# N.A.M.E.S. 2010



## putputman (Mar 5, 2010)

I plan to attend the N A M E S show in April for the first time and really looking forward to it. My two younger brothers and I are taking a little road trip and I expressed an interest in the engine show and they agreed. Our plans are to drive through northern Wisconsin to the U P of Michigan, down through the L P of Michigan, cross over to Detroit for the show, and come home by way of Canada.

It is my understanding that the show has moved back to an old location that was used for many years. Not being familiar with the Detroit area, I am looking for some advice as to hotel/motel recommendations from some of you who have been there in the past. It is still a ways off but I would like to get my reservations in fairly soon.

Also open to other places of interest in the Detroit area.

It sounds like George and Steve will be displaying their engines at the show. I'm wondering how many more HMEM members plan to be there. It would be nice to meet some of you at the show.


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## IronHorse (Mar 5, 2010)

I am thinking of attending this year. I have never gone to a model engine show, but I am sure it would be interesting. Although it is an 8 hour drive from Toronto, and I hate driving, maybe this year I will go.


IronHorse


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## rodan (Mar 5, 2010)

Guys,

Although it has been many years since I attended the show, it is a good one.

Can't make any motel/hotel recommendations. But I can recommend you make some time to go to the Henry Ford Museumin Dearborn:

The Henry Ford
20900 Oakwood Blvd.
Dearborn, MI 48124-4088

http://www.thehenryford.org/index.aspx


This is a great museum for the technically inclined. The collection there is quite varied but very interesting. Well worth the price of admission.

Enjoy the trip

Rodan


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## ChooChooMike (Mar 5, 2010)

I HEARTILY recommend *rodan* suggestion ! I visited the Henry Ford Museum and Greenfield Village last year and LOVED it !! 

Being a steam engine nut, I was quite enamored with huge collection of stationary steam engines in the museum and the locomotives running around Greenfield Village 

Unfortunately, I was only there for about 1/2 day and couldn't see everything I had wanted. :rant:

GO !!

Mike


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## kuhncw (Mar 5, 2010)

I am planning to give the nearby La Quinta a try this year. Its on-line reviews seemed a bit more favorable than for some of the other choices. www.tripadvisor.com 

Hopefully, I've made a good choice. 

Regards,

Chuck Kuhn


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## RonGinger (Mar 5, 2010)

> I am thinking of attending this year. I have never gone to a model engine show, but I am sure it would be interesting. Although it is an 8 hour drive from Toronto, and I hate driving, maybe this year I will go.
> 
> 
> IronHorse



There is a Model Engineering club from Toronto that has come by chartered bus for several years. I dont know their exact name or a contact, but if you dig around you ought to find it. That might be more pleasant than driving alone.

I have 900 miles and about 16 hours to drive, so Im not very sympathetic to your mere 8 hour ride ;D

It is moving back to the Southgate Ice Rink, which is much smaller than the last few shows in Toledo. I prefer Toledo, but Ill still go, I wouldnt miss the show


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## 1hand (Mar 5, 2010)

I was going to try to attend, but its the same weekend as my girls dance production. I got to be there to make sure the money was spent on the lessons.... ;D

Matt


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## stevehuckss396 (Mar 5, 2010)

There is a page on the NAMES web site that gives the names of all the local motels and resturants. 

http://www.modelengineeringsoc.com/hospitality.htm

I am hoping to blow off work early and get down to the arena friday. That seems to be the only time that you get to see anything when you show stuff.


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## Quickj (Mar 5, 2010)

Arv,
I normally do not miss this show, but this year my spouse made arrangements for a vacation in Florida over the same time period as NAME's so I will have to miss it. I normally drive the southern route down around Chicago, but Neal James normally drives the northern route as you are proposing. It takes me 12 Hours exactly from Minneapolis.

I can't recommend a hotel near Southgate, because the show has been in Toledo for a couple of years. Before the show moved to Toledo, Scott Logan (From Logan Lathes) hosted a dinner party every year on Friday evening at the Holiday Inn and I have stayed there a couple of times. Certainly not the worse place I have stayed in Detroit.

Like everyone else, I recommend you take in the Ford Museum while you are there. I would Drive down Thursday, Take in Ford on Friday (All Day), Go to NAMEs on Saturday, and a couple of hours on Sunday and drive home. Actually 2 days at Ford and Greenfield village would be better.

Enjoy the show. Sure wish I could join you all.


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## putputman (Mar 5, 2010)

Thanks for the replies. 

Rodan & Mike, it sounds like the Ford museum is a must see when in the Detroit area. Will see If I can get the bros. to go along with it.

Ron, are you saying the show is much smaller or just the show area is smaller?
I am hoping it is still one of the major engine shows in the USA.

Steve, I have seen the NAMES web site but am hoping to get recommendations from some HMEM members that have been their before. Maybe even a place that members hang out in the evening.
Looking forward to seeing that POM engine of yours at the show.

Quickj, my heart really bleeds for you having to spend time in Florida with your best friend after one of these long Minnesota winters.
I'm sure we will meet at LeSueur or Albany. Have a good trip.

Still would like hotel/motel recommendations from members who have been there.


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## RonGinger (Mar 7, 2010)

> Ron, are you saying the show is much smaller or just the show area is smaller?
> I am hoping it is still one of the major engine shows in the USA.



The location is much smaller than Toledo. Of course there is no way to tell how many exhibitors will attend, there are some that thought that moving to Toledo caused some of the Detroit exhibitors to not attend. For those of us driving hundreds of miles it seems silly that a 30 mile move of the show would make any difference to the attendance.

The show was at this same location for 5 or 6 years before the move to Toledo. It is a city owned Ice Arena. There are 2 rinks, and at this time of year one rink has been 'de-iced' and is used as a general show site. The first year the entire show was on the one rink, and it was rather crowded. The next couple years they expanded by putting down some plywood sheets on the ice. It was a terrible place for a show- your feet froze.

They will not be using the ice side this time, so its back to one rink. If they get a normal turnout its going to be crowded. 

The show is run by a committee of about a dozen people. I understand there have been lots of debate over the location. I suspect Toledo cost a lot more money, and may have been more than they can afford.

In my personal view I really wish it were in Toledo- I really liked the location. We stayed right there in the connected hotel and it made it all very easy. But I would not miss the show, so Ill go wherever they move it.


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## PTsideshow (Mar 19, 2010)

Here is the Hotel/Motel list for the area around the NAMES location.

We started to install the piping for the air manifold system in the area. Yesterday, as somebody in the last couple of years had removed most of the piping. But it will be back in for the show. We will be using the east arena known as arena 'B'. and the meeting room near the dining/food service area to the east.

Sounds like we will have a full list of vendors as the booths and tables are all spoken for.

When calling about the rooms.

Remember to ask for the NAMES room Rate









> For those of us driving hundreds of miles it seems silly that a 30 mile move of the show would make any difference to the attendance.


And to address the above statement. It was one group of people that didn't get their way about things at the show. And had a hissie fit. That was talking that up, most didn't take an active part in the set up or operation of the show.

All though I feel with the problems they had in their own groups at the time caused a lot of the huff and puff stuff. Too many people that have "NO" connection or "DIRECT" knowledge with the show are making statements about the what and why of the changes as to the location. And other things going on.

A number of the Board members retired/ left the board. Some due to their moving to Florida and would no longer be able to take part in the year long activities of the business end. Some due to declining or worsening health and have reduced their participation, to a minimum or retired from the board.
Now you add to those facts that, the people that displayed are getting older. And are finding it harder to drive to the shows no matter were they are held. 

Part of the problem was that the Canadian people that bussed it to the shows found the extra time it took to get there, That it doubled the number of drivers according to the laws to get there and made it cost prohibitive. 

The other item is most of the Boards members and active volunteers now reside in southeast Michigan or Canada. With in a 100 miles or so of the arena. 

There is also just the general drama of some peoples need to get something started and stir crap up, to try to ruin things for everybody else! If you have spent 20 minutes on the forums or in group of hobby people you know the kind of thing I'm talking about.

It's to bad but that is life. 

FYI It takes a week to set the show up in the arena whether it was Seagate or Yack or at Southgate. Everything from laying out the table spaces and isles to setting up and covering the tables to the airlines etc. are done by volunteers or arena staff payed by the group renting the arena.

We will be back there at least more two days to finish up the reinstall the manifolds etc. before the setup.

There was a new management company that took over Seagate arena for the City of Toledo, They wanted to double the rent and other costs for the show.

I will be posting the sheet for exhibitors, Fuel rules and safety as soon as I get a corrected copy. Different fire departs different rules or interpretation of the rules.

Any other questions, I will try to answer or get the answers too.


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## PTsideshow (Mar 20, 2010)

Here is some more information and changes that might be of interest to those thinking of attending.

There will be a space as in the past for static display of large scale outdoor RR equipment. And the large scale tractors inside. Due to space limitations there will not be either an oval or straight section of track inside the arena area for running.

There is some thing being worked out about the local track and shuttle buses to and from the arena, Details as soon as they are available.


Seminar list should be available soon.

There are no Vendor Tables Available for this years (2010 Show) By city ordnance,there is no selling from trailer,trunk,car or free standing outdoors set ups. The city said it will be enforced!

Friday is set up day for exhibitors. Setup time is 8:00 AM to 6:00 PM Friday.


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## PTsideshow (Mar 20, 2010)

There are NO MORE VENDOR tables for rent at THIS YEAR SHOW 2010

There are over 120 tables including Booth tables that have been Rented for this year.

Also please read the following:

You can not sell from the exhibitor tables, And to clarify some statements e mailed to me. "NO" as far as I have been able to find "NO ONE" has ever been given permission to sell from the exhibitor tables at any time in the past. They are for display only. We have removed people in the last couple of years that have broken that rule.

This year due to space N.A.M.E.S. as a group, was not going to have a sales table for exhibitors as in past years.

But either the group or the guy that has run the exhibitors sales tables the last couple years. Has rented some vendor tables and is planning to let people sell items on the tables on a commission basis.
I have no other information on it. I also don't know if it is just him or the group he is with doing it. A live steam RR group out of Ohio.

Bottom line is if you sell it you better be on a VENDORS tables. And people have tried being sneaky about it. They don't get away with it much. As the other exhibitors, vendors and customers let us know!

The only other set in stone selling rule is NO Knives, Guns are allowed with open access on the tables or for sale. 

By city ordnance,there is no selling from trailer,trunk,car or free standing outdoors set ups. The city said it will be enforced!


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## PTsideshow (Mar 20, 2010)

*2010 Seminar Schedule*

The 2010 seminar schedule has been finalized. But due to circumstances beyond our control can be changed.

Once again this year we have a fine line-up of seminars for you to attend. All seminars will be in two areas. Seminar A and B will be located on the 2nd floor at the south end of the arena. Please look for the signs.

Saturday, April 24, 2010  
Time--------Room------Presenter--------------Subject  

10:00 AM-----A---------Mike Rehmus--------3D CAD to Casting

10:00 AM-----B---------Rich Carlstedt-------Unique Methods of Model Part Fabrication (Including "Micro" Forge) 

12:00 PM-----A---------Dale Grover----------Getting Started With EMC, Free Open Source CNC Control Software

12:00 PM-----B---------Jerry Kieffer----------Basic Gear Cutting  

2:00 PM------A---------Ron Ginger------------Adventures in Home Shop CNC

2:00 PM------B---------Rick Chownyk---------Building a Backyard Foundry   

Sunday, April 25, 2010 
 Time------Room---------Presenter-----------Subject 

10:00 AM-----A---------Phil Shannon---------Try This (35 Years Worth of Machining and Bench Tips) 

10:00 AM-----B---------Dale Grover----------Getting Started With EMC, Free Open Source CNC Control Software


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## PTsideshow (Mar 21, 2010)

Didn't realise that this wasn't the original thread.
Here is the link to the flyer and map of the local area
 ;D


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## putputman (Mar 21, 2010)

PTsideshow, this will be my first national engine show like this. Not sure what to expect.

Is there plenty of parking at the show?

Is there shuttle service from the hotels? 

Are there food vendors for breakfast, lunch, etc.?

Does HMEM have a booth or meeting place? 

Looking foreward to meeting some of the people that have been posting.


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## PTsideshow (Mar 21, 2010)

There is plenty of free parking around the arena. There food vendors that service the arena. The usual stadium food with a dining area that has plate type meals.

The hotels/motels are spread all over the place so its drive yourself to the show.

There are also plenty of the usual fast food joints and other family style restaurants. in the area. 

The only shuttle service is for the wives/ladies to go to the mall. And a shuttle to the live steam groups tracks for rides Great Lake Live steamers.

Don't think HMEM has a booth or table. As a Meeting place generally those that are going pick a time and spot to meet, along with making up a small tag or sign and wear them.

If you are setting up to display your engines you can have a sign says that you are looking for other forum members. That is another good way to snag bodies as they walk by.

Before it's here I will post the final layout


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## PTsideshow (Mar 22, 2010)

Here is the layout as planned for 2010 show




Green Tables are the exhibitors tables 
Red Tables are the vendors tables and Booths are two tables
NORTH is to the right of the drawing

And please the layout is not open for discussion, Due to City Fire and Safety Ordinances, walkways widths and pathways to the fire exits are set.


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## PTsideshow (Mar 26, 2010)

Well all the air manifolds, are in area "B" and we are good to go for the show. They have a couple of more tournaments over the next couple of weeks ends then they will take the sheet of ice out.


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## PTsideshow (Apr 3, 2010)

Due to the number of emails and PM's that I have received on this and other forums about the tables! The numbers of, and sizes of the display and number of items,reserving space etc. et all.

First off I am a *Volunteer*, I am not a Director, nor do I have any say in what the Board does etc.

What I have been told is an answer to two common questions:

1 THERE ARE NO RESERVED TABLE SPACE OTHER THAN THE VENDOR TABLES!

2 And don't bring everything you own, just your best work.


Please do not contact me about tables.
I WILL NOT HOLD ANY TABLE SPACE FOR ANYBODY!

If you have any question s Please contact the person on the flyer Mike Danko by phone 419-708-1366 or by email the email on the flyer for general info

thanks


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## cfellows (Apr 16, 2010)

Hope some of you fellas take lots of pictures for us guys that can't make it. I've been to several of these shows and really love'm, but just can't justify the expense anymore.

Chuck


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## Bill Mc (Apr 16, 2010)

Hi fellas - Wish I had a passport so that I too could go to this years N.A.M.E.S. from Ontario, Canada. However I have been to the Ford Museum at Dearborn Michigan 3 times through the years. It is fantastic there. They have trains, planes and automobiles of every description there as well as ALL other collectibles. There is lots of things there for the ladies to look at whilst the men are over at the N.A.M.E.S. show. You should really spend two days at the Ford museum. I usually walk/run through the exhibits in one day but by the end of the day I am dragging my A__.  Have a good time. - Billmc


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## PTsideshow (Apr 17, 2010)

They announced this past week that the village will be open on a daily basis now. The weather looks to be in the low 60's for next weekend high's, and lower 40's as the lows. As well as you can believe the weather guessers! 

FOR THOSE COMING TO THE SHOW AND USING A MOTEL THAT IS ON THE LIST, REMEMBER TO MENTION THAT YOU ARE THERE FOR THE N.A.M.E.S. GROUP DISCOUNT.
 :big:


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## putputman (Apr 17, 2010)

PT, is there a list of venders and display people that is available?


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## PTsideshow (Apr 17, 2010)

There is one that is a list of the tables that the vendors have paid for there is nothing that I have access to. The program booklet is currently at the printers, So the exhibitors packets with the plaque and pin aren't complete yet. There never is an exhibitors list, as there is no preregistration.

There will be around 50 plus vendors, most of the regulars. A couple of the old line regular vendors have sold out to somebody else or not coming this.
Paul Jacobs will not be there due to health reasons, and Myers engine works will not be there due to their move/retirement to FLA. plus a couple more.


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## PTsideshow (Apr 17, 2010)

Here is the current update





Here is the hall A Denude of ice and rink walls, from the second floor balcony.




This shot is of the big news the rink management decided to take down the part of the wall and penalty box, in front of the back entry and exit to the dinning room and the smaller vendors area. In the past they always left it up and it has caused a traffic bottle neck in that area.

The exhibitors tables that were in this area, will be moved to the walkway area that was the path to get here. This will make it a lot easier. Than any of the previous years.

Also anybody that is local and has some free time on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday and would like to volunteer to help with the set up feel free to come on down to the arena about 9:30 10:am


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## PTsideshow (Apr 19, 2010)

Day one of set up
Setting up the overheard air, and electric supply, wire rope hung between the arena uprights. Divider down the center of vendors row. And sorting air lines


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## PTsideshow (Apr 20, 2010)

Set up day two




Blue covered tables are the exhibitors, and the red covered tables are the vendors.




This is the thruway to and from the small vendors area, this area in the past. Was the cause of a lot of complaints, it shouldn't be a problem any more.




Looking at the vendors row from the North end.


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## PTsideshow (Apr 21, 2010)

Day three of the set up




Looking down toward the back end of the hall/Rink B




Looking to the south end towards the registration tables




Floor level looking towards the back or North end, all the piping and air lines are in and reworked from the change from Toledo layout.


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## cfellows (Apr 21, 2010)

Man, you're breaking my heart...

Chuck :'(


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## stevehuckss396 (Apr 21, 2010)

Went down and helped with the air pipe. Met PTsideshow and a few other good people. Going to spend tomorrow packing up and will head down friday!!


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## Jadecy (Apr 21, 2010)

I almost missed getting a vendor table this year because I waited too long. My table will be right in the food area. ;D 


*Don't forget the small group of vendors that are off the main floor by the food!*

I am bringing some interesting stuff this year so stop by and see me if you get a chance. Come introduce yourself if we haven't met or say hi if we have already met at a different show. I will also have a nice carnival display run by a steam engine. Let me know you are a member of HMEM and I will give you an extra 5% off. 

*Executive Model Design*

My name is Doug (aka Jadecy)



See you there!


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## PTsideshow (Apr 22, 2010)

Jadecy  said:
			
		

> I almost missed getting a vendor table this year because I waited too long. My table will be right in the food area


Haven't, forgotten about the area in the small hall, the one photo of set up shows the wide open walk thru this year. It's them old ladies that are using the room for kung fo practice and bingo don't like having their picture taken!

you won't have to worry, about customers Doug. As the current flow will naturally carry all the bodies thru that room.



			
				stevehuckss396  said:
			
		

> Went down and helped with the air pipe.


Yes you did, and we got all the assorted problems worked out. The compressor that you helped Brian with worked and all the manifolds, and table manifolds got blown out. It was nice putting a face to the name.
 ;D


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## PTsideshow (Apr 22, 2010)

Day Four set up




From the balcony looking North




Southgate Fire Marshall, making his first visit to this years show, as there is a Fire Marshall on duty each day of the week the others will be making a daily visit




The small vendors hall, the wall in the background will be open and more vendors after Friday night, there is a fundraiser for some group in there on Friday night.


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## PTsideshow (Apr 22, 2010)

Here is the cover of the program and the vendors list along with the show schedules Of course all subject to change from Volcanoes and mother nature or man made disasters! 












You can use the map at the start of this thread for locations


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## PTsideshow (Apr 22, 2010)

At the show when not actively engaged in doing work, I will be under this hat,a standard top hat.




That is if the kitten doesn't eat the sign first


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## 4156df (Apr 22, 2010)

Glen,
I hope you'll keep the posts and pictures coming. They're the next best thing to being there. Thanks.
Dennis


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## PTsideshow (Apr 23, 2010)

Will try, to keep up !


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## deere_x475guy (Apr 23, 2010)

Looks like I will be there also on Saturday.


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## PTsideshow (Apr 23, 2010)

Put to bed for the night.








two of the dealers in the small hall.

Looks to be shaping up as a great show. Lots of great looking projects,and since it has been a long day. And I'm beat I will leave you with a tease.




Gary Davison's SNOW


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## PTsideshow (Apr 24, 2010)

About 10 minutes into the show Saturday morning




It's all here


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## zeeprogrammer (Apr 25, 2010)

A big thank you to PTsideshow, Bob (deere_x475guy), and Steve(huckss396)...and anyone else I have missed (and sincerely apologize for).

I really appreciate the time you all put in to describe the show, how it's put together, and all the wonderful work shown.

I'm very glad to see the pics and videos of NAMES. I hope to attend some day and meet you and any of the other members.


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## Philjoe5 (Apr 25, 2010)

I'm with Zee. Thanks to PTSideshow, Steve and Bob :bow: for spending the time to post pics of a great show. I missed attending this year

Cheers,
Phil


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## gbritnell (Apr 26, 2010)

I would like to thank all of the people that put on the NAMES show. It is a big undertaking to get all the tables, pipes and everything else set up. The attendance looked really good for Saturday but Sunday was a little thin. I kept my engines out till about 3:00pm and then started packing up but I only have a 3 hour trip.
 It was good to see some old friends and meet new ones. It's like a non stop HMEM board, talk, talk, talk. 
 I think the quality and variety of the work gets better each year. There was eye-catching pieces in every corner of the hall. 
 In the past I have attended some of the seminars but there were so many people there Saturday that I couldn't get away. It was tough just getting to the washroom for a few minutes.
 George D. Britnell


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## PTsideshow (Apr 26, 2010)

Sunday morning shortly after opening, Total combined attendance of exhibitors,vendors, people from NAMES group and paying guests was in the neighborhood of 3,000. This was the 21st year it is the first, oldest, and largest running model engineering show in the US. The founders took a trip to England and saw a couple of their model and steam shows. and came back and started one here.
I know their are some say that it isn't the largest, but it doesn't have an auction hooked to it as another large shows does and that one is a for profit company. As the North American Model Engineers Society is a Michigan Non Profit Corporation.

The biggest problem we have is that as the exhibitors get older, they tend to leave on Saturday afternoon. so they can drive in more day light. It is something that I don't think will ever be solved.




This is the arena at 6:30pm, some many people leave by 3pm that a lot of the small type busy work of pick up the wood card holders, and other stuff can start. Problem yesterday was the guy that drives the equipment for the city, has to service the operating ice rink for the figure skating ladies next to this arena so we had to wait for him to bring the trailers back in. Before we could unload the stuff to re store the hoses, cords and all the piping. till next year. We got out of there at 10:10pm and I was home by 11:00pm and dragging the seat cushion to bed!

A number of members, of the assorted forums showed up and seemed to be pleased with the shows etc And it is always a pleasure to meet and greet!


Some stayed and helped with the show Clutch and a number of members of the forum. Johnny D drove up from Fla for it. And a couple of other people also drove some distance. To Weston Bye and the others members that showed up and exhibited Thanks! George, and Craig were there and had the village presses wares and I know that there were other members there and I might not have seen. I hope you enjoyed the show.

They were a great number of very nice work this year in addition to the items that have been in the past. more photos later.

And to the rumor mongers and others that it just drives them crazier or stupider than they all ready are.

And a special one to the party, that contacted me from another forum and user name about what I was posting about the show. And I had no guts to use my real name so you tell me in person at the show how it sucked! I was as promised easy to find at the show all three days. As I had posted I was in plain view under the top hat with the sign. And you didn't have the equipment to come to a face to face! If you were even at the show.

And to ever was emailing the the notices that the show was canceled on Friday morning it didn't work. I got one of the emails.

All I can say is, the line from the movie the Holy Grail; "I fart in your general direction!"
 :big:


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## SAM in LA (Apr 26, 2010)

PTsideshow,

Thank you for taking the time to work on the show and share your photos.

It is people like you that make this a great forum and hobby.

Don't worry about the little people out there that try to cause trouble.

There are plenty of good people around to spend your time with.

SAM


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## putputman (Apr 28, 2010)

Well the brothers & I just got back from our road trip to NAMES last night. It was a wonderful trip and good chance for brotherly bonding. Left home last Wednesday and took a leisurely drive up through Northern WI. to the lower part of the Mich. U.P., and down along the Eastern shore to Detroit. Spent a day at the show, another day at Ford museum. Then a leisurely drive to Sault Ste Marie, along the Northern U.P., and down through WI. to drop off little brother, & then home to MN.. The other brother still had another 100 miles to go to his home.

The show was great. The talent to be seen at this show was way beyond my expectations. I had a chance to meet and talk to some of the HMEM members, George, Steve, Chuck, Roy, to name a few. I'm sure I talked to many other HMEM members without knowing who they were. (Sure would be nice to have name badges for everyone at these shows.)
There are a lot of photos of the show, but I wish everyone could see and hear George's and Steve's engines in person. They run flawlessly.

I have to thank PTsideshow and everyone in his organization that sponsored this show. In reading some of his comments, it sounds like there is some controversy going on, but what ever it is certainly wasn't apparent at the show. This was the first, and probably last major engine show that I will see in my lifetime, and I thought it was extremely well put on. It is hard to imagine how they were able to plumb that entire building with air without air leaks all over the place.
The parking, registration, food, displays, etc. Were all reasonable and convenient.

I am about a week behind on the HMEM forum so I guess I had better start getting caught up.


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## PTsideshow (Apr 28, 2010)

Well thank you, had a number of emails from a couple of the usual suspects. They seem to only take delight in trying to ruin it for any one that might enjoy it. I guess the party, that was sending "the Show is Canceled" emails out. Must have been disappointed about the news that it was not only on but, the vendors, exhibitors and the paying public all had a great time. 

There were air leaks but only small ones as somebody only hand-tightened the table manifold piping together. But that just a fact of life with a pipe layout change from last year.

The quality of work done seems to be rising each year. 

I hope, you can make it back and bring an engine or two next time. Will try to get my pic's up soon. As I'm off to cut the 40 at my parents house, take a week off and it is knee deep according to my mother! ;D


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## RonGinger (Apr 28, 2010)

I am back in Maine now, just under 2,000 miles round trip. I met up with 7 friends in the Boston area and we all drove out in a rented 15 passenger van.

I admit I was worried about space at the show, but it all worked out fine- our group had plenty of room together. 

I still like the Toledo site better, but I understand the reasons for the move and agree it has to be. It was nice having the hotel connected to the show in Toledo, but we stayed just a bit over a mile away, so it was not a big deal.

My seminar was well attended, the room was quiet and the projector worked well, so all well on that front.

I sold a few items on the consignment table, and found a few treasures I 'needed'.

Great show, my 20th, and I expect to be there again next year.


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## kuhncw (Apr 28, 2010)

Thanks to PT Sideshow and all the others in the NAMES crew for a great show. I certainly enjoyed the entire weekend and look forward to returning next April. 

We left Sunday afternoon and drove to Auburn, IN. Next day, we toured the Aburn Cord Dusenberg Museum and found it to be an excellent display of historical automobiles and related history.

Regards,

Chuck Kuhn


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## PTsideshow (Apr 29, 2010)

Yes thank you for driving, as far as you did, if you had heard any of the rumors about the demise of the show. Steve Hucks and other members of the Detroit area metal working club helped, with set up and tear down. It is appreciated, the powers to be are mulling over the comments in the suggestion box and from the show floor. 
We will have the other arena for next year, they are making arrangements with a local minor league hockey team for rental of their floor to go on top of the ice. It is supposed to be better than the last two floors. There is also the discussion on adding more electrical drops to the tables.
So planning for next years show started with the closing of the doors on the storage trailers Sunday night! :big:


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## RonGinger (Apr 29, 2010)

> I know their are some say that it isn't the largest, but it doesn't have an auction hooked to it as another large shows does and that one is a for profit company. As the North American Model Engineers Society is a Michigan Non Profit Corporation.



Just to be clear, Cabin Fever is a larger show by just about any measure- more vendors, more exhibitors and much more floor space. Enough that they have a boat pond and large G scale train layout. The management of Cabin fever is one guy, Gary Schoenly and his son Jarred, not a corporation. The auction is the day before the model show and in my view a nice addition to the show.

I see no reason we need to get into this 'mine is bigger' stuff. Both are excellent shows, I attend both and plan to as long as Im able. They are not competitor but complimentary events.


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## PTsideshow (May 2, 2010)

RonGinger  said:
			
		

> I see no reason we need to get into this 'mine is bigger' stuff. Both are excellent shows, I attend both and plan to as long as Im able. They are not competitor but complimentary events.



I think it is silly also, But there are some people that just can't give it up.
They tend to send emails about things. Why they won't post in the open forums I don't now.

But the point is that Cabin Fever show/auction is a FOR PROFIT company. They don't have the STATE NON PROFIT regulators, checking the paperwork for all the dotting on the i's and crossing the t's. 

Non profits in Michigan cannot, run what would be 3rd party auctions or auctions that take only a percentage of the profits of items sold. Items must be donated to the group and then all monies raised stay with the group.

Same reason the Exhibitors sales tables, were not a NAMES operated/profit generating venue since we have moved back to Michigan.

As to the number of vendors,at a Non profit event(Michigan) the ratio of vendors allowed to exhibitors is a a% based number, before it becomes a trade show type event. There are more things that dictate the operation of a NON PROFIT event(Michigan). We have a number of lawyers that are with the group or hired by the group to translate the legalize. 

We had a pond years ago, nobody used it, and no extra bodies to put it up and take it down.
I have been told by a local model boater, that they don't come because a lack of a prize giving contest, and that years ago there were issues between some people. All before my time, and of no interest.

They also have a larger population base/area that can make the drive to the show. I have no problem with any of the shows/expo's etc. but you have to compare a FOR PROFIT COMPANY to the same. And NON PROFIT to the same.

I answer the pm's and emails on these forums so they can see that there is nothing to hide. As I will not be draw in to an email war or what ever they call it.
 ;D


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## stevehuckss396 (May 2, 2010)

From what I read here, I think the point you are trying to make is, The "for profit" shows have greater freedom to do what they want. NAMES has to hold back on auctions and consignment sales to retain their "non profit" status. They also need to keep a high percentage of exibitors over vendors.

Is that correct? Don't want to put words in your mouth.

This was only my 4th year at NAMES and 2nd as an exibitor. I have never been to Cabin Fever but hope to in the future. With the NAMES and Zanesville shows being the only shows I have been to, I would have to say I like them both and will continue to go to both and hope to add CF to the mix. They all have the same group of good people, the smell of the fuel and sounds of the engines reving and the chug of the steamers. I love being around all that. They all seem to have what i'm looking for.

If you are someone who has anything to do with putting on even the smallest show, THANK YOU!!


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## PTsideshow (May 2, 2010)

YES, and the non profit has to follow guidelines, supplied by the agency that oversees them in the state. And every state is different. Were a for profit can do most anything within the boundaries of the law. 

As you know Steve having volunteered to help set it up this year. It runs on the graces of the people that help out. And I would say most do it to help promote the hobby.
 ;D


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## putputman (May 3, 2010)

It has been a week since the NAMES show and I have viewed my photos and photos from others that were at the show and every time I see something new that I hadn't noticed before.

I also can think of many questions I wish I would have asked while I was there. Too late now!!

There was one RED WING engine there and I would like to talk to the owner, but didn't get his name. If he is on HMEM, perhaps he would be so kind as to PM me. If any other HMEM members that might recognize the engine and know the owner, would you PM me.

This is the engine:





Perhaps PTsideshow might have some info on this display.


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## PTsideshow (May 4, 2010)

Nope it looks to be a first time there, Don't recognize it. Red Wing is now produced by PM Research out of New York.
Pretty nice looking one.
 :big:


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## putputman (May 4, 2010)

Thanks PT. Hopefully he is a member and will see this post someday. 

The reason I would like to talk to the guy is I have two Red Wing engines like his, but neither run as well as his. I watched him start his time after time by just flicking the flywheel c-clockwise against the compression and it would bounce back and start running. I would like to get some hints on his ignition system & timing. It was so crowded that I couldn't stop to ask many questions. I just moved along with the crowd to the next inspiration.


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## kuhncw (May 4, 2010)

Hello Arv,

That Red Wing belongs to Bruce Harr. I'll send you a PM.

Regards,

Chuck Kuhn


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