# Bridgeport on wood floor joists and plywood???



## vascon2196 (Jun 14, 2013)

As you can see by the title of this thread I have an issue...or maybe not...I don't know which is why I am asking.

I built a shed about 8 years ago using concrete blocks, 2x6 floor joists, and 3/4" PT plywood. I have attached CAD images for reference on how it was constructed. The shed is 12ft x 12ft x 8ft.









Do you think a Bridgeport would sink or swim in this situation?

If a concrete floor is needed, how could I add a concrete floor if the shed is there already? Could I tear out the plywood, box the floor in from the outside, and fill it with cement???

I have a raised ranch and putting the mill in the garage right beneath my bedroom is out of the question (at least in my wife's eyes). I also do not want to build a brand new structure just to house a milling machine.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!!!


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## n4zou (Jun 14, 2013)

You can cut a hole in the floor, frame in a form, and pour a pad. You can get away with pouring the concrete directly on top of the ground. Someone might hate that you did that 30 years from now IF they keep the building and the Mill. If it shifts while you still own it you will just need to level the Mill when required to compensate.  More than likely you'll have done yourself a favour by making that concrete pad easy to remove along with the building sometime in the (distant) future.


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## Cogsy (Jun 14, 2013)

You could also cut out that section of floor, sink some solid posts into the ground and build a solid platform tied into the existing structure. Personally, I'd just go for the concrete pad directly under the mill though.


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## kvom (Jun 14, 2013)

I would use an air conditioner pad under the shed and another one on the floor of the shed, connected with 4 pieces of iron pipe threaded onto flanges,  You only need 4 small holes in the flooring for the pipe supports to pass, and the flanges can be used for leveling.  The pads are typically thick plastic and very rigid.  Your material cost would be less than $200.


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## steamin (Jun 14, 2013)

Chris,

Thank you for asking about placing such a heavy item on your shed floor. The first thing I see that causes great concern to me is the placement of the blocks. The holes in the block should be vertical. Structurally they are much stronger and designed to be used that way. I know flat surfaces are better to work with, that is why there are cap blocks. I know of first hand about someone who used blocks as you did to help elevate their car to work under it. The blocks broke and caused the individual great harm.
Second, you have no supporting blocks towards the middle of the shed. The static load bearing will be way to much for the 2x6's and single layer of 
plywood that you have. 

Third, do you have any concrete footers that the cement blocks are resting on ? If not, then all the weight that you plan to put in your building will cause the building to just sink into the ground every time it rains.

The building you have is a great "shed", but to turn it into a machine shop would be a disaster in the making. Sorry to rain on your parade and I know you are all excited about having machine tools and such, but please rethink what you have and what you are trying to do with it. 

I can see the corners being jacked up to correct the block and foundation situations. I can see the existing plywood floor being taken up and heavier timbers and more support points being installed. I would consider a double layer of 3/4" plywood cris-crossing for the floor. 

Probably the easiest and safest thing to do would be to pour a proper concrete pad and deconstruct your current shed and build it back on the new concrete pad.

Again, I am sorry to raise so many concerns, but I am thinking of you..
All the best to you and your endeavors,
Larry


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## vascon2196 (Jun 14, 2013)

Thank you Larry...I am considering everyone's input. I will definitely be taking my time with this decision.


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## va4ngo (Jun 14, 2013)

I agree with all that steamin said, especially orientation of blocks. If you elect to do that, regardless of what size slab, use some form of waterproofing such as plastic sheet to prevent water rising through the slab and causing rot and rust.

Phil in Melbourne Australia


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## stevehuckss396 (Jun 14, 2013)

I wouldn't do it personally. Pour yourself a pad with footings and build the building on the pad anchoring the walls to the concrete. A good quality machine deserves a good quality building.


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## vascon2196 (Jun 23, 2013)

I have decided to pour a small 7ft x 12ft foundation just to the left of the shed. The shed was built 7 years ago and is still level and I just could not bring myself to start cutting holes in it.

At least with the foundation poured I have a future home for a Bridgeport once I find one that I can afford.

Thanks for the input fellas.


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## vascon2196 (Aug 1, 2013)

I just received a call from my old employer...he is willing to sell me a full-size original Bridgeport including shipping for $5,000. The machine has been well taken care of.

I still have to pour the concrete slab!!!

What do you guys think?????


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## Sshire (Aug 1, 2013)

My list when I got mine
1. Everyone wants to know how old. "What's the serial number?" I'd rather have an old, lightly used BP, than one that's much newer but has been used to death.
2. What head? J head (pulleys) has many fewer parts than a Vari-speed(2-J) head. Since virtually all are 240v 3 phase (unless that's your power supply in the shop), a VFD with a J head gives you variable speed, soft start, dynamic braking, etc. Some folks will tell you to get a rotary phase converter. The continuous whine, for me, was not acceptable. Plus I wanted variable speed, etc.
3. Chrome ways? Much less potential for wear.
4. What is the spindle runout?
5. Are power feeds installed? What type? BP or Servo brand are most common. Once you have them, can't live without them. Especially on the knee. The cranking (10 cranks to the inch) get old, real fast
6. DRO?


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## kvom (Aug 1, 2013)

$5K for a BP seems high, but depends on what comes with it and how far to ship.

I'd recommend calling John at http://www.j-lscraping.com/.  He reconditions Bridgeports and is located in MA.  In the past his refurbs have been well less than $3K.


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## Lakc (Aug 2, 2013)

Its hard to comment on the worthiness of that offer without knowing a bunch of specifics, like year, model, condition, accessories, and shipping/rigging. 
Base price for a used/good BP in our area is only 2-3k.


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## Sshire (Aug 2, 2013)

2-3k sounds right for the mill. How far is is traveling and does it include putting it in place? I.e. rigging.


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## Wizard69 (Aug 2, 2013)

vascon2196 said:


> I just received a call from my old employer...he is willing to sell me a full-size original Bridgeport including shipping for $5,000. The machine has been well taken care of.
> 
> I still have to pour the concrete slab!!!
> 
> What do you guys think?????



I have to agree with others that price is high for a used Bridgeport of any reasonable age.   A relatively new machine with lots of support parts might be worth it.   

Beyond that if you don't have the slab poured and have no place to store the mill, the Question is already answered isn't it.  

Speaking of that new foundation what is right for your area might not be right for others.   For example do you have a frost problem, lots of moisture, strange clays subject to shifting & etc.  It is a good idea to get input from local builders, engineers or inspectors that is applicable to your area.  The last thing you want is your slab shifting after the machinery is installed.   

Also slabs for machinery should be a bit thicker than the structural requirements might imply.   Thicker will provide more mass for one thing but it also provides for the ability to install solid anchor bolts which are always desirable.


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## vascon2196 (Aug 2, 2013)

Here is what I know so far.

Serial # 2J-107413-2,

DRO installed,

Pneumatic Draw Bar System,

Vise Attached,

Purchased new,

No power feeds,

42 table,

Price includes delivery and installation (5 to 6 miles)


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## Sshire (Aug 2, 2013)

1968 manufacture date based on the serial number. Given the power drawbar, vise and DRO, not bad but seems a bit high. Check spindle runout. Move table to center x and y. Lightly tighten x axis locking handle. (just enought to crank on x). How tight it gets toward the ends is generally an indication of wear. Repeat with y axis.


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## vascon2196 (Aug 2, 2013)

Thank you Stan...I want to offer $4,000 but would hate to be insulting. I worked for this man for 6 years and left on good terms. The machine shop has been family owned for over 100 years...

I want to believe I am getting a good deal, if you know what I mean?

I will check the wear and runout best I can.

Thanks to everyone for the input...it means a lot!


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## kvom (Aug 2, 2013)

Check the vise.  The Bridgeport original vises didn't have removable jaws and are not up to more modern vises like Kurts.

The air draw bar is a good thing!

Do you have 220V power at your shed?  You'll need that plus a VFD to power it.


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## vascon2196 (Aug 2, 2013)

I do have 220V but no VFD.

I'm going to pay a visit to the shop soon...I'll check out everything and take pictures if I can.

Thanks again,


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## Mainer (Aug 3, 2013)

There is more to life than getting "a good deal." 

Assuming the machine is in good condition, and it probably is, $5K may be a bit high but not totally outrageous. Other B'ports in other places may be had for cheaper, but you have a chance to buy THIS one that includes delivery and installation.  I assume the DRO is a well-known brand, Acu-Rite or similar. That's over a thousand bucks of value. How much is a power drawbar? $500? How much would it cost to hire a rigger to move it?

How much is the machine worth to YOU? That is all that matters. Be aware that in 20 years the fact that you paid $5k or $4k won't matter a bit. Amortized over 20 years, an extra grand is 50 bucks a year. That's one dinner at a nice-ish restaurant per year.  Even in 1 year, you won't care what you paid.

You can always dicker politely: "Is there any chance you can come down a bit on the price? I'd really like to buy it, but my budget is limited. $5000 is probably fair, but it would be quite a stretch for me to come up with that much."


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## vascon2196 (Aug 3, 2013)

He also told me "don't worry about the dough"...give him what I can now and the rest when I have it. I thought that was nice of him.

I called a few local cement suppliers and they all sell 5-yard minimums at a cost of $500. I would only need 2-yards for my slab.

I would have to purchase 70-bags at 80-lbs. per bag to do it myself.

Looks like I'm going to have to enlist my friends and make a few beer runs!


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## Sshire (Aug 3, 2013)

What Mainer said. If the BP is in good shape, do it. After you make the first few cuts and realize that 2000+ pounds of iron allows you to do big cuts without thinking or tiny cuts and moves with a lot of precision, you won't even think about the $


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## kvom (Aug 3, 2013)

WRT the slab, my RR club is building a car storage barn and pouring the slab in a series of 10x10 sections.  If you can get gravel, sand, and cement delivered, your slab can be poured in a few hours.  We used a motorized mixer from HF.  For one load from thre mixer we add 15 shovels of gravel, 10 of sand, and 6 of cement.  Three of us finished pouring one section in about 3 hours (does not include any form work). 

Obviously the premixed concrete in bags is easier, but lots more expensive.


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## MachineTom (Aug 3, 2013)

Seeing that you live in MA, likely there is building code to follow. Since a BP is about 2K lbs, you will need support for everything,, building and machine. If they allow slab on grade for an outbuilding, meaning no below frost level footing. I would dig down to 6" and 2' wide, tapered to grade in the center then pour a floor about 12" thick tapering to 6" in the center, so overall 6" above grade.

That would need 2 yards of concrete for a 7 x 12 pad. That would be alot of premix bags like 144 if you get 1/2 cubic foot a bag. Depending on the distance to the concrete plant, rediimix delivered, or in one of those tote trailers would be the way to go. Mixing 2 yards by hand or with a small mixer will be a real heavy job for 1-2 people, but doable.

A BP fits best backed into corner of small buildings, 45° to the walls. this will eat an area of about 6 x 6, which is half the size of the shed.


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## Swifty (Aug 4, 2013)

MachineTom said:


> A BP fits best backed into corner of small buildings, 45° to the walls. this will eat an area of about 6 x 6, which is half the size of the shed.



I agree with putting it in a corner, unless you plan to machine very long items it saves a lot of space. The back of the ram is in the corner, just make sure that the table movement doesn't hit the wall.

Paul.


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## Wizard69 (Aug 6, 2013)

vascon2196 said:


> Here is what I know so far.
> 
> Serial # 2J-107413-2,
> 
> ...



It might be worth that $5000 if the draw bar system and DRO are of good quality.


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## Wizard69 (Aug 6, 2013)

I'd like to be the dissenting voice with respect to putting a Bridgeport in a corner..   I don't like that arraignment at all, besides what did the Bridgeport do to deserve such punishment?    

Why don't I like it.    
1.   Access to the back side of the machine for cleaning and the storage that always seems to end up there.  
2.   Once you have a mill big stuff happens.   You don't want to limit your ability to use the machine to do unplanned things.  
3.   Access from the table ends.    Sometimes the view is better from an end of the table.


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## MachineTom (Aug 6, 2013)

No crunch issue at all, from the corner of the walls to the Y axis handle is 6'. From the center line of the machine at max Y movement to the wall is 5.5' and at min position about 50". With a 42" table max centerline distance to the X Handle is 40". If the work won't fit that , I just grab the crowbar and move the bugger until it does.


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## vascon2196 (Aug 20, 2013)

Just poured the slab at 7FT x 12FT x 6in deep, with 6in of stone underneath. I rented a mixer from Home Depot and had them deliver two pallets of 80lb bags. The slab is also has steel mesh and robust footings in each corner.

The slab had to be moved from the back yard (250ft from the driveway) to the front yard (20ft from the driveway). Due to several factors, the rigger did not feel comfortable moving the mill to the original back yard location.

As long as the structure that house's the mill "looks pretty", my wife does not mind it sitting in the front yard (off to the side).


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## vascon2196 (Sep 2, 2013)

The slab is poured...left wall, right wall, and back wall complete.

Tomorrow I give the call to deliver the Bridgeport.

Once the mill is in place, the front wall and roof will be built around it.

Last, the wiring.

Pictures to follow.


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## vascon2196 (Sep 7, 2013)

My Bridgeport arrived yesterday...very exciting!

The most frustrating thing so far has been explaining to people what the machine is and what it does. Not a single family member understands why I needed "such a big machine".

If I have time tomorrow I will post some pictures.


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## Sshire (Sep 7, 2013)

Can't wait to see the pictures! 
When some people saw mine, they wanted to know why I had such a big machine to make such little engines.
The other advantage is that it will hold down the new shop in a windstorm.


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## Sshire (Sep 7, 2013)

Chris
Forgot this. 
http://www.machinerypartsdepot.com/site/1478157/product/BRM-2J

http://www.machinerypartsdepot.com/site/1478157/product/BRM-J

THE book, not just for rebuilding, but repair and maintenance also.

The people at H&W are very helpful. They have lots of info on their website and all Bridgeport parts. No connection, just a happy customer.


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## vascon2196 (Sep 8, 2013)

Wow, thank you for those links Stan.

Their website has a lot of great information, I am going to book-mark that one.

Forgot my camera at work and I have no camera phone...hopefully pictures will be taken this week!


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## vascon2196 (Oct 5, 2013)

I finally got around to taking pictures! Each weekend has been filled with building the "home" for the Bridgeport and since I am building it myself it has been taking a while.

I dug the trench for the electrical wire today and decided to take a break from that and snap a few quick pictures. I have not had a chance to clean the machine yet so it may not look as pretty as it should.

Just happy to have it.


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## Tinkerer58 (Oct 5, 2013)

No point in cleaning it the first time you use it it will be dirty again LOL.

Just like to know if your building the shop around the machine what happens when you decide to move, you leaving it behind LOL

When people ask you why you want such a big machine for little engines I always say you can make small thing on big machines but you can't make big thing on small machines, I'm slowly working my way up.

Good looking shop and machine.


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## vascon2196 (Oct 6, 2013)

Thanks for the kind words!

We plan on staying here a while (the next 30 years at least), I'll worry about moving then if I have to. Unfortunately the only thing I could do was build a small shed around the machine once it arrived.

Someday I hope to have a 2-car garage with an area in the back for a proper home shop.

Take care.


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## Sshire (Oct 6, 2013)

Looks great, Chris!
Love the collet. If it's the same dealer, they're still in business

http://www.brodeurmachine.com/pages/cfHome.cfm

One tip. Open up the top of the Bijur oiler, take the case off the BP and clean out the gunk from the bottom. Refill and pump a bunch of times to clear out any old lube.

Also, I notice you have the 2J2 head. That's what came with the 2hp version. It has the rabbit and the turtle and 2 windows on the front to see the RPM numbers. Mine is the 2J (1.5 hp) with a round dial on the front. Unless you really have a desire to see what's inside that case, do not turn the speed crank unless the motor is running. If you do. The cable will wrap itself backwards around the crank pulley. My dealer told me this about 20 times.  

Good luck with it.


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## vascon2196 (Oct 6, 2013)

Thank you Stan. Yes, I purchased the mill directly from Brodeur Machine (I worked there for 5 years as a CAD designer). I gave the owner a call to see if he knew anyone who was selling a used Bridgeport....he said he was selling (2) of them at the end of the summer!

I called at the right time.

Thanks for the information on the oiler and on the dial in the front. There is a metal plate warning to not rotate the dial unless the motor is on. I will make sure not to fuss with that.

Well, I was in the midst of completing the electrical trench when it decided to down-pour. I may have to wait another week until that project is done!

See you this weekend at the engine show!


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## Sshire (Oct 6, 2013)

Chris
If you haven't found it, there is a "not-so-obvious" lube point on the table for the X-Y leadscrews. Centered on the table, at the bottom of the center T-slot, is a SHCS. CLEAN THE CHIPS OUT.*







Center the table to the saddle on the X axis. (I measured both ends of the table to the saddle edges and scribed a witness line).






Now, remove the SHCS and put 10-20 drops of way oil down the hole.*

See you this weekend


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## vascon2196 (Oct 6, 2013)

Thank you Stan...I wonder if the previous owner knew about this one...


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## vascon2196 (Dec 8, 2013)

So I finally got set up and began using the Bridgeport today. I squared up a part...no problems. I began drilling a couple of holes when all of a sudden the "On/Off" D-Lock switch shut off...right in the middle of drilling a hole.

I thought for a moment I blew a fuse or something. I shut the box off and turned it on again and it turned right on....so I kept drilling. Then it seemed to shut off every minute after that. But as long as I kept shutting it off and turning it on I could keep drilling.

Looks like I need a new On/Off switch or box or whatever the hell it is.


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## weez (Dec 8, 2013)

I believe your problem is that the overload switch is tripping.  The on/off switch has a device in it that shuts the mill off it pulls too much current.  If you notice the off button also says reset.  When the overload trips you push the off button to reset it which would explain why it will restart after you shut it off.  I would make sure that it is wired for the correct voltage that you are supplying.  It appears from one of the pictures that it has a 480 volt plug on it.  It is unusual to have 480 volt residential service.


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## robcas631 (Dec 9, 2013)

I'd say start with a good foundation check with local building codes as to proper depth and "other" requirements. Make sure your foundation is above grade as per code. Ask about a termite shield, sill seal insulation, required sill and placement of anchor bolts. If you are going to pour a concrete slab, check soil conditions. If you have sand add 6 x 6 - 10/10 WWM. If you have clay then you will have to remove it per code add sand and gravel. Above all add a vapor barrier. Use teco connectors if building a wood floor. Also, you can use 2 x 6 joists but the floor would be unstable for the usage you seek. I strongly recommend 2 x 8 or better yet 2 x 10 D. F. with 3/4" sub flooring. Be sure the walls are thick enough to be insulated via code. Add collar ties or ceiling beams 2 x 6 would do, check for proper insulation and ventilation codes.


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## Sshire (Dec 9, 2013)

Chris
Can you put an ammeter on it to see what it's drawing under load?

Rob
You must have missed the previous 4 pages.


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## vascon2196 (Dec 9, 2013)

Yes Stan I can borrow one. I'm going to talk with the electrical guys today at lunch. I'll keep you posted!


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## vascon2196 (Dec 9, 2013)

So it looks like the Square-D Start/Stop switch has 3 overload (heaters) on the inside. When I re-wired the motor to 220V that made the current increase. The 3 overload switches have to be rated for the higher current...apparently they are not.

These overloads are probable not something I can buy at Home Depot.

Anyway...when the machine was running....it ran great! My 12ft by 7ft shed is now full of aluminum chips!


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## vascon2196 (Dec 10, 2013)

Funny...my local electrical supply shop had them in stock for $20/each.

I got them off Amazon.com for $12/each! Even with shipping the total was almost half the cost.


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## PopAlexandra (May 14, 2018)

Wizard69 said:


> It might be worth that $5000 if the draw bar system and DRO are of good quality.


 
I still say it's a bit much by any standards, but I guess it's anyone's choice and money. 
_____________________________
Alexandra


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