# silly, but real, plan requests for pump...operated by cats



## drysdam (Apr 24, 2013)

We got this crazy cat a few months ago that will only drink running water. And that cat trained the OTHER cat to prefer the same. So now I'm constantly finding running faucets when a child has watered the cats and then left it going.

I know you can get cat fountains, but:



 I don't want an unsightly cord at the cat feeding area (replacing batteries is just as bad)
 I'm always nervous about electrically powered water devices, especially where we are always going to trip on it, cats are going to bite it, kids are going to play with it, etc
 energy efficiency and self-sufficiency!
 why buy when you can make?
 
I'm envisioning some kind of treadle pump that a cat could operate. Paw down, water comes out. But I've never made a pump and I have no idea how to estimate some of the forces and volumes involved. Plus there are many types of pump (displacement vs suction, etc). So far, I think the following requirements apply to the cats:


 low force: I don't know how hard a cat can reasonably be expected to press, but probably not more than a pound I'd guess
fast payoff: there's no way I'll be able to train a cat to pump for several cycles to get rewarded by water. Water should start coming out in one or two presses of the lever.
low flow rate: they are satisfied with very low flow rates. maybe a cup/minute?
  these apply to me:


 I have a 10" lathe and a benchtop mill that would probably fit a cat onto the table. (maybe machining a nozzle and water tank onto the cat would be a better solution.)
I've been machining for about a year
I have 100% imperial tools and no digital anything (conversion is not a mathematical difficulty but with no metric drill bits, taps, etc, it can present other problems)
Any ideas?


----------



## ConductorX (Apr 24, 2013)

I love the project idea.  I am trying to figure out some useful work my cats could do.

Perhaps a faucet like they use in public restrooms that you turn on and then slowly turns itself off, until you build the cat-pump of course.

Please keep your cats away from mine.  My cats don't drink much, they eat only canned food.  I use a one gallon automatic water dispenser.  (gravity feed)

Good luck with your project!
"G"


----------



## drysdam (Apr 24, 2013)

I had a gravity feed thing going on (two liter bottle in a pan), but without the daily attention of the water bowl it gets dirty.

Actually, any cat water pump is going to have the same problem, which reminds me of another requirement:


It should be fed from a bowl, not an enclosed reservoir, to facilitate cleaning


----------



## n4zou (Apr 24, 2013)

This may be the answer to your problem.

Arduino Cat Faucet  
http://squarism.com/2011/03/09/arduino-cat-faucet-with-mongodb-and-rails/

If I built something like this I would have used a solenoid operated valve and a separate spout similar to to the ones we humans use in water fountains.


----------



## Noitoen (Apr 24, 2013)

You could use a stainless vessel, fill it with water, pressurize it with a bicycle pump or similar, and when the cat operates the spring loaded lever on the valve, the water would pour with some pressure. You could also use those fertilizer dispensing containers that operate in the same manner, just add the valve. If the container is dark, it wont spoil the water so cleaning will be easy.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B000TAWBBC/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20


----------



## Paulsv (Apr 24, 2013)

I think I'd just put out a bowl of water, and when they get thirsty enough, they'll drink from it.


----------



## drysdam (Apr 24, 2013)

None of these solutions are resulting in time in the machine shop making a hilarious, but useful, device. That's the primary goal here, naturally.


----------



## ConductorX (Apr 24, 2013)

drysdam said:


> None of these solutions are resulting in time in the machine shop making a hilarious, but useful, device. That's the primary goal here, naturally.


 
I am very new to machining metals to make cool stuff.  I am not really an engineer even though I play one on the internet.  I am curious also to see how this pans out.  

"G"


----------



## drysdam (Apr 24, 2013)

Actually, your "slow off faucet" idea is a pretty good one. But it would still require an external power source. I think the cats can have ONE job around the house.


----------



## ConductorX (Apr 24, 2013)

drysdam said:


> Actually, your "slow off faucet" idea is a pretty good one. But it would still require an external power source. I think the cats can have ONE job around the house.


 
Your post complained that the kids leave the water on.  The slow faucet would let them "water" the cats without worrying if they left the water on.

"G"


----------



## drysdam (Apr 24, 2013)

Well yes, but plumbing isn't fun. But I could use that concept for the cat waterer as well. It would solve the problem of keeping the cat pumping. 

I had been thinking it could be a thing where the paw press immediately releases some water and also starts a flywheel to keep the water going for a bit so they don't have to drink and pump at the same time. But some sort of (mechanically) timed open dwell period would also work. But the water needs to get up to the reservoir somehow.

In fact, I think that dooms the dwell idea. The cats aren't going to go over there and pump their water up for later. The pumping needs to be intrinsic to the drinking.

I guess I should make a simple suction pump and just see how well it works, then iterate.


----------



## Wagon173 (Apr 24, 2013)

What about a spring loaded billow pump with a plank long enough for the cats weight to be enough levorage to force the water out the nozzle. Then you wouldn't need any pressure vessel and the water that drains out could drain right back into the holding tank.  
Or you could build some device that shocks your kids everytime they turn on the faucet for the cat and let the cat drink from the toilet like mine does lol


----------



## BronxFigs (Apr 24, 2013)

Many, many, times, not so long ago, I thought that dog and cat owners needed to have their heads examined, and that a good psychiatrist could probably help them out.  Then...I got a dog.  Now, I understand, perfectly, the whole water-pump/faucet thing.  I'm still smiling...but, I understand.

Good luck with the quest for a self-watering system for the cats.

Frank


----------



## Brian Rupnow (Apr 24, 2013)

I've had experience with fresh water and cats---and probably not what you're thinking!!!


----------



## Brian Rupnow (Apr 24, 2013)

How about a pressure sensitive pad or a set of light curtains, even a photo cell so that when the cat walks into a "drinking area" an electronic signal is sent to a preset timer, which turns on the water valve for 3 minutes, then shuts off when the timer times out and can't be restarted untill the cat leaves the area (thus creating a second signal) and then re-enters it before the system will work again. Hell, you can buy those components off the shelf.---All it takes is money.


----------



## jwcnc1911 (Apr 24, 2013)

It's funny you mention this.  I was thinking about small pumps all week.  We needed a very small pump at work for lube.  I'll show you what I was thinking.  You could probably run it with a small treadly but you usually have to whack the flywheel on a treadle before pressing it.  Maybe a 2 finger treadle?  I've been drawing it up all week... give me a day or so.  This kind of encourages me to get on it as I really love making things that make people ask:  "why?"


----------



## Mosey (Apr 24, 2013)

Obviously some of you are cat-challenged. Mine will only drink from the running faucet when we  turn it on for her, and then only when she asks. This can be several times within 15 minutes. Talk to her first, before you build something only to be rejected. Ask how I know.
She wouldn't come near a contraption she had to work for. And if it made a sound, you wouldn't see her for 3 days.
Mosey


----------



## jwcnc1911 (Apr 24, 2013)

I got a .22 you can borrow!


----------



## Anko (Apr 24, 2013)

jaja this is a very funny topic

dam cats, mine drink water for every place on the house or yard, but not from his water dish...

For your project the first thing to come in my mind is a "finger engine", something that the cat can press and make a flywheel to move and activate a water pump, but I dont think that a cat can understand and catch the rhythm of the turning of the flywheel, at least, no without severe months of training.








here is my idea, a simple foot switch activates a tiny valve that let the water flows from a open compartiment, at the same time the footswutch makes an electrical contac thats drive a small electric motor, this motor accionates a steam engine and water pump model attached to the main structure, making the effect that when the cats press the switch, the steam engine feeds the water pump making the water fall out.

just an idea...


----------



## drysdam (Apr 25, 2013)

> Mine will only drink from the running faucet when we  turn it on for her, and then only when she asks.


This is a very good point. Sometimes our cat will be in the sink meowing so I turn on the faucet and he just looks at it and me like "what are you DOING?" I guess he wasn't thirsty that time.

I love the drawing of the cat pedal fountain and that would probably be the most practical solution. But I think the hilarity factor from a purely mechanical, cat-*powered* solution makes it worthwhile for me to keep thinking.

Someone above made the good point about the flywheel being locked and needing timing the cat isn't likely to be able to provide. Maybe I should dump the flywheel and go with a spring return.  I did a little reading yesterday and this seems simple enough:






(image credit: Wikipedia Commons)

I can even make it look like a regular handpump, but with a handle suitable for a cat's paw. (Did I mention this is a polydactyl cat, so I need to make the pedal even larger.) The force requirement is easy to adjust by making the lever longer or shorter. And if the intake "bulb" is large compared to the volume of the tube, it might deliver water with only a single press.

I made a stupid little check valve last night which gave me enough experience to know how to make a much better, smaller profile one next time. With two of those, a tube, a spring and a shaft I think I'll have a start on a prototype...


----------



## ConductorX (Apr 25, 2013)

My wife loves her two cats.  She has been on thier staff for over 10 years.  They have never been free to roam the neighborhood.  She had an elaborate cat enclosure built for them at her home in Long Beach.  When she decided to marry me and move to Louisiana I had to come up with an enclosure to keep them contained but still provide an outdoor experience.  They have a yard now 30' x 60' with a containment system I devised from looking at other similar systems.  They have not discovered a way out yet.  

Wire enclosure we call the Kitty Kat Koncentration Kamp:










"G"


----------



## Hopefuldave (Apr 25, 2013)

Hmm...
In the interest of maximising shop time, power a pump with a cat treadmill? Something like a mini running machine, belt roller geared to a nice stainless steel double piston pump, with the outlet just above head height so they have to walk up the belt to reach it, a nice flying-ball governor to control the belt speed, with a powerplant cooling fan aimed at the cat...

Daft enough?

Dave H. (the other one)


----------



## drysdam (Apr 25, 2013)

Hey, I came up with that concept the other day too! I didn't know anyone had actually done it.


----------



## rodw (Apr 29, 2013)

Hopefuldave said:


> Hmm...
> In the interest of maximising shop time, power a pump with a cat treadmill? Something like a mini running machine, belt roller geared to a nice stainless steel double piston pump, with the outlet just above head height so they have to walk up the belt to reach it, a nice flying-ball governor to control the belt speed, with a powerplant cooling fan aimed at the cat...
> 
> Daft enough?
> ...



I think Dave is on the right track.You need to carefully construct a precision low friction ferris wheel for mice. Use the ferris wheel to drive a pump. Teach the cat to chase mice and it will get a drink at the same time.

It is amazing how fussy cats can be. A neighbour of ours once had a Siamese cat who would only eat rabbit. Rabbits were not plentiful in the area so they were forever scouring their 60,000 acre property with rifle in hand to feed their cat....


----------



## Swifty (Apr 30, 2013)

We have similar fences around wildlife reserves to keep out feral cats. They use more of a curved top instead of straight bends. And for some reason they have 3 strands of electrified wire as well, maybe that's to keep out the 2 leged ferals.

Paul.


----------



## ConductorX (Apr 30, 2013)

Swifty said:


> We have similar fences around wildlife reserves to keep out feral cats. They use more of a curved top instead of straight bends. And for some reason they have 3 strands of electrified wire as well, maybe that's to keep out the 2 leged ferals.
> 
> Paul.


 
Sorry to get off topic.  My fence was designed to keep the cats in.  I am afraid that if a feral cat got in it would not be able to exit.  Plus my dog occupies half of that yard as well.

"G"


----------



## Mattkguns (Apr 30, 2013)

Here's an idea for the flywheel operated pump. Use a rack and pinion with a one way bearing. Simple, easy to tune with different levers and pinion sizes, and potentially silent.

-Matt


----------



## walnotr (Apr 30, 2013)

What comes to my mind is a a device like a toilet flush system. Once a treadle is pressed, the tank would empty into the bowl and refill until the float turned off the valve. Not quite a cat powered pump but does use hydraulics to operate.  Dogs seem to like water bowls operated in a simular manner.


----------



## drysdam (Apr 30, 2013)

> Here's an idea for the flywheel operated pump. Use a rack and pinion with a one way bearing.



I had an idea like this after I rejected the flywheel. Kind of like one of those kids' tops where you press the handle down to spin it up. It doesn't care how spastically you press or how far, it will speed the top up. 

I actually did succeed in making a "pump" the other night. Two check valves (of my own design, but so simple they presumably already exist) a piston and a cylinder. I just need to get the rest of the mechanics designed.


----------



## kilocharlie (Apr 30, 2013)

My design instincts go along with N4 - use some kind of valve instead of a pump, as it lends itself toward low force, is easily seated by a spring, and could have a lever to the basin that is sensitive to the weight of the spent water, limiting the total water charge allowed to pass through the valve (so the thing does not get left on). A back-and-forth (think teeter-totter) system would work until water got too low to operate.

Use a large, easy-to-clean reservoir, so you don't have to fill it too often.

Excellent design challenge, btw!


----------



## mwilkes (May 1, 2013)

I'd have a small spring-loaded platform, probably with a velvet cushion on it, above a rubber water reservoir of some sort and a couple of check valves. When Cat sits on the platform, water'd be forced through valve 1 up a tube where it'd trickle out into a collecting bowl. Cat may or may not like the taste of rubber. When Cat gets off the platform, the springs would reinflate the reservoir so the water in the collecting bowl would get sucked back in via valve 2.

As an aside, my cat only drinks running water from a bath tap, and usually only if my wife is brushing her hair at the same time. Strange, often hilarious, creatures are cats.


----------



## tk (May 1, 2013)

Perhaps, instead of a pump could you make a valve that is activated by the weight of a cat standing next to the bowl to drink. Then you could have a gravity fed source or the pressurized container Noitoen suggested. In a practical sense I tend to go with Paulsv, but this would be a whimsical device that will provide skills for other projects. Please post it if you decide to build it!


----------

