. The thing at the top says aluminum sulfate, but that's not the same thing
as aluminum potassium sulfate, unless I'm far off. Is there something there I'm missing?

Dean


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## boatmadman (Jun 9, 2010)

Thanks for the tip Fella's, alum now on order.

I set out to make the steam valve spools and had problems. The first one came out ok, but no2 somehow came out off centre >>:-(, as did no 3, no4, no5 and no 6. >>:-(

So, I left them for a while and tried again, this time with success, all 4 are ok, I think!

I then thought I would do a simple job, so made the flanges for connection to the steam chests.

Having succeeded with those, I thought I would tackle the steam control valves next, that went well, although time consuming getting them right.

Ian


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## Blogwitch (Jun 9, 2010)

Things are lookin' good Ian.

Nearly time to try out your silver soldering.

Expect to relap your control valve after the soldering, as flux might get into the bore and you might get slight distortion of the block. Don't go overboard with either flux or heat, just enough to get the job done.


Bogs


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## Deanofid (Jun 9, 2010)

All those parts came out nice, Ian. I don't see a broken tap anywhere.. 

The spools have a ring of small holes about mid-length. Are those for exhaust?

Dean


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## boatmadman (Jun 9, 2010)

Bogs,

Think I will practice silver solder on a bit of scrap first

Dean,

The ring of holes midway are transfer ports, the engines are double acting and the spool valve has a drilling part way through the centre to the transfer ports.

Ian


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## Tin Falcon (Jun 9, 2010)

Dean if you go to the safety section they say this:


> Supplied in kibbled form, these are large flakes of Aluminium Sulphate, also know as Alum. It is the traditional coagulant for water treatment applications including swimming pools with sand filters. In alkaline solution, Aluminium Hydroxide is formed which is insoluble and has a positive charge. The negatively charged particles, which contribute to water cloudiness, are attracted to the positive Aluminium Hydroxide particles, which become larger and heavier and more easily removed from the water. The best practice is to ensure that this takes place in the filter, not in the pool water itself. The following should be taken into consideration.


Tin


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## Deanofid (Jun 9, 2010)

Thanks, Tin. That's what it says, alright.

This page says alum = aluminum potassium sulfate, and is not the same as aluminum sulfate.
I wonder who is right, and more importantly, does anyone know if the pool stuff will dissolve steel.

Dean


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## boatmadman (Jun 10, 2010)

Today I thought I would have a go at some steam pipe and silver solder.

Not having done much ss before, I decided to do some practise items first. The first pic shows a flange blank ssd to a short length of copper pipe and cut in half. As I wanted to be sure to get full penetration (ooeeerrr), I cut the item in half to have a look.

Success, it appears to have gone all the way through!

I then cut 2 more blanks and had a go at soldering from the pipe end, pic 2 shows the result, not so good, think again.

 I then turned a flange with a spigot for the pipe to sit in with the idea of putting a ring of ss in the bottom of the spigot, apply heat and let it do its job, but, the pcd of the bolt holes is too small to let me do this with the design requirement of 4mm pipe, so, think again!

I then soldered blank flanges onto a length of pipe from the open end of the flange, filed back to near flat and finished on a flat plate  success, pics 3 and 4 show the results, with some added bling!

Next I needed to work out a way of getting 4 bits of pipe the same. Pic 5 shows a flange positioned 20mm or so from the end of the pipe., with flux and ready to solder.
Pic 6 sees that pipe in the tube bender, using the flange to locate for length, and pic 7 shows the pipe after bending.

Pics 7 and 8 show the finished and polished pipes. These will need to be cut to length to fit into the control block at a later stage.

Overall, I am happy with the results, they arent as good as some I have seen, but theyll do!

Ian


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## boatmadman (Jun 10, 2010)

and the rest


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## boatmadman (Jun 26, 2010)

here we have engine no. 1 mostly assembled and timed. Just needs the blank plates fitting to the steam chests, the cylinder covers bolting on and the steam control block fitting.

It turns with two fingers on the flywheel, its just a little tight, but I hope it will improve with running in.

Now I have to wait for more copper pipe for the inlet/outlet connections.

Then I will have to beg steal or borrow a compressor!

Ian


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## shred (Jun 26, 2010)

Looks good! If it turns over with a couple fingers, it should be a nice runner. If you put air on and it kicks but doesn't run, you might want to visit my 'paddleducks' thread around part where I was timing the engine-- I misinterpreted the instructions which caused no end of annoyance before I got it sorted.


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## zeeprogrammer (Jun 26, 2010)

Great stuff Ian.

This is the type of engine I'm seriously considering for a boat/engine project I'd like to do some day.

It looks like the silver soldering is going well.


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## Blogwitch (Jun 26, 2010)

You've got that silver soldering well nailed now Ian, they look great.

Expect to do a bit of fine tuning on the spool valve positions (up/down), but it should run with things a fair way out, so that should be left until final assembly.

It really is looking good.


John


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## Maryak (Jun 26, 2010)

Nice one Ian. :bow: :bow:

Looking forward to seeing the video. ;D

Best Regards
Bob


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## boatmadman (Jul 9, 2010)

It runs!!!! ;D ;D

The first clip shows it at 28psi on air. It started at 35 and after about ten mins ran fairly smoothly at 28. The jerkiness is the camera frame rate - honest!

The second clip shows it running at about 35 psi

There are no gaskets fitted at this time, just piston o rings

Ian

http://s239.photobucket.com/albums/...e first run/?action=view&current=MVI_1512.mp4

http://s239.photobucket.com/albums/...first run/?action=view&current=MVI_1511-1.mp4


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## Blogwitch (Jul 9, 2010)

Absolutely great Ian.

Once you get them air tight and bedded in they should run very nicely on 10 psi.


John


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## Deanofid (Jul 9, 2010)

The second clip looks like it is a very smooth engine, Ian. Really a nice runner.
Thank you for the vids, and congrats!

Dean


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## xo18thfa (Jul 9, 2010)

This is a very nice looking engine and a great build log. I saw these plans a while back and have been studying them closely. One of these could end up in a Gauge 1 live steam locomotive someday.

Thanks for sharing all this. Bob


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## zeeprogrammer (Jul 9, 2010)

Congratulations Ian!
Sounds and runs great to me.


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## shred (Jul 9, 2010)

Looks good to me!

A little running in and tuning and it'll run nicely on ridiculously small amounts of air, especially if you o-ring the pistons.


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## boatmadman (Jul 12, 2010)

Update on magic powder and broken taps-- It works! Thanks for the tip fella's.

The offending item has now been dissolved out of the mounting hole which means I dont have to re make the part. There is still some in the tapped hole, but thats not an issue as I think I can rotate the gland by 45 deg .

It took a while,(about a month), but it didnt hold me up as I was working on the other engine.

Ian


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## boatmadman (Jul 14, 2010)

When I started on this project, I was working with the hope of 50% success rate, hence two engines. The intent was to make the mistakes on No.1 and end up with one good one plus some spare parts.

Well, today I spent fiddling with No.2 engine, and it also runs! In fact I think it runs a little better than No. 1

I havent posted any pics/video as they are identical. When I get them running together I will post a vid.

Ian


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## ariz (Jul 14, 2010)

congrats Ian, nice running engine
waiting to see them running in pairs


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## boatmadman (Jul 16, 2010)

Here we have both engines completed, assembled, run in on air but awaiting strip/clean before steam run.


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## Blogwitch (Jul 16, 2010)

Very nice indeed Ian. 

As far as I know, of the many versions of this engine that has been built, no one other than myself has built two working ones.

Maybe you should do what I did, leave one as standard, and do a bit of bling on the other. Even a little bit totally transforms the looks.

25psi of steam, lots of steam oil in the lubricator, let them warm thru a little to get rid of condensation, and then they should purr away like little pussycats.

They shouldn't need to run very fast as under load 300 to 400 RPM will be a fast speed, normally 100 to 200 rpm is a good running loaded speed for an engine of this size.


Bogs


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## boatmadman (Jul 16, 2010)

Thanks everyone for your comments and advice through this build, they were all very much appreciated.

At the moment, I am thinking I will mount one engine on a plinth, possibly a bit blinged up as you suggest, John, and the other to go in a boat of some sort.

Not decided yet though.

Ian


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## Deanofid (Jul 16, 2010)

Hey! Twin twins!
They look great, Ian. You did a fine job on both. Something to be proud of!

Dean


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## SAM in LA (Jul 16, 2010)

Ian,

Nice engines.

How large a boat will these engines fit in to?

SAM


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## arnoldb (Jul 16, 2010)

Very well done Ian :bow: - lovely job!

Kind regards, Arnold


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## Troutsqueezer (Jul 16, 2010)

Very nice Ian. Two of 'em no less. :bow:

You've inspired me to include this engine in my next round of builds. The fact that Bogs did such a nice job with the plans helps immeasurably. Now that there are a few build threads on this model it's hard to go wrong. 

I've taken stock of my skill levels at this point and figured I now have enough skill to learn the skills I need to make some slightly more complicated engines. I've ramped up my ambitions for the next round of engine making. I intend to build three engines simultaneously, making a part for one, then a part for the next, etc. Those engines will be this one that you have just completed, Upshur's Hit and Miss and Elmer's beam. 

Again, beautiful job!

-Trout


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## boatmadman (Jul 16, 2010)

Thanks for the comments fella's.

Trout, before I started on these engines I hadn't touched a milling machine for over 25 yrs, so it was almost a case of starting all over again.

Bogs's instructions are so good that a novice can do the engines justice. I refrain from saying 'complete novice' as a little knowledge is required in order to understand the processes.

In other words - go for it!! 

Ian


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## doubletop (Jul 18, 2010)

Ian

Very nice and definitely on my list for a next build . Looks like I need a trip to the scrap dealer to find myself a cylinder block

Pete


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## njl (Jul 18, 2010)

Ian,

thats very nice work.

How about building a boat which has a twin engine set up. It would be a shame to seperate them as they look so good together.

Nick


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## Blogwitch (Jul 18, 2010)

Nick,

I think the problem with the twin engined idea is the physical size of the boat required.

One of these engines, coupled to a suitable boiler should easily cope with a 4 to 5 ft long hull, depending on displacement, a twin engine layout would require a 6 to 7 ft hull, or maybe even longer.

One of that size changes all the logistics, a bigger car to carry it in, two man launches, somewhere to store it, etc. 

When you go to a larger size, usually loadsa money is involved, and it is that part which can't be hidden from the better half.

Why do we need that great big pickup? Are you sure we need a three car garage? Lifting that is going to murder my back. 

At one time, my car choice was based around how large my model boats were, or how many I wanted to transport to the lake.

Then I came to my senses, and made boats that fitted into a smaller car.


Bogs


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## boatmadman (Jul 18, 2010)

Bogs,

You have hit the nail right on the head - a boat for these two would be unmanageable for me.

My current boat build is about 4ft long, and will weigh xxx kg (a lot!), as was my last one. That's about as big as one person can realistically manage without trailers and launching trolleys etc. I too need to build boats to fit the car, not buy cars to carry boats!

So, that's why I am now considering a launch type boat for one engine.

The c of g of these engines is quite high, and that will have some bearing on the type of hull it can go in. Most launch types are long and relatively narrow, which may cause stability problems, depending on how low I can get a suitable boiler, plus of course lead ballast.

Ian


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## njl (Jul 19, 2010)

Thanks for the heads up John, not being a model boater I didn't realize that it would need to be quite so big as to make it impractical. Actually I have exactly the same sort of issues with my R/C planes hobby. 

Sorry Ian scratch the twin idea. 

Oh well must dash, I've got to get back to fixing my lawn tractor, today the grass box has fallen apart. The lever that tips the grass box for emptying has broken loose and the top bar of the space frame it attaches to has snapped clean in half so I need to weld it back up and get the grass cutting finished or I'll miss out on my shop time. 

Nick


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