# Bogs goes electronic.



## Blogwitch (Jul 20, 2010)

This is a little tale of preparation and result, and I am in no way suggesting it will work for everyone, just a write up on things that have happened to me.

Since 1974, I have been in constant pain in parts of my lower spine and legs, from an accident I suffered whilst serving in the RAF. After a bout in hospital to try to put things right, I ended up with a right foot that feels totally dead all the time, and nagging pains in the areas I have already told you about. The surgeon told me that in later life, things would come back to haunt me. It wasn't too bad for the first 35 years, being mainly controlled by pill popping and taking a rest when needed. I think it only caused me to have about a month off work in the whole of my working life.

Nearly a year ago, the haunting started, and I was basically knocked off my legs because I could stand the pain no longer, as it had gone from bearable and controllable, to feeling like I wanted to scream whenever I moved my legs.

To cut a long story short, after visits and examinations by many eminent specialists, I was told that there are no surgical procedures that can help me with my predicament; I will just have to cope the best I can. My GP came into it at that time, and suggested maybe I should attend a 'Pain Clinic', at which point I told him "I have enough pain at this time, without anyone giving me some more".

He then went on to explain that a 'Pain Clinic' was a group of specialist people, who looked at ways of using alternative treatments to long standing problems that everyone else had given up on. As it was in my case. I had other skeletal and bodily problems, but they would only be looking at the main cause of my grief.

Being very sceptical about the whole thing, I agreed to submit to their torture treatment, but only for six months. 

During my time under normal treatment regimes, I was being given enough opiate based products to ensure I will be hooked on them for the rest of my life.

The first thing these 'new age' quacks came out with was that they are going to stop all my pill popping opiates, and just leave me on the high dose patches that Mal has to stick on me twice a week, as I can't reach the places they are recommended they need to be stuck.

So then they started to feed me small doses of drugs used to treat epileptic fits. Not that I am epileptic in any way, they were using a side effect of the drug Pregabalin to condition my spinal nerves to be receptive to a Tens Unit. Unfortunately, because they had taken away some of my pain killers, the pain was worse than it normally was.

I tried all different versions of that drug, as some of the other side effects were worse than having the pain, ranging from being suicidal, to wanting to kill anyone who showed up at the door. Luckily they saw the problems almost straight away and found one that only gave the side effects that were needed. That might explain a few of the bad posts I did during that time.

Anyway, six months passed, and yesterday I attended the clinic to see if things had worked.

You must remember, I was very sceptical, even though mates such as Cedge told me that it had worked for them, and I made the quack promise me that if it didn't work straight away, he would put me back on my old opiate intake. He duly agreed and stuck a couple of pads either side of where the main pain emanates from, and connected me up to his all singing, all dancing medical Tens Unit.

After twiddling a few knobs and nearly giving me a heart attack by a sudden tingling sensation in the upper regions of my a**e, all of a sudden, my chronic pain had disappeared, and I felt as though I could do a couple of circuits around the block.

So instantly I said "Thatll do for me, wrap it up and I will be on my way.

The unit he gave me for playing about with was this one

https://www.tenscare.co.uk/index.php?action=products&product=1

About the cheapest product that they sell, but in my case it was free (good old National Health Service). A more robust unit will be issued once I find that this method of pain relief is going to do me some good over the long term.

So I duly got home, then Mal attacked me, and stuck two sticky patches on my backside and duly plugged me in. A quick bit of programming and I was having roughly the same relief as I was getting with the quack. Absolutely great, moving about like I hadnt done for years, no chronic pain at all, just a slightly annoying tingle in my nether regions. That will do me just fine.

Now for the bad news, there is always a catch.

I can only use this particular unit for six hours a day, with the max of one period of use being 1.5 hours. So it looks like I will have to plan my day well ahead, so I can use it for times when pain needs to be at its minimum, like going into my shop for a machining session. No more 16 hour days in there, just 6 hours max, spread over the whole day. But anything is better than what I can do at the moment, which is absolutely nothing.

So why have I told you all this.

Very recently, my pain had been so bad, and other things were getting to me as well, I was considering giving up my shop completely, selling everything off, and settling down in front of the television to become a cabbage.

But now, with this small revelation, I have decided to get off my backside and regain my life, no matter what it takes.

There is even more light at the end of the tunnel, a new procedure has just been undertaken, and speaking to my quack, it just might be on the cards for me in the future.


Those outside the UK might not be able to see this video.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10516682



Never again will I dismiss something offhand, without first giving it a go.

Bogs


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## ksouers (Jul 20, 2010)

John,
That is great news! I'm really glad the saw bones were able to give some relief without taking out the life from your routines. The implant looks interesting, it could extend your day.

Yes, the video did work just fine here across the pond.


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## fcheslop (Jul 20, 2010)

That's good news John,watched the video clip its just fantastic .
best wishes frazer


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## mklotz (Jul 20, 2010)

John, that's just great. I'm very happy for you. I hope it continues to work for you.

So, now that you're an electrical engineer, can you light fluorescent bulbs just by grasping them?


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## John S (Jul 20, 2010)

More to the point, can you get BBC 2 on it ?

John DVD went in the post today.


John S.


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## bentprop (Jul 20, 2010)

That's fantastic,John.I'm glad it's given you a new lease of life.
I'm sure it helps your family as well,not having to walk on eggshells around you.
I look forward to seeing more of your projects as and when.
all the best.Hans.


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## Deanofid (Jul 20, 2010)

John, thanks for writing about this. Not only the trouble you've had, but how they found a way
to get you some relief.  

As another guy whose early injuries and accidents have finally come to roost in the last decade, I'm 
glad to hear there may be something that will let me stand up like a man, (besides the 
unlimited supply of pain pills the doc currently supplies!). The pills work, but I can't work in the
shop when they're doing their magic.

I'm asking the doc about this next time I see him. I'd love to be able to stand in one place for
an hour, or walk around a tractor show without resorting to a cane.

It's great news to hear that you're feeling better! Being able to get back into the shop will do
your inner man a world of good, too. 

Dean


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## Stan (Jul 20, 2010)

A Tens unit is a remarkable device. About ten years ago, I used one for a while until the docs figured out a surgical procedure that fixed me for a couple of years and then needed more surgery. 

I am glad it is working for you. Don't turn the power up until it burns the skin. The pain from the burn makes you forget about the pain in your back but then both hit you. Good Luck.


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## ozzie46 (Jul 20, 2010)

Wonderful news John. I so happy for you. 

  Now get back in the shop. :big: :big: :big:

 Seriously now you can have a little fun again.

 Ron


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## Cedge (Jul 20, 2010)

John
Glad to hear the stimulation unit worked for you. It isn't a magic bullet and it won't reverse the root cause, but back when I used mine, it was all I had between me sitting at home counting wall spots and doing a day's work. Once you've learned to dial it in properly, you'll find you can block just about any level of pain you might be having on a given day. That odd tingle does take a bit of getting used to....LOL

Those time limits are pretty much spot on. I could stretch it to about 8 hours but there was some residual effect on the nerves of the skin. I had a numb spot on my lower back for some time after I stopped using it, although that eventually went away too. Just as an aside... I was talked into trying acupuncture/pressure at one point and while i was just as skeptical as you were of this regime, it did help the problem a good bit and aided in the final healing process.

If I'd known I'd last this long, I might have cut back a bit on the dirt bikes and the cliff rescue work. Both were harder on me than I imagined, back when I was having so much fun doing them. 

Steve


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## Maryak (Jul 20, 2010)

Great news.................What's the next project ;D 

Best Regards
Bob


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## Antman (Jul 20, 2010)

Isn't life cruel ... isn't life joyful
  Ant


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## Twmaster (Jul 21, 2010)

John, that's wonderful news. As somebody who suffers from chronic pain I cannot tell you how happy I am for you. Sadly I am without health coverage and such a beastie would be out of my grasp.


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## GailInNM (Jul 21, 2010)

Great news John. I am very happy to see you creeping back towards the fun side of life.
Gail in NM


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## Kermit (Jul 21, 2010)

That's wonderful John. I'm still doing the pill thing three times a day, and the Doc is still buggin me to get my back sliced open by the surgeons. Says that will stop all the pain etc etc. I looked it up and the surgery has around an eighty percent success rate, but that still leaves 20% of the patients who get no relief from it. Glass half empty is what I say...well, when I ahve something that works why change it? ;D  Like you said though, I'm hooked on the stuff now. Miss a dose and get the 'junky sniffles', miss two and the world turns dark and ugly. 
Scary how many of the people posting here have almost the same health problems. I am interested though, because as others have mentioned; pain killers and metal cutting machiines have no business being together in the same room. Makes this hobby a real slow goer for me.

Congrats on the 'recovery' John,
Kermit

Ps. up at 3:00 am again. Damn this 90 minute wait for medicine to take effect.


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## minerva (Jul 21, 2010)

> Never again will I dismiss something offhand, without first giving it a go.



John great news on another result.
I can really identify with your sentiments, about two years ago I was suffering from what I called a "frozen shoulder" the pain was excruciating and relentless, numerous visits to the quacks and use of a purchased TENS unit provided little relief. During a visit to the hospital a physiotherapist suggested accu-puncture might help. I was absolutely terrified of the thought of it ( I have always hated needles) but he convinced me, and after just one twenty minute period of treatment ( I never felt a thing) the pain was gone and some 2 years later I'm firing on all 4. There must be a moral here somewhere.
Hopefully many more hours of workshop fun!

kindest regards 
TerryT


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## T70MkIII (Jul 21, 2010)

I'm very pleased to hear this is working for you, John, and thanks for sharing your thoughts with others who may also benefit. My wife used TENS after her cesarians, but since then I hadn't given it another thought. Sad to hear so many of you guys are in pain.


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## Lakc (Jul 21, 2010)

Thats great news. Pain free shop time sounds productive. ;D


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## Blogwitch (Jul 21, 2010)

Gents, many thanks for the well wishes, and I do hope that it will let me get back in the shop after such a long layoff. 

My brain is almost exploding with ideas and projects, purely because I could think about doing them, but not actually do the physical side of the job. I have built so many engines in my head, if I put them into metal, it would take me many years to get them all finished, and it doesn't help when I read about all the new stuff being built on here.

My post wasn't about getting sympathy, but to show that, after such a long period of pain, supposedly non curable, relief can be available for very little outlay, as long as you are one of the lucky ones that it works on.

As I said in my post, I was getting ready for giving up, but by putting my scepticism to one side, it has opened up, hopefully, many more years of enjoying what I like doing the most.

There are so many people on this site that have major pain like I did, I only have one thing to say to them. 

Don't give up on it, try a few of these 'alternative' treatments if you can, you never know, pain relief could be just a matter of pressing a button, just like me.

The moral is, no matter how implausible it sounds, it just might be the relief you are looking for.



John


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## Stan (Jul 21, 2010)

Acupuncture is a black art. Before I tried the Tens unit I tried acupuncture. One treatment and I was pain free for about twelve hours and told that I would need several treatments to get permanent relief. I tried the several more treatments but none of the needles hit the magic spot that provided the relief the first time.

I have never regretted having the surgeries even though the second one was less than 100% success. Like many here, my troubles started when I was young, macho and indestructible, doing things that no sane person would try. Since you never grow out of stupidity, after the first successful operation, I didn't follow the surgeon's advice and damaged his work.


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## lordedmond (Jul 21, 2010)

Thanks for the info John

like you my problems started with an injury to my left foot , which looks Ok bur the xrays show a mangled up mess in side , plus I have started to grow in all my joints , My hands and arms are Ok yet but 18 a day codeine tabs for the past 8 years has surly got me hooked plus a load of paracectomal /sp. I am going to see the vet tomorrow so he is going to have his ear bent for a tens trail

having to use wheels make getting about difficult but my WS is set up for me and loco making continues at a slow pace ruled by the pain 


anyway good luck with the long term use of the tens 


Stuart


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## itowbig (Jul 21, 2010)

very good news indeed may you make many more metal chips. best of wishs


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## kvom (Jul 21, 2010)

Excellent news. I'm waiting to see your next project now that you can gdt to the shop again.


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## Omnimill (Jul 21, 2010)

Thats great news John, I've heard good things about the Tens units and glad it's giving some respite.

Vic.


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## student123 (Jul 21, 2010)

John,

I just got in & read your OP.
Best wishes & well done with finding a way forward for you. 

Mike


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## larry1 (Jul 21, 2010)

John.                                                                                          Congratulation, really glad to hear the tens work for you, best of luck. Larry


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## doubletop (Jul 22, 2010)

John 

That's shocking news! Hope it works out fine for you and you an spend more and more time in places you'd rather be than couped up in front of the box.

A couple of questions


Any EMC issues? workshop kit starting unexpectedly or computers packing a sad :'(

With the location and effect of the pads does it have a bedroom assist mode? 

Anyway great news I'm pleased for you

Pete


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## Blogwitch (Jul 22, 2010)

Pete,

I wouldn't know about the bedroom bit, I gave up on that as a regular pastime years ago. Machining is a lot more pleasureable for me at this time, maybe I can pick up on the other if and when I start to feel better.

Kvom,

I will just explain why you won't see me making things for maybe a fair while.

I have some patent work to finish off before anything else, and as you can imagine, it cannot be shown on here as it would violate the patent rules, and as so much is at stake, I don't want that to happen.

But once that is over, I have a post to finish off, and then I will be doing what grabs my fancy at the time. It might be finishing off the Halo builds, or it just might be a start on the flame licker castings I bought, but on the other hand, I have a few engines that need to be blinged up to display standards.

As you can see, I am a little undecided.


John


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## Twmaster (Jul 22, 2010)

John, it's nice to have all those options now in front of you. Hip hip HOORAY!


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## metalmuncher (Jul 23, 2010)

Hi Bogs, I have read your post a couple of times and am a bit puzzled as to why they have told you to only wear your Tens for a max of six hours. I have similar sorts of problems to you with regard to my back, and have been to the pain clinic and been given a Tens machine. They said I could wear it for as long as I wanted, not that I do. I find if I wear it for a day I can get relief for the next couple of days before I need it again. I used it last weekend to walk round a steam rally and felt as fresh as I did at the start. I hope it works for you as it has helped me cope with life a bit better since I have had mine. All the best Keith.


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## Blogwitch (Jul 23, 2010)

Keith,

I don't know why I was given different instructions to yourself, I just follow what I was told.
The instructions given by the quack were almost the same that were in with the unit, just slight differences.

One thing I do know, with the settings I use, as soon as it is turned off, the pain soon comes back. So maybe you don't have the same problem as I do.


I put it down to them knowing their job better than me.


Bogs


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## rickharris (Jul 23, 2010)

I also have a tens unit for chronic sciatica. I asked how they work and was told that actually it isn't well understood at all. 

Some feel it is disrupting the transmission of pain information by over loading the nerves locally, 
Some think it is a distraction signal that confuses the brain, and some think like many things when the brain receives an input for some time that is continuous it switches off that input - or ignores it so it isn't distracted, this is somewhat like scratching relieves and itch (whilst your scratching any way).

My unit has no limit on how long it can be used for although I only get relief when it's on. Fortunately this allows me to correct my posture for long enough to relieve the issue after a few days. I can't see what there may be that would be a danger unless you have a pace maker or similar problems.

Although some are sceptical it does work - for some anyway - on neurological pain.


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## Stan (Jul 23, 2010)

Although some are sceptical it does work - for some anyway - on neurological pain.

There is really little knowledge about the human brain. A neurologist said to me "I know a little bit more about the brain than you do".

Things like the Tens unit, acupuncture and even medicine men provide pain relief to some people. If the Tens unit works for John, Great. If it doesn't work for you, try something else, and not necessarily from a medical doctor.


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## Blogwitch (Jul 23, 2010)

That was why I started the post Stan.

I was very sceptical for almost six months, right up to the time he 'turned me on'. Within seconds, I became an instant believer.

The post was made to hopefully convince a few people, who are suffering from the same sorts of problems I have, to become less sceptical and give it a go.

The units cost very little money, and I am sure, if I wasn't so unsure about it, I would have been quite willing to waste that money, just to see if it would work for me. I could have been enjoying pain free sessions years ago.

I honestly think it was the 'conditioning' that I had from the quacks that made it such a success for me, but who knows, it might not need that conditioning cycle for some people.

It has been suggested that it is all in the mind, and if that is to be believed, for proof, you only have to look at my wife. Anyone who has met her will straight away tell you that last year, the prognosis was terminal, and she looked awful. But right from the beginning, she was totally positive about it all, anyone who even mentioned the 'C' word would have been given a lecture by her. It wasn't going to get her.
Now, except for a few twinges from her surgery, she is the picture of health. 
For me, and many others who have met her, we now believe she willed herself better.

So maybe it is all in the mind, but if it gives pain relief, then there is nothing wrong with being called a loony, it is a small price to pay.

So basically, all I was trying to get across, is that if you do suffer from chronic pain, be a little less sceptical, alternative methods just might work for you.

It definitely did for me.


John


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## DICKEYBIRD (Jul 27, 2010)

Great news John and I'm very happy for you! ;D Nothing worse than chronic pain hanging over you 24 hrs. a day.

I've dealt with lower back pain/sciatica for over 40 years. A buddy dropped his side of a VW "squareback" engine I had just rebuilt and was taking off the stand. I tried to lower it by myself to keep from damaging it...dumb! I've had to have several nerve block injections and have taken various pain pills & anti-inflammatory pills by the bucket load. It has been an up/down situation all those years, some days better than others.

6 years ago I started walking every day, rain or shine, cold or hot; 1st for only about 15 minutes and then slowly worked up to 35 - 45 minutes now. The results have been truly amazing. I now live a fairly pain-free life and if I don't do stupid things I don't even take over the counter pain relievers.


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## cidrontmg (Jul 27, 2010)

I´m not suggesting that anyone should really go this route and build his/her TENS unit, but there´s a pretty good website for any aspiring builders (or otherwise interested) at
http://kisu.tripod.com/
"A set of scanned images from the "Silicon Chip" magazine in Australia describing the functioning, construction and use of the T.E.N.S. unit for the relief of pain."
Nine parts that you can peruse, or d/load the whole shebang as a 1.5 Mb ZIP file.
I don´t think it would be a cost-effective solution at all, not even the kit as advertised in the page. 
And as has been already said many times, these things really work for many people, obviously not for everyone, and like Bogs said, 
"So maybe it is all in the mind, but if it gives pain relief, then there is nothing wrong with being called a loony, it is a small price to pay."
Well, pain is ALWAYS ALL in the mind.
It´s very good to hear that the unit works for you, Bogs, and how about that Liney Halo build...  ;D


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## steamer (Jul 27, 2010)

Great News John! Many blessing and tidings of prosperous time in your shop.

Dave


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## lee9966 (Jul 27, 2010)

John, I am glad that you found such help. Chronic unrelenting pain can really change a personality, and that's no fun.

I look forward to your future posts so that I kin start learnin' agin.


Lee


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## Blogwitch (Jul 29, 2010)

I have actually had a bit of time in my shop, nothing too stressful to begin with. Just a load of handles on some files I was given, and a little bit of a tidy up.

It was amazing just how much needed to be tidied away considering I hadn't been working in there. Just nipping in for the odd screwdriver or spanner, and just throwing it on the bench when I had finished with it, rather than putting it away.

It is early days yet, it will take me some time getting used to standing up straight again and getting the work ethics into motion, but once I do, I hope to be back to my normal self.

I hope my little box will help me a some this afternoon, as I am helping Stew to put the finishing touches to his loco boiler. Normally it took longer than planned, as I had to rest so often.


John


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## John Rudd (Jul 29, 2010)

Stan  said:
			
		

> Things like the Tens unit, acupuncture and even medicine men provide pain relief to some people. If the Tens unit works for John, Great. If it doesn't work for you, try something else, and not necessarily from a medical doctor.



I've tried a TENS unit, as given to me by the hospital Physio Dept, and more so recently to try and alleviate some of my back pain and to improve my mood at work...Sadly not this time..

I'm waiting on the outcome of my MRI scan that I had at the weekend for my spine/pelvis/hips....

It's good to hear thought that these electronic devices can help in some cases and good to hear that it is helping someone from the forum....


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## Blogwitch (Jul 30, 2010)

Hi John, long time no hear from you.

I actually had a failure yesterday. On Wednesday I gave it the full monty. I had gradually built up to it, as suggested by the quacks, and got my first four 1.5 hour sessions in, and it worked great.

I was due to help Stew yesterday afternoon with his boiler, but by the time I had got to his shop on my buggy, even with the tens unit, I was in no fit state to stand up, never mind help him.

The tens unit masks the pain, not fixes it, and because I had done so much on Wednesday, there was just too much pain for it to overcome by the time my body caught up yesterday, even with excruciatingly uncomfortable settings on the unit.

It is going to be a matter of finding the correct work regime for me to follow, so that whilst under the numbing effect of the tens unit, I don't overdo it.



> It's good to hear thought that these electronic devices can help in some cases and good to hear that it is helping someone from the forum....



Don't get me wrong John, this is my last hope, and it has given me pain relief beyond my wildest dreams, for the first time in over 35 years I can feel no pain as such. But there is always a down side, and with me, it looks maybe like one day no pain, the next, a bit more than usual.

Friends are taking us out today, so I will give it another go on the full monty, and then see what it feels like tomorrow.


John


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## HS93 (Jul 30, 2010)

John my recollection of using them is more power is not always the best you have to get a level and freqency (pulse) to a level that works I always found a lower level gave more relief, when they are not as powerfull as they where these days since they can now be bought over the counter the originals ones where only available in the UK if they where perscibed by a specialist, I think I told you I had an incident when i knocked the controles and could not turn it down as I did not have enough control to do it.

peter


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## Blogwitch (Jul 30, 2010)

Peter,

I remember you telling us about that episode, and we all had a good laugh at your misfortune.

Yesterday, I tried every mode at all settings, low and high, and still it was not enough to subdue the pain I was feeling, but after a few more hours of good rest, I had recovered enough for my morphine patches to take control.

As I said, I think it is a great unit, but I must prepare and restrict myself so that I don't overdo things while under it's influence, I don't want a repeat of yesterday.

Today, everything is back to normal and it is doing a great job.


John


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