# 3cc Diesel - My first ICE



## Maryak (Sep 18, 2008)

Hi all,

I thought I would give record keeping a try as I progress with my current model. Promised myself I would do this with model 1, but failed dismally. This time your feedback and input into the project should, (I hope), keep me on my toes!

Today was a major swarf making day with Aluminium from [email protected]*[email protected]*e to breakfast, (sorry for the spelling for those of you who escaped King Georges clutches), as I started on the crankcase. I must admit - this is crankcase 2 as crankcase 1 went in the bin after I realised my math was up the proverbial creek at a point not to far before where I am now.

The first image is of the crankcase after the initial lathe work is complete and ready for transfer to the mill.







Next is the crankcase in the rotary table ready to mill the flat on which the cylinder sits






The flat is milled






Slotting the clearance slots for the conrod.






Having finished the slots it was time to call it a day. Tomorrow I hope to profile the outside of the crankcase and if that is successful its on to the cylinder if not its back to the scrap yard for more Alu!

Please feel free to offer comments, suggestions, criticisms etc. I will not be offended. Because as with the saddle stop - old dogs can learn new tricks.


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## Bernd (Sep 18, 2008)

I'd say you'er right on track there Maryak. Nice clear pics too. Keep up the good work. :bow:

Bernd


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## Maryak (Sep 19, 2008)

Bern,

Thanks for your input

Alas today I did not seem to have as much success with the close up shots as yesterday, same camera, same operator, hopefully will be better next week.


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## Maryak (Sep 19, 2008)

Crankcase - Day 2

Profiling the angular sides.






Profiling the round underbody.






Phew  finished the machining of the body - now to make the bearing bushes but that's for next week.






This design seems to be very fiddly both with the crankcase and the cylinder, be that as it may it is interesting and challenging. It's not a design where your concentration can afford to lapse as the bigger most expensive bits both in size and time invested in them are the most complicated - well that's what I think so far.


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## wareagle (Sep 19, 2008)

Maryak,

It is looking great! Keep up the good work! 

You are working on what I think is the most critical part of the engine, and that is the crankcase. The reason I believe the crankcase is the most critical?? It is the foundation of the engine, and if things are not true or slightly off, then the engine will not perform well or even at all. _I'm not saying that the other parts are of no importance and that their tolerances are forgiving. Just everything is based on the crankcase._

Question: The snout on your CC is pretty beefy... Are you planning some fun with that or is it the way you are building the engine?

Looking forward to seeing more!!! Watching an engine being built is an inspiration to all, and especially to me as it is very similar to my current project. Seeing your post is really making me want to blow off my day's work and work on bits in the shop for the day!


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## Bernd (Sep 19, 2008)

I'd say you need to get away from the caffeine. :big:

Pics aren't to bad to see what your doing. Just keep up the good work. Like W/E said it's an inspiration.

Bernd


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## Maryak (Sep 19, 2008)

WarEagle,

The original design used a casting for the CC which is ribbed but has a solid core dia of some 5/8".

The bore of the CC is 7/16" fitted with bushes, as designed one is plain and the one inside the chamber is shouldered out to 9/16" to take up axial movement behind the crankshaft web.

I didn't much like the idea of steel on aluminium at the front of the engine so settled on 11/16" OD for the snout, a repeat of the inner bush for the rear giving a 9/16" bearing face for the steel bits which hold on the prop.

Just a thought but are the nut and spline washer steel?

The original drawing shows a combined pulley and flywheel??? so maybe it was designed for a boat. No idea of the material

If I need to reduce the size of the snout I can.


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## Maryak (Sep 19, 2008)

Bernd,

Thanks for your continued input.

After my morning heart starter, (coffee and a fag), I drink tea or water for the rest of the day. Returning home it's cognac and coke, (purely for medicinal purposes of course).


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## wareagle (Sep 19, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> WarEagle,
> 
> The original design used a casting for the CC which is ribbed but has a solid core dia of some 5/8".
> 
> ...



Well, there really isn't a need to reduce the snout diameter if you don't want to. The reason I had asked is were were talking about different ways of building the two Crusaders. One of the things we had considered was to fin the snout parallel to the crank shaft, but we scrapped that idea to save time.

Are you going to use a flywheel on your engine? 

There is a stud from the crankshaft through the prop with a nut that does double duty as a spinner. The crankshaft is steel, the stud is steel, and the nut/spinner is aluminum in the Crusader design. There is also a plate the the prop is sandwiched against that mounts on the crank shaft. In the design we have, there is a .125" shear pin that keeps the prop turning.

The bushing in the Crusader has a significant smaller thrust area than your example. The crank shaft diameter on the Crusader is .500", and it is a press fit into a .625" hole (the snout). The thrust surface is a shoulder at the end of the bushing and if I recall correctly, the diameter of that shoulder is .675". This is as designed by the author of the HSM article. Note: This is not to say that one way is better than the other! Just comparing the designs of the two engines.

I am anxious to see your creation come to life!


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## Maryak (Sep 20, 2008)

WarEagle,

Not only do no fins make it easier to machine the lack of same make it much easier to hold and set up.

Today I had to transport SWMBO to the city and nearby was a model shop claiming all sorts of things about model aircraft, small engine powered cars etc., i.e. a big boys toy shop. Went in, waited a good 10 mins for the guy trying to sell some $1000 dune buggy radio controlled gizmo when finally he looked at me and asked could he help. I said could you please tell me the size prop I need for a 3cc engine, a whole $6-$16 looking in the displays. Looked me up and down thought for a whole 30 secs and said, "Sorry mate haven't a clue!

So that combined with, "Win of the Week," a nice solid piece of rolled brass prompts me to answer yes I reckon I might go for the flywheel and pulley combo.

Thanks for the info re bushes nuts spinners etc. The 3cc Crankshaft dia is 5/16" and the flywheel and pulley combo is 1-1/2" dia and 3/4" axial length.


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## wareagle (Sep 20, 2008)

Maryak,

You might find the information you are looking for on prop sizing *right here*. I have come to determine that if one is in the market for something slightly out of the ordinary, you have to know what you need before you go. Customer service for the most part has become extinct!

I do agree about the fin issue, and that among other things would be the reason it was decided to fore-go the snout fins. Really, unless the snout is too thin, it is nothing more than a cosmetic issue anyway.

W/E


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## Brass_Machine (Sep 20, 2008)

Can't really comment on the prop or snout... but, I will say this: it is off to a good start!

Eric


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## Maryak (Sep 20, 2008)

Eric,

Thanks for the encouraging comment

Bob


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## Maryak (Sep 20, 2008)

War Eagle,

Slow learner, took me a while to figure right here was a link went there and it says 9x4.

Is that 9" dia and 4" pitch.?

Thanks for your patience


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## wareagle (Sep 21, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> War Eagle,
> 
> Slow learner, took me a while to figure right here was a link went there and it says 9x4.
> 
> ...



My apologies on the link. I should have made it a little more clear, or just posted the URL.

The first dimension is the prop diameter, and the second is the pitch. I am 95% sure that the measurements on that link are imperial, though it doesn't say for sure.

You are very welcome!


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## Maryak (Sep 21, 2008)

WarEagle,

Think I'll make a template saying thanks War Eagle, save me a hell of a lot of typing.

Bob


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## wareagle (Sep 21, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> WarEagle,
> 
> Think I'll make a template saying thanks War Eagle, save me a hell of a lot of typing.
> 
> Bob



LOL!!!  :big:

Bob, no need to. That is what this place is about, and right now I am neck deep into a project very similar to yours, so I am easily able to point you in the right _a direction_ that will help keep you going. Many others here have helped me out, and I am just paying it forward. One day, it may be you helping me out through something, or maybe you will be mentoring a newbie machinist! 

That's what makes these forums such a great resource. It's like having a shop full of veteran machinists (and other talents, too) standing over your shoulder giving you advice on the problems you face and methods you use. And which one of us wouldn't benefit from that?!?!?!


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## Maryak (Sep 22, 2008)

Hi All,

Apart from the weather, which was lousy, (right when I needed both doors open), I think I had a reasonably successful morning in the shop. Cleaned up the crankcase and made and fitted the crankshaft bearing bushes.

The crankcase ready for bushing.






Drilling the bushes after machining the major dia.






Parting off the first bush after machining the minor dia and shoulder.






Squaring and sizing the thrust face.






The bushes ready for pressing into the crankcase - Force fit 0.001"






Pressing the back bush into the crank chamber.






Pressing the front bush into the crank snout.






Reaming the bushes after pressing to try to attain best alignment.






Crankcase with bushes in place and to size.






So far so good. Next will be the end cover for the crankcase.


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## CrewCab (Sep 22, 2008)

Really nice work Bob :bow: ............ how far undersized was the minor diameter ....ie, .... much did you leave to ream out 

Looking forward to your progress.

CC ........... aka Dave


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## Maryak (Sep 23, 2008)

Dave AKA Crewcab,

Thanks for your kind words.

The finished ID is 5/16" so I drilled the bushes to 19/64", (closest undersize drill I have), before pressing them in, so the reamer has to remove 0.016" off the diameter.

Bob


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## Maryak (Sep 23, 2008)

Progress Report,

SWMBO had no plans for me today, she and our credit card are recovering from another city trip. I almost managed a full day on the engine but stopped at a point where if I had continued I would still be in the shop. I'm sure you know what I mean.

On with the saga - I managed to make and fit the Crankcase end cover and make a start on the Cylinder.

Slide show follows

After the initial machining - checking the fit of the crankcase on the end cover.







Machining the outer face






The outer face counter bored






Marking out the end cover for the stud holes






Drilling the stud holes






Using the end cover as a template for the stud threads in the crankcase






Tapping the crankcase 6BA and Oh so easy to tear a thread out in Alu!!






Phew the studs are fitted






The crankcase with the end cover in place.






The MS Cylinder chucked and machined down to a known dia, (1-1/4"), - makes it easier to centralise the rectangular cylinder base which sits on the rectangular top of the crankcase.






If I'd kept going I would have wanted to finish the cylinder OD but that tomorrow's job.


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## Bogstandard (Sep 23, 2008)

Bob,

Great post and very informative.

Many thanks

John


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## Maryak (Sep 23, 2008)

John,

Thanks for your continued encouragement, I was just looking at your quickie turbine seems to want to go like hell - 35K rpm!!!!

Must be top class workmanship for it to stay in one piece at those speeds :bow:

Bob


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## Maryak (Sep 24, 2008)

Well, I was hoping to show an almost completed cylinder but it was not to be.

Arrived at my shop bright and early with fully charged batteries in the digicam and coffee and a fag under my belt.

Didn't even get the door unlocked when my mate came rushing up."Thank Ch&&*t your here we have a panic on. There are 3 ISO tanks which need to be on a ship by 2:30 (1430) today and they're out of date. Bureau Veritas want em surveyed yesterday."

We were in such a rush that we arrived without our documentation, "No problem," says my mate, "You keep working and I'll go back and get the docos." Off he went , only problem was the test fitting I needed was in the back of the Jeep and not in the trailer. So another fag and a cup of TEA waiting for his return.

The whole day went pretty much along those lines, although we did make the cut off time for loading.

Hence this is my progress

Cylinder OD ready for a polish up with some crocus and oil.






Hope your day was better than mine.


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## Maryak (Sep 25, 2008)

It's me again,

Managed to spend the morning in the shop on my engine, and I managed to finish the lathe work on the cylinder.

Ready for parting off






Accuracy when parting off are not my strong suits, so I always leave a bit to play with.






Machining the base and spigot






Trial fit on the crankcase






Boring the cylinder slightly, (0.001), undersize to allow for honing.






The cylinder ready for transfer to the mill - the reason it's sticking out of the chuck so far, is to allow all the drilling of ports etc without altering the setup in the chuck.






If all goes according to Hoyle tomorrow, maybe I can start the honing process next week :


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## Maryak (Sep 26, 2008)

Being Friday, (TGIF), (Poets Day) I stopped early and went and had a hair cut, it was that, buy a violin, or enter the sheep dog trials ;D

Things went pretty well; all be it at a much slower pace than I anticipated. I was ever so gentle with my 1/16" slot drill. Speed 1600 rpm, depth of cut 1/64," feed rate approx 3/16" per min. Any advise was I too slow and blunting the tool etc?

Set up for milling the rectangular base






Milling the base






Base wrecked angle complete






Milling the transfer slot






Set up to drill and mill the ports in the barrel






I must say I will be glad when this task is successfully completed - Have a great weekend guys


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## wareagle (Sep 26, 2008)

Maryak,

Your little engine is coming along nicely. I've been watching this unfold and it is inspiring me to put my work work aside and go make some pieces for mine! Might just do that!! :big:

Keep up the great work!


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## Maryak (Sep 26, 2008)

W/E

Thanks for your continued interest. Next week should see the basic cylinder complete. I am pondering which is the best way to finalise this.

There is a snout to be silver soldered onto the inlet port for carby attachment and a cover plate to be soldered over the transfer slot and port. (Not my strongest suit).

I feel that if I get that far, I should make and solder on these bits for 2 reasons:

1. The heat applied particularly with the silver solder may distort the cylinder a little.

2. It seems a bit pointless to do any honing when 1 above may be correct and I may well stuff up the process with both soldering jobs and have to start all over again with the cylinder.

Comments/suggestions?
Bob ???


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## kustomkb (Sep 26, 2008)

great progress pics, and descriptions. work looks great!


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## Maryak (Sep 26, 2008)

Thanks Kustomkb,

I am enjoying both making the model and posting my progress warts and all

Bob


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## wareagle (Sep 26, 2008)

Maryak, I think the silver soldering will be a trick, and I am facing the same issues myself. For a remedy to a potential issue, I think that I will heat the whole thing prior to soldering. My thought is it would reduce the temperature differential and hopefully reduce the warpage from soldering.

I am still thinking about this problem, so if anyone has any other suggestions, I am all ears!!!


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## Maryak (Sep 29, 2008)

W/E,

Thanks for your continued support and positive input to my project.

Regards
Bob ;D


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## Maryak (Sep 29, 2008)

This post is gunna be bigger than Ben Hur by the time I finish the engine  

Today saw the machining of the cylinder completed and the nervous Nellie port cutting under the belt 

The Chariot Race continues.

Sharpening the drills that will be used for the ports - to try for accurate sizing.






Drilling the Inlet Port.






Milling the Transfer Port.






And the Exhaust Ports.






Oh for a Geared Head. 






Set up to Profile the Inlet Port Stub.






Profiling the Inlet Port Stub.






Machining the Inlet Port Stub body.






Test fit of the Stub on the Cylinder.






Drilling and Tapping the Stub.






The Stub and the Cylinder.






Well "That's All Folks" - (for today anyway )


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## Maryak (Sep 30, 2008)

Hi Guys,

A little more progress today but not as much as I would have liked. SWMBO needed transport to the city, (sometimes I wished she'd learn to drive, most times I'm glad she doesn't ).

The beat goes on.

Marking out a Former for the Transfer Cover.






The completed Former.






Small piece of 0.025" steel sheet for the Transfer Cover.






Ready to Form the Transfer Cover.






The inside of the formed Transfer Cover






And the Outside.






Thanks must be given to Ron at: http://www.modelenginenews.org/ - there are some great tips and ideas for the building and running of small IC Engines; some of which I have used to good effect on this project.

The inside of this cover now needs silver soldering, but on checking I found I only have plumbers grade, so as well as the city I went to BOC Gases and bought a stick suitable for steel, (bloody expensive because of the amount of silver it contains ).


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## ksouers (Sep 30, 2008)

Maryak,
I've been watching your build with great interest.
Thank you for such detailed documentation of you project.

Great work indeed.


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## Maryak (Sep 30, 2008)

Ksouers,

Thanks again for your kind words and continued support.  :bow:

Bob


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## CrewCab (Sep 30, 2008)

Bob,
Judging by the number of hits this thread has received in the last week and a half since you started it (858 at the last count) methinks lot's of people are very interested  8) ............... me for sure 

Like Kevin said, thanks for taking the time to document the individual steps and share them :bow:








Oh, and by the way ............. you seem to be slacking a bit today ......  ;D :big: ;D



 CC


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## Twinsquirrel (Sep 30, 2008)

> Oh, and by the way ............. you seem to be slacking a bit today ...... Shocked Grin big laugh Grin
> 
> 
> 
> Wink CC



Ha! I was just thining the same thing!! Seriously though I am learning so much from this thread, not to mention the inspiration...

Thanks Maryak..


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## Maryak (Sep 30, 2008)

Crewcab - Twinsquirrel,

Thanks guys for your support and encouragement.

One of my better decisions was joining this forum, (It's the GREATEST), and the help and support I have received from members just fantastic.

Sorry about slacking off yesterday  :  :-*

Progress seems to be related to confidence and this soldering and metal forming at such a small, (to me), scale is lower down my list. Up until the mill engine and this ICE, I've been a 12" to the foot modeler 

Regards to All
Bob


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## CrewCab (Sep 30, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> Sorry about slacking off yesterday  :  :-*



That's the good thing about a hobby mind ............ you could do that every day if you really wanted ;D

atb Bob, good luck with the small sheet metal work, ............. I know what you mean though, most of my earlier creations have always been at 25.4mm to the inch  .................. errrrr ........... +/- 5% :

CC


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## wareagle (Sep 30, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> Sorry about slacking off yesterday  :  :-*



No worries! We all do it from time to time.



			
				CrewCab  said:
			
		

> That's the good thing about a hobby mind ............ you could do that every day if you really wanted ;D



This is true, but don't let it happen again!! If it does, we'll take it out of your pay! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			















In all seriousness, you'll get there one piece at a time! Just keep going!!!!


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## Maryak (Oct 1, 2008)

W/E,

Thanks again and you'll be pleased to know minimal distortion of the cylinder. ;D 

Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Oct 1, 2008)

Sorry Guys,

Slacked off again today, (or should I say I received strict instructions on where to be and at what time :)

SUCCESS SUCCESS, well at least with the silver soldering - See below.

Making a Locator for the Cylinder Inlet Stub from Aluminium - Why Alu - well because I read somewhere that it doesn't like silver solder and that's what's needed here.






Tapping the Locator for the draw bolt






The Stub and Locator






Test fit of the stub on the cylinder using the locator.






Washing the parts 1-Kero (paraffin for the poms), 2 Thinners, 3 Soap and Water.






The Transfer Cover ready for Silver soldering - Note the sophisticated brazing hearth ;D






The soldered Transfer Cover






The Inlet Stub ready for Silver soldering.






And after,






Checking for cylinder distortion - I'm very pleased to report that things still seem to be within 0.001" 






Shaping the Transfer Cover - Great tools these Dremels 






Test fit of the Transfer Cover on the cylinder using a boilermakers micrometer 8)






Am I glad that 50% of the dreaded soldering saga is over


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## SandyC (Oct 1, 2008)

Hi Maryak,

you are indeed making very good progress, congratulations.

I am sure the project will end up a great success.

One minor point to consider though...... when it comes to silver soldering..... the use of aluminium as a NON-STICK fixing aid is frought with danger.... the typical melting point of ALI is around 660deg C .

I don't know which grade of SILVER SOLDER you are using, however, assuming that you are using something like EasyFlo 2.. 42% silver content + it has 25% cadmium in it's make up, then this melts at around 610 deg C - 620deg C...pretty close to Ali.

If, as I suspect, cadmium based solders are not available in OZ then the nearest equivalent CADMIUM free type SILVERFLO 40 (40% Silver) then this melts at 650deg C - 710degC.

SILVERFLO 24 (24% Silver) melts at 740deg C - 780deg C.

Obviously you have got away with it in this instance, however, I thought it worth warning you of the possible problem.

When you come to solder on the transfer passage I would suggest you fit a RUSTY bolt and nut through the inlet stub just to make sure it does not move when re-heating, and use some soft iron wire, bound round the cylinder to hold the transfer passage in place.
Don't push your luck and try using an ALI clamp or fixture.... I would hate to see all that good work wrecked for the sake of using the wrong method.

Please don't think I am being critical, nothing could be further from the truth, I am just pointing out a possible problem area for you and others who may be following this thread to consider.

Best regards.

SandyC  ;D


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## Maryak (Oct 1, 2008)

SandyC,

Thank you ever so much for your input to my project. Yes it was pretty close as it turned out and yes I did get away with it this time :. and No I won't push my luck in future.

It's always great to learn something new :bow:

The product I used was Prosilver 45 from BOC Gases.

I have read some of your other posts re boilers and a boiler for my mill engine is down the track for me so look out mate because I'll definitely be seeking lots of help with that   

Regards
Bob


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## SERCEFLYER (Oct 1, 2008)

Can I ask something? Is this a published engine design, or is it a homebrew? I am really enjoying this thread-- I love it when someone makes such an effort to detail a build.

George


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## Maryak (Oct 1, 2008)

Serceflyer,

It's a published design from a British Magazine "Model Engineer" April 1947.

I've modified the port locations a little and altered the design of the Carburettor and intake. 

Due to my total lack of experience with these engines, don't know yet if these will be good or bad ???

So far it's been:

1.   A ton of Fun.

2.   An incredible learning experience.

3.   A challenge to my metalworking skills.

4.   A great sharing experience with some very valuable lessons learned from other members of this forum  who are helping and guiding me along the way. 

Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Oct 3, 2008)

After yesterdays fiasco, (see the break room), today saw progress 

EUREKA - The soldering is complete and the transfer cover is on. ;D

A special thanks to SandyC for his advise which made things Oh so much simpler and safer. :bow:

A polishing kit for the Dremel pick up for $30, when you think that each tool with an arbor is $9.75 each, I thought it was good value and will be a great help at the finishing stage.






Preparing the cylinder for soldering on the transfer cover.






And the transfer cover.






Side view of the cylinder with the stub and cover in place.






The other side.






And looking down from the top.






I spent a little time playing with the polishing kit and think I may be able to achieve a reasonable result.

Went on a material hunt to find stuff for the cylinder lap.

Decided to stop and calm down because I was so relieved and excited to have finished the soldering without melting down the cylinder. :fan:

Long week-end here, (Labour Day), so Tuesday should see the lap made and a start on lapping the cylinder.

Avagdweeknd


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## SERCEFLYER (Oct 3, 2008)

I can't wait to see this thing run.

How does the cylinder attach to the head? I don't see any threads at the top of the cylinder.

What sort of lapping compund do you plan on using? Some recommend diamond paste. I've had better luck with a product called "Timesaver." It's a non-embedding compound that breaks down into a polishing compound as it is used up.

George


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## Maryak (Oct 3, 2008)

The design uses through bolts from the top of the head to the crankcase.

Lapping compounds will be

1. Fine grade auto valve lapping compound

2. Dremel paste.

3. Brasso.

Apart from diamond I am open to suggestions to improve on the above.

Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Oct 3, 2008)

Hi Guys,

Help please ??? ???

Attached is a PDF of the carburettor I have designed for this engine.

Will it work ??? ??? :-\

If not please tell me what's wrong.

Thankyou
Bob 

View attachment Carby.pdf


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## rake60 (Oct 3, 2008)

Works fine here Bob!

Rick


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## Maryak (Oct 3, 2008)

Thanks,

I was a bit nervous that I had the venturi in the wrong place

Bob


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## CrewCab (Oct 3, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> Thanks,
> 
> I was a bit nervous that I had the venturi in the wrong place
> 
> Bob



Bob ........... I'm guessing a little here mate .......... so please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong ......... but ..... ??? I have a feeling Rick is telling you the pdf file has uploaded fine, but I feel you are asking for comments on the design .......... mmmmmm this could be a good time to run and hide 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 CC


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## Maryak (Oct 3, 2008)

Wasn't sure myself what Rick meant but yes, I am seeking help/confirmation of the design. ???

Regards
Bob


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## wareagle (Oct 3, 2008)

Bob, the venturi and fuel inlet area are in the same spot with the published design that I have. I will also add that as long as I have been around engines, I haven't seen a design much different than that. I say you are good to go.


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## Maryak (Oct 3, 2008)

W/E,

As usual your prompt and informative reply have set my mind at rest :bow:

Thanks Again!

Bob


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## CrewCab (Oct 3, 2008)

WE is spot on Bob imho :bow: .............. however I do have a query sir 8) .......... are you proposing to form the bell mouth air inlets in a tapered / conical shape as per the drawing .......... and if so ......... how ???

Thanks Bob ......... whatever the outcome, I'm just happy to be along for the ride 

CC


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## Maryak (Oct 3, 2008)

CC,

Yes I'm going to have a go using form tools which I will have to grind up.

Will be a good exercise for my tool bit grinder/end mill sharpener.

Reckon I'll probably start with a hefty piece of brass and make lots of swarf. ;D

Regards
Bob


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## jack404 (Oct 3, 2008)

Bob 

looks ok here mate, as others have said its inline with others that are about, so not reinventing the wheel helps

side question.. did you use to be at the SA maritime museum ( maybe i have the name confused )

regards

Jack


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## Maryak (Oct 3, 2008)

Thanks jack for your support 

No your correct - It's me

I was Fleet Manager, Marine Engineer, repairer restorer and anything nobody else wanted to do, which was most things involving my Spanish mate Manuel Labour.

Retired a year ago, (sort of), sold my yacht and the only boats I play with now are the one's in the bath.  ;D

Regards
Bob


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## rake60 (Oct 3, 2008)

Actually my reply was to say the design looked as if it would work to me.

If you think my typed words are confusing, you should talk to me in person.
Especially if I'm running a machine tool.
I often use words that haven't even been invented yet!  

Rick


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## wareagle (Oct 3, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> sold my yacht and the only boats I play with now are the one's in the bath.  ;D



Please, no video. LOL ;D :big:

Bob, your project is coming along very nicely! Many many cuddos for taking us along on the journey!


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## Maryak (Oct 3, 2008)

Don't worry, the camera would break and I'm a tweezers and magnifying glass kind of guy so your safe. 

And thanks to all for your support 

Bob


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## jack404 (Oct 3, 2008)

No worries Bob

Thank you and to your Mrs for Dinner and the advice 

went to afghanistan not long after that and got a bit banged up while there, in Sydney now and back banging tools about, going to expand on Sterling and Lamina engines now i have the time.

its a small world..

looking forward to see how your final design ends up

cheers eh

jack


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## Maryak (Oct 3, 2008)

Small world 

Go make some swarf :

Hope you get Tatiana here soon  

Bob


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## SERCEFLYER (Oct 4, 2008)

Bob,

Here are the resources I used when making needles and needle valves. I don't have a grinding attachment and did a bad job of gringing a needle free-hand. Just grab a micrometer go to a ladys' sewing shop and ask for darning needles. I found that a #12 needle was .063-- exactly what I needed. Then just solder the needle as needed.

http://modelenginenews.org/techniques/nva.html

http://modelenginenews.org/techniques/needles.html

George,
Seattle


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## Maryak (Oct 4, 2008)

George,

Thanks for the info on needle valves - your not just a pretty face are you - Darning No 12. :bow:

Regards
Bob


----------



## wareagle (Oct 4, 2008)

Now that's a good idea! I will remember that when it comes time for me to build up my carb.


----------



## SERCEFLYER (Oct 5, 2008)

Just make sure to take a micrometer along to make sure you have the right size. It'll be an adventure to find your "darning."

 (yes, you will probably be the only guy in the sewing store!)

George


----------



## Maryak (Oct 7, 2008)

As long as I don't get stitched up while I'm there ;D

Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Oct 7, 2008)

With the long weekend behind me and a release from home duties, back to the shop and engine.

Found an old brass bolt which was de-zincing so useless as a bolt but good enough to make an expanding lap as suggested by LH Sparey in his book 'The Amateurs Lathe"







I'm not trying to teach anyone to suck eggs - but for those starting out in machining. The core of the shop is, (in my opinion), the lathe. Big Bucks   and a simple thing like a chuck board will protect your investment when changing chucks or parting off with a hacksaw. 






Test fit of the cylinder on the lap.






Grooving the lap for abrasive retention.






Drilling the lap half its length for the wedge.






Drilling the slot start and finish holes after transfer to the mill.






Milling the slot between the drilled holes.






The completed Lap with the steel wedge in place.






Progress interruptus - a bore casing from an irrigation bore which needed considerable persuasion to part from the pump. It had been 250ft down for the last 40 years.






Back to the cylinder an attempt to see inside after lapping.






Time now to go and find some cast iron for the piston.

Avag'day
Bob


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## SERCEFLYER (Oct 7, 2008)

Bob,

Looks like you've had an easy time with the lapping. Could you help me understand how the Sparey lap design works? I don't see how that pin or wedge will expand the lap? What am I missing here?

And, did you check to see if your lapping produced a .001 taper from the top of the cylindeer to the bottom? (The top of the the cylinder being smaller to produce a tight "pinch" at top dead center for better compression.)

George


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## SERCEFLYER (Oct 7, 2008)

I like this armchair machining. Make a pot of coffee, read the paper, watch the newborn while SWMBO sleeps in (I'm on paternity leave), and follow along with Bob as he progresses on the little diesel engine. 

Thanks for your efforts!

George


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## Maryak (Oct 7, 2008)

George,

Thanks for your input and support.

Your no orphan when it came to this expanding lap; but Lawrence Sparey was a pioneer in the field of small IC engines so I figured he knows what he's on about.

See the attached PDF for my attempt at explaining the laps expansion ;D

Regards
Bob 

View attachment Lap.pdf


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## SERCEFLYER (Oct 7, 2008)

Thanks, I get it now. So, how do you advance and keep the pin/wedge in place inside the lap? 

I take it that your lapping compounds worked. The inside of the cylinder looks pretty good from here in Seattle.

George


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## wareagle (Oct 8, 2008)

Maryak,

Nice lapping job!  :bow: You are cooking on your little thumper! 

W/E


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## Maryak (Oct 8, 2008)

Thanks W/E and Serceflyer for your kind words about my lapping - NOW Read on :wall:

The day started out with my mate asking how the honing of the cylinder was progressing.

Done! says I. Well gimme a look then? he said. 

I reverently unwrapped the cylinder from its oil soaked rag and handed it to him. :

I hate to say this but there are still some marks in the bore, was his comment. 

Show me! I replied, which he did.

[email protected]#t, youre right, I said, :-[ (along with many other adjectives which vividly describe various bodily functions and activities).

Thus past a couple of hours lapping and polishing to both his and my satisfaction.

I reckon its so smooth now that if you fell inside it you would probably slip into the next world. 






Onto the Main Piston

Obtaining a suitable piece, (well 3 actually), of Cast Iron











Centreing the best bit in the 4 jaw






Drilling through 1/8" - This design has a separate wrist pin dummy piston inside the main piston - held in place with a 1/8" CS bolt.






The main piston ready for counter-boring.






I did not have a suitable boring bar for this job - so make one ;D Rough hack out of a piece of 3/8" HSS with an Angle Grinder, (4" NOT 9", Them's Widow Makers them is), and ready for grinding.











Further progress was deferred whilst I deferred to my better half. :bow:

More tomorrow, (I hope) ;D


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## Maryak (Oct 8, 2008)

To S/F,

George my apologies for not attempting to answer your question :-[

Yes, I had the problem of the wedge slipping back out after tapping it home with a hammer.

My solution was a piece of 1/2" round brass, held in the drill chuck, mounted in the tailstock.

With the lathe stopped and the cylinder on the lap, using the tailstock handwheel, adjust the tailstock, against the wedge until you feel the cylinder begin to bite. Lock the tailstock and lap until all is free running. Repeat as necessary. I had a butchers after 2 adjustments to observe progress and add polish as necessary. Running time at 600rpm was about 2 mins per lap.

Hope this helps ;D

Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Oct 9, 2008)

What is it about Thursdays at the moment ???

Half a day lost to the wineries. :-\

A few headaches here 6 x 26000L tanks waiting to be filled with bulk wine or Ethanol and had to be certified clean dry and free of contamination.






Back to the important things like model engines 

Setup to counter bore the main piston - this must be pretty accurate as the position of the dummy inside it locates the conrod and hence affects the timing. Don't know why I'm worrying already had a play about with the port positions :






The counter bore






Setting the parting off tool to allow a little clean up and sizing of the main piston.






The main piston ready for clean up sizing to length then lapping to the cylinder.






The chunk of cast iron transferred to the 3 jaw for the dummy piston and the contra piston - Why? - because my 4 jaw is to big for my rotary table ;D






The main piston on the dummy piston.






Checking that the dummy piston bottoms fully inside the main piston.






Drilling through No. 38, (1/8" tapping drill) - Ready for transfer to the mill cross drilling for the wrist pin and milling the conrod slot.






That's it for today and don't know how much will be achieved tomorrow.


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## jack404 (Oct 9, 2008)

Bob,
 great work and great pic's 

am learning a lot just watching.

I have a boring bar if you like.

In NSW i cant make pistols ( licencing issues anti gun Nazi types not honouring federal licences etc etc) so this is pretty useless and it will be a few years until i get back to Adelaide where my master smithing ticket stands up

if you want it let me know and it'll toddle its way via austpost its BOW brand and i've got my last new Valenite insert in it ready to go and i have the spanner for it ( i dont think i actually used this one but cant remember i usually use the bigger brother for .40 S&W , my standard size, this one will do .32 and up but have not done a .32 in 15 years and this is only 3 years old)












cheers

jack


----------



## Maryak (Oct 9, 2008)

Jack,

Thanks very much for your generous offer :bow:

I have quite a few boring bars mostly bigger up to 2" dia bar + the tool insert.

Your bar would not help because, I had to face off the back square to the bore, hence the maximum width of tip + bar needed to around 3/16" as its not a through bore

Thanks again but keep your bar for your next barrel.

Regards
Bob


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## Macca (Oct 9, 2008)

Bob,
I have been following this build with great interest, you are doing a fantastic job.
What is the purpose of the main piston/dummy piston arrangement? Is it to allow the main piston to be easily replaced because of wear? Or is it for adjusting the compression?


----------



## Maryak (Oct 9, 2008)

Macca,

Thanks for your support and interest.

Not 100% sure myself but I think the idea is to provide for maximum seal between the piston and the bore as there is no through hole for the wrist pin in the main piston. How this stacks up against a hole in the top of the main piston, where there is max MEP, who knows. ???

I have been pondering how best to seal that little sucker for some time. :

Please guys any suggestions ??? ???

Regards
Bob


----------



## wareagle (Oct 9, 2008)

Bob, how do the pistons fit each other? Do they utilize a sliding fit or is it a press fit? I am trying to figure out the reasoning behind the design myself. The only thing I can come up with is to make the piston in this fashion could theoretically be lighter than out of a single piece of material, but this is a WAG at best.

Your project is coming along nicely! I have no doubt you will have yourself a very nice runner!


----------



## Jones (Oct 9, 2008)

Normally designers use the inner piston to carry the gudgeon pin so it is captive and can't score the sides of the bore or get jammed in the ports.


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## Maryak (Oct 10, 2008)

W/E,

Thanks for your continued interest and support.

In the interests of being able to disassemble/reassemble the engine, without damage to the main piston, I elected for a neat sliding fit,which I managed to fluke ;D

Also re-read the articles in the 1947 magazine which a guy sent me when I was researching and asking questions about small ICE's and this seems to fit with the original approach. In addition the recommendation for sealing the CS bolt in the piston top is plumbers or tinmans solder.

Jones,

Thanks for the information on the whys of this design. Is there a reason why its not threaded and screwed in ??? getting rid of the need for the CS bolt and this soldering business.

Would somebody please enlighten me what is plumbers/tinmans solder - not silver solder by any chance ??? ???


----------



## Maryak (Oct 10, 2008)

Arrived at my shop to find this outside the door with a note from my partner in crime which said ,

"Bob, this came off rail last night, please fix ASAP"

Aaagh, the GENTLE  men of railways, it's not the first and won't be the last. 






ASAP took all morning and some of the afternoon and I was knackered after up and down each end of the tank several times : : Like I said before I'm supposed to be retired, but it's nice to feel wanted ;D

Fixed!!






Hence today's progress Nil, Nothing, Zip, Zilch :'(

Have a great weekend.


----------



## Jones (Oct 10, 2008)

I think the inner piston isn't screwed into the out piston because it could unscrew during running. There is nothing stopping the main piston rotating.

That is a HUGE tank.


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## Maryak (Oct 10, 2008)

Jones,

26000L and you'll see on the side written ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGE  

Why doesn't the little 1/8" CS bolt unscrew? especially if the solder doesn't penetrate all the way through both pistons ???

Regards
Bob


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## Twinsquirrel (Oct 10, 2008)

> 26000L and you'll see on the side written ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGE Shocked Shocked



Enough for 1 Aussie bbq bob? 

David


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## Maryak (Oct 10, 2008)

T/S -Dave

Maybe, as long as not too many guests ;D

Regards Bob


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## Maryak (Oct 13, 2008)

Another week and off to a good start 

The Dummy piston was transferred to the mill

Cross drilling the dummy for the wrist pin.






Set up to mill the conrod slot.






The completed conrod slot.






Tapping the dummy for the wrist pin lock.






The dummy ready for parting off.






Tapping the top of the dummy 1/8" for securing to the main piston.






Trial assembly of the main and dummy pistons.






The contra piston OD complete.






Counterboring the contra piston.






Parting off the contra piston.






The piston parts completed.






Old copper dolly to make the piston lap.






The piston lap ready for boring to a neat fit on the piston.






The sun was over the yardarm so I called it a day


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## Maryak (Oct 14, 2008)

Today saw the piston lap completed, ready for lapping tomorrow

Test fit of the piston in the lap






Set up to mill the lap slots, one all the way through and two half way through.






The milling of the slots completed.






The lap and piston.






The lap with its' adjusting wedge fitted.






After lunch, I made a mandrel on which to mount the pistons, but clever me left the camera at home :

Piccys tomorrow ;D


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## SERCEFLYER (Oct 14, 2008)

Looks like another Sparey lap design! I like it-- you are sticking with the original spirit of the engine.

George


----------



## Maryak (Oct 14, 2008)

George,

You are correct and thanks for your continued support. 

Best Regards
Bob


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## wareagle (Oct 14, 2008)

Bob, it's looking good!


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## Maryak (Oct 14, 2008)

Hi All,

Having read the idiots guide to good lapping, (but not carefully enough - more later). I went to the Tallow Terminal at the Harbour and obtained a couple of samples of tallow for use in the final mating of the piston to the cylinder.






The piston mounted on its' mandrel for lapping.






Charging the lap with fine valve grinding paste using a piece of 3/8" round HSS.






The piston just entering the cylinder.






Time to change to Dremel polishing compound - note the careful lap clean up for change over.






At this point things started to go pear shaped - literally :






As I mentioned earlier I had not read the instructions thoroughly enough and I had things upside down, i.e. the lap was bigger than the piston and it should have been smaller.   Fortunately smaller is easier than bigger ;D






Cleaning up the new improved, (I fervently hoped :-\), piston lap.






All squared away again  but much more due to good luck than good management : and a test fit of the cylinder on the piston using tallow.






Whilst I could not feel it with inside calipers after lapping the cylinder, the fit of the piston revealed that I do in fact have a slight taper in the bore  Again entirely due to good luck this is in the recommended direction, i.e. the cylinder is slightly smaller at the top than the bottom. : : :

Switched the lap to Brasso and had hours of fun getting the piston far enough into the cylinder where it is shown and its pretty tight.






A final mating of piston and cylinder was carried out at slow speed with nothing other than tallow and VOILA, HARASHO, WHOOPEE it's done ;D ;D ;D






After all that excitement I came home to write it all down and relax - leaving the contra piston for tomorrow :big:


----------



## Maryak (Oct 14, 2008)

W/E,

Thanks mate for your continued encouragement :bow: Today was a hit and miss day but the exhaust was closed more than it was open hence more of a hit than a miss. 

Best Regards
Bob


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## NickG (Oct 15, 2008)

So does the piston go all the way up the bore to where it's meant to without binding?

How long did it take to lap the piston like that?!

I am thinking I may have to do this when I make my first IC engine.

Regards,

Nick

ps keep up the good work. I admire people that post their experience and write ups along the way on here, I can barely find time to make anything let alone write it up on here!


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## Maryak (Oct 15, 2008)

NickG,

Thanks for your support and interest 

Yes the piston goes to within 1/4" of the top without binding. ;D

The lapping on its' own took me 4 hours, including fiddling about with the lap and correcting my mistake with the pear shape. Approximately the same amount of time was spent lapping the cylinder and I anticipate at least 2 hours for the contra piston. Say 10 hours all up of just lapping. 

Are you in the unfortunate position of having a job, a large family, an even larger dog which requires walking. Or are you even more unfortunate with time on your hands and trying to live off the pension ??? ???

Regards
Bob


----------



## NickG (Oct 15, 2008)

Bob,

This is a very interesting post for me and I'm sure many others!. Having build a few oscillating engines or wobblers, I remember trying to build a 0.8cc Sparey Diesel when I first started this hobby (I was about 15). Needless to say I didn't get very far!!!

That sounds good, I know from doing various steam engines and recently my hot air engine that it reeps rewards to pay great attention to getting the fit between the cylinder and piston right.

Well, I can't say I'm unfortunate, I'm very lucky really, I have a 2 1/2 year old son and a 3 month old son. However, that and a nagging wife isn't conducive to spending quality time in the garage! I can imagine living off the pension will be difficult these days but some time would be nice. Having said that, I don't know where I wasted the 5 years prior to having kids!

Nick


----------



## Maryak (Oct 15, 2008)

Nick,

Thanks for your reply. I remember those times of a young family. Don't be too hard on Mrs Nick, 2 under 3 makes for a very busy and tired Mum :bow: where a good result is all the nappies off the line and dry ready for re-use. :

From what I have read in the lead up to this project, 3cc is about as small as you should be for a 1st attempt at a model IC engine. Have a look at WarEagles Crusader, as an alternative. He is more than happy to share his knowledge with us all.

Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Oct 15, 2008)

Sorveltaja,

Each to their own, I admire how you are persevering with your engine :bow: and I know how it can be frustrating at times. 

On my steam mill engine, I made 2 cylinders, 4 crankshafts and 3 eccentric straps before I got them right :

It's all part of the fun 

So far Ive only had to make 2 crankcases with this engine, but there is still some way to go :-\ :-\

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## SERCEFLYER (Oct 15, 2008)

Maybe a dumb question: what exactly is Dremel paste? Brasso is a polishing compound, right?

About the contra-piston: make sure it is a tight fit in the top of cylinder. One way is to create a thin-walled (.030 thick) contra-piston with a 1/2 degree outside taper. This causes the walls to compress a bit and create a tight and springy fit.

Just a thought.

George


----------



## Maryak (Oct 16, 2008)

George,

No question is a dumb question, if we don't ask questions we will have trouble finding the answers :bow:

Dremel is a small electric tool which revs through a good range up to 15000 rpm. In the polishing and grinding kit is a small container of polishing paste, a bit like a cutting compound in a heavy duty car polish, (never thought of that until now :).

Brasso is a metal polish mainly for brass, hence the name brasso. Museum curators and those who want a long life from their brass artifacts would kill you if you used brasso, as I found out to my distress when polishing an old binnacle. :-[

I assume you are referring to the David Owen method of making contra pistons ??? Thought I'd give the old way a try 1st and if NBG either in assembly or later, will give it a go.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Oct 16, 2008)

Once more into the fray rode the intrepid lapper ;D

Today saw the finish of the contra piston and a start made on the conrod. I agonised over the choice of material for quite some time  The original called for steel on steel, which was for me a no-no  Then I considered steel with bronze bushes, but short of making both big end and gudgeon smaller, (which I did not want), couldn't see a satisfactory solution. Next I considered bronze, but rejected it, for no explainable reason other than I thought it might fracture ??? ??? ???. Last was aluminium which has been recommended in various other publications as being suitable. In the end I opted for Aluminium :-\

Sizing the contra piston lap.







Sizing the mandrel for the contra piston.






Test fit of CP on mandrel.






Loctite the CP on the mandrel.






Almost there 






The contra piston a nice tight fit in the cylinder.






A little heat to remove the CP from it's mandrel.






Both pistons in the cylinder.






Hacking out a lump of aluminium for the conrod
















That's all for today.


----------



## SERCEFLYER (Oct 16, 2008)

Yes, I was referring to the David Owen method. I love that you are using traditional laps and techniques. 

I will be super impressed if your 1st piston/liner results in a runner. I went through at least 3-4 pistons and liners before I got a first pop!!!

Jumping ahead a bit: do you plan on mixing your own fuel?

George


----------



## Maryak (Oct 17, 2008)

George,

Thanks for your input and continued support. I too will be super impressed if it runs 1st up   

Fuel is a tricky one, due to all the restrictions on chemicals various. I suspect Ethyl Ether could be a problem ???

But will X that bridge when I come to it. I understand it is possible to buy premixed brews from the model aircraft/racing car fraternity, but hey lets get the engine built ;D

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Oct 17, 2008)

Sorry guys waiting for Mrs M's movie to finish downloading - its only been going 7 hours but not enough bandwidth to handle piccys   

Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Oct 17, 2008)

Well, Mrs M's movie finished so I can post today's effort, ;D (that's 2 movies she's downloaded, the first and the last ;D, by mutual agreement of course :).

Slacked off again today and only managed half a day on the model the other half being tanks as my partner in crime is up north in Mintabi at his opal mine, ( a delicate operation involving a D9 bulldozer and gelignite. . I'm about as close as I want to be, (800km South). "Perfectly safe" he says as we are busy stuffing ourselves under the ute to avoid the fall out from one of his efforts 

I digress, back to the engine.

Made a little progress with the conrod and its' machining/supporting jig.

Carving off a lump of Alu for the jig.






Squaring said jig lump.






The jig and conrod blanks.






marking out the conrod blank.






The conrod blank ready for dirlling and reaming.






The set up for drilling and reaming.






Reaming the gudgeon pin end with a homemade reamer from 3/16" round HSS.






The jig and conrod blanks drilled and reamed.






Brass rod for the jig locating pins.






Press fitting the big end pin into the jig.






The big end pin positioned with the conrod blank being offered up.






And so ended another week - will see, you, yous, y'awl - next week - have a good one guys.


----------



## wareagle (Oct 17, 2008)

Progress!! Everyting is looking great! The excitement is building here, and I'm looking forward to seeing you fire it up! Heck, it's a shame we couldn't be there with ya for the inaugral huff and chuff. 

For your "large" downloads, here's a thought... My method of downloading large files (which isn't very often) is to set it up to download as I go to bed. This way, the computer does all of the work and there isn't a problem with the computer or connection being slowed down. If Mrs. Maryak wants movies, let 'er have 'em.  Just download them during sleepy time!

Keep up the great work!!


----------



## Maryak (Oct 17, 2008)

W/E,

Thanks as usual for your helpful advise. I wish you could all be here too for the inaugural fire up 

Mrs M missed her internet access, as much as I did. She uses it to keep in contact with her family in Siberia and Moscow using a program called "Free Call" plus Skype, ICQ and Windows live. She was as peeved as I was.

The time allocation for Oz, from the Russian movie server, is from 10:30 to 16:30 our time. This plus we have a 5GB download allowance before we are shaped has certainly put a stopper in the works.

Lastly we have 2 satellite dishes which receive between them 5 Russian channels and on average I make about 2-3 Russian DVD's a week of films, serials and documentaries so she's not missing much ;D

Not exactly Model Engineering, but you deserve an explanation after all you help and support for my project :bow:

Ah the things we do for those we love : : :

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## malcolmt (Oct 17, 2008)

"Ah the things we do for those we love"

And our wives  :big: :big: :big: :big:

It's alright mines asleep so i can get away with saying that (This time)

Kind Regards

Malcolm


----------



## Maryak (Oct 17, 2008)

Malcolm,

What can I say ??? : ??? : ??? :

Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Oct 20, 2008)

Hi Guys,

Had a bit of a nasty shock today. Mrs M had a giddy turn so off to the doc followed by the hospital.

Thought it was a stroke but thankfully no.

All's well that ends well but after all that I'd had more than enough for one day.

Hopefully tomorrow can proceed at a more normal pace.

Regards
Bob


----------



## jack404 (Oct 20, 2008)

Hope everythings ok mate

Give your better half my best wishes and i'll be hoping that everythings ok 

the S word is a awful scary subject.

take care or your Mrs and Yourself eh

jack


----------



## Maryak (Oct 20, 2008)

Thanks Jack ;D


----------



## wareagle (Oct 20, 2008)

Bob, I am glad to hear that Mrs. M's medical issue wasn't as serious as first thought. Take good care of her and know that she is in our thoughts. Best wishes for a rapid and full recovery!


----------



## CrewCab (Oct 20, 2008)

All the best to you both Bob, take care.

CC


----------



## Maryak (Oct 20, 2008)

Thank you everyone for your thoughts and support

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## SERCEFLYER (Oct 20, 2008)

Bob,

I'm happy to hear that the Mrs. is doing better. Best wishes.

George


----------



## ksouers (Oct 20, 2008)

Bob,
Add me to the list, glad to hear Mrs. M is doing well. 
Hoping everything continues to go well.


----------



## Maryak (Oct 21, 2008)

First up, thanks guys for your support with Galina. After a restful night she is doing fine and managed to give our credit card a bashing today : : ::bow: :bow: :bow:

Back to the engine, I managed to get a little done today - completed the conrod jig and started to profile the rod.

The rod blank, jig and its pins assembled.











The set up for starting the profile. The jig pins are in the table slot and pressed against the back side of the slot. Hopefully this will give the correct angle for the rod side.






The conrod 1/4 complete.











That was all I had time for today as we had a meeting with our builder this arvo which went pretty well so things are pretty much back on an even keel.

Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Oct 22, 2008)

Today saw the connecting rod completed, fiddly little sucker 

I can't tell you how glad I am I made that little jig  worked a treat both on the mill table and in the rotary table.

I am starting to wonder now if aluminium will handle the forces involved without bending. I guess we'll find out if the thing runs : :

Pins moved over and milling the other side of the rod.











Milling the other side and overall height after turning over in the jig.






Profiling the ends using the rotary table.






The finished rod - sorry about the quality :






Have a good day


----------



## jack404 (Oct 22, 2008)

whats the size of that bob??

length ways 

looks small but the rule is way blurry ( know the feelin with camera's)

am amazed at what you can do in a day or part there of

cheers

jack


----------



## Maryak (Oct 22, 2008)

Jack,

Attached PDF gives sizes, to me it's bloody small 

Regards
Bob 

View attachment Conrod.pdf


----------



## jack404 (Oct 22, 2008)

yes bloody small 

well done eh

your mounting must be very good all the small stuff like that i have either
given flying lessons too
or crushed, trying to stop the flying lessons

i'll try your way next time i do something small

thanks 

and heck, well done

cheers Bob :bow: :bow: :bow:

jack


----------



## ksouers (Oct 22, 2008)

Very nice, Bob. That looks nerve-rackingly small. Well done.


----------



## SERCEFLYER (Oct 22, 2008)

As long as the engine does not get flooded and suffer from "hydrolic lock", aluminum should be ok for the con rod.

Nice progress today! What's next? Head?

George


----------



## Maryak (Oct 22, 2008)

Thanks Jack, Kevin and George for your support and input :bow:

Next will be the gudgeon pin followed by the crankshaft. If that's all OK, will make a jig for drilling the holes in the crankcase, cylinder base and head. Then the head etc. 

Jack, leave lumps on the ends, sides called chucking pieces so you can hang onto things, put them in the place where you can do most of the work before removing them. Then you've got some anti flying in place which wont damage the actual part this + patience and small cutting depths ;D

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Philjoe5 (Oct 22, 2008)

Hi Bob,
I just picked up this thread and read the 9 pages with keen interest. First of all, glad to hear your Mrs. is not going through a serious medical issue. Thanks for your great documentation of this build particularly the details of making the lap. Being a newbie myself and quite ignorant of how this process is done correctly, I've made what I thought qualified as a lap but now I'm not so sure. I guess we can judge by the end result, which is a running engine, which I have in fact made. But honestly I don't think I've ever achieved a "mirror" finish in a bore. Is this a more important or necessary requirement for an engine of this type/size? I may try your technique on a Stirling engine I made but has never run properly. I know for a Stirling a "mirror" finish bore is likely a requirement for it to run.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## wareagle (Oct 22, 2008)

Bob, glad to hear you and the Mrs. are in the clear! That's great news!

Your connecting rod came out well. Thought it is small, I think that it will be just fine for the purpose. It is small, but so is the volume of the engine. There shouldn't be enough push on the piston/rod assembly to hurt anything. I'm with you, it is small, but in perspective to the rest of the engine... Not so much.

Keep up the great work!


----------



## Maryak (Oct 23, 2008)

Dear Philjoe5,

Thanks for your kind words 

I'm a novice too when it comes to this lapping business, just read a couple of old books I had about the place. I would not call my cylinder or piston a "mirror finish" - Polished yes. In the good old days, things were finished off with white lead and tallow, enabling a mirror finish but white lead is not available any more and I'm sure long term lappers had a good dose of lead poisoning from their efforts.

I believe a good sliding fit to 0.0001" is required, (about the same level of accuracy as diesel engine injectors/fuel pumps, and again I would call the look of such parts polished but not mirror.

As I found out, the relative length of lap versus lappee is important, about 2-3 to one, i.e. a cylinder lap is longer than the cylinder and a piston lap is shorter than the piston. You can get really high tech and make fancy expanding laps and truing laps, (which are shorter than the lappee).

Hope this helps but as I said I'm a novice at this lapping game.

Regards
Bob :-\


----------



## Maryak (Oct 23, 2008)

W/E,

Thanks again for your continued encouragement and concern for Galina, a CT scan next week should put the whole matter behind us. That's you and George who think the Al will be OK in the conrod, so I'll stick with it. :

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Oct 23, 2008)

Achieved less than I was hoping for today, the gudgeon pin took much more time to lap and fit to the conrod than I anticipated. For some reason I had great difficulty in getting the lap to charge with abrasive and initially managed to transfer brass from the lap to the pin. Maybe a brass lap was not a good idea and I should have used cast iron or copper ??? ??? ??? Got the little sucker in the end ;D

A better picture of the finished connecting rod






The pin and crankshaft laps.











The finished gudgeon pin.






The gudgeon pin and dummy piston and conrod assembled.






The piston and conrod ready for screwing and soldering.






A lump for the crankshaft being faced.






And that was my lot for today as we had a meeting with our builder in the afternoon which went pretty well


----------



## kustomkb (Oct 23, 2008)

I Have really been enjoying this thread, alot of great tips and techniques, keep up the great work!


----------



## CrewCab (Oct 23, 2008)

Bob, 

I've not posted a lot in here but I have been watching avidly, much better than Mrs CC's choice in TV  .......... anyway, I'd just like to say thanks for your hard work in both machining and posting .............. and explaining ........... don't arf' elp us newb's 

Thanks Bob .............. keep it coming ;D ............ please 8)

CC


----------



## Maryak (Oct 23, 2008)

CC and Kb,

Thanks for your support and encouragement. :bow:

I have derived a lot of pleasure myself from the discipline of documenting my progress and/or lack thereof.

Every post from other members has only added to my determination to keep it up. It's also given me warm fuzzies to be a part of a great bunch of people.

Thank you all. :bow: :bow: :bow:


----------



## CrewCab (Oct 23, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> It's also given me warm fuzzies to be a part of a great bunch of people.



Just watch out for the Fluffy Bunnies ;D

CC


----------



## Maryak (Oct 23, 2008)

Fluffy Bunnies are Mrs M's department :big:


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## Maryak (Oct 24, 2008)

Hi All,

Friday turned into a fiasco, with wrong numbers on tanks being sent all over the world. Of course people couldn't find the bloody things they were looking for the wrong number : :

When that was finally put to bed, I called it a day so did not get too much done. Anyway it's POETS day isn't it?

Below is what I did manage to achieve.

Machining the main shaft of the crankshaft.







Final cut on the main shaft.






Ready to start lapping the main shaft to fit the crankcase nose.






Lapping the shaft.






Have a nice weekend everyone


----------



## stegaster (Oct 24, 2008)

hi there 

I new to all this stuff of machining , but I would like to try to do this engine , can u give some plans???

thanks


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## Maryak (Oct 24, 2008)

Stegaster,

Plans available from:

http://www.ejwinter.com.au/

Plan No. IC9

If you are new to this hobby, I strongly recommend you make a simple steam engine 1st ;D
There are plenty of great examples elsewhere on the board.

And WELCOME to a great hobby and a great forum 

Regards
Bob


----------



## jack404 (Oct 24, 2008)

i got the catalogue from them last week Bob,

best and worst $10 i ever spent

best cause theres so many good plans 

worse i can see a lot of missing hours building them

i see you did not get the casting kit for that one but doing it "ala Scratche"  :bow: :bow: :bow:

i ordered the No.2 mill engine castings yesterday : ;D 

cheers

jack


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## Maryak (Oct 24, 2008)

Jack,

Purchased castings are: (Only my opinion ) I'm sure others will disagree, but that's what makes the world go round.

1. Very expensive to buy.
2. It's more easy to stuff up the machining, due to marking out and clamping requirements.
3. Some are of poor quality and you don't know about it until you
 (a) start to mark out
 (b) start machining.
4. It's not as much fun as making a clothes peg from a telegraph pole. :

On the plus side.
An engine made from castings has the potential to look much more authentic than one blocked out of solid. Just look at the Chuck Fosters 3 cyl Fairbanks Morse. For me it would not have half the visual appeal and impact if it was blocked out.

Regards
Bob


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## jack404 (Oct 25, 2008)

Bob each to their own

but i have done rebores/rebuilds on Izuzu diesal motors and reworked Amal carbs :big: ( talk poor quality!!)

so am well trained in bodgies on cast items, maybe the only thing i'm "good" at

besides once i have them here i can copy to my hearts content ( another thing i'm ok at )

i can cast a few metals so will experiment once i get the paid work out the way
besides its a good place to start with what i have in mind for later on

ageed on the telegraph pole bit but the small stuff is a bit elusive for me yet ( look at my pile of practise bits and peices)

the plan is to do the mill then maybe the IC/11 from Mr Winter then maybe i'll have enough practise to start on what i want to build and that will be scratch built

but thanks again for the tips :bow:

cheers

jack


----------



## Maryak (Oct 27, 2008)

Start of another week - My how time flies when your having fun :

Today saw the main shaft of the crankshaft lapped and fitted to the crankcase and a start made on a jig for machining the big end.

One thing I have learned, is that brass laps are a dead loss :wall: I don't have a good techo reason why but I suspect it has something to do with the zinc content. The de-zinced brass bolt I used as a cylinder lap was fine, but the gudgeon pin was long winded and the main shaft went nowhere until I changed to a cast iron lap.  ???

The surface finish after fine lapping paste, oil and a cast iron lap. (The multi grips area hang over from the brass lap and were used to pry apart my fingers :.






Almost there  time to change to metal polish.






Thank goodness that's done ;D The crankshaft in the crankcase.











Setting up to cut the crankshaft thread.






The completed thread.






Test fit of crankshaft in the crankcase.











Aluminium for the crankshaft jig.






Marking out the crankshaft jig for the crank throw offset.






Transfer of centre height + 3/8"






Lining up the jig for offset transfer.






Marking off the centre point of the offset.






Setting up to the offset point.






Reaming the jig to take the crankshaft.






Called it a day at this point. Let's see what tomorrow brings


----------



## Maryak (Oct 28, 2008)

Hi Guys,

Well, so much for my marking off the offset :-[

Read on

On removing the jig to insert the crankshaft, it just didn't look right ??? ??? ???
Suffice to say my maths or should I say my arithmetic was up the proverbial creek without a paddle on measuring I was only out by 1/8"  : 

Here is the stuffed up jig.






Set up in the mill this time to try and achieve correct positioning of the offset.






The jig with the correct and incorrect offsets, note I marked the correct hole with a line to the crank OD.






The crankshaft mounted in the jig.






Back in the lathe and ready to start machining the big end and thickness of the throw.






Half way through the machining.






The big end ready for lapping.






Had an afternoon appointment and another one tomorrow morning so maybe Thursday ???


----------



## Philjoe5 (Oct 28, 2008)

Bob,
Great photos and progress. Thanks for the update. I was happy to see the pics of drilling an offset on the lathe using the four jaw to hold the work. I had tried that once but my offset was too far and I had trouble with two of the jaws gripping the workpiece.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## SERCEFLYER (Oct 28, 2008)

Another way to establish the eccentricity of the crankpin fixture is to use a DI to indicate directly off the outer surface of the fixture. Once the DI shows a deflection (up-and-down) twice the crankpin throw, you are there.

Drill and ream away. 

George


----------



## Maryak (Oct 28, 2008)

Phil and George,

Thanks for your continued support and input, yet another way to skin the proverbial cat. :bow:

Phil, it is sometimes possible to use a split sleeve, increasing the OD of the part to be offset. Just depends on how much is left on the jaw thread to get the offset required. Alternatively a faceplate may be used to achieve the required offset in a lathe.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## wareagle (Oct 28, 2008)

Bob, on my Crusader, I think that the crankshaft is the most difficult part to machine. The second would be the cylinder with the ports and such, but IMO the crankshaft takes the cake. Al of that said, your crank came out looking great! Your little engine is coming along very nicely.

Keep up the great work!


----------



## Maryak (Oct 28, 2008)

W/E,

Thanks for your continued support and input.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## NickG (Oct 29, 2008)

I was interested to see how you machined the crankpin as I struggled to say the least with that on my hot air engine.

Once you have drilled the offset, how do you set that to run true? Just put the crankshaft in it and set that to run true with the dti? Your method of drilling in the milling machine seems far easier and more repeatable to me.

I struggle to set a point running true in the lathe 4 jaw ... how do you do that? I noticed you had some sort of centre? Was that floating with a dti on that?

Keep up the good work.

Thanks,

NIck


----------



## Maryak (Oct 29, 2008)

Nick,

Thanks for your continued interest. :bow:

To try and answer your questions 

The offset in the jig is made relative to the jig centre and I am relying on the 3 jaw being true enough to locate the jig within acceptable limits. I'm lucky that my 3 jaw has minimal runout. If you have an older stressed 3 jaw, or one which has been abused then you would have to set up the jig OD to run true in the 4 jaw using a DTI. ;D

The little gizmo shown with the DTI is a spring loaded centre finder. It's about 6" long 3/8" dia and on the tailstock end has a sliding fit female centre working against a fairly lightly loaded spring. To set up locate between the centres and adjust the tailstock to compress the spring about half way. Then measure way. It's a good idea to try and get somewhere near by eye before using the finder as it does not like large angles of offset. 

Hope this helps ??? ???

Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Oct 30, 2008)

Well, achieved a little lot less than I should have :

Somehow, (one of my Asian friends), I managed to engage the X feed and sheared the lead screw shear pin  
No damage to the lathe but my ego took a bashing :-[ :'( :-[ :'( so instead of progress I spent some time replacing the shear pin. ;D

Almost finished lapping.






The completed crank pin.






A trial assembly of the bits made so far. Spent some time filing the conrod to clear the crankcase near the top of the stroke - should have been more careful 1st time around 






Setting the crank pin horizontal to mark out the centre, allowing machining of the crank arm for balance.






Hopefully tomorrow will see the crankshaft in the mill ???


----------



## NickG (Oct 30, 2008)

Great stuff, looking like an engine now!


----------



## Brass_Machine (Oct 30, 2008)

Looking good Bob!

Eric


----------



## Maryak (Oct 30, 2008)

Thanks Nick and Eric for your support. 

Regards
Bob


----------



## Metal Mickey (Oct 30, 2008)

What I like about your posts is the honesty shown for any errors made. Only from mistakes do we learn, and if we make them ourselves they may be imprinted easier.......(but not with me!) So I like to learn by seeing how people achieve there end and just as much from what went wrong.

Thanks for your posts they are great!


----------



## wareagle (Oct 30, 2008)

Metal Mickey  said:
			
		

> What I like about your posts is the honesty shown for any errors made. Only from mistakes do we learn, and if we make them ourselves they may be imprinted easier.......(but not with me!) So I like to learn by seeing how people achieve there end and just as much from what went wrong.



I have to echo this statement! It is easy to put together a post with all of the "right ways" to achieve an end result, but there is much to learn from the goofs, oops, oh no's, and awh shucks that happen along the way.

Bob, thanks for taking us along on the journey.


----------



## Maryak (Oct 31, 2008)

M/M and W/E,

Thanks guys for your kind words, when I learn to walk on water then I'll be a perfect machinist 

W/E
I've been giving some thought about your comments re the crankshaft being the most difficult part of your Crusader to make.

In my case, so far, it has been the crankcase, (the design had a lot to do with this), I had to make 2 to get 1 good one :'( I was very nervous about the conrod but it came out OK, so too has the crankshaft. In both cases the jigs I made were a good investment and made life much easier as well as providing good accuracy. 

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Oct 31, 2008)

Yet another week has flown by, I'm sure as you get older time passes more quickly, which is a real PITA when you ain't got much left .

Enough philosophy for one day ;D. The crankshaft is finished and went pretty well apart from the CU's with the jig and the leadscrew .

First job to finish the crankshaft was to set the boring head to bore at the correct diameter.







Next came marking out the crank arm for the cut out.






A bit of good old US know how provided the shim to hold the crankshaft in the chuck.






The crank arm boring.






The completed crankshaft.






The crankshaft and crankcase.(sorry about the focus, must have sneezed ;D)






Gave our car a fright and spent the afternoon cleaning it  

Have a great weekend


----------



## gjn (Oct 31, 2008)

Bob

It's been good to follow your project, especially to see the lathe you are using. I've recently bought the same type, probably from the same place, and was getting a little irked by conversations with people who are trying to tell me that the only way to produce precision work is on a second hand Myford, South Bend or the like. It seems to be holy writ in some quarters that the Hafco lathes are worthless!

Seeing the type of work you are producing on the al320g with the stock chucks etc restores my confidence...

Off topic slightly but have you had problems with the tailstock chuck spinning under shock loads?

Rgds - Gavin


----------



## Maryak (Oct 31, 2008)

Gavin,

Thanks for your support and your comments about our lathe.

Yes, in the land of my birth, there is only one lathe for the model engineering fraternity - "The Myford" I am afraid I don't understand why.

For me the China of today is the Japan of yesterday. Sure some of their early stuff was off the mark, but for a run of the mill jobbing lathe, in my opinion,they are now as good as anybody. They come with all the basic parts as standard, (chucks, faceplates, steadies and a tool kit complete with oil can), Others on the other hand seem to want an arm and a leg for every additional item, including of course there own oil can at their own very special price. This is the 2nd Chinese Lathe I have owned, I traded in my 1st one on this one. I also have a Chinese Mill/Drill bought second hand and it has given me no trouble whatsoever. 

No I've not experienced spinning in the tailstock. Have you tried bluing a couple of different Mt3 items and seeing if there is a difference in their fit in the tailstock ??? Also if using an Mt3 tanged sleeve you need to be out around 15mm for it to seat fully in the taper.

Hope this helps ???

Regards
Bob


----------



## Jones (Oct 31, 2008)

Yes, I bought a used ML7 as my first lathe and, unknown to me at the time, it was pretty well worn.
Sold it and bought a 12"x36" Taiwanese gear head lathe (AL-960B) which is absolutely superb. Can't fault it.


----------



## Maryak (Nov 3, 2008)

Hope you all had a good weekend.

Not a lot achieved with the engine today, but the really good news is Galina's CT Scan showed no evidence of stroke or heart attack, so we are both very relieved and happy  

Made a start on the drilling jig for the holes in the crankcase, head and cylinder flange.

Facing the lump.






Locator for the head end






Locator for the cylinder/crankcase end






Tomorrow I should transfer to the mill and cut the sides to match the cylinder.


----------



## gjn (Nov 3, 2008)

Bob

Good to hear the news re the boss. On your post of 22nd September there is a photo of your parting off tool, what type is it and where did you get it from? I'm looking for something a bit more robust than the one I have and was wary of getting into the carbide jobs (too much $$$), yours looks like the type I want to get.

Rgds - Gavin.


----------



## Maryak (Nov 3, 2008)

Gavin,

PM sent re parting tool.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 3, 2008)

Good news on the home front Bob. 

I'll be interested to see how this drilling jig works.

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Maryak (Nov 3, 2008)

Phil,

Me too 

Regards
Bob


----------



## CrewCab (Nov 3, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> the really good news is Galina's CT Scan showed no evidence of stroke or heart attack



That's great to hear Bob, and I'm sure I speak for everyone, wish her all the best ;D

anyway, still watching your build with great interest, it's coming along nicely ............ thanks for your efforts.

CC


----------



## Maryak (Nov 3, 2008)

C/C

Thanks for the kind thoughts, maybe today I can get a clear run at the model ??? ???

We'll know this evening. :

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## wareagle (Nov 3, 2008)

Bob, I am relieved beyond words that Mrs. Maryak is okay! What a huge relief!!

You project is coming nicely! Many thanks for the contiuned posting of your adventure.


----------



## ksouers (Nov 3, 2008)

Bob,
Excellent news about Galina!


----------



## SERCEFLYER (Nov 3, 2008)

I'm happy to hear the good news about your wife. 

I think we'll see a running engine soon....

George


----------



## Maryak (Nov 4, 2008)

W/E, Kevin and George,

Thanks you for your support and concern for Galina. :bow: Yes we are both very relieved and glad it's behind us

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 4, 2008)

Well, I did manage a reasonable day in the shop, it started to warm up this arvo and it was either off with my jumper or go home. I elected for the latter and hopped under the shower. :

The drilling jig is - So Far.....So Good ;D

The drilling jig set up in the mill to mill the flats matching the cylinder.






Half way milling the flats






The flats are complete.











Set up to drill the holes in the jig.






The completed drilling jig - the through holes are 6BA tapping and the half way holes are 6BA clearance.











Set up for drilling the crankcase.






The crankcase complete with tapping holes.






Tapping the holes in the crankcase - I believe that these are pretty important as the whole of the compression and firing forces are carried on these 4 threads via through bolts.






And home I went, it's always stressful tapping aluminium as it's just so easy to tear out the thread especially at such a small, (too me), size.


----------



## wareagle (Nov 4, 2008)

Bob,

Looks like you had a good day. More progress is good!


--Nothing that the old hands don't know already, but for a person inexperienced or having troubles... Tapping aluminum I have found is easy, but can be tricky. The aluminum can get gummed up on the tap, and then can bind up and break the tap, usually on the last hole. : I use a light oil (WD-40) when I am tapping, and have found it makes a huge difference in thread quality and easy of tapping. It reduces the tendency of the gum up issue, and allows a better thread. It doesn't take much, either. Tap Magic works very well for the purposes also.


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 4, 2008)

Good work Bob. Thanks for the pictures. Do you actually tap those small holes with the tap and tap wrench free standing like the picture shows? 

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Maryak (Nov 4, 2008)

W/E,

Thanks for your continued input, yes I used what would be the equivalent of Tap Magic. For very hard materials I use a brew called, "Angels Breath" its a mixture of 2 parts olive oil to 1 part kero or mineral turps and it works a treat. (You guys working with titanium).

Phil,

Yes I tapped them free standing using a small square as a visual guide. With the head to guide them I'm hoping they will line up OK : I have tried some of the suggestions re tapping guides with little success, I feel you place too much reliance on them and they, for the most part, can be just as easily misaligned as the tap itself. (Only my opinion and not set in concrete ;D)

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 5, 2008)

Hi Guys,

Well I managed to get a good run today  

I must say that the time and effort put into making the drilling jig for the crankcase, cylinder and head has repaid itself with very satisfying results. The three items mentioned actually line up with each other.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





On with the progress report. 

Opening out the holes in the drilling jig to 6BA clearance.






Drilling the holes in the cylinder base.






A Test fit of the cylinder onto the crankcase.











Aluminium being readied to make the head by providing a chucking spigot.






Testing the cylinder fit in the head.






Drilling the holes in the head.






Another test assembly :






Preparing the head for tapering.






Tapering the head using the compund slide.






The head after tapering and cutting the cooling fins.






Reaming the top of the head to take a bronze bush in which will be fitted the compression screw.






Completed head, cylinder and crankcase assembly.











If I were to make another or similar engine, I would leave the lapping of the cylinder and pistons until now

Ah well you live and you learn.


----------



## NickG (Nov 5, 2008)

Definitely looking like an engine now! Getting quite excited, I think I just heard a little put put!


----------



## Maryak (Nov 5, 2008)

Maybe you did but if you were close by it would be louder due to my nervous peristaltic action filtering down to the nether regions.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







Best Regards
Bob


----------



## CrewCab (Nov 5, 2008)

Great work Bob, it's really coming together now.  :bow:

CC


----------



## Maryak (Nov 5, 2008)

Thanks CC,

All the support etc is really great
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Brian Rupnow (Nov 5, 2008)

Fabulous work!!!!----Brian


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 5, 2008)

A definite engine is emerging from all that bar stock :bow: :bow:. You've documented some really nice machining techniques

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## wareagle (Nov 5, 2008)

Bob, 

You definately have it goin' on!  :bow: That little engine is looking fantastic. You are well on your way to a great little engine.


----------



## dsquire (Nov 5, 2008)

Bob :bow:

Looks like your going to have a great little engine. I am enjoying watching the progress. Thanks for all the tips.

Cheers

Don


----------



## Maryak (Nov 5, 2008)

Brian, Phil, W/E and Don,

Thanks guys, you have no idea how much your questions, suggestions, brickbats and bouquets have contributed to this project.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Brass_Machine (Nov 6, 2008)

Hey Bob

That is looking good! I didn't read the whole thread, whatcha gonna put it in?

Eric


----------



## gjn (Nov 6, 2008)

Bob

Next time the aircraft museum at the port has an engine run day take yours along as well so we can see it running!

Rgds - Gavin


----------



## Maryak (Nov 6, 2008)

Eric,

Thanks for your comments. The short answer is I don't know ??? ??? ???

My Grandson is almost 16 and I thought about a model aircraft that maybe we could build together. Ran it past his mum, (my one and only beautiful daughter, actually she looks very similar to Nicole Kidman). She nearly freaked and I got dressed down. The lad is Dyslexic and one of the problems is he has no concept of personal safety. A propeller at 5000rpm was definitely out.

Any suggestions would be very welcome.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 6, 2008)

I guess you would call today

Tanks for the Memory. ;D

Yep tanks tanks and more bloody tanks.   

Did manage to get a little shopping done late in the day for HSS, a 2mt dead centre and a pin chuck for the No. 70 drill.

Hope tomorrow will see a little progress.

Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 6, 2008)

Gavin,

I have a mate who volunteers at the Aviation Museum. Also was very glad when you took the Nomad wings back out of my store when I worked at the Maritime Museum. ;D ;D

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## wareagle (Nov 6, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> Eric,
> 
> Thanks for your comments. The short answer is I don't know ??? ??? ???
> 
> ...



Bob, just a thought... The buddy that started the second Crusader along with mine is planning of building a remote control air boat and using this engine for that. The prop will have a full cage built around it to protect it as well as other objects from being chopped up. His idea is to build it in such fashion that it can go over land as well as water. He has a three year old boy that will likely be involved in the running of it as well, so there is the same safety concerns as your facing. No drawings or plans exist for the boat at this time, its just at the idea stage.


----------



## Brass_Machine (Nov 6, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> ...
> 
> Any suggestions would be very welcome.
> 
> ...



WE's suggestion is good. Can ya stick it in a RC boat??

Eric


----------



## Maryak (Nov 6, 2008)

W/E,

What a great idea, a caged prop and a boat, at least I've built a couple of sailing dinghies so thus may be just the ticket :bow: :bow:

Looking forward to hearing more, assisting if possible etc. etc. :big: :big: :big:

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## wareagle (Nov 6, 2008)

Bob, another plus side of the boat idea is weight... Not nearly as critical as being in an aircraft! 

I think your engine will be light enough that an aircraft option is easily obtainable, but the Crusader I am building seems like it will be a bit on the heavy side for flight.


----------



## Maryak (Nov 6, 2008)

W/E,

If after all this mine don't run flight will not be a problem   , just the sudden stop at the end of its ride ;D

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## wareagle (Nov 6, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> W/E,
> 
> If after all this mine don't run flight will not be a problem   , just the sudden stop at the end of its ride ;D
> 
> ...















  Thanks for the chuckle!!


----------



## rickharris (Nov 6, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> Eric,
> 
> Thanks for your comments. The short answer is I don't know ??? ??? ???
> 
> ...



You could go for a ducted fan - Hide the prop. Or even bypass the engine and use it for another project - and go for a glider / electric flight model (much less dangerous (It can hurt though, so it helps lessons to be learned without cutting fingers off !))


RC aircraft are so much fun it's a shame to miss out on them - AND building them can lead into othe hobbies such as engineering!!!!


----------



## Maryak (Nov 6, 2008)

Rick,

Thanks for your input and suggestion about gliders. :bow: At least I now have some very good pointers.

A little voice keeps saying _"Finish the engine first....finish the eng...... finish the......."_  

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 7, 2008)

EOW again  

Managed to get a little done today and the head is looking like a head
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




The original plan called for the compression screw to be tapped directly into the head, also there was an option of a steel or aluminium head. As I opted for the alloy head I was not too happy about the compression screw being tapped directly into it.

Can't remember where I read it but the gist of the comment was, " And a very nice finishing touch was the insert in the head incorporating the compression screw."

Bearing this in mind and my own opinion that steel on aluminium was not the greatest, I settled on a brass insert, (coz when I looked, I had no bronze other than a big lump being saved for a bigger job ??? ???).

The sleeve blank ready for tapping and parting off.






The head and tapped sleeve.






Pressing the sleeve into the head - note the locating screw on the underside to square things up before going under the press.











The sleeve in the head - The shoulder on the inside is insurance against things moving when it gets to operating temperature :






I thought it would look snazzy if the sleeve was above the top of the head so made it 1/8" longer ;D






Some brightstock being turned into the compression screw.






Have a good weekend


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 7, 2008)

Looking good Bob. What is the function of the compression screw in your engine?

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Maryak (Nov 7, 2008)

Phil,

Thanks for your remarks.

The cylinder in this design carries 2 pistons, a power piston which drives the crank and opposing it a contra piston which controls the compression ratio between about 16:1 to 20:1. The compression screw controls the position of this contra piston which is adjusted for power, even running etc. I have read and been told that this is necessary due to differing atmospheric conditions such as pressure temperature and humidity all of which have a bearing on how the engine performs on a given run.  

In todays world apparently these engines are used primarily for control line racing of model aircraft and dog fighting, (how this is done with control lines is beyond me). I am advised that they have a much greater speed range than other types of model engines.

I have no experience with any type of model IC engine, so I am merely repeating parrot fashion what was read and said. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 7, 2008)

So the compression screw arrangement seems to serve the same function as found on some older style diesel engines. I have a clone of a Lister diesel engine (6 hp @ 600 rpm, 800+ lbs) and some of these have been produced with this system. Does that mean your engine will run on diesel fuel? If so, that would be extremely cool 8)

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Maryak (Nov 7, 2008)

Phil,

Alas it is not a true diesel but a CI engine
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




The fuel is a mixture of Power Kero, or Jet A1, Ethyl Ether and Castor Oil. The local model aircraft guys have offered to help me set it up, mix the fuel etc and show me the correct way to start it without losing a finger 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Reckon I will avail myself of their help. I only made 1 phone call and the secretary of the club was all about like a can of worms. Restores your faith in human nature :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 7, 2008)

Ah, got it! Model airplane engine fuel. Will your engine have a glow plug or does the compression adjustment allow it to "diesel"?

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Maryak (Nov 7, 2008)

Phil,

It, (I fervently hope :), will Diesel. There is no glow plug or other ignition than compression.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## SandyC (Nov 7, 2008)

Hi Guys,

Bob..... excellent progress on your diesel, it is really beginning to look the part now.

I think you may find that your estimations of the RPM output may be somewhat low..... typically these engines were quite capable of more than 11,000 - 12,000 rpm. depending upon the propeller size used and the exact fuel mix.
The fuel used for racing (control line team racers) depended upon the CLASS of the races being flown (open class or FAI class (Federation Aeronautique International)). 

FAI class was restricted to STRAIGHT fuel mix, as per your formula.

Open class more often than not had an additional ingredient (Amyl Nitrate) as an ignition booster...typically between 5% and 15%.

Control line combat also used this nitrated type of fuel.

Some of my own Racing diesels (Oliver tiger, ETA 15 etc) at 2.5cc were/are capable of turning an 8" dia x 7" pitch or a 7" dia x 9" pitch propeller at around 18,000 RPM.... and yes I started them by hand...starters were not allowed under the rules and in any event would have mangled the wooden racing props.

Phil..... The majority of Model Airplane Fuel, as you would now know it, would be for GLOWPLUG engines.

Very few diesel (CI) engines are manufactured nowadays (regretably), however, some model stores still stock the correct fuel for them.

GLOWPLUG engines use a fuel mix of 75% - 80% METHANOL (as used for drag racers) and 20% - 25% SYNTHETIC RACING oil.&#160; 
This would be a straight mix.

A racing mix would also contain between 5% - 15% NITRO METHANE as an ignition booster.

Model Diesel (CI) engines will not run on this type of fuel.

For either fuel type, when a nitro additive is used, the amount of oil is typically reduced to around 15% and the other ingredients adjusted to maintain the 100% total mix value.

WE....
Your Crusader 0.60 engine will use the METHANOL based fuel and just to give you an idea..... it would be quite capable of flying a 10lb - 12lb model aircraft, and at 80MPH or more. 
It will probably turn a 12"dia x 6" pitch propeller at upwards of 12,000 rpm and with some NITRO METHANE in the mix could well get 14,000 rpm.....
It will probably deliver close on 0.8BHP or even more.

Modern 0.60 engines are capable of more than 1.2BHP.

Hope this will give some encouragement to have a go.

Best regards.

Sandy.


----------



## Maryak (Nov 7, 2008)

Sandy,

Thanks for your input and encouragement, plus all the information on model aircraft fuels :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 10, 2008)

Mondayitis, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




One of those days when your are flat out but achieving little forward motion. 

That pretty well sums up today. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




On the plus side the new camera is a beauty and I hope you like the shots from it 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Threading the compression screw.






Testing the thread in the head.






Parting off the compression screw.






Cross drilling for the T handle.






Poor mans T handle :






The piston assembly complete and soft soldered together.






Not much was it   ??? ???


----------



## dsquire (Nov 10, 2008)

Maryak 

That camera sure seems like it is doing a beautiful job of showing what beautiful job you are doing with the compression screw. Well done Bob. :bow:

Cheers

Don


----------



## Maryak (Nov 10, 2008)

Don,

Thanks for the kind words and your continued support and encouragement. :bow:

Yes, I'm really chuffed with the new camera thanks to Crewcab and Mklotz for their valuable advise on what to buy 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




It really has to be a good camera for ME 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 to take shots of that quality.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## wareagle (Nov 10, 2008)

Bob, as for progress, I think you have done great. The small stuff does take more time. At any rate, the little engine is coming together and it looks like you have 'er on the downhill side of things.

Looking good!!


----------



## Maryak (Nov 10, 2008)

W/E

Thanks yet again for your input and support. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




I hope today will see the engine assembled 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Next is to make a mod to my grinder base so that the jig is held firm relative to the wheel.

That way I hope to be able to make more accurate form tools for the venturi and the bell mouth on the carburettor 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 10, 2008)

Bob,
Your superior use of the "Emoticon" is equalled by your excellent machining and photos :big:. Keep 'em coming. 

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Maryak (Nov 10, 2008)

Phil,

















Funny but I can't find one which says THANK YOU but I do Thank you. :bow:

Best Regards
Bob.


----------



## Maryak (Nov 11, 2008)

Well another day almost down the gurgler on the model front. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Sometimes, with some people, the only thing their head is for is to keep their ears apart 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Enough, lets talk about important things like model engines 

I did manage to get the engine assembled 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Drilling the mounting holes in the crankcase lugs.






The crankshaft and holding down bolts.






Next the piston assembly.






Now its starting to look like an engine











A couple of rulers to show the size.






Snuck it home, past SWMBO and onto the kitchen scales 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 235grams, a bit over 8ozs






What the first assembly revealed 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 :

1. It goes together 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




2. There is a tight spot which on closer inspection, (with a magnifying glass and a torch, (flashlight)) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 revealed that the conrod was just catching on the cylinder at about 300 before and after TDC. Some judicious use of a small file will be required to clear the obstruction on the rod.

3. There seems to be compression, but I'm not convinced that the contra piston is a good as it could be, because there were air bubbles around the compression screw. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Maybe it's a result of the very slow rpm, I sure hope so. Any advise/comment will be gratefully received. I was sorta, kinda half expecting this 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Well TTFN and for our correct way up friends it's goodbye from him


----------



## wareagle (Nov 11, 2008)

Bob,

The dynamics of you compression will change when the engine is running. With the speed at which the compression takes place, there won't be enough time for the fuel/air the seep past things like the compression screw ofr piston and cylinder wall. Yes, there will be some loss in these areas, but nothing in the magnitude of turning it by hand. Hope that makes sense.

You have done a great job on the engine!! A little tweaking and you're all set. And it looks great!! :bow: :bow:


----------



## SandyC (Nov 11, 2008)

Hi Bob,

First off let me say that is one very nice 'Vintage' looking engine.... take a bow my friend.

Quote from WE.



> The dynamics of you compression will change when the engine is running.





> Yes, there will be some loss in these areas, but nothing in the magnitude of turning it by hand.



I agree with WE on this score, however, the fit of the contra-piston on these engines is quite critical.

If you can press it into the bore with your fingers, albeit requiring a good deal of finger pressure, then it is TO LOOSE.
The contra-piston fit needs to be somewhere between this type of fit and a press fit.
The idea is that you need the turning/pressing force of the compression screw in order to push the contra-piston further down, whilst the engine compression (when running) will return it if the compression screw is retracted.

If it is too loose then it can, and will, move whilst the engine is running.
On the other hand, if it is TO TIGHT then the engines compression, even on a firing stroke, will not shift it back if it is inserted to far, with the result that the engine will remain OVER COMPRESSED. (which will lead to other damage)

This, as you can imagine, is a tricky balance.

The only real way to find out for sure is to aim for a reasonable tight fit then run the engine and observe it's behaviour.

As for the issue with the con-rod..... on all my CI engines the lower inside edge of the liners are chamfered to give sufficient clearance.
I would suggest that you do this on yours, rather than relieve the con-rod....these need as much meat as possible since they have to take a fair bit of abuse when the engine is running.

I hope this all makes some sort of sense to you.

Very best regards.

Sandy.  ;D


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## SERCEFLYER (Nov 11, 2008)

Bob,

I agree with Sandy. Don't relieve the con rod-- you might set up stress areas where a crack would begin. Use a small burr on a Dremel tool to relieve and chamfer the inside of the liner.

On my engine, I had to Dremel the crankcase flange area, too!

Does the compression have a springy, bouncy feel to it? At TDC, does it hold compression for about 30 sec- 1 min? Before making any changes, give the engine a few flips with fuel (touch the fuel on the side of the piston through the exhaust) to see if you get a pop.

Almost there.....

George


----------



## Metal Mickey (Nov 11, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> 3. There seems to be compression, but I'm not convinced that the contra piston is a good as it could be, because there were air bubbles around the compression screw.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I had the same signs when making my Mills 1.3cc diesel engine and I made a new contra piston which was a better fit (although I thought the first one was!) and made a big difference. Not least with no bubbles around the compression screw afterwards. So if it was me, I would make another contra piston......for what its worth......

Yours has been a great build and I really have enjoyed the pictures.

Mike


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 11, 2008)

Nice work Bob. I'm looking forward to the first run. Good luck with the "tweaking" stage. We rootin' fer ya 

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Maryak (Nov 11, 2008)

W/E, Sandy, George, Mike and Phil,

Thanks to all for you support and your sound advise. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







Plan of attack is to grind a little off the bottom of the cylinder sides to relieve the rub.

The contra piston is a tight as Sandy suggests but the holding bolts need sizing so that I can adjust the compression and see if there is the desired "pop back" of the CP. If not as Mike says make another. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


----------



## CrewCab (Nov 11, 2008)

Bob I've been a little remiss at commenting, both here and in another couple of ongoing builds, that aside I am watching with great interest 8) ........ top class work and superb effort in documenting and photographing the build, it's threads like this which will encourage people to become involved. Good luck with the final stages, we're all waiting for the first "Big Bang" Pop 8) under it's own power.

CC


----------



## Maryak (Nov 11, 2008)

Crikey CC,

Thanks for your input, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 there are so many good things and so much valuable information being posted that it's dead easy to read a topic, think of a contribution and then go on to the next without adding your 2 bobs worth. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




All comments are gratefully received and all have been of tremendous help and support. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










Best Regards
Bob


----------



## gjn (Nov 11, 2008)

Bob, what type of rotary table are you using on your mill, where did you get it? I assume you are using the chuck from the AL320G on it, how do you mount it? Have you used the 4-jaw from the AL320G on it? If so did that mount the same way?

I'm looking at getting a rotab myself and would welcome the input?

Rgds - Gavin


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## Brass_Machine (Nov 11, 2008)

Bob,

It looks the beesknees! Not much longer now. I do agree about modding the crankcase and not the rod though. Can't be of any other help.

Eric


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## Maryak (Nov 12, 2008)

Gavin,

PM sent re RT 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Eric,

Thanks for your kind words and support 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Nov 12, 2008)

No, I didn't slack off, well sorta kinda. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Have a look at The Beijing Deckel thread if you can't stand the suspense. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## gjn (Nov 12, 2008)

Bob

PM sent regarding the chuck mount on your RT.

Rgds - Gavin


----------



## gjn (Nov 12, 2008)

Bob

PM resent. 

Rgds - Gavin


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## Maryak (Nov 13, 2008)

Hi All,

Had a very satisfying day with the engine today 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




So here's what happened.

The cylinder set up to relieve the sides where the conrod was touching.






The relief work complete 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	









As I needed to find out what was happening with the contra piston, I needed to see inside. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 To do this I modified the drilling jig as a see through head.






The engine assembled with the CP under my look see head.







I pushed the CP down as far as it would go using a brass dolly and then turned the engine over using a SMALL spanner on the nuts. My reward was a satisfying click as the CP bounced back to the top under the head, (just like Sandy said it should). Couldn't believe my eyes, (and ears), so did it several more times each with a rewarding click as the CP returned to the top of the cylinder under compression. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	








Made all the adjustments I could, ran it for about 30secs with a drill and Tallow as a lube. Cleaned everything and oiled and reassembled.
















Next is the carburretor and a visit from the bling fairy would be nice.


----------



## SERCEFLYER (Nov 13, 2008)

That's one good looking little machine!!!!

George


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## dsquire (Nov 13, 2008)

Bob

Looking very good. Won't be long and it will be making a bit of noise for you.

cheers

Don


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## Maryak (Nov 13, 2008)

Don and George,

Thanks for your help, support and advise. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## NickG (Nov 13, 2008)

Excellent, this is going to be running by next week! :bow:


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## ksouers (Nov 13, 2008)

Way to go, Bob! I'm getting excited for you.

This has been a very interesting and informative build.


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## Maryak (Nov 13, 2008)

Nick & Kevin,

Thanks for your continued support. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Metal Mickey (Nov 14, 2008)

I am really looking forward to seeing it run. Great work and from what I have seen it should be a great runner. Good progress with your 'adjustments' as well. Fingers crossed.

Mike


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## seagar (Nov 14, 2008)

As an old aeromodeler, I have raced diesel engines in team race ,I am finding your build VERY interesting and cant wait to see the final result. 

Great work and thanks for sharing.

Ian


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## Maryak (Nov 14, 2008)

Mike and Seagar,

Thanks Guys for your support. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







000 progress today. It was contract signing day for our new home. A visit to the builders is always an excuse for SWMBO to spend some time in the city.   That's what we did.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## wareagle (Nov 14, 2008)

Bob, glad to hear you have 'er almost ready! It certainly looks great!!  :bow: :bow: :bow: And a big thanks for taking us along the journey!!

So, are you going to run and then bling it? Or vice versa? _Personally, I don't think you bling on this one! It has the attitude, "I am an engine. Don't like it? Deal with it!" _


----------



## CrewCab (Nov 14, 2008)

wareagle  said:
			
		

> _Personally, I don't think you bling on this one! It has the attitude, "I am an engine. Don't like it? Deal with it!" _



That gets my vote, just fire the Bad Boy up ;D

CC


----------



## Maryak (Nov 14, 2008)

W/E and CC,

Thanks for your continued support and your informed comments about bling. :bow: :bow:

It is advise I most gratefully accept :bow:

Next week it's on with the carburretor and a whole new world of small accurate drilling. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 14, 2008)

Very nice progress Bob. It'k looking good. I can't wait to hear you rev it up. ;D 

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Maryak (Nov 14, 2008)

Philjoe5  said:
			
		

> Very nice progress Bob. It'k looking good. I can't wait to hear you rev it up. ;D
> 
> Cheers,
> Phil



ME TOO 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Metal Mickey (Nov 15, 2008)

Congratulations on signing for your new house. Does this mean a new workshop? Exciting or what.....


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## Maryak (Nov 15, 2008)

Mike,

No new workshop, I may move my existing one to my daughters place which is closer than its current location relative to our new home.

Thanks for your continued interest and support.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 17, 2008)

Hi Guys,

A start was made on the carburettor which I decided to try and make from solid rather than silver solder the two parts together, so on with the show 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




A piece of 3/4" brass.






Threading the end for the cylinder connection.






A test fit.






Form tool for the divergent nozzle.











The inlet side of the carburettor.






Grinding the form tool for the convergent/inlet side.






The body ready for transfer to the mill.






Tomorrow should see this part finished, (I hope). : :

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 17, 2008)

Nice work Bob. Thanks for the update. The inlet side looks like a mild taper. Did the special toolbit you made allow you to make this taper more directly? ???

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Maryak (Nov 17, 2008)

Phil,

No - the outside of the inlet was formed using the compound slide. The form tools were for the insides on both sides of the centre boss. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Clear as mud 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







Thanks for your continued interest and support. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 17, 2008)

Well,

Things went OK but progress was slower than anticipated due to unforeseen domestic duties encroaching on my play time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Here's what I did manage to achieve. 

The set up to mill the flats on the centre boss.






Milling the flats.






The completed flats milled.






Cross drilling the centre boss






Set up in the lathe for cutting the 1st external thread.






And there endeth todays effort.


----------



## Philjoe5 (Nov 17, 2008)

Bob,
Let me be the first to say....your pictures are crystal  clear. I'm anxious to see this completed carby ;D

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## ksouers (Nov 17, 2008)

Bob,
I have to agree with Phil. The pictures from the new camera are fantastic.
Now it really shows the great work you are doing.


----------



## jack404 (Nov 17, 2008)

ageed the camera makes looking on so much better 

but Bob you got the talent i must say :bow: :bow: :bow:

great work mate!! and its not taken that long either!!

i do fully intend to copy your work one day ( if i get the skills sorted)

hope you dont mind 

cheers 

jack


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## SERCEFLYER (Nov 18, 2008)

Bob,

So, have you decided to grind your own needle, or get yourself to a sewing shop and find a darning needle?

I love the brass carby!!

George


----------



## Maryak (Nov 18, 2008)

Thanks Guys for all your kind words and continued support. :bow: :bow:

I am very happy with the new camera and I am thrilled that you guys like it too ;D ;D

Jack - Of course I don't mind, I am more than a little flattered.  

George, at this stage I will take the darning needle option. :

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 18, 2008)

Hi Guys,

Today saw the main body of the carburretor completed and boy did I have some fun cutting the external threads 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





The first outside thread.






Tapping the internal thread for the feed pipe and needle valve.






Operating the lathe by hand to give a good start to the external thread.






The finished body






Knurling the lock nut for the engine/carby interface.






The body fitted to the engine.






And that was it for today.


----------



## gjn (Nov 18, 2008)

Bob

That's not just engineering, it's art! I continue to be impressed with every post, can't wait to see it run.

On another note, thanks very much for the PM re the rotary table chuck mount, I bit the bullet today and picked up the 8" version of the Vertex table and I picked up an old cast iron chuck backing plate on the weekend for $5 which I'll modify along the lines of your plate so I can mount both my 3-jaw and 4-jaw chucks.

Rgds - Gavin


----------



## NickG (Nov 19, 2008)

Move that file a bit to the left, it looks like a propeller!

The engine looks great, the carb is excellent, worth the effort making it from solid. So when will it be running? You should stream the start up live!

Nick


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## Philjoe5 (Nov 19, 2008)

Great looking carby. I was just thinking of all the ways I could have buggered up such a (for me) complicated part. Congratulations on a great job :bow:

Cheers,
Phil


----------



## Maryak (Nov 19, 2008)

Thanks Guys for your kind words and support. :bow: :bow: :bow:

"That's not just engineering, it's art!" - Gavin have a look at some of the work by guys like Cedge, Paulo, Metal Mickey etc and there you can see art. Glad you went for the 8" rather than the 6" RT. Good luck with the backing plate. 

"The engine looks great, the carb is excellent, worth the effort making it from solid." - Nick thanks, I was very lucky it did not turn into a propeller.  

"I was just thinking of all the ways I could have buggered up such a (for me) complicated part." - Phil, I very nearly did bugger it up hence the 2 different thread diameters on the X piece. Could not get the tap to start and chewed off a good 1/8" of the original. That's when I hit on the idea of a hand cut before trying the tap. Just saved my bacon. ??? ??? ;D


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## CrewCab (Nov 19, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> That's when I hit on the idea of a hand cut before trying the tap. Just saved my bacon. ??? ??? ;D



Bob as you well know :bow: ...........  that's the difference between a "Fitter" and an "Engineer" .......... as an Engineer you find a way to make it work .... even if it means making it again, ..........and again ........err ........... etc  8)

Nice work ........as ever ....  8)  , now ........... who was it that suggested streaming the video of it's first trial run,  :

CC


----------



## Maryak (Nov 19, 2008)

Thanks CC,

Your comments as always helpful, complimentary and amusing. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







At its' 1st run I am sure there will be considerable streaming, but I doubt you'd want a video of this particular stream. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 19, 2008)

Hi Guys,

Despite our site problems, which I know our admins are working night and day to try and fix it, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 the show must go on.

Disaster with the fuel pipe, ah well, "Life was not meant to be easy," (quote by one of our more observant Prime Ministers).

Brass for the fuel pipe and valve seat






Threading the fuel pipe.






Test fit to carby body






Drilling the valve seat.






The valve seat






A poor mans collet for the fuel pipe






Disaster the fuel pipe snapped    - What did I learn ??? ??? The fuel pipe 1/16" hole must not extend up into the threaded section of the pipe. 
I made the collet too long straining the pipe when I removed it 






Gave up at this point and took me and my micrometer to the ladies sewing shop. Received some very odd looks when I miked the darning needles.  






Ah well tomorrow is another day and another fuel pipe. : :


----------



## wareagle (Nov 21, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> Gave up at this point and took me and my micrometer to the ladies sewing shop. Received some very odd looks when I miked the darning needles.



I can just see some old ladies now in a corner of the store... "Hey, what's that perv doing with the needles over there?" 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I am sure they had a head scratcher on that one for sure!!

Sorry to hear of your set back! I am quite certain that you get 'er done!! It looks great!!!  :bow:


----------



## Maryak (Nov 21, 2008)

W/E, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Thanks for your continued support and input, Friday was a dead duck, paperwork and more paperwork. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I should be grateful that it does not happen very often.

When that was done an afternoon nap 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 seemed far more attractive than a fuel pipe.

Things will slow now as we are busy making all our selections for our new home, (taps, baths, tiles etc.etc.) and we need to be sorted by 15 Dec.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Maryak (Nov 24, 2008)

Hi Guys,

Today saw fuel pipe No2. actually finished without any drama. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Here's a bit of a run down.

Attempt 2 - Note the big lump at the end for the centre.






A shorter poor mans collet.






The completed fuel pipe in the carby - (and that's where its staying) 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	









Knurling the Gland knut.






Threading the gland nut.






A view down the carby to check alignment.






The gland nut in place.






The darning needle at the darn right length to become a needle valve, (I hope). 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	









Hope you had a great weekend.

We spent the rest of the day selecting bricks and tomorrow is tile day wall and floors in the wet areas.


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## wareagle (Nov 24, 2008)

Bob,

I am glad to see you have the fuel pipe sorted! It is looking like this will be a runner here pretty soon!!

Best wishes,
W/E


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## Philjoe5 (Nov 24, 2008)

Bob,
Nice work on that carby. Thanks for the update,

Cheers,
Phil


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## Maryak (Nov 25, 2008)

W/E and Phil,

Thanks as ever guys for your continued support and encouragement 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




We (I) have had an exhausting day selecting all the wall and floor tiles for the kitchen, bathrooms, Toilets and Laundry. Early on there were a couple of tense moments. But I must say Galina's sense of style, colour and proportion is much better than mine and she only strayed from the spec by $200. A damn fine effort by Mrs M. :bow: :bow:

Tomorrow should see me relaxing making a needle valve 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Nov 25, 2008)

Well, blow me down the needle valve is finished and I made a start on the fuel tank
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Knurling the needle valve handwheel.






Threading the needle :






Test fit of the needle in the body.






The needle in the stem before soldering in place.






The gland is packed and the needle valve is in the carby.






A view down the inlet to show the needle valve on its seat.






The carby and engine.






Aluminium for the fuel tank top.






Counter boring the tank top before threading.






And that was that - Tomorrow is hummer the plumber for all our taps, baths, basins, sinks etc. - Wish me luck


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## Philjoe5 (Nov 26, 2008)

Looking smart Bob. A real engine is taking shape

Cheers,
Phil


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## Maryak (Nov 26, 2008)

Phil,

Thanks again. :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


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## CrewCab (Nov 26, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> Knurling the Gland knut.



Bob .............. are you sure that's legal allowed :

Joking aside though you are really on a roll now .......... absolutely brilliant thread and it's just going to get better I feel .......... thanks for taking the time to document your exploits 8)

Happy plumbing thingie's ;D

CC


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## deere_x475guy (Nov 26, 2008)

Bob one heck of a job on all of this. I am just now getting back to the site after being off for the summer. Took me awhile to read this entire thread but well work the time. Great job and looking forward to seeing more of your progress. Thanks for the effort you are puttin forth to picture document your progress. I know it can be a time consuming process in it self.


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## wareagle (Nov 26, 2008)

Bob, superb work there, my friend!! I think you have a nice runnner there!  :bow:


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## rake60 (Nov 26, 2008)

Keep the updates coming Bob.
I'm looking very much forward to seeing this animal come to life.

Rick


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## Chip (Nov 26, 2008)

Wow! Maryak, what a thread!!!!!! Many thanks for the ride!


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## Maryak (Nov 27, 2008)

CC, Bob, W/E, Rick and last but not least Chip,

To all of you a heart felt thanks for the support and encouragement. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			








 have had a great deal of pleasure documenting my exploits with this engine. (Not to mention a new camera :)

Our visit to the plumber went off pretty well and we came out still owning our shirts :big:

Best Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Nov 27, 2008)

It's Him Again, 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Managed to finish the fuel tank top before the plumbing selections 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Internal thread in the top - done by hand turning the lathe.






The finished thread. Looks a bit rough, but brasso and elbow grease should fix it. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	









Tapping the boss thread.






The whole thing so far.






All that remains is the fuel bowl which I hope will be soon.


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## T70MkIII (Nov 27, 2008)

Sorry I'm late to your party, Bob. Really enjoying it!

Regards
Richard

P.S. I'm ex-Adelaide; now Perth.


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## ksouers (Nov 27, 2008)

Wow, Bob!! You've really accomplished a lot in the past couple days!
It's really looking great.
It won't be long now :bow:

Kevin


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## Maryak (Nov 27, 2008)

T70MkIII  said:
			
		

> Sorry I'm late to your party, Bob. Really enjoying it!



Richard, thanks for your support and your not late.
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Kevin,

Thanks for your continued input. ;D

Best Regards to all,
Bob


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## Maryak (Nov 27, 2008)

THE ENGINE IS COMPLETE 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







Notice I didn't say finished. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




What's left ???

Make a stand.
Dismantle a little bling here and there, (never done this before   ).
Gasket Gue and paper gaskets.
Clean and re-assemble.
Buy a 9"x4" propeller.
Obtain the fuel ingredients. (Buy as a last resort :).

Before I get too carried away here's what went down today, (which included an awful lot of thanksgiving  )

Cutting the external thread on the tank.






The finished thread.






Knurling the tank body.






The top fitted to the tank - see I said brasso was useful.






The tank bored out.






Three views of the complete assembly - for the draftspersons (Paula see how your influence is spreading 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ) - it was done in awkward angle projection. :
















Have a great weekend.

Best Regards
Bob


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## wareagle (Nov 27, 2008)

Bob,

It looks great! Outstanding accomplishment, and excellent work! Congradulations on your achievement! 




Here's to success!!


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## ksouers (Nov 28, 2008)

Bob,
Way to go!! Congratulations on completing such a fine engine  :bow:

I suspect the first time that little engine barks we'll be able to hear the shouts of joy all the way over in this hemisphere!


Cheers,
Kevin


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## SERCEFLYER (Nov 28, 2008)

Beautiful machine!!!! 

My suggestions for the gaskets: just use a lucky card from an old playing deck. Go to an office supply store and get a circle cutter. There's a good Japanese brand that I use. It's basically a compass with an x-acto blade at the writing end. It's really easy to cut gaskets for the backplate and head this way. (Make sure to soak the gaskets in castor oil before assembling.)

I like your "darning" needle valve!!!

Good luck on getting a "first pop."

George


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## Maryak (Nov 28, 2008)

W/E, Kevin and George,

Thanks Guys 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










.

I am very sure there is a part of each person who has contributed to this topic somewhere in "ICB" and it's thanks to all of you that she's come this far.

Thanks for the tip about using a playing card for the gaskets. I am concerned that it could be a little thick between the crankcase and the cylinder, altering the timing and port positions, can you comment please.

Best Regards
Bob


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## T70MkIII (Nov 28, 2008)

Awesome achievement, Bob. Can't wait to see/hear how she runs!

What are you going to build next?


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## Maryak (Nov 28, 2008)

Richard,

Thanks for your support. :bow:

When it comes to video cameras and daughters, I think you have Brian and me mixed up. I don't know if my daughter even has a video camera. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Not to worry, when the time comes I'll set up the Canon on a tripod and see if I can make a video. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## T70MkIII (Nov 28, 2008)

Sorry, Bob - I edited as soon as I realised.


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## Philjoe5 (Nov 28, 2008)

Very nice work Bob. It's been great fun following your build and along with others I'm waiting to hear her go!

Cheers,
Phil


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## SERCEFLYER (Nov 28, 2008)

Bob,

Good point about the card thickness. I found my playing cards to be about 11 thou thick. It's a good idea to have a variety of gaskets so that you can experiment with different port timings. I also made 3 conrods that were different with about a 10 thou range in distance between crank pin and wrist pin holes. This provided an easy way to compensate for some accumulated error. 

You may want to rig a timing jig with a protractor just to make sure your port timings are as desired. Just bolt the protractor in place of a prop and rig up a block scriber so that you can indicate the markings off the side of the protractor. Then, flash a penlight into your cylinder while rotating the protractor (and the crankshaft) and note when the piston covers and uncovers the intake, transfer and exhaust ports. This will give you an idea of how close you are.

Best wishes!

George


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## CrewCab (Nov 28, 2008)

ksouers  said:
			
		

> I suspect the first time that little engine barks we'll be able to hear the shouts of joy all the way over in this hemisphere!



I'm expecting to be woken up by the screams of delight : ............ Bob ........... what more can I say ............. 20 21 pages of pure unadulterated good fun and top class work ......... :bow: I know it's been said before but ........... we all really appreciate the time you've taken to document and photograph each stage, it really is invaluable to us "less experienced" dude's 8)

Good luck with the first run ...................as well as a propeller how about an airboat ......... might as well have fun in style 

CC


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## Maryak (Nov 28, 2008)

Phil and George,

Thanks guys for the kind words and thanks for the timing info etc. :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Nov 28, 2008)

CC,

Thanks. :bow: :bow: For me the documenting and photographing have been part of the fun. The feed back and help received from this has been tremendous, more than worth the small effort on my part.

Richard asked what's next. I really am torn between a hit and miss engine or a boiler for the mill engine.

What's disturbing me a little is; I lean more towards the hit and miss because it's more in my comfort zone whereas a boiler is not in my comfort zone.

I suppose I should show a little intestinal fortitude and build a boiler, after all with the price of copper what it is what's a few mistakes : :

Best Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Dec 1, 2008)

Hi Guys,

Another week starts and today saw a stand made to hold the engine.

Some Aluminium for the stand







Milling the uprights.






And the base.






Marking out the base






The base drilled and counter bored for the cap screws.






Drilling the uprights.






The engine in the stand.






Tomorrow is stripping and cleaning and gasketing etc.


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## malcolmt (Dec 1, 2008)

Hi Bob
As with many others here i thank you for your serialising this amazing creation, Superb work. :bow: :bow: :bow:
I may just be being stupid but how are you going to fill the fuel tank ? also presumably there is a vent of some sort to allow air in as fuel is used up ? I'm sure i must have missed something in the story, perhaps you could point me in the right direction.

Fantastic work, Really looking forwards to the video.

Kind regards and much admiration.

Malcolm


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## Maryak (Dec 1, 2008)

Hi Malcolm,

Thank you for your kind words 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







The fuel tank unscrews from the tank lid, which in turn is screwed to the bottom of the carby. So, you remove the tank part, fill it and screw it back in place. The tank lid has a 1/16" breather hole drilled in the top. 

I hope that's cleared it up for you.

Thanks again 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## SandyC (Dec 1, 2008)

Hi Bob,

What can I say...... superb piece of work...... have 25 brownie points and a weeks holiday with pay.

A very good gasket material is BROWN parcel wrapping paper...... oiled with Castor oil when assembling.

For your fuel tank, you may need to make a sealing ring.... this can be from cork (thin) or better still, NEOPRENE sheet rubber.
Be sure it is NEOPRENE though...... SILICONE or VITON will swell and distort due to chemical reaction with ETHER and, to a lesser degree, PARAFIN (kerosene). NEOPRENE is inert from this attack.
The same goes for any fuel tubing you may need.

I was also wondering how you were going to fill the fuel tank, since I could not detect any breather/filler hole in the top plate (photo's), however, you have cleared that up in your last post.
Personally I would increase the size of the breather hole to 1/8" dia and fill via that, rather than having to keep removing the tank and trying to replace it with a partial fuel load..... guaranteed to spill me thinks.
But that's just me.&#160; ;D ;D ;D ;D

One final point....... I notice the propeller fixing appears to be using two hexagon nuts...... presumable the rear one is firmed up fully to the crankcase end of the thread on the crankshaft..... if not, and the prop is held just between the two nuts (with a washer either side), then there is a very great risk of it coming loose whilst running.
It would be more normal for there to be a fixed prop drive plate behind the propeller, usually fitted to a short tapered section on the shaft, or a flat (D shape) to prevent rotation, presumably there was nothing shown/detailed for this on your original plans?

Good luck on your hunt for sourcing your fuel ingredients, they are very difficult to get (especially ETHER) here in the UK.... but ready mixed fuel is not to hard to get.

My very best regards.

SandyC&#160; ;D ;D


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## wareagle (Dec 1, 2008)

Bob,

It looks like you are about to make some noise there! No doubt you have built a good 'un. Outstanding work!!  :bow: :bow:

In much anticipation of hearing some engine like sounds!! 

 
W/E


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## Metal Mickey (Dec 1, 2008)

Well I think its crap! :big:

Excellent thread and good honest reporting. Its the way we learn. Many thanks for the journey... :bow: :bow:


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## Maryak (Dec 1, 2008)

SandyC  said:
			
		

> One final point....... I notice the propeller fixing appears to be using two hexagon nuts...... presumable the rear one is firmed up fully to the crankcase end of the thread on the crankshaft..... if not, and the prop is held just between the two nuts (with a washer either side), then there is a very great risk of it coming loose whilst running.
> It would be more normal for there to be a fixed prop drive plate behind the propeller, usually fitted to a short tapered section on the shaft, or a flat (D shape) to prevent rotation, presumably there was nothing shown/detailed for this on your original plans?



Sandy,

Thanks for your kind words, yes there was nothing on the original plans other than a flywheel and starting pulley combination. At this point the prop is to give it load and a hand start capability, and yes the back nut is against the thrust collar on the crankcase to control end play in the crankshaft.

W/E

The time is fast approaching when the proof of the pudding is in the eating.



			
				Metal Mickey  said:
			
		

> Well I think its crap! :big:



Mike,

It's all your fault, it was you who pointed me in this direction from your website : :

Best Regards to the 3 of you.
Bob


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## Philjoe5 (Dec 1, 2008)

Bob, I see you are coming down the home stretch :bow: :bow:You are about 1-2 weeks ahead of me. I have nearly all the parts machined. I'm just now planning out my engine base. I'm doing mine with plywood first to test out my assumptions about how much clearance to put between all the components that slide onto my crankshaft. I just ordered my aluminum baseplate. 

It's been great fun watching your engine come together. It really looks great. 8) 8)

Cheers,
Phil

PS. Your choice of emoticons has always livened up the posts; keep those coming on your next project


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## Maryak (Dec 2, 2008)

Thanks Phil,

And I'm glad you like the emoticons. Half the fun of posting is trying to find the right one 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## joe d (Dec 2, 2008)

Bob

I've not posted any comments on this build to date, but I HAVE been following it with great interest.... and I have to add my two-cents worth: Great Job! :bow:

I've not yet tried one of these engines, but when I do, this thread will be an excellent resource. Thanks in advance, and please do document your next build to the same depth so I can steal more ideas.....

Cheers, Joe


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## Maryak (Dec 2, 2008)

joe d,

Thanks for your 2 cents worth and I am very glad you have found some of this useful. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Dec 5, 2008)

Well it's the end of another week and I suppose a lack of progress report is needed 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Things went very well with our building selections for the new home and that took up most of my time 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




On the engine front, I have obtained all the bits required to finish, including the fuel components and propeller 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Next week should see a dismantling, gasketing, cleaning and final assembly.

If that all goes according to Hoyle. We should be ready for a see if it will run late in the week. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Thanks to GailinNM for his help and advise in fuel mixing and the required ingredients. The fuel tank holds all of 20ml. So I'm real glad I bought an eye dropper 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




The photoklutz forgot his camera so you'll just have to look at the finished propeller pnuts next week. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## Philjoe5 (Dec 5, 2008)

Good going Bob 8). I'm anxious to see your first run :bow:

Cheers,
Phil


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## Maryak (Dec 5, 2008)

Phil,

Thanks as ever for your support - I hope you haven't lost my seat on Tweak Mountain 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## GailInNM (Dec 5, 2008)

It is looking very good Bob.  I think that you have covered all the details well. As long as the piston is twice as tight and the contrapiston is three times as tight as you think they should be then it will be a be a great runner. 

Have you decided on a next project to follow this one?

Gail in NM,USA


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## Maryak (Dec 5, 2008)

Thanks Gail,

Everything is as described by all you guys who have been around these engines and its just suck it and see time.

Best Regards
Bob


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## Metal Mickey (Dec 6, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> Mike,
> 
> It's all your fault, it was you who pointed me in this direction from your website : :
> 
> ...



You are too kind......so someone is reading it then! Can't wait for the video!


----------



## Maryak (Dec 8, 2008)

Hi All,

Again not much progress but the good news is that right now I am very hopeful we will mix some fuel and give ICB her first test tomorrow 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Gee that Castor oil is thick stuff had to really push to get the crankshaft back in the crankcase and had a high initial compression on reassembly. 

Just to show I wasn't kidding, a photo of the pnuts and propeller, a 9"x4"






Best Regards
Bob


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## dsquire (Dec 8, 2008)

Bob

Looking good. I've got my ear plugs in waiting. Good luck. :bow: :bow:

cheers

Don


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## T70MkIII (Dec 8, 2008)

Finger crossed from all in Perth!


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## Maryak (Dec 8, 2008)

Don, Richard, MM

Thanks for your continued support. The pucker factor is really kicking in and I have everything crossed 

























Best Regards
Bob


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## rake60 (Dec 8, 2008)

Let er eat Bob! 

Best wishes for a successful test run.

Rick


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## CrewCab (Dec 8, 2008)

OK .............. I'm stood on the garage roof looking South ........... how long till "Kick Off" ;D

No, I'm not really going to stand there all night : .......... Good luck Bob ........... looking forward to tomorrows instalment ....... or for you guys is it "Today's instalment" :

CC


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## jack404 (Dec 8, 2008)

Good luck with it Bob

lookin forward to seein this one run

watch ya digits eh!!

jack


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## Philjoe5 (Dec 8, 2008)

Bob,
Will be rootin' for ya here in wicked cold Pennsylvania, where castor oil would hardly flow at all. My seat in the "Tweak Zone" is now available should you need it. ;D

Cheers,
Phil


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## Maryak (Dec 8, 2008)

WOOPEEEEEEEEEEE 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	
















IT RUNS 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







As promised and at great expense to the management 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	











There was a fair bit of detonation in the first run so had a bit of a play with the fuel and this second run is a lot better but still a bit of tweaking.





Guys, I cannot thank you all enough for your support and encouragement. I am over the moon. :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


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## rake60 (Dec 8, 2008)

Gee I can't be sure Bob, but I think I'm hearing a bit of a miss on every fifth stroke. 




_Congrats! _





GREAT WORK!!!!!!!!!!!!
There is only one grin bigger than your own at this moment.
It belongs to me. 


Rick


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## Philjoe5 (Dec 8, 2008)

*HOORAY FOR BOB'S ENGINE* and, of course, to Bob the builder! Nice going Bob, it's been interesting to watch the process. :bow: :bow: :bow:

Cheers,
Phil


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## Macca (Dec 8, 2008)

Fantastic! Sounds like a swarm of bees.
Did it take a lot of tweaking?
Congratulations


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## dsquire (Dec 8, 2008)

Bob

Congratulations. Glad I had my hearing protection on. Sounds like you have a real good runner there. Job well done. :bow: :bow: :bow:

Cheers

Don


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## ksouers (Dec 8, 2008)

Bob, congratulations! Woo Hoo!!!

Now I know why I couldn't sleep last night, you're loud celebrating kept waking me up! ;D

Well done, and well earned  :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow:


Kevin


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## GailInNM (Dec 8, 2008)

Thats great Bob.
It not only looks good but it runs well also.
It's a great credit to you for getting your first IC engine running. Many first efforts don't run at all, but yours is fantastic.  :bow: :bow:
Gail in NM,USA


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## jack404 (Dec 8, 2008)

Bob she's a bottler

gret soundin too

well done mate , its been a class act all the way

i've learned a heap 

and have a lot to look forward too thanks to the doco'd way you have done this

beats a plan set and instruction book any day

thanks and again

bloody well done

cheers

jack


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## joe d (Dec 8, 2008)

Bob:
Congratulations! That is one really fine job of work. So, now the traditional HMEM question: What's Next?

Cheers mate, Joe


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## gjn (Dec 8, 2008)

Bob

Let me join the queue of people passing on their congratulations, it's a fitting end to a very enthralling and educational build, can't wait for the next engine.

Rgds - Gavin from up in the hills


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## Maryak (Dec 9, 2008)

Gentlemen,

Thank you so very much for your kind words, your support and your encouragement. You are all a very large and important part of my success. :bow: :bow: :bow: 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




There's quite a bit of missing, I think the kero is off spec, added a little petrol and it helped but not quite there yet. - Gail any suggestions ???

It's also very fuel hungry, about 10ml/min - normal ???

I am going to have to put some thread tape on the compression screw as it vibrates off its' setting, another reason for missing.

Lastly, me and my workbench, not to mention the engine covered in castor oil and ether, no wonder I,m sleepy 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




. Mine seems to be a very messy engine. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




I am home enjoying a couple of stiff brandies and coke 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Once again thanks to all. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Grins bigger than mine ??? ??? I find that hard to imagine 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 but thanks Rick.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## GailInNM (Dec 9, 2008)

Bob,
I can only offer a couple of suggestions.

Easy one first. Compression screw. 
The bottom of the compression screw should have the last bit of thread removed so none of the thread can touch the contra piston. Also, the end of the compression screw should have a recess in the center that is about 1/2 the diameter of the root diameter of the thread so you have a ring touching the contra piston. Both of these will reduce the tendency for the compression screw to wander while running. In extreme cases it may be necessary to add a lock nut of some kind. A scrap of something about 1mm thick and shaped like a keyhole with a tapped hole for the compression screw works well. A little more on this when discussing the missing.

Now the hard one. Missing and fuel consumption.
Adding petrol to compression ignition (CI) fuel is normally the wrong thing to do. Petrol has a self ignition temperature about 30 to 40 degrees higher than kerosene. Also the explosive limits of mixture are higher. The fact that it helped and your fuel consumption is a little high may be related. I would expect the consumption to be about 4 to 5 ml/min when the engine is broken in, or about half of what you are seeing. I doubt the kerosene quality is a problem. CI engines are very forgiving about the kerosene grade and most anything is fine as long as looks and smells like kero. I have never tried them, but I have been told that some of smokeless and perfumed lamp oils don't work too well because of all the additives.

Looking at all the above, I am guessing that the contra piston is too loose. Some time back I think I told you the contra piston needs to be 3 times tighter than what you think it should be. What I think is happening is that you are having to run a rich mixture to get enough oil to seal the contra piston. Adding petrol will force a richer mixture due to the higher explosive limit and increase the fuel consumption. Also a contra piston that moves at all during running will cause the compression screw to move. 

An undersize piston will also cause increased fuel consumption, but it is much more forgiving as it is moving and forms a dynamic seal. It also gets a lot more fresh oil every stroke which helps it seal. 
I don't think that is your problem. 

You did not say if you "doped" the fuel you mixed with an ignition promoter. At the speed your engine is running, I don't think doping the fuel with a nitrate or nitrite would have any real effect, but it might smooth it out some when it is broken in and running at higher speeds. I don't think would help with the missing. 

All of the above is a guess, but a guess based on building an running CI engines for quite a while. 

And yes, CI engines are ALL messy.

Gail in NM,USA


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## Maryak (Dec 9, 2008)

Gail,

Thanks very much for your comprehensive response to my queries.

Yes, the last 1/8" is free of thread; and no there is no recess in the bottom, (will fix that tomorrow).

Lamp oil in its natural state is in fact 300 test kerosene used in Hartridge machines for setting diesel fuel pumps and injectors. (A snippet from Bob's glossary of useless knowledge). The perfumes and dyes added by various religious orders definitely reduce its' performance as a fuel.

I hear what your saying about the contra piston. If I had to push any harder to get it into the cylinder, I would say it was a 1:1 interference fit - maybe that's whats needed ???

There is no dope in my mix, other than the dope doing the mixing :

When I remove the compression screw tomorrow I will be able to see how much fuel is under the head. There was minimal leakage around the screw and non down the sides between the head and cylinder.

It's good to know all CI engines are messy. I smelled like a cross between an anesthetist and a drug lord : 

Once more thanks for your prompt response and support :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## seagar (Dec 9, 2008)

Congratulations on a great build and comentary.I am an old model aero team racer and raced diesel engines for years .The fuel mix I used was 48% Kero.30%either 20% castor oil nd 2% amel nitrate .

Have fun , Ian.


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## T70MkIII (Dec 9, 2008)

You're the man, Bob! Great job. I can't wait to see what's next...


----------



## max corrigan (Dec 9, 2008)

Good work Bob sounds great i gotta try something like that one day, yer overalls came out good too 
regards Max..........


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## kustomkb (Dec 9, 2008)

Fanastic engine!, and thread!

Great work!


----------



## NickG (Dec 9, 2008)

Bob that is fantastic! How fast do you reckon it is running? About 9000rpm?!


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## Maryak (Dec 9, 2008)

Thanks Guys, :bow: :bow:

I am so thrilled it even ran 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





Glad you like the close up of my overalls, I didn't realise at first that I was standing in front of the camera. :

Today will be a tweak day.

I have a rev counter so will try and find the speed.

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## GailInNM (Dec 9, 2008)

Bob,
In the US at least, rule of thumb means non precise way of checking or evaluating things. On small, 1/2 to 2 cc CI engines, my rule of thumb for contra piston fit is literally a rule of thumb. If I can push the contra piston into position with my thumb, then the fit is too loose.

From your operating setting, if you back the compression screw off a half turn or so and then turn the prop over smartly while holding on to the prop, as opposed to flipping it, you should feel when the contra piston breaks free and moves. At the same time that happens, you can hear the click as the contra piston breaks loose and strikes the compression screw. This is difficult to describe, but once you have done it once you will know it forever.

Ian,
If Bob is following my recommendation for fuel mix, he is running about 35 percent oil. While the amount of oil you were using is good for high performance engines that have front rotary valve and ball bearings, it is not enough for a sideport induction engine with sleeve bearings. I know his is really a rearport, but somehow they are always referred to as sideport, at least on this side of the pond.  It is difficlult to get enough oil on the crankshaft sleeve bearing. On front rotary sleeve bearing, the percentage of oil can be reduced some as the crankshaft bearing is getting fresh oil all the time. If ball races are used, then the oil can be reduced even more. 

I also recommended that he not bother with the amel nitrate or other ignition promoter as, in my opinion, it does very little at under 10k RPM, although it may make starting a little easier. At higher RPM it has very definite effects on smoothing out an engine. It is also difficult to source any of the suitable dopes in the USA with the current concerns about explosives here. I suspect that it is not much different in most of the world. 

Gail in NM,USA


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## seagar (Dec 9, 2008)

Gail I will mind my own business in future.

Ian


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## GailInNM (Dec 9, 2008)

Ian,
I was not in anyway meaning to offend you. I am sure that Bob appreciated your comments, and they are welcomed. I am no expert, just someone who has found out what works for me, just as you know what works for you. Each engine is different and there is a good possibility that Bob will end up running something different than what either one of us recommend. 

Bob sent me a PM asking for a recommendation and I had responded by PM with what I thought would be a safe starter fuel to get his engine running. Part of the tweaking process is playing with fuel and knowing what others are doing is a big help. Looking back, those PMs probably should have been part of the thread, and a lot of that information was in my last post. 

If I worded things wrong, please accept my apologies. I meant no ill will.

Gail in NM,USA


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## CrewCab (Dec 9, 2008)

Bob, I don't log in for a few hours and your thread gets 3 new pages 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 ............. OK I know it's mi' age and I'm getting slower 

Firstly ............ blimey it's a fast little beggar ;D

Secondly ............. Very well done Sir ....... Be very proud, you have every right, it's a cracking runner 

Thirdly ........... thank you for sharing the pictures of your butt ............ : .......... just what we all needed ;D  ;D



Congrat's Bob ......... top class work .............. as ever :bow:


CC


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## Maryak (Dec 9, 2008)

Seagar and Gail,

Thank you both for the time you have taken and the various options you have given me for fuels and fixes :bow: :bow:

Seagar,

I know Gail quite well from PM's and the other side of our forum. Please be assured the last thing he would want is to offend anybody.

Best Regards to you both
Bob


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## Maryak (Dec 9, 2008)

CrewCab  said:
			
		

> Thirdly ........... thank you for sharing the pictures of your butt ............ : .......... just what we all needed ;D  ;D



CC, Thanks for all of your comments, the above was by far the most appropriate 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







Yes it proves I am a Photoklutz. To present my best view to the camera once, maybe, butt 3 times : : : what more can I say. ???

Best Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Dec 9, 2008)

No tweaking today and probably tomorrow due to tanks and electrical selections.

Best Regards
Bob


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## Metal Mickey (Dec 10, 2008)

Bob, what can I say. Superb! Yes there are many things people can add to the running BUT IT RUNS and at speed so that's brilliant! I am so impressed that I would like to add a link from my website to your video and this threads link. Would you have any objection?

Once again, well done......what are you going to use it for, anything? Or is it built just for the hell of it?
 :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow:


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## Maryak (Dec 10, 2008)

Mike,

Thank you for your very kind words. :bow:

I am flattered 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 that you want to link it to your website and of course I am more than happy for you to do so.

I started this engine in the main because I could not afford the copper to build a boiler for my mill engine. I am afraid that for me to build a steam engine and not run it with steam leaves me with a feeling of an incomplete project.

That's just me and is NOT intended in any way to detract from some of the marvellous steam engines which have been built with great accuracy and run on very small air pressures and at very low revs.

So not only is it my 1st IC engine but it is, (in my mind), my 1st completed model project.

During the build process I have become hooked on model IC engines, (12" : 1ft I still prefer steam).

That was a very long winded way of saying I built it to see if I could.

Without the support of this forum and its members, I doubt I would have finished or had any record of what I did and why.

Thanks to all and to all :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


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## wareagle (Dec 10, 2008)

Bob, nothing more I really can add to the comments already made. A big hearty congrats for a job well done both on the engine as well as documenting the journey and taking all of us along with you!!!  :bow: :bow: :bow:


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## Maryak (Dec 10, 2008)

W/E,

As one of the mainstays of my support team from the very beginning, A HEARTFELT THANKS. :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


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## Philjoe5 (Dec 10, 2008)

Bob,
I get your thinking on the steam engines. I've been contemplating a boiler build, but, I also have access to steam lines at the Kinzers Rough & Tumble Museum right near my house. I go to all the model engine shows there so I can test one of my engines on steam before I go through the effort of boiler making. All I need to do is build a displacement oiler and I'm good to go. I know at some point I'll get the experience needed to build an IC engine but that's another one of those future projects.

Meanwhile, you taught me a lot about building an IC engine and I also finally learned the art of using the emoticon successfully 

 



Cheers,
Phil


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## CrewCab (Dec 10, 2008)

Maryak  said:
			
		

> To present my best view to the camera once, maybe, butt 3 times : : : what more can I say. ???



Bob, 
Your sense of humour coupled with your obvious engineering skill ............. plus ........ the willingness to share the "bloopers" as well as the good times are what has made this thread what it is ............ an outstanding success ......... and don't just take my word 8) ........ look at the stat's for yourself 


 ..                    *>>Click Here<<*


Topics by views ........ No: 4
Topics by replies ....... No: 1

and in very good company I wood add :bow: ................although .............. how you are going to beat this one I'm not sure ......... but I'm already looking forward to it ;D

CC :bow:


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## Maryak (Dec 10, 2008)

Phil and Dave,

THANKS :bow: 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	










Best Regards
Bob


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## Paolo (Dec 11, 2008)

Congrat's Bob a very top class work !! Well documented as ever ! Thanks for sharing with us..
Best regards
Paolo


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## Maryak (Dec 11, 2008)

Paolo,

Thanks for your kind words. :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Dec 12, 2008)

YOU ARE NOW ENTERING THE TWEAK ZONE​

After reading and digesting the advise from Gail and Seagar. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 I decided to make a new Contra Piston. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




This time I used the David Owen method as recommended by George, (Serceflyer). 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Let me tell you this is the absolute best way to make the contra piston, so without further ado here's my interpretation of the method.

A lump of spun cast iron for the new cp. The piston is turned down to 0.015" oversize.






End milling the cp to give a thin wall piston (1/32")






The cp ready for parting off






Brass for the cp mandrel.






The cp glued to the madrel with super glue.






After facing the cp, the compound slide is set over 1/2 deg.






The cp is now turned down with this slight taper, using the compound slide, until about 1/4 of its' length will enter the cylinder. At this point fine 440 grit emery lubricated with oil and a flat bar are used to further reduce the dia of the cp until about half of its' length will enter the cylinder.

BELIEVE IT OR NOT - THAT'S IT 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





NO LAPPING

The finished Contra Piston.






A little heat and a wooden clamp removed the piston from the mandrel.

The engine was re-assembled the new contra piston was tapped into place with a brass dolly.

Below is the result - the rev counter showed 7000rpm.





What's left ???, another turn of thread on the compression screw.

Best Regards
Bob


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## GailInNM (Dec 12, 2008)

Looking and sounding good Bob. I think you are sneaking up on it. 

It looks like it is starting easy enough so you have plenty of good ether. After you get some time on it, you can probably cut the fuel with a little more kero to reduce the kero to oil/ether ratio and get a little more RPM.

Just don't go below about 27 percent oil with a sleeve bearing and you should be safe. I would not change anything until you get about 30 minutes on the engine. If you start reducing the oil, start checking the front bearing temperature with your hand and if it starts to get hotter, then go back up a little bit on the oil.

Gail in NM,USA


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## Maryak (Dec 12, 2008)

Thanks Gail,

I will play with the compression screw next and see where that leads. I feel just a touch more compression will take out the miss and give a few more rpm. Fuel consumption has improved by about 30% with the new CP.

Best Regards
Bob


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## rake60 (Dec 12, 2008)

I have never build an IC engine myself.

I sure am enjoying watching this thread Bob! :bow:
Beautiful works indeed!

Rick


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## Maryak (Dec 12, 2008)

Thanks Rick, :bow:

One more tweak on the screw and then it's thinking time for what's next ??? ???

Best Regards
Bob


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## kustomkb (Dec 12, 2008)

Sounds great!

The view from Tweak Mountain must be sweet! 8)

Kevin.


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## Maryak (Dec 12, 2008)

kustomkb  said:
			
		

> Sounds great!
> 
> The view from Tweak Mountain must be sweet! 8)
> 
> Kevin.



Thanks Kevin, :bow:

Yes I'm pretty chuffed at having a runner  

Best Regards
Bob


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## jack404 (Dec 12, 2008)

It a little ripper Bob

well done 

as to whats next 

please doco it like this one for the lesser mortals here

cheers and well done eh

jack


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## Philjoe5 (Dec 12, 2008)

Great video Bob.  Looks like you'll need to pass on your seat in the Tweak Zone:bow: :bow:

Cheers,
Phil


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## Maryak (Dec 12, 2008)

Phil,

After I've screwed the compression screw and unscrewed my butt, the seat will be vacated for the next Tweaker, adjustments "All for your safety and comfort my dear!!" occupant.

Best Regards
Bob


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## SERCEFLYER (Dec 12, 2008)

Bob,

What can I say-- brilliant stuff here!!!! You really should contact your fellow Oz resident, Ron Chernich and tell him about this thread. I think he'd love to display your work on his webbsite, www.modelenginenews.org.

This has been a great instruction on building a traditional engine from the 40's.

Thanks for taking us along for the ride. I have a 3-month-old boy at home, so "armchair machining" is the best I can do at the moment.

Best,
George


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## Maryak (Dec 13, 2008)

George,

Thanks for your kind words and help along the way. The darning needle and the contra piston advise were especially helpful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







 :bow: :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


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## Maryak (Dec 16, 2008)

I've been pretty well flat out with the new house and tanks

But Yes dare I say it - ICB is finished 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Here is my swansong on this topic and a HUGE thank you to all who participated. :bow:





Best Regards
Bob


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## SandyC (Dec 16, 2008)

;D

Hi Bob,

A truly great piece of model engineering, my most sincere congratulations to you.

This whole build series, warts and all, has demonstrated just how dedication, perseverance and willingness to remake necessary components WILL lead to a just reward.
It has been a great pleasure to follow your progress over the past few months.

Not only have you built a wonderfull example of a VINTAGE 40's aero engine, you have also shown the way with your skills in movie making.
That, my friend, is one of the best video's I have watched on model engines and I consider it a great honour to be included in the credits given to all who contributed.

What's next?..... tough act to follow.

Congratulations again Bob.

I wish you all the best with your new home and hope you and your good lady manage to have a great Christmas and a peacefull New year.

SandyC. ;D  ;D


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## Cliff (Dec 16, 2008)

I would like to congratulate you on a fantastic build it has inspired me to try to built a engine and put my almost forty years of machining experience to work. I thoroughly enjoyed following the build from the start thanks for the experience. Cliff


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## Philjoe5 (Dec 16, 2008)

Bob, the video was great. Sounds like you've got the tuning down. It seems to run smoothly, congratulations. And hats off for sharing the build process with us.

Cheers,


Phil


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## malcolmt (Dec 16, 2008)

:big: :bow: :big: :bow: :big: :bow: :big: :bow: :big: :bow: :big: :bow: :big: :bow:

BOB
Heartfelt congratulations on a super job, I am sure we all learned something from your generous serialising of this build.
Many thanks for the video finale.
Kind regards

Malcolmt


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## joe d (Dec 16, 2008)

Bob

Happy for you that the tuning has worked out to a really nicely running engine. Thanks again for bringing us all along for the ride. Now that you've gone and put my name in the credits I'll have to shell out for membership in the actor's union :big:

Cheers, Joe


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## T70MkIII (Dec 17, 2008)

Beautiful work, Bob. I've enjoyed reading this build diary immensely and learned a lot along the way. Thanks, and congratulations.


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## Metal Mickey (Dec 19, 2008)

b, your engine is grand and the video! Is there no end to your talents? Nice idea to mention the reprabates on here. Well done, you should be very proud. I know I am for you. Mike


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## SERCEFLYER (Dec 24, 2008)

Is there any chance that Bob's little beauty could be nominated for the "Engine of the Month?" I think it might encourage others to do such a great job of documenting and sharing.

And, use emoticons ;D ;D  :bow: :bow:

George


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## GailInNM (Dec 26, 2008)

I know I am late Bob, but congratulations on a very successful build. I have enjoyed the ride along with you. 
Gail in NM,USA


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## Maryak (Dec 27, 2008)

Gail,

Better late than never and my most sincere thanks for your help and support especially in the latter stages of the build. :bow:

George,

Thanks for your remarks. :bow:

Best Regards
bob


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## BronxFigs (Apr 29, 2013)

Dumb question for the forum members, from a total amateur....

Can this kind of engine be super-sized?  Scaled up, like the "Double Dyno"....say 2-1/2 times larger?    Port areas, and a few other things will change, but can it be done to these type engines?

Can the engine be throttled to run a little slower, or is it the nature of the beast to always be a high RPM-er?

Just curious.

Frank


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