# Contemplating Grizzly's Horizontal/Vertical milling machine



## willburrrr2003 (Jan 12, 2012)

Hello all, I am contemplating purchasing this machine with my tax return this year... Please give me your opinion on this machine, or even better if you have tried it or own it tell me how you like it. Here is the catalog page from Grizzly http://www.grizzly.com/catalog/2012/Main/550 , the machine is the one at the bottom of the page. It looks like it will do everything I need it to do, and complement my CNC minilathe nicely.

Regards,

  Will R.  Everett, WA.


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## lazylathe (Jan 12, 2012)

Hi Will,

That machine also caught my eye when i was looking through the new catalogue!

Looking through the specs it has a very small cross travel, just over 3 inches.

Since it is a new addition i am not sure if anyone will be able to provide any feedback on it.

It is neat that it can do double duty as a vertical and horizontal mill though.

Good luck in your quest!
Let us know what you decide on!

Andrew


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## ninefinger (Jan 12, 2012)

I saw this discussed on another forum and noted that Grizzly had added it to their lineup. I personally thought that the Y axis travel was just too small but it depends on your own needs. Also when configured as a vertical mill the clearance between the spindle and the work is really small...

You can see a review of it here http://www.mini-lathe.com/mini_mill/reviews/U1/U1.htm

Hope that helps a bit.

Mike


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## shred (Jan 12, 2012)

I think the lack of quill / drilling feed and minimal room in Z will be a nuisance. The concept is an interesting one though.


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## willburrrr2003 (Jan 13, 2012)

Thanks for the responses guys, I read through Mike's link and do find the y cross travel to be smaller than I thought from first glance....I was thinking the z wouldn't be to bad if I used collets with 3/8" endmills and a range of collets for drilling... I could make the collets on my CNC minilathe. It was my intention to CNC the mill so I could drill will the z axis at that point.  I think the Y travel is gonna be the deal-breaker....I need more.  Shame, I loved the vertical mode setup.... it was the most like a knee-mill  and that's what I am looking for a mini knee-mill.....basically like a tabletop bridgeport  


Regards,

   Will R.


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## purpleknif (Jan 18, 2012)

Take a look on E-bay at the mill sold by Big Dog Metalworks. That's the one I got. More X & z travel and an overall heavier machine. I like mine a lot and I'm a full time machinist.


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## Blogwitch (Jan 18, 2012)

What size horizontal arbor has it?

Unless it can accept standard size cutter bores, say 1" or 1.25", then you are going to be making all your own cutters, unless you are going to limit yourself to slitting saws.

These are two basic standard sizes that allow you to buy at very reasonable prices, say off ebay, otherwise specials will start to get very expensive, or as stated, you will be making your own.

John


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## geoff (Jan 19, 2012)

An interesting machine, i thought i had seen it somewhere else, it`s a Sieg SU1 universal mill sold in the U.K. by axminster tools and costing a whopping £984.00 they also do a power feed for it.

Geoff


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## Tin Falcon (Jan 19, 2012)

Nice looking machine . I like the idea of a bench top combo knee mill. 11 7/8 in X so you can slot or surface a long piece. 
they a bit tight in the z almost 5 inches less than the X-2 and a little tight in the Y 
I like the concept though. Could be interesting if one had the time and money to open the envelope a bit.
Tin


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## MachineTom (Jan 21, 2012)

The horizontial aspect appeals to me, but the vertical distance is very small by the look of it. The spec's do not state the distance. If a 3" cutter was on the Hor. spindle, the work height might only be an inich+/-. A speed of 200rpm on a 3" cutter is way fast, fast even for a 2" cutter. Assuming it take's an R-8 in the horz. spindle, that provides for a 1" arbor, but I don't recall seeing supported arbors as short as the one in the photos. 

The lack of geared down low speed I believe kills it use as a Horz mill. With the right gearing a 1/2 motor is fine on a horz mill, but a DC motor slowed to a crawl is not the way to do it.


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## Blogwitch (Jan 21, 2012)

Tom,

Reading about it on suppliers sites, there doesn't seem much info on the arbor diameter, but as far as I could understand it is either 16mm or 20mm, so not a very rigid arbor at all, especially if it is the smaller size. 
I wish I had a 1.125" one on my machine, instead of the 1" it has. Getting as big a bar as possible really beefs it up in the rigidity stakes.

I was buying lots of all sorts of profile cutters (new old stock) in 1" bore size off ebay, and they averaged about 3 UK pounds each. I suppose you could sleeve down the larger bore sizes down to fit the smaller arbor, but I think that would restrict it slightly on how much cutting pressure you could apply.

It looked to be a good all round model engineering machine, then spoiled because of the throat, rigidity and size limitations.


John


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## pete (Jan 21, 2012)

Will,
I've been reading a very few posts about this machine for a week or so. It's very intersting that they thought there was enough of a market to put it into production. I think the Y and Z axis is smaller in distance than it should be. And they really should have designed a proper Z axis spindel downfeed. Accuracy wise? It might be better to set up and adjust a machine like this as a horizontal machine only, As long as you had a vertical mill to use along with it. Most dual usage machines get more than a bit tiresome and real time consuming to switch and adjust functions. 

From what I've read, The horizontal spindle diameter is mostly a non standard size for normal off the shelf blade type horizontal mill tooling, At least for North American tool suppliers anyway. The avalible low RPM horse power is an issue too. Obviously there's shop built solutions and additions around both of those problems.

I'm all in favour of a horizontal mill, And I bought a 1946 Atlas horizontal as an addition to use when it would do a better job than my vertical mill will. Pound for pound and horse power to horse power, A horizontal mill will take and remove far more metal per hour and more accurately than a vertical mill can just due to the spindle being supported at each end. But they each have their own built in negitives. I haven't checked out the larger model of this H/V mill, But it might be the better way to go. Everyone's situation is different though, Your shop may be cost, room and weight limited like mine is.

This is just my opinion and it's worth far less than you paid for it.

Pete


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## kd7fhg (Jan 26, 2012)

I wonder if you could use this as a surface grinder also? I don't have much need to buy a dedicated surface grinder, but for that one job that i come across once in a blue moon.


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## MachineTom (Jan 26, 2012)

With a spindle speed of 2200 the wheel speed would be way to slow for any wheel that would fit in the space available. On a surface grinder the table wheel will move my table 12 inches in 4 turns, that machine take 10 turns for an inch. The ways are designed on a surface grinder to be hidden from the grinding dust as well as possible, on that mill, the Y travel is just a great place to collect dust.


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## kd7fhg (Jan 27, 2012)

MachineTom  said:
			
		

> With a spindle speed of 2200 the wheel speed would be way to slow for any wheel that would fit in the space available. On a surface grinder the table wheel will move my table 12 inches in 4 turns, that machine take 10 turns for an inch. The ways are designed on a surface grinder to be hidden from the grinding dust as well as possible, on that mill, the Y travel is just a great place to collect dust.



Thanks Tom,


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## Mage_AmenRa (Nov 14, 2015)

I bought the SU1 mill and I am considering some modifiations. The Horizontal shaft for holding cutters is a very odd size, sine it is an R8 i am using a milling holder to hold a shaft i am making that will be 1" a more standard size for wheel cutters. I have a lathe so that will allow me to make a new one form harden stok i will aneal, machine then reharden. the solution to the quill function for drilling to me is to make a new holder for the head that is fitted to a dovetail rack assembly. I am uttently looking for one i can purchase and modify to do this. To me without these modifications the use for it is rather limited, however I am excited to use it for gear cutting and worm hogging. My products are in prototype phase and the small mahine will work well for this purpose. once in prodution i plan to step up to CNC.


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## Tin Falcon (Nov 14, 2015)

Here is an interesting mod performed by one of the members here.


2 Sieg Millers Combined







Looks like these are actually showing up in the wild. 
Tn


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## gbritnell (Nov 14, 2015)

About 5-6 years ago Grizzly sold a combination mill but it was much larger with more usable numbers. I was going to buy one but although it was listed in that years catalog it was discontinued. A horizontal is one of those tools that is very handy, once in awhile, but I would rather get a vertical that has good numbers, X-Y travel and most definitely Z or head space. There's nothing more frustrating than having to use special tooling because of the lack of vertical travel.
gbritnell


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## Tin Falcon (Nov 14, 2015)

> nothing more frustrating than having to use special tooling because of the lack of vertical travel.


True  screw machine length  drill bits are pretty much a must for a mini mill or mini lathe. et al
Tin


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## Mage_AmenRa (Nov 20, 2015)

One of my interests is lamps, they are a very sellable item. I plan to build the traveling stage extension to allow deeper drilling. Hopefully the machine will prove rigid enough for deep drilling softer materials like wood etc. I have nearly completely a drawing of the design, and will post soon.


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