# Making a QCTP (Quick change tool post)



## Majorstrain

Just thought I might share my progress on making a QCTP for my lathe. 
The original tool post is the standard type that is 75mm square and 65mm high. The new tool post is based on a design that pulls the tool holder into the tool post.

When I finish the QCTP I'll finalize the drawings and post them in the plans section (I imagine I'll have lots of changes due comments and the process of making the parts), but until then here is what I have so far.

Your suggestions and comments are most welcome 

Cheers,
Phil
*
QCTP_70mm.pdf
STD_holder_70mm.pdf*
These files updated 6-6-09
Changes: dovetail dimensions given using rods 6mm or 1/4" rods
        section D-D view direction corrected for looking at base from under side, not from top through. 

*
QCTP_70mm.pdf
STD_holder_70mm.pdf*
These files updated 21-6-09
Changes: Drawing now have truncated dovetail corners (chamfered).


View attachment QCTP_70mm_Assembly.pdf


View attachment Parts_70mm.pdf


View attachment QCTP_70mm.pdf


View attachment STD_holder_70mm.pdf


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## Majorstrain

I manged to scrounge some 4130 bar stock the was 90mm in diameter and 85mm long.
I skimmed the sides and squared up the ends on the lathe.







Then proceeded to turn it into a square bar on the mill. A quick note : 100mm bar stock is required to get the full 70mm square, Since I only had 90mm bar the corners will have a rounded edge. No great loss I think.











When that was done, I roughed out the dove tail slots.






Now I just have to wait until I buy, make, or borrow a 60° dove tail cutter.

Cheers
Phil


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## steamer

Looks like a copy of a Hardinge...It's a good post!

I built one like it some time ago for my old Atlas lathe






I used an 11/16" hex head bolts to match the Atlas supplied wrench, but the rest is nearly identical...and you will like having two clamp bolts as it really locks the post down.

The key is to cut the two female dovetails the same time with the clamp nut, the arrow shaped part, in the post and spaced out say .03" with a washer while your cutting it. After you cut both dovetails and the clamp nut, remove the washer

I would make the dovetails to roll dimensions, not to the apex dimensions shown on your drawing as there is no way to measure an apex dimension. Put two 1/4" diameter or so ACCURATE dowel pins in and machine both female dovetails to the same dimension. If you measure between the two rolls, you can measure it very accurately, especially with guage blocks or even an adjustable parallel in between the two rolls.  If you do that with the clamp bolt in place it will clamp at the same handle position with tool holders in either position. That will be very welcome in use.

For holders, get a long bar and cut the required dovetail full length, to a roll dimenstion again, then part off the individual holders from there.

Hope that helps!  You'll like the toolpost!

Regards,
Dave


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## Majorstrain

Yep, I've modified it to make it easier for me to make.
The operating theory is basically the same. 
I'm thinking about making the mechanism a cam lock arrangement rather than the screw system.
I'll give it some more thought when I get to that stage.

Cheers
Phil

Nice pic, What metal did you use Dave?


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## steamer

....Nice pic, What metal did you use Dave?...."


Scrapboxalloy ;D........I think It was a chunk of 12L14, complete with rounded corners like yours......it ran for 5 years and went with the lathe when I sold her. No issues.

The Arrow piece was 4150 HT though.....I had a female thread in that piece and that IS a wear item.
No troubles with mine though.

The parts don't really rub together ( other than the arrow) with any pressure so as long as the mating surfaces are kept clean, your good.

Dave


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## steamer

Phil,
I thought about it a bit and think you should stick with a clamp bolt. It would be tough to make the camlock feature as part of that clamp.  Maybe a sacrificial clamp bolt used while you machine the camloc and dovetail features into the clamp.... maybe?....haven't thought about it beyond that.
Cool thing is if you use the design you currently have, the toolpost becomes the fixture to machine the clamp bolt.......I hate making fixtures!

....A clamp bolt was good enough for Hardinge......... :

Dave


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## Majorstrain

steamer  said:
			
		

> It would be tough to make the camlock feature as part of that clamp.  Maybe a sacrificial clamp bolt used while you machine the camloc and dovetail features into the clamp.... maybe?....haven't thought about it beyond that.
> Cool thing is if you use the design you currently have, the toolpost becomes the fixture to machine the clamp bolt.......I hate making fixtures!
> 
> ....A clamp bolt was good enough for Hardinge......... :
> 
> Dave



Your absolutely right Dave, I'll stick with the bolt idea. The sacrificial blot is a great idea also.
Thanks
Phil


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## deere_x475guy

Phil very nicely done plans so far. What kind of flood coolant are you using and how long have you been using it? I ask because I have a mister right now and want to add flood coolant to my lathe and mill.


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## RobWilson

looking good Phil, great idea having the locking lever on the side out of the way ,i think i may build one for my larger lathe.
Rob


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## Cliff

Hey Majorstrain 
 Really liked your post I am planing on making a QCTP for both of my lathes I like the way your making yours. What size lathe are your prints for. Keep up the good work I might use your prints if you don't mind Cliff.


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## Majorstrain

steamer  said:
			
		

> The key is to cut the two female dovetails the same time with the clamp nut, the arrow shaped part, in the post and spaced out say .03" with a washer while your cutting it. After you cut both dovetails and the clamp nut, remove the washer



WILCO Dave, I'm waiting for a dovetail cutter to arrive now, (tried making one using a triangle insert tonight. fabrication was successful to a degree, but not good enough for steel). I'll start on boring the wedge holes and and making the internals tomorrow, in prep for the combined dovetail operation you describe.



			
				steamer  said:
			
		

> I would make the dovetails to roll dimensions, not to the apex dimensions shown on your drawing as there is no way to measure an apex dimension. Put two 1/4" diameter or so ACCURATE dowel pins in and machine both female dovetails to the same dimension. If you measure between the two rolls, you can measure it very accurately, especially with guage blocks or even an adjustable parallel in between the two rolls.  If you do that with the clamp bolt in place it will clamp at the same handle position with tool holders in either position. That will be very welcome in use.



Excellent point, I'll modify the drawings to suit, Thanks



			
				deere_x475guy  said:
			
		

> Phil very nicely done plans so far. What kind of flood coolant are you using and how long have you been using it? I ask because I have a mister right now and want to add flood coolant to my lathe and mill.



To tell the truth, I rarely use the flood system, I have mainly worked with aluminum and brass so far. The last time I used the flood system was when I made my 3" boring head soon after I got the mill about a year ago. The coolant is a soluble oil that I got from the boys at work, they have been using it for years. I'll find out what the brand name is tomorrow.



			
				Cliff  said:
			
		

> Hey Majorstrain
> Really liked your post I am planing on making a QCTP for both of my lathes I like the way your making yours. What size lathe are your prints for. Keep up the good work I might use your prints if you don't mind Cliff.



Hi Cliff, The original tool post on my lathe is 75mm square and 65mm tall. Not real sure how to measure the lathe but it looks like it would swing 10" and be able to turn 25 -28" between centers. There is a pic of my lathe in this thread http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/index.php?topic=5029.0
The QCTP that this has been developed from was 60mm square without the holder and about 50mm tall. I have a set of drawing for that QCTP that I will update if you like.

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions, I'll see if I can get some more done b4 the baby arrives. T- 1 week and counting.
On the plus side the honey do b4 baby list is complete now. ;D

Phil


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## deere_x475guy

Majorstrain  said:
			
		

> To tell the truth, I rarely use the flood system, I have mainly worked with aluminum and brass so far. The last time I used the flood system was when I made my 3" boring head soon after I got the mill about a year ago. The coolant is a soluble oil that I got from the boys at work, they have been using it for years. I'll find out what the brand name is tomorrow.



Phil, thanks no rush as I am not set up yet to use it anyway but I would like to start finding out what others are using.


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## steamer

Phil,

For a small lathe ( Say 10" and under), the basic Hardinge design is a great one.

I'm using a Phase II AXA wedge on my 1200 pound 12"x 39" Logan and it works great!

Either works fine.....one of them gives you bragging rights.... ;D :big:


Dave


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## Majorstrain

Got a good few hours in the shed today, the center hole is finished and the wedge slot cut in the body.

Here is the progress pics.


I don't have a 45° set square or angle plates so I used a V block and DTI to set the angle in the vice.






and now it's ready to start the center hole






I worked my way up to the largest drill bit I had (13mm) making sure not to pop out the bottom into the vice : . The hole doesn't need to go all the way through, just into the section that will be removed for the wedge block on the other side.






I used a 3" boring head and the longest boring bar I had that would fit in the 13mm hole. The hole was slowly bored out to 15mm and the full depth of the bar.






The handle end completed with the 3 different diameters. 15, 20 and 30mm.






Started roughing out the wedge slot and soon uncovered the tip of the drilled hole. That was probably a bit too close to popping out into the vice. 






Wedge slot on the final cut, 30mm wide and 21mm deep from what would be the tip if my bar stock had been big enough.






Here is the wedge slot finished. 
You may notice that there is a 20mm recess 2mm deep at this end of the center hole. The reason is that my boring bar was 1.5mm too short and the 15mm hole was not deep enough. To solve the problem I just centered the 20mm cutter over the hole and plunged it in 2mm. It should have no effect on the operation of the tool post.






There are a few things to add to the drawings, we'll see if I can get to that tomorrow.

Until then,
Cheers
Phil


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## steamer

It's looking very familiar.

I put my block on two rods to set up for the flat. You used a Vee block...that's about the only difference........LOOKING GOOD! :bow:

Dave


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## Majorstrain

steamer  said:
			
		

> I put my block on two rods to set up for the flat.
> Dave


Interesting, could you sketch that for me Dave, I can't picture it. I know it will be blindingly simple when I see it.

Update time.
I finished the hold down holes today. That's enough for the mill until the dovetail cutter arrives, now it's back to the lathe to make the internals.

The top view






The bottom view






I learnt from the earlier boring depth issue, this time I bored the large radius first which gave me room to go deeper with the boring bar and not foul the tool shank.

The next two pics are for size comparison, the small lathe is on loan from a friend who has no space to store it. 

My lathe with the old post behind the new QCTP






Friends lathe, quite a common unit badged for Hare and Forbes






Cheers
Phil


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## Majorstrain

Drawings updated, refer to first post.

Phil


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## Majorstrain

Well, after a few distractions I got back into the shed and spent some time on the tool post. 
I finished the threaded insert, the retaining nut, and spacer. The metal is of an unknown grade.
I also had make a holder for an internal threading insert I had. ( that was successful after the third attempt :wall

My drawing calls for a M24x1.0 thread but I discovered that I don't have the change gears for the 1mm pitch, so I used a 1.5mm pitch instead. I imagine the making some change gears will soon follow.





The threaded insert completed





The retaining nut ready to part off





Parting off.





Didn't even drop it in the muck ;D I manage to drop the bits most times.





Stopped parting off the spacer half way so I could put a chamfer on the edge.





The completed parts and the internal threading tool. 

Cheers until the next instalment,
Phil


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## Majorstrain

Managed to get about 4 hours in the shed tonight.

I finished the centre nut and did the turning on the leaver base. The leaver base just needs the lock screw drilled and tapped and the leaver hole drilled and tapped. Both operations I'll do on the mill.

Here are the pics.

This is the centre nut ready to part off. The M5 hole has been drilled and tapped.
I didn't have a left hand turning tool so I used my parting off tool to remove the material left of the large diameter. I was very careful to take light cuts and watch for tool flex. All went well.





The pic below illustrates my limited tool range at this time. oh: 

After parting off the centre nut and turning it around in the chuck, I drilled the hole for the M10 tap.

When I tap on the lathe I usually put the tap in my tail stock keyless chuck and with the Morse taper loose I hold the tail stock chuck by hand and power tap at the lowest RPM.

Well with the M10 tap, the tap spun in the chuck and I could not get it locked tight enough. Holding the chuck by hand was still not a problem though.

After giving up on that method I went to my cheap tap set and got out the tap handle. Just my luck, the hole in the centre was just too small for the tap. :wall:

The pic shows how I ended up getting around the problem. I should note that I did not power tap using this method, I locked the lathe chuck using the back gear leaver and tapped a quater turn at a time.





Finally, the finished centre nut





The parts assembled with the centre nut.





To cut the chamfer on the leaver base I just set the compound slide to the angle required and advanced it by hand.





The progress so far with the leaver base in place.





Best regards,
Phil


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## Maryak

Phil,

This is going to be one very nice QCTP. :bow: :bow:

Best Regards
Bob


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## Majorstrain

> Phil,
> 
> This is going to be one very nice QCTP. :bow: :bow:
> 
> Best Regards
> Bob


Thanks Bob,
That's quite a complement coming from a man as skilled as yourself.
Best Regards
Phil


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## Majorstrain

Nipped out to the shed for half an hour while mum and baby are asleep.
Tapped the two holes in the leaver base and shortened a bit of rod that was already threaded with M8 on the end. I changed the specs for the leaver from 5mm to 8mm to suit the bit of rod available.






















That will be all until Thursday (pay day ;D ) when I buy the 4140 2" round bar for the wedge and 3" x 1 1/2" flat bar for the tool holders (not that I would call that flat :big. 

What are your thoughts on the number of tool holder I should make? scratch.gif

I was planning on making 5. A boring bar holder, a parting off holder and 3 general tool holders. Any others anyone can think off that would be handy?
Better to make them now and cut the dovetails in one go.

Cheers
Phil


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## RobWilson

Very fine piece of work Phil,great looking tool :bow:
Rob

Forgot to say make lots of holders ;D


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## steamer

Phil,

You will quickly find that there is no such thing as enough tool holders
I would add to the list a small boring bar holder as I always seem to have on of my plain ones tied up with a small boring bar in it.
If funds can allow I would also add a couple more plains as it's easier to set them up now and do them all at once.

Dave


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## Majorstrain

Cheers Rob,
The dovetails will be the defining moment, I've never done them b4. I'll give anything a go though.

Thanks for the tip Dave,
It's $45AU for the steel to make 5. Not a big ask to make a few more at the same time.

On another note. The 20mm dovetail cutter I purchased was spec'd to cut a 10mm depth of cut, but when it arrived the DoC is only 7.8mm





What do you guys think about two passes to get 10mm DoC? The shank is probably recessed enough to allow that although getting a smooth finish might be a problem. 
Is it wiser to reduce the dovetail depth or do the 10mm and have a vertical flat at the top of the dovetail recess (talking about the tool post body here like below).




The clearance on the tool holder might be an issue but I have a plan. ( Just smile and wave boys, just smile and wave  ;D wEc1 )

Here's the idea





The first dovetail is cut as close and deep as possible with the limited depth of cut. The second dovetail has been cleaned up by running a small end mill in on an angle.

We'll see how it goes.

Cheers
Phil


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## Cliff

Hey Phil your post looks great as far as other tool holders you might make one for a knurling tool if you use one very often. Giving you my two cents worth about your plan of attack on milling the dovetail's can't see why it wouldn't work but that's just a opinion of a thirty eight year machinist but there is only one way to find out is to try it again good work Cliff.


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## DavesWimshurst

Phil,
Leaving a little off the sharp corners of the dovetails would make the tool holders less vulnerable to damage from bumping into other tools, maybe truncating the corners of both the post and holders will work.
Your tool post looks like a really solid design. :bow:

You can never have too many tool holders:






The two in the back for the knurling tool and the milling spindle are built into the accessory. The dovetail for the knurling tool is of aluminum since it doesn't have to relocate accurately. I also used aluminum for a test indicator holder. 


Dave


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## Majorstrain

Cliff  said:
			
		

> Hey Phil your post looks great as far as other tool holders you might make one for a knurling tool if you use one very often. Giving you my two cents worth about your plan of attack on milling the dovetail's can't see why it wouldn't work but that's just a opinion of a thirty eight year machinist but there is only one way to find out is to try it again good work Cliff.



Thanks Cliff,
I haven't done knurling B4, but I think I'll get some wheels and make a scissor type.



			
				DavesWimshurst  said:
			
		

> You can never have too many tool holders:



Hi Dave,
Now I've got a serious case of tool post envy. woohoo1

After a good nights sleep and another think, I think I will truncate the corners a bit and also reduce the dovetail depth on both the holder and body. I could always buy the next cutter size up, but that would be more waiting :'( and the cutter would be cutting on both sides in the first few passes.

The TI and knurling holders are a must do.

Thanks again guys
Phil


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## DavesWimshurst

Phil,
I had recently bought an atlas shaper and was looking for an excuse to use it! :big:
Dave


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## steamer

Phil,

I agree with Dave's comments, truncating the tip is good practice anyway

Dave

Like the second image down in post #24


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## Majorstrain

Well the QCTP body is complete. woohoo1

There were a few oh: moments as well as :wall: but it's done. Now it's just the tool holders to make when the metal arrives.

The series continues with the making of the wedge. I started with a piece of 50mm (2") 4140 round bar and started whittling. The bar needs to be at least 42mm diameter to have enough material for the wedge.





Hot chips anyone? (fries)





With the diameter down to 15mm and leaving me standing in a heap of swarf :big: I marked out using an art-line pen and verniers.













M10 x 1.5mm thread single point cut and tested for fit. (still haven't got the hang of that)

Now off to the rotary table mounted on the mill to square up the wedge end.









Time to cut the dovetails. I started by increasing the slot width to 26mm to allow for the chamfered ends on the top of the dove tail.





Cut the dovetail sides an equal distance for centre with the base width to 35mm using the DRO as a reference. 





I then recorded the dovetail final dimensions using the rod method so I can match the holder dovetails to the body.






OK now starts the section on what NOT to do. :wall:

To get the right size and profile on the wedge, it needs to be spaced out a bit in the holder. I decided to use a washer as the packing but not having one with a 15mm hole I cut one in half and used that. 












The wedge was secured in place with the centre nut (make sure it's tight)

Those with a keen eye will see the cause of the impending doom. :





The reason for the pants packing moment. The overhang of the packing into the cutter path.
On the second pass, the washer rotated and wedged in between the body and cutter :fan:. (second pass was a climb cut oh
Then the drive belt slipped preventing more damage.

The remedy was to shorten the packing








Problem solved ;D

With the dovetails cut into the wedge, the packing was reduced to put the chamfer on the wedge.
(sorry, don't have a pic of the finished cut. You can see the result two images down.)






Then the packing was increased to cut the excess metal off the wedge and follow the profile of the body.









With the profile matched, I marked the nose of the wedge for the metal to be removed.




Just marked it with an art-line pen.





Back to the lathe




Faced off the excess 





The last operation was to drill the peg holes and insert some 15mm long 6mm pegs for the tool holder height setting.





Note that the wedge is smaller then the body. When unlocked (extended position) the wedge side must not protrude past the body sides or the holder won't slip on to the body. The wedge dovetail is also recessed in from the body dovetail for the same reason. That was the reason for all the packing sizes used.

Another oh: moment was when an end mill extended in the holder and I didn't notice until I had finished one pass and the coolant had cleared oh:. The cause was that after starting a cut, I backed out using the high speed traverse. The tool gripped on the way out. There was no damage to the tool or work piece but I didn't notice the tool extension :wall: 
You might see it in the bottom of one of the dovetails.

Oh well, That's it until next week.
Cheers
Phil


Off now to the Perth metal workers meeting. see ya
http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/index.php?topic=4831.0


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## Majorstrain

Drawings updated, refer to first post.

Phil


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## steamer

Yup , looks very familiar!  Nice Work Phil!

 :bow:

Dave


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## Majorstrain

steamer  said:
			
		

> Yup , looks very familiar!  Nice Work Phil!
> 
> :bow:
> 
> Dave



Thanks Dave,

Certainly learnt a bit about 4140 and work holding on this one.
Thanks again for the tip on machining the wedge in situation, it worked really well and was easy to visualise the cuts needed.

Cheers
Phil


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## steamer

Your welcome...anytime

I did mine basically that way, but I did all the machining with the shim in,,,,both dovetails and the corner bit of it in two setups....then pulled the shim.

4100 series steel is a bear to machine.  But I too made my wedge from it and with all the abuse it takes at the thread, you'll be glad you did.  Now ...fun with tool holders!

I think I stated before, cut the dovetail first in a long strip of stock, then part them off.....I cut them individually oh:, but that was a LOT of work, and far from the most efficient way to go about it

Then machine the height adjusting screw holes and slots.....don't forget the pins on the post!

At this point, Again, I would press the tool post into service here as a holding fixture for the now individual tool holders while you machine the tool slots and clamp screws.  I can't think of a more rigid or repeatable setup....and of course hindsight is 20/20 right.... :  I didn't do it this way, but I should have! oh:

Put a knee on the mill and bolt the post to it horizontally and have at it. It should all go pretty fast.

Pictures please! ;D




Dave


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## Majorstrain

I'm back at last, ;D
The 75 x 38 x 600 mm flat bar arrived tonight woohoo1 so I made a start. Not much but a start none the less.

The 4140 flat bar is not so flat after all. 
It was slightly concave down the centre of its length and had a small twist from end to end. 
Not worries, I clamped it down to the mill table by the corners and ran a 50mm face mill over it. when I got to the clamps I just moved them in a bit so the cutter could get to the corners as well.

The 600mm bar clamped to the mill. The right end has the corners yet to be faced and the left end is done




Flipped it over and it sits on the table nice and flat.

Next on the agenda is to mill the dovetails



			
				steamer said:
			
		

> I would press the tool post into service here as a holding fixture for the now individual tool holders while you machine the tool slots and clamp screws.
> Dave



Great advice Dave, WILCO

Cheers
Phil


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## Majorstrain

G'day all,
Got a full day in the shop and stuff all to show for it. Don't get me wrong, It was a good day with no problems just slow progress.

Today I got into milling the flat bar down to the width of the dovetails, A total of 20mm off each side 9mm deep.
I used a 20mm HSS two flute cutter, (just what I had to hand) and with the help of Marv's feed and speed programs came up with the figures.
RPM 150
Feed 15mm/min
Well even with a 25% depth of cut (5mm) it's still 4 passes at 40 minutes a pass, plus a finish pass. :wall:

There is still more of the same to come tomorrow. :wall: :wall:

And now for the progress pics.

Pass #3 , how do the pack that much swarf in to the bar in the first place. Must be done the same way the get the smoke into the electronic components. :big: :big:





First side done, starting on the second. few! I would hate to do this without a power feed. Rof}





A 5mm doc and 9mm deep, just doesn't seem to worry the old girl.





Cheers
Phil


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## steamer

good lord man, your building a whole heap of holders!  :big: and a bunch of chips too!

Keep at it...I wish my mill table was that long, I can only cut 16" 

Dave


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## Majorstrain

woohoo1 Finished the dovetail on the tool holder blank. I must say I'm glad to see the end of that.

The 20mm HSS cutters would only last 4 - 5mm passes before they were too dull to keep using, that meant a trip to the tool and cutter grinder at work.
2.4 meters of cut between each resharpen. 
I think I've actually learnt how to use the grinder now. ;D

Here is the last cut in progress. 
The markings on the end are from the steel suppliers band-saw. The piece is 75mm (3") wide, that must be one heck of a big saw.





Before I tore down the set-up, I measured the dovetail with some 1/4" HSS tool rods and then did a test fit.
All OK, even though I had made the dovetails a little under size. ;D





When I installed it on the lathe, I discovered an issue. oh: 





I must have misread the drawing because the tool holder seems a tad too tall. 
Maybe the dimension was 60mm high not 600mm.  stickpoke Rof}



Just joking, I'll take the blank to work tomorrow and cut it up on the cut-off saw into 11 tool holders of 55mm height.
Then it's time to finish them off.

Night all,
Phil


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## Cliff

Hey Phil 
 Just beautiful work.
     Cliff


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## steamer

Looking good Phil....Worst parts over....the next tough part is all the tapped holes!...heheheheheheh :big:


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## Majorstrain

Thanks Chris and Dave,


			
				steamer  said:
			
		

> the next tough part is all the tapped holes!



On that note, would you recommend using a slightly bigger tap drill on 4140 or just use the recommended size?

Cheers
Phil


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## Cliff

Hey Phil I can't see why 10mm won't work you don't want to get to big. again excellent work. Cliff


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## steamer

4140!  Well that explains the endmill wear!  ;D

Yes, I would not use the standard 75% depth of thread for 4140, try 50% depth first....and don't even think about using #6...... :big:

Get yourself some EXCELLENT quality HSS two flute spiral gun taps....don't cheap out here with taps if your doing that many holes in 4140....it's not worth it.

Gun taps will push the chip forward and be very free cutting, but you can only take advantage of that with through holes.....like on a tool holder.  I think I'd just find a cliff to jump off of if they were all blind holes.. :big:

Dave


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## Majorstrain

G'day all,

After cutting up the tool holder blank at work into aproximatly 55mm lengths, I brought them home and set about sqauring them up and reducing the width to 70mm to match the tool post.

The first operation was reducing the width of the holder. Reference height was taken from the dovetail edge on the moveable jaw of the vice.
Once one side was done, I flipped it over and did the other side. This ensured that the dovetail was central.
All 11 holders were done before moving on to the next operation.







Next was to square up and clean up the adjacent side. Again all 11 were done on one side before flipping them over and milling the final side to size.






There has been a bit of talk about vice stops and alike, this is what I use as a stop.






Any way, with reference points set in the DRO. 
The height adjusting slot was milled using an 8mm universal mill 8mm deep in one pass.






Again all 11 done.






The next job was to drill and tap the height adjusting screw thread. (drawing has M5, I changed it to M6)



			
				steamer  said:
			
		

> Yes, I would not use the standard 75% depth of thread for 4140, try 50% depth first....and don't even think about using #6...... :big:
> 
> Get yourself some EXCELLENT quality HSS two flute spiral gun taps....don't cheap out here with taps if your doing that many holes in 4140....it's not worth it.
> 
> Gun taps will push the chip forward and be very free cutting, but you can only take advantage of that with through holes.....like on a tool holder.  I think I'd just find a cliff to jump off of if they were all blind holes.. :big:
> 
> Dave



I took your advice on the depth of tread Dave and used a drill bit for a 50% DOT. 
I have a set of Sutton power taps that I used. They draw the swarf out the top as they tap. Good for blind holes as well.
I bought the set when I had to tap 100 blind holes in aluminium. M3 was the size needed but I got the set any way.










That was the last operation that I finished all 11 holders at the same time. 
Now it's time to individualise the holders for there intended tools.

When I cutt up the 600mm tool holder blank, the last holder ended up only 40mm high. I started with this one as a test piece.
It will be made to hold 1/4" HSS tooling.

I milled an 8mm wide slot 7mm deep across the holder and then drilled and tapped 4 M5 holes to hold the tool.













[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMU3Q0ovJ2g[/ame]

The tapping is done at 50 rpm and the quill hand feed until the tap bites, then the quill draws itself down and my hand moves to the reverse switch.
When the right depth is reached, I flick the mill into reverse and assist the tap by taking up the weight of the quill with the feed leaver. Again it feeds itself out.
Lots of motion lotion helps (cutting oil)

One down 10 to go. ;D

I did two more holders before I called it quits for the night.
They were some standard holders that can take 16mm tooling. (although I only have 12mm tooling)

Milled a 20mm wide slot 17mm deep in two passes (8mm deep each). Then a couple of clean up passes of 0.1mm on the sides.






Drilled and tapped 3 M10 holes for the tool holding bolts.






Just in case you didn't get bored watching the first tapping movie, here is the M10 being power tapped. :big:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSVIPNA0oDo[/ame]
Ah, Not quite as exciting as watching paint dry. th_wav


This is the progress so far. The M10 bolts will be changed for cap screws when I get some.






And the same on the tool post.

1/4" tool holder





Standard holder











Well bye for now,
Phil


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## arnoldb

Really very nice Phil :bow:
Regards, Arnold


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## kustomkb

Nice work Phil,

great documentation too!


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## Cliff

Phil looking real nice. I never had the balls to tap like that be my luck to break the tap right off and ruin the part. Cliff


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## Majorstrain

Thanks Arnold, Kustomkb, Dave and Cliff for your kind comments and advice.



			
				Cliff said:
			
		

> Phil looking real nice. I never had the balls to tap like that be my luck to break the tap right off and ruin the part. Cliff


When I gave the run down on the tapping I should have included this very important bit of information.
When I tighten up the ER32 collet that holds the tap, I just snug it up. That way the tap will slip in the collet and not break. If it slips under normal load, just stop the mill and snug it up a bit more in position.

If anyone has pictures or an explanation on how they made special tool holders it would be greatly appreciated. I'm looking for ideas including parting off holders and boring bars etc.

Cheers,
Phil


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## steamer

Hi Phil,

Oh I have GOT to get me one of those taps!......
Of course,neither of my mills have a quil..... :big:

Looking good!  Thanks for the video too.....It's really nice to see it done.

Dave

PS hope the cut is healing well......sans alcohol :big:


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## Majorstrain

Thanks to all who made comments and gave advice along the way. :bow: :bow:
I'll pop back here to document the making of some non standard tool holders, but that's it for now.

Next project is to cut some missing change gears for the lathe. 
This will encompass forming a single point involute tool to fit a fly cutter, and then cutting the gears.
If it hasn't been documented before, I'll spit some pictures out for that one as well.

Then maybe I can get back to Elmer's #24 beam engine that is half done and the boiler to suit.

Kind regards,
Phil



			
				steamer said:
			
		

> PS hope the cut is healing well......sans alcohol :big:



Thanks Dave, it's a knife like cut under the thumb knuckle. Doing well but not healed yet.
I must remember to keep the alcohol for drinking not washing parts. ;D 
Can't say I like the taste of Metho though, and the parts don't come out quite as clean if I use bourbon. scratch.gif


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## GailInNM

Phil,
Here is a cutoff blade tool holder that I made a long time ago.
The support for the blade goes under the blade to keep it rigid as possible. As shown it has a 0.060 blade and will cut off up to 1.25 inches. 

The notch for the blade is as snug fit on the blade. It is 0.050 deep at the top of the blade and at the bottom of the blade there is a section about .09 wide that is only 0.033 deep. This keeps the side relief angles equal on both sides of the blade, but if you build one you should probably check your blade as it may be different. In the second photo you can see the small step at the bottom of the blade.

The blade is held in with 10-32 socket head cap screws. On the top of the blade, the blade is thicker than the notch is deep so washers clamp the blade in place. On the bottom, the blade is recessed into the holder, so the 10-32 holes are counter bored so they will clamp on the blade.

Mine is set up with a 0.625 radius support for the 1.25 max cut off diameter.

In use, the blade is indicated in to be perpendicular to the work and with the tip on the center line of the work.

Note the non-active end of the blade has been ground to 0.025 wide for cutting narrow fin slots on small IC engine cylinders. It is easy to reverse or change the blade for such operations. 

My tooling is not a nice looking as yours, but it is functional. Thanks for the nice how to thread.

Gail in NM,USA


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## Majorstrain

Thanks Gail,


>



I've got an inset type cut off tool that I have never used because I didn't have a holder. 
Your design will fit the bill nicely, my tool has parallel sides so the fabrication will be easier.

I made a quick and easy tool height setter today, just a bit of brass and spring steel.






I parted off the brass 10mm below tool height and tapped a hole in the top. The steel strip is just a 3/8" wide piece off the back of a 1" thick metal band saw blade.
The blade height is set on centre height and locked with the locking nuts.

On the bottom I have recessed the base so there is less chance of a nick or swarf tilting the base. I also inserted a small magnet into the base to give a bit of sticktion (there's a word for the day)






Cheers,
Phil


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## RobWilson

Phil :bow: that's a real pro job you have made of the parting toolholder.i like it 
Regards Rob


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## Paolo

Another job to do!!! :big: :big: :big:
Best regards
Paolo


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## ksor

Hi, 

I'm looking for QCTP for my Stanko 1A616 - on old russion lathe from the 1960's !

Would you recommend I just "scale up" your drawings to fit my needs - or did you find some drowbacks with your design?

Best regards
KSor, Denmark


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## Majorstrain

Hi KSor,
I'm sorry to say I don't have the experience to recommend a scale up. 
I have no problems with mine other than the cross slide mounting bolt is not in the center of the body like other tool posts, the forces trying to rotate the body can be greater depending on which hole you use. 






Two bolts would solve the problem. Like what Steamer has done






Steamer also mentioned that the design was good up to 10', mine is on a 12' swing lathe.



> Phil,
> 
> For a small lathe ( Say 10" and under), the basic Hardinge design is a great one.
> 
> I'm using a Phase II AXA wedge on my 1200 pound 12"x 39" Logan and it works great!
> 
> Either works fine.....one of them gives you bragging rights....
> 
> Dave



Cheers
Phil


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## BillTodd

Hi, 

Just a quick post to say thanks for sharing this. I was part way though my own version of the Hardinge holder (slightly smaller than yours) when I discovered this forum, so was able to modify my wedge screw to your design - much better than my simple bolt idea! 

Rather than use a dovetail cutter, I sawed my dovetails with a 3/16" side & face cutter in a horizontal mill, which seems to work quite well. Also, since threading up to a shoulder is quite painless on an HLV-H, I was able to dispense with the threaded insert.

Regards,

Bill Todd


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## Lew Hartswick

I'm almost done with a tool post "design" which is a small version of the MH 90 
(mechano???? something spanish ) that are on the Clausing/Metosa at school.
It started out just to see if I could make it and ended up having to be modified to
see if it could be used on the teachers home South Bend so it has some "less than 
ideal" proportions. but we'll see in a week or so and if it works I'll post a few pix. 
I really like those posts/holders that came with the lathes. 
  ...Lew...


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