# Stealing Whole Posts



## Blogwitch (Nov 20, 2011)

It seems that this is starting to get a well established thing to do nowadays. It first started off on far eastern sites, now it seems to have got a lot closer to home.

I have been reliably informed that one sites owner has blatantly lifted one of my posts about how to make a tramming tool from the Madmodder site and dropped it directly onto his site, most probably because he doesn't have anyone on board that can write about anything interesting.

I have no issues with people linking to my posts, in fact I do it myself because it is a lot of trouble to duplicate posts on two different sites because it has to be tailored to the members on each site.

No one ever contacted me about if they could copy the post directly. 

So be warned, this chap looks to be a post thief.

The site and person in question.

A chap called Nelson, and the site, http://www.***************.com/

I was a member of that site for about a week, and once I realised how bad it was, I couldn't get off there fast enough.

If I had his email address, I would do a bit of threatening.


John


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## Foozer (Nov 20, 2011)

Their Front Page states

"We are in the process of adding content to each section."

Shall leave the semantic of interpretation alone

Least they (he) did begin the post of subject with a link to the original from MadModder

Robert


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## Blogwitch (Nov 20, 2011)

Thank you Robert.

Have you a direct link to the post he stole on his website?


It is about time people like this were stopped dead in their tracks.


John


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## spuddevans (Nov 20, 2011)

Bogstandard  said:
			
		

> Have you a direct link to the post he stole on his website?



Just found it, http://www.***************.com/showthread.php?3953-Milling-machine-Tram-Tool-by-Bogstandard


Tim


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## Blogwitch (Nov 20, 2011)

Thanks Tim,

Now I have the damning evidence, I can now take him apart, bit by thieving bit.


John


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## AlfJones (Nov 20, 2011)

If it's any consolation, it's a very good post.... :-\


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## pcw (Nov 20, 2011)

title of thread sais: Milling machine Tram Tool by Bogstandard 

did they rectify it? i mean he doesnt take credit for it now but gives it to bogstandard
pascal


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## Blogwitch (Nov 20, 2011)

Pascal,

I made that post when over on Madmodders. He could easily have linked to the article, but no, he stole the whole lot and put it onto his site, without even asking me if I minded. It doesn't matter if he attributed it to me or not, it is not an underhand thing we want to encourage.

That is why a few more of us are starting to use more watermarking in our pictures, as this sort of thing is starting to happen too frequently

I have already contacted him about it, but no reply as of yet.

How many other peoples' posts has he stolen in an attempt to make his slipshod website look like it is being frequented by more experienced people?


John


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## bearcar1 (Nov 20, 2011)

There is also the entire build sequence thread of Arnold's Coomber engine. There is no direct plagiarism of it having been built by anyone else but him, but then again, other than his name being listed, no other reference is used. A clear case of drag-and-drop piracy with subtle nuances added for effect. The complete article seems to have been posted this past Friday (11/18). I agree about having such fine work "stolen" and posted on other sites without direct permission of the originator should be eliminated. 

BC1
Jim


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## Foozer (Nov 20, 2011)

bearcar1  said:
			
		

> There is also the entire build sequence thread of Arnold's Coomber engine.



Arnold appears to be a member of that site and by the look of the replies to the post there I would say it was Arnold himself that posted the original. 

In the tramming tool question the post did carry a link to the original post. Perhaps a hazy citing of the source, but not a plagiarism. 

So long as the source is listed these public post are available to everyone. To what level a reprint without permission extends is a question of is the battle really worth the fight.

I could tell the post, both, were either sourced or provided by the original author and now I'll shut up and drink my coffee afore the hole I dig for myself gets any deeper.

Robert


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## bearcar1 (Nov 20, 2011)

Well, yes, I see that now Fooz'. I had to go back twice to the site and make an attempt at finding out who the members were. The members list is rather obscure and not labeled as such. Anyway, our friend Arnold 'may' have posted his build to that site. If he has then I be bad. :-[ :hDe:

BC1
Jim





witches I tell you!!! witches they are!!!
(nevermind)


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## Blogwitch (Nov 20, 2011)

Jim,

I can't comment on Arnold's post, only mine. Arnold might be a genuine member on there and just contributing as he does on a few sites.

This is a partial part of the email that I sent to him. The rest was my personal writings to tell him what I am about to do if he didn't remove the post.



> Nelson,
> 
> Could you please tell me the meaning of this post on your website
> 
> ...




This is his reply




> There is both a link acknowledging where it came from and an acknowledgement of the author.
> 
> 
> Please do not contact me again.
> ...




So it looks like he seems to think that every post on the net, including offerings from every member of this site, is fair game to be just picked up and posted onto his site.

Methinks it is now time to open up his dealings to other sites as well, just to see if they like the idea of someone stealing their posts.


John


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## steamer (Nov 20, 2011)

Wow....friendly sort aint he.

Is he making money from the adds...I have to wonder?

Dave


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## spuddevans (Nov 20, 2011)

Foozer  said:
			
		

> In the tramming tool question the post did carry a link to the original post. Perhaps a hazy citing of the source, but not a plagiarism.
> 
> So long as the source is listed these public post are available to everyone. To what level a reprint without permission extends is a question of is the battle really worth the fight.
> 
> I could tell the post, both, were either sourced or provided by the original author and now I'll shut up and drink my coffee afore the hole I dig for myself gets any deeper.



It was interesting to note that when the post was 1st put up, there was only a link to the thread on Madmodder, and no reference to who had actually written the post. There have since been a number of edits.

One thing that is quite worrying is that it would appear that someone has copied the pictures to host them on their forum, ( I say appear because only members can see the attached images ). Surely this is a blatent infringement of copyright, even theft?? of Bogs intellectual property, ie his pictures. That is assuming that Bogs hasn't given his permission for them to be copied/used in this way?


Tim


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## Blogwitch (Nov 20, 2011)

Tim & everyone else,

I have been approached many times for people to display my offerings on their websites and blogs, and in all but one case, I gave them my wholehearted permission.

I am a great believer in sharing knowledge, but the underhand way he has done this has really upset me. I thought that people who run websites were to my way of thinking, not as he thinks he is, above the laws of decency and fair play.

Thanks to all for your comments and help

John


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## steamer (Nov 20, 2011)

spuddevans  said:
			
		

> It was interesting to note that when the post was 1st put up, there was only a link to the thread on Madmodder, and no reference to who had actually written the post. There have since been a number of edits.
> 
> One thing that is quite worrying is that it would appear that someone has copied the pictures to host them on their forum, ( I say appear because only members can see the attached images ). Surely this is a blatent infringement of copyright, even theft?? of Bogs intellectual property, ie his pictures. That is assuming that Bogs hasn't given his permission for them to be copied/used in this way?
> 
> Tim



Hey Tim

He's edited the thread from this morning. All the pictures were visible to me then...and I'm not a member.  The pictures are not visible now and there is a wise ass comment in it's place

Check for your self..
Dave


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## mu38&Bg# (Nov 20, 2011)

Generally forums require you to relinquish copyright of anything you post to the forum. Most of the other forums I belong are very clear about this. This protects their ad revenue streams.

I know HMEM was setup without the idea of making money on the forum, but it also seems that they aren't protecting themselves from plagiarism, I found nothing about about terms of service. In general in the US anything you publish has copyright. Here, you're putting it in a public place with no specific ownership or usage rights declared. it might be open game for what is happening. I'm not sure how public forums play into this. HMEM should look into this. Madmodder.net also has no specific terms of service, but they are registered in the UK?

I know that the forum owners here are trying to keep things simple, but a few standard disclaimers and notices might give them some power to fight this sort of thing. Without ad revenue to protect, getting lawyers involved is unlikely, but sometimes all it takes is a firm letter.

Greg


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## Tin Falcon (Nov 20, 2011)

HMEM copyright policy here.
http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/index.php?topic=4355.0
Tin


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## mu38&Bg# (Nov 20, 2011)

Ok, so it leaves the poster to fend for themselves.

Greg


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## spuddevans (Nov 20, 2011)

I thought it did ???



> To all Members of this forum:
> 
> This plans section and this forum is not a place to exchange copy written material that has been published or authored by others.
> 
> ...



Tim


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## Blogwitch (Nov 20, 2011)

No need to worry my friends, it looks like he has closed down his site. Even Rick got onto him in the end. 

http://www.***************.com/content.php

It does go to show that if people stick together and complain, bad practices such as this can be stamped out.

BTW,are the ways he acted in keeping with his profession.

http://www.jdsupra.com/profile/NelsonTimken/

Here in the UK, where I live, they are called leeches.

Many thanks for listening


John


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## Jeremy_BP (Nov 20, 2011)

My, that was over rather quickly. I'm glad too, things like that are not only irritating, but certainly don't leave me with the best taste in my mouth.
I really enjoy websites like this, where I can share and get feedback on my own projects, and learn massive amounts from others. Events like this only serve to drive people away and harm the overall effectiveness of this medium as a whole. Fortunately, this seems to be done with.
Let the model building resume!


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## arnoldb (Nov 20, 2011)

Gents

For the record, I did post a couple of items on ***************. The Coomber build in the forum as a build in progress, and posted by me. The one on the home page was copied from there - not by me.

Nelson did ask my permission a while ago to use some of my posts, which I granted, on condition that it would not violate any copyright laws. I offered to rather re-post in my own time some of my older bits; which I would have much preferred.

My tooling odds 'n ends thread was copied as-is from HMEM and modified on the first page with only a couple of the initial lines changed - not by myself; this I am NOT comfortable with, but it appears to be removed from the H-M site now.

I will not continue to be a member on that site; there has now been too many "inconsistencies" - and I am really not interested in getting into online dung flinging wars. Between John's post and now, that site was shut down, and then re-opened again...

BC1 Jim, no my friend, you're not bad - thank you for looking out for me :bow:

Regards, Arnold


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## rake60 (Nov 20, 2011)

I had posted here but my legal advice suggested I remove the post.

While the reuse of material posted on web sites is unethical it is *not* illegal.

All we can do is hope other site owners will be ethical.
Most are but some are not.

Again, they are breaking no laws!
They can copy anything they want to and there really isn't much that can be done about
it in a legal account. 

Let's hope they are an exception to the rule and in a normal arena the posts made on
a web site will not be legally stolen by anyone else.

Rick Kerr
(rake60)


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## dsquire (Nov 20, 2011)

Rick

I just noticed your new tag line. Kind of cute. Do the lathe's pay any attention to it? :big: :big: :big:

Cheers 

Don


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## rake60 (Nov 20, 2011)

dsquire  said:
			
		

> Rick
> 
> I just noticed your new tag line. Kind of cute. Do the lathe's pay any attention to it? :big: :big: :big:
> 
> ...



The lathe has been doing better since I made *THAT* public! LOL

Rick


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## steamer (Nov 20, 2011)

Bogstandard  said:
			
		

> No need to worry my friends, it looks like he has closed down his site. Even Rick got onto him in the end.
> 
> http://www.***************.com/content.php
> 
> ...



I was thinking perhaps more like a rat like substance...though not good enough to be a real rat mind you...

Dave


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## dwentz (Nov 20, 2011)

I am not sure what is going on with that site, but it seems that they are lifting content from many of the other machinist related sites, there has been related post stolen from Practical Machinists and Mad Modder, that I have seen. I would guess that they are trying to build their site in the hopes that they can sell more ads.


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