# waterloo traction engine .29 scale



## sawyer massey

We started a groop build a waterloo 25 HP side mount
The reason for the scale is a 10 inch pipe works out to boiler diameter so scaling the rest from there


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## sawyer massey

Cylinder is coming along nice 
Orion machines quite wekl


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## aka9950202

Looking good.  Did you cast them yourself? 

Cheers, 

Andrew in Melbourne


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## sawyer massey

Yes I did quite the learning curve


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## aka9950202

Did you  use  3D printing to make the pattern? 

Cheers, 

Andrew in Melbourne


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## sawyer massey

No I made them the old way out of wood
I have 5 of every think to cast its a group build
Thanks for asking


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## sawyer massey

Governor pattern and partly machined casting and cylinder head


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## smittman

sawyer massey said:


> Cylinder is coming along nice
> Orion machines quite wekl


OK I'm new to machining but what's orion. I've searched the net without luck. Thanks Smittman


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## sawyer massey

Cast iron fat fingers little screen lol


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## sawyer massey

sawyer massey said:


> Cast iron fat fingers little screen lol






Second cylinder poured hope it machines well


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## sawyer massey

Think I'm getting better at this the last crank and govenor 
Also the steam chest cover I burnt the sand of first way softer irion


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## sawyer massey

cast the cross head guide machined  well


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## johnmcc69

Nice castings!
 What plans, pictures, or actual engine are you working from?

 John


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## tjwal

If you’re doing cast iron then more info on the melting and casting process, PLEASE.

John


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## sawyer massey

We are working from a friends full-size engine 
5 of us are building them
The drawings I am making up as well as the patterns

As for the casting it is iron
We use an a10 or an a 20 crucible depending on what we are going to poor
I use green sand and spay it with graphite and alcohol
Helps with the chill and the finish of the casting
The foundry is fire on oil


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## sawyer massey

That's what the full size engine looks like 
Thanks
Todd


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## sawyer massey

This is as far as I am right now


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## awake

I would love to try my hand at casting, but aluminum is as much as I have hoped for. I am impressed that you are not only casting iron, but getting such beautiful results!


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## sawyer massey

Coming along ...goveners are finished 90 % of the main frame one eccentric one in rough cast as well as the strap and crosshead


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## johnmcc69

Beautiful castings!

 John


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## sawyer massey

Thanks


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## sawyer massey

2 nd govener castings straight from the sand


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## sawyer massey

2nd set of governor castings


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## sawyer massey

To day's castings 
Connecting rod cross head eccentric and strap steam chest cover


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## dgcarlson12

What kind of government regulations do you need to adhere to regarding safety concerns i.e. boiler explosion/certification etc?


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## sawyer massey

dgcarlson12 said:


> What kind of government regulations do you need to adhere to regarding safety concerns i.e. boiler explosion/certification etc?


In Ontario you are allowed so much heating surface 
A boiler barrel under 16 inches
An run 100 psi or less
Can't be over on any on thing
We are running at the max heating surface allowed 
Hope this helps


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## HMEL

dgcarlson12 said:


> What kind of government regulations do you need to adhere to regarding safety concerns i.e. boiler explosion/certification etc?


It depends on who has jurisdictional authority.  In the U.S States retain that authority and there are a few States who have no standards.  In addition to the Sates cities may also claim jurisdiction.  Many simply state in law follow the ASME standards.  Europe and Canada set their own standards  DIN is one.  Technically the ASME has on average higher safety factors.  Inspectors are often certified and work for insurance companies.

The ASME for instance has a section on Miniature boilers in which the parameters are defined. To qualify in this category its less then 16 inches in shell diameter, less then 20 square feet of heating surface, less then five cubic feet of gross volume, and less then 100 psig allowable working pressure.  The testing standards are less but require a hydo static pressure test at three times the working pressure while big boilers its 1.5 times.  Now I am retired so some of this may have changed.  Your jurisdiction will tell you what hoops you will have to jump through to get a boiler certified.

Now I know many of these boilers are not certified and if you build one make sure you are confident in the design.  I prefer a hydro test done with water. (always with water) I have found its the most reliable test and is accepted and sometimes preferred.  Remember you will be the one standing along side of it as you pressurize it with firing.

There can be two types of explosions.  One from fuel mismanagement and one from structural failure.  I have only seen one structural failure and it was as bad as any fire explosion I have seen.

You may have to spend a few coins to get it certified but its worth every cent you spend.


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## sawyer massey

HMEL said:


> It depends on who has jurisdictional authority.  In the U.S States retain that authority and there are a few States who have no standards.  In addition to the Sates cities may also claim jurisdiction.  Many simply state in law follow the ASME standards.  Europe and Canada set their own standards  DIN is one.  Technically the ASME has on average higher safety factors.  Inspectors are often certified and work for insurance companies.
> 
> The ASME for instance has a section on Miniature boilers in which the parameters are defined. To qualify in this category its less then 16 inches in shell diameter, less then 20 square feet of heating surface, less then five cubic feet of gross volume, and less then 100 psig allowable working pressure.  The testing standards are less but require a hydo static pressure test at three times the working pressure while big boilers its 1.5 times.  Now I am retired so some of this may have changed.  Your jurisdiction will tell you what hoops you will have to jump through to get a boiler certified.
> 
> Now I know many of these boilers are not certified and if you build one make sure you are confident in the design.  I prefer a hydro test done with water. (always with water) I have found its the most reliable test and is accepted and sometimes preferred.  Remember you will be the one standing along side of it as you pressurize it with firing.
> 
> There can be two types of explosions.  One from fuel mismanagement and one from structural failure.  I have only seen one structural failure and it was as bad as any fire explosion I have seen.
> 
> You may have to spend a few coins to get it certified but its worth every cent you spend.


 Thanks 
 I have bin around and running steam engines for over 45 years my dad and his dad were to we still own my grandfathers engine
 I was certified to weld high pressure pipe up to 40 inches in diameter 
Let  that laps did not use it any more
I have built three other boilers 2 for the Sawyer Massey I built one for a goodision I made .......and yes you are more then right design right and know what you are doing around steam boilers 
Thanks 
Todd


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## sawyer massey

This a picture of my Sawyer Massey 
And a 21 up Robert bell I own .....not my grand fathers...that engine is in the north still


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## sawyer massey

Slowly coming along 
Just drilled the crank to check clearances
On ecentrick and strap complete the other 90%


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## sawyer massey

A few more castings
Valve guide
Ecebtric and strap
D VALVE
CRANK SIDE BEARING CAP
Seems I forgot to take a picture of the bearing cap


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## sawyer massey

Bit more finished ......The valve guide took way longer then I thought it would lol


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## sawyer massey

Some castings for the second engine
And the progress on the first


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## sawyer massey

Poured a 3 cylinder lost some sand but usable
And some more work on the connecting rod


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## johnmcc69

That's looking great!

 John


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## sawyer massey

Connecting rod ......done finely lol


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## sawyer massey

Back to pattern making ........still another 12 hours to finish I think 
Bondi and sanding ...so much fun lol
It 11.75 in diameter and 3.25 thick


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## sawyer massey

Hope to cast it this weekend hope it pulls from the sand clean


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## sawyer massey

Comes out clean 
Raining here .......might have to weight


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## sawyer massey

sawyer massey said:


> Comes out clean
> Raining here .......might have to weight


S


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## sawyer massey

Pour looked like it when well see tommorow  when I take it out of the box


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## MIKE4444

sawyer massey said:


> Thanks
> I have bin around and running steam engines for over 45 years my dad and his dad were to we still own my grandfathers engine
> I was certified to weld high pressure pipe up to 40 inches in diameter
> Let  that laps did not use it any more
> I have built three other boilers 2 for the Sawyer Massey I built one for a goodision I made .......and yes you are more then right design right and know what you are doing around steam boilers
> Thanks
> Todd


Hi  am new at Steam  Traction Engines , Very interested in building a small  steam engine, Have looked on the net , but No plans for a simple small  Loco or Traction engine, plenty of scratch models , but no plans , looked at the Cracker , Dribbler engines,   etc...as i am new can you help as to a simple  , say around  5 inches long or smaller to start of with, email me at        [email protected]        thank  you MIKE


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## sawyer massey

Well looks good ...Turn it today I hope 
The smalls are part of the reverse gear


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## sawyer massey

It will work lost a but of sand ......but usable


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## johnmcc69

Looks good to me!
 Nice job!

 John


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## sawyer massey

Machined the link for the reverse gear and the 2 ecentrick ends that a thatch to it 
No rotary table .....did it the old way


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## Peter Twissell

Unless you have a very large rotary table, the 'old way' is the only way to achieve any rigidity in the setup at such a large radius.


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## mnay

Beautiful work.  I have been afraid to tackle cast iron.  I am impressed with your castings.


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## sawyer massey

Thank you ......I made a lot of scrap at first getting better at it now


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## photopro

Here is a method I use to mill large radius's.  This particular setup is for putting a very large radius inside the axle box on the 1.6" scale Mikado locomotive I built some years ago but will work for smaller parts also.  The radius was required so the ends of the axles can independently move up and down, depending on track conditions, without binding. 

The basic setup is to use a heavy bar to support the workpiece and provide it with a fixed pivot on one end and a slotted pivot on the other end where the rotary table is located.  The whole setup is mounted on the mill table of course.  The slot allows the rotary table to move without binding.  The radius is determined solely by the distance from the fixed pivot to the cutter, not the size of the rotary table. 
How you mount the workpiece to the bar is up to you.

Doug


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## sawyer massey

99% of the link reverse finished........


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## sawyer massey

A little more finished ........Running on air by new years ?


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## sawyer massey

Looks like it will work just have to make the ran to hold up


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## sawyer massey

Well that's the reverse gear finished......all but the clean up before paint


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## sawyer massey

Well she is running ........can't share a video ...yet


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## sawyer massey

There we go


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## Peter Twissell

It says the video is private, so I can't see it.


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## sawyer massey

Peter Twissell said:


> It says the video is private, so I can't see it.


Hope that's fixed now


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## Sprocket

Not yet, still says private


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## sawyer massey

That I hope boes it


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## sawyer massey

One more try ....then I'll make another video


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## sawyer massey

Back to pattern making .......my head hurts from this one
The last one is the full size we are copying


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## sawyer massey

The finished pattern and the crank shaft rear mount


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## sawyer massey

A little cleanup and  should be good hope to cast the other mount tomorrow 
Little hard getting the heat up I  the foundry -10 today  lol


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## sawyer massey

The rear /crank mount and the governor for engine #2


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## sawyer massey

Making some progress on the governor's


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## sawyer massey

.  Governor #2seemes to work
It's on engine #1 lol


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## sawyer massey

Mounts are machined and rough fitted ....do the rest when the boilers finished.
And one rear hub one front back hub is 16lb


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## sawyer massey

A start on the boiler


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## swarf

Is this boiler designed by a P/ENG?
What process did you use to weld the boiler with and what filler metals did you use? Was or is the TSSA involved? What materials did you use? Do you hold a current weld ticket for the process you are welding with?


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## sawyer massey

It's under code #1  ,2 it's 5/16 516 grade 70 plate tube sheets are 3/8 6011 root 7018 fill and my license lapsed years ago
The pipe is a 36 .......will the service your question ?


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## swarf

sawyer massey said:


> It's under code #1  ,2 it's 5/16 516 grade 70 plate tube sheets are 3/8 6011 root 7018 fill and my license lapsed years ago
> The pipe is a 36 .......will the service your question ?


What ASTM pipe are you using?


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## sawyer massey

You tell me you know the answer


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## sawyer massey

A 106


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## sawyer massey

Do you know how build a boiler and the codes ?


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## swarf

Lol Sawyer, I'm not being critical or smart ass. I'm a code pipe welder by trade and huge steam enthusiast. Just asking because I'm interested in what your doing.
I'm fabricating an HRT boiler and I am exempt from code construction, or should I rephrase bound to ASME section one under the model boilers clause.


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## sawyer massey

What engine are you building it for .......I have one that was given to me years ago 90,%done I'd quess about 7or 8 inch diameter roughly 24 long was for a Peterson traction engine a friend of mine was building ........I'll never use it


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## swarf

sawyer massey said:


> What engine are you building it for .......I have one that was given to me years ago 90,%done I'd quess about 7or 8 inch diameter roughly 24 long was for a Peterson traction engine a friend of mine was building ........I'll never use it


Are you ready for this, it's has a 10 inch shell and theoretically produces just under 1hp. All for a Stuart 10v . Have other intentions for the boiler. But the 10v is all I have (machining) currently.


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## sawyer massey

Holes for the stays done .....still a long way to go


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## sawyer massey

Bit more done


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## Richard Hed

sawyer massey said:


> Holes for the stays done .....still a long way to go


I designed and built one like that but I didn't like it's design so I scrapped it and built a water-tube for 5HP.  Scrapped that one too as it was a prototype.  Still have not got round to the third one, need a mill to do some of the cuts for the welds.


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## sawyer massey

Richard Hed said:


> I designed and built one like that but I didn't like it's design so I scrapped it and built a water-tube for 5HP.  Scrapped that one too as it was a prototype.  Still have not got round to the third one, need a mill to do some of the cuts for the welds.


Mill does save a lot of grinding


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## Richard Hed

sawyer massey said:


> Mill does save a lot of grinding


In this case, the mill is a necessity to make regular holes, about 250 holes, which pipe ends fit into and are welded.--the holes are nice fits.  My prototype, I cut the holes out with a plasma arc--very sloppy ultimately bad welds, one with a pin hole that I could not get out no matter how I tried.  The steam generator, was, however, a success.  Reached 100 psi in about 15 min.  The next one will be the same design with a few tweeks.


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## sawyer massey

Making some progress......on small clearance issue


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## sawyer massey

Cast the door and door ring today


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## sawyer massey

Oh yes lol the castings


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## sawyer massey

And they are on the boiler ..still some cleanup to do


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## johnmcc69

Nice work!
 How did you make such a detailed pattern for the smokebox door? It looks great!

 john


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## sawyer massey

The lion's head was a door knocker
The letters are mirror image 3/8 stamps into .010 brass
With a hard plastic under .....  Anealed the brass 2
The lion's head holds them in place


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## sawyer massey

Plugging away .......waiting for tubes for the boiler in the meantime I did the front axel support and axel castings


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## sawyer massey

Bit more done tonight ..... wheel's will slow me down ......and should do some yard work lol


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## sawyer massey

The full size one


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## sawyer massey

Piping next ....still waiting for tubes so pipe it disassemble it put in the tubes ........2steps forward one back lol


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## MIKE4444

Hi i am looking for Full Plans for the Stephenson  Rocket,   steam  engine,     very interested in building this engine, scale does not matter ,Willing  to pay for them, but must be complete.        many thanks 
MICHAEL


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## sawyer massey

Tubes are here lol that's this week hydro by the weekend if all goes well


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## sawyer massey

Hydrode held for 30minutes.  Only can run 100 lb in Ontario on model boilers


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## deverett

MIKE4444 said:


> Hi i am looking for Full Plans for the Stephenson  Rocket,   steam  engine,     very interested in building this engine, scale does not matter ,Willing  to pay for them, but must be complete.        many thanks
> MICHAEL


You might like to try the National Railway Museum, York as a first port of call.
Email [email protected]. 
Home page  Home | National Railway Museum

Dave
The Emerald Isle


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## chrsbrbnk

If you run it in Minnesota or Iowa  or Missouri ( lots of shows and lots of models) you could have a second safety valve  for say 150 or so.


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## sawyer massey




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## johnmcc69

VERY nice work!

 John


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## sawyer massey

Not steam yet but closer


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## GreenTwin

Your build is coming along very nicely.
It took me quite a few years to get the iron thing worked out.
There are some tricks to getting clean machinable iron with no hard spots or voids.

Great work !
.


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## sawyer massey

I find it is alot to do with what you are using for scrap electrick
Motor cast is what I use never have hard spots any more before that it was a shot in the dark


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## Mike N

I just spotted this build, it is very impressive.  It's fun to see how others find clever ways to machine castings.  You are certainly a master at your craft!


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## swarf

Todd,

You a machinist by trade?


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## GreenTwin

The welding on this project is impressive too.
Welding is an art, and while I have done a lot of it, I would really need to take a class in order to do Code welding.

.


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## swarf

Shield time is everything with welding. If your stick welding, remember L.A.S.H.T.
L = arc length
A = electrode angle
S = travel speed
H = amperage (heat)
T = technique 
If all else is as it's suppose to be (bevel angle, root opening, landing size, material type etc) chances are it will be one or more of those key points.


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## sawyer massey

swarf said:


> Todd,
> 
> You a machinist by trade?


Yes my trade is a machinist helps alot lol


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## sawyer massey

Levers finished 100 lb of air in the boiler


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## swarf

TEACH ME lol.


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## sawyer massey

Bit more finished


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## sawyer massey

On all four lol


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## sawyer massey

Not a traction engine yet but not bad for first time on steam


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## sawyer massey

bit better video


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## johnmcc69

Very nice!
 I love the sound of it when you put a load on the engine! A beautiful thing...

 John


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## LorenOtto

sawyer massey said:


> bit better video



How about a video of the sawmill?


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## sawyer massey

Next steam up for you


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## sawyer massey

the saw mill is run by my other engine last year .....but it shows the mill 
Enjoy


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## LorenOtto

sawyer massey said:


> the saw mill is run by my other engine last year .....but it shows the mill
> Enjoy



Thank you for sharing the video.  I especially enjoyed the small sawmill powered by an actual Steam Traction Engine.  What is the sawmill modeled after; Frick?  I built a 1/4 scale American from castings and plans developed by master modeler Dirk Petersen, now deceased.  I have enjoyed showing it at many shows here in the Northwest.  But I have had the opportunity to power it with a model steam tractor.  Maybe someday.  Good show.


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## sawyer massey

LorenOtto said:


> Thank you for sharing the video.  I especially enjoyed the small sawmill powered by an actual Steam Traction Engine.  What is the sawmill modeled after; Frick?  I built a 1/4 scale American from castings and plans developed by master modeler Dirk Petersen, now deceased.  I have enjoyed showing it at many shows here in the Northwest.  But I have had the opportunity to power it with a model steam tractor.  Maybe someday.  Good show.


Not to sure it was built by a man named Harold Lunny many years ago 1972 I think


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## sawyer massey

The proper casting for the flywheel side is on now
And a start at the wheel mounts 
And today's pour for one of the six others 
Thanks
Todd


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## sawyer massey

Engines #3&4 are underway ......the bearing bore and Babbitt should take care of the blow hole


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## Richard Hed

sawyer massey said:


> Engines #3&4 are underway ......the bearing bore and Babbitt should take care of the blow hole


This is very interesting.  Yeah, that blow hole looks awful, but your solution sounds OK.  I can hardly wait to see more photos.  Can you film your processes?


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## sawyer massey

I can film .....but when I do the last one I plan on doing it on a  move by move .....should have the easiest way to do it by then


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## sawyer massey

Today pour all the smalls for engine #4 and the flywheel for #3
That will be it for a while back to pattern making for the drive train


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## sawyer massey

Moving along .....lock down in Canada again


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## sawyer massey

Pinions and bull gear 
The differential pattern .....will try to pour it this weekend


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## sawyer massey

Differential pattern so far


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## johnmcc69

There has to be a lot of work in those patterns, Good luck with the pour. Though you may not need it, your other castings look pretty darn good.

 John


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## sawyer massey

Got board so slopped some paint on it lol


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## sawyer massey

Pinon gear .bull gear and side mounts are finished .......on to the wheels


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## sawyer massey

Poured the countershaft bearing housing today 
Snowing but not to bad  foundry is outside when I pour


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## sawyer massey

Bit of time in the shop tonight.....finish them on the weekend I hope


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## sawyer massey

Slow but steady ...it will get finished lol


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## sawyer massey

Finley got up the nerve to try the differential gear...... looking good so far ...still hot 
Happy new year


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## sawyer massey

Well that will work as you can see one of the inner spikes is full .....new that before we poured it .....
But paired it to the ones that are finished
Bull gear and pinion at the right center distance.
Went round no trouble .
Now to finish the guts for it .....need 30 hr days lol


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## sawyer massey

Round and round ....noisey but it works ....a little quieter if I load it like it would be... ithttps://youtube.com/shorts/WKUYrwIpOzU?feature=share


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## sawyer massey

sawyer massey said:


> Round and round ....noisey but it works ....a little quieter if I load it like it would be... ithttps://youtube.com/shorts/WKUYrwIpOzU?feature=share


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