# Shop Size



## Tin Falcon (Jul 14, 2007)

Guys:
 one of these days I may get the nerve to post photos of my shop or pieces of it. I have machines in the basement ,the main shop is a room in back of the house and the horizontal saw is in the garage. Something that stands out though. It seems like most of us want a bigger shop. The late great Rudy Kouhoupt once told me his shop was a shed that was 96 square feet.  8x12 IIRC. the reason ? Most jurisdictions do not tax or regulate buildings under 100 square feet.  Of course I heard that Rudy had engines tucked just about everywhere in his house including the kitchen so would not surprise me if he had machines in the house . I do not really know though.  . I do know he was an amazing man , machinist and writer. He always treated me like a friend. 
Tin


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## rake60 (Jul 14, 2007)

Tin shops fill up fast.  I don't think anyone can ever have one big enough.
If funds were unlimited and you built the perfect shop to fit everything you
own, two days later you'll run across a great deal on another machine. :? 

My little basement shop has some room for growth in every direction but
UP.  It still has it's draw backs.  Worst one is an angry female voice saying
"WHY it the living room carpet sparkling AGAIN? :evil: "


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## wareagle (Jul 15, 2007)

To quote a friend of mine in regards to shop sizes; "Bigger than you need is not nearly large enough".

He has a 50'x100' shop, and just about anything that can be imagined (automotive wise) can be found in there. When he built it, he said he'd never in his lifetime outgrow it. It was the ultimate shop.

Now the ultimate shop has two cargo containers sitting beside it for the overflow.


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## Sprocket (Aug 16, 2007)

Yeah, they fill up fast. I separated off about a third of a one car garage space
because that's what I could spare.  I insulated and heated it, and started filling it up














and there is a lot more in there now. Gotta rearrange some I think...


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## Jose Rivera (Dec 19, 2007)

Sprocket  said:
			
		

> Yeah, they fill up fast. I separated off about a third of a one car garage space
> because that's what I could spare. I insulated and heated it, and started filling it up
> 
> 
> ...



I would love to see more of your lathe!!


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## JoseMorales (Feb 21, 2010)

Jose:
Buen lugar de trbajo y buena herramienta
Felicidades,
JoseMorales.
Saltillo, Coahuila, Mexico.SS


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## New_Guy (Feb 21, 2010)

Jose Rivera  said:
			
		

> I would love to see more of your lathe!!



Sprocket posted pic's of the Southbend in the "show us your lathe" thread the pain job looks perfect 

i dont know how i ever got my lathe into my shed and i cant wait to get a mill thats going to be a very fun weekend :big:


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## ariz (Feb 22, 2010)

mine is about 3 x 10 meters
it is (was) the garage, but the car was expelled time ago; it stays outdoors now

it is cold in the winter and hot in summer, and yes, space is never enough
I don't know where to stock my new tools, every place is taken

well, there could be still a little place...
my wife has her washing machine in there. if only she could find another place for it ;D


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## Blogwitch (Feb 22, 2010)

I have a shop that is 16ft x 8.5ft, and everything had to be fitted to inch perfect precision to get it all in, in fact two of my machines were purchased because they were the only ones that would fit into the space I had available.

I now have a major problem, I need to find room for an X3 sized speciality mill to come into the shop in the near future. Something will have to go.

You will find that a lot of the UK lads have very small shops indeed, and come up with ingenious ways to get it all in. An 8ft x 6ft shed would be like a football field to them.

Blogs


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## DickDastardly40 (Feb 22, 2010)

If you would like to see a delightul 'retirement' shop, check out this thread on Practical Machinist to which I hope I'm not breaking any rules by posting:

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/member-shop-photos/oldcarguy-s-retirement-toy-shop-124958/ 

If money were no object I'd like something similar, though perhaps less oriented to automobiles.

Have fun in your workshops, I've been working away for 3 months from home so far since starting a new career and miss mine.


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## rake60 (Feb 22, 2010)

*Now THAT is a shop!*
 th_confused0052


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## ieezitin (Feb 22, 2010)

I have quiet a large machine shop and I am fortunate to have a barn for my weld facility, but for ten years I operated in a small shed type environment. I purchased this farm with full intention for my machining and welding business for a retirement business.

Even I am running out of room in the machine shop and in two months I have to fit a Bridgeport Knee mill in and maybe a cnc mill.

By virtue of my grooming I am tidy in the shop, everything has its place and there is a place for everything, while using my tooling or plucking material for usage I pay attention to shop hygiene, this really is a key to a well functional working environment. Saving time and mental anguish in looking for a 50 cent piece or dragging out your little favorite boring bar.

Some advice is this, once an item has a home religiously put it back there, dont cast it aside and tell yourself a lie you will put it back later. Its less taxing on the brain and keeps distractions down to a minimum. Walls and ceilings! Just empty space! Use them, stick stuff in some form of order on walls and ceilings, I use walls for tooling and accessories all laid out in order of purpose, ceilings I use for stock, long round bars angle iron and flat bar.

I use wood boxes for things like home made tooling and fixtures. And a most wonderful accessories is those little plastic tier trays that hold little fasteners nuts etc, its a PITA trying to find a little 10-32 x ¾ long cap head in the junk box. I have over time labeled and stacked these little plastic draw organizers and have a nice little hardware store at my fingertips.

I dont think its really a case on how big your shop is but just how organized you and the shop are!. Spending valuable shop time in manufacturing systems and making hardware that suits you will pay dividends and reap pleasure in your shop future experience.

Saying that. You could put me in a aircraft hanger I still would find some way to fill it!.

All the best.            Saying ( be tidy ) echo echo echo  Anthony.


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## SAM in LA (Feb 22, 2010)

Now remember this.

It's not the size of the shop that matters, it's how you use it.

 :big: :big:


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## New_Guy (Feb 22, 2010)

DickDastardly40  said:
			
		

> If you would like to see a delightul 'retirement' shop, check out this thread on Practical Machinist to which I hope I'm not breaking any rules by posting:
> 
> http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/member-shop-photos/oldcarguy-s-retirement-toy-shop-124958/
> 
> ...



lol saw that guys shop ages ago totally insane!!! he has 2 large surface grinders and an EDM!!!!


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## Tin Falcon (May 21, 2011)

I know I am digging up an old thread here but I believe the topic to be quite current. Recently a couple of folks have posted photos of there work area set up in a corner of a garage . And comments made about not being a real shop.When I was at the Kinzer/ Rough and tumble show last weekend I was reminded that the late "Dick" Hamilton Upshur kept his machine shop in a closet he had a modest 6" craftsman lathe and a small but customized mill. His plan sets can be found here. http://hamiltonupshur.tripod.com/ Dick passed away in 2006 I may have seen him at cabin fever but can not say I ever met him. While not a house hold name he is still well remembered in the Model engine building community especially those who knew him through cabin Fever and Kinzer, as he exhibited at both. Dick Uphur isa perfect example that you do not need a big shop to do great work. 

I have seen fine examples of Sherline mill and a Sherline lathe and a unimat mill set up in there own portable shop . These were furniture grade wooden boxes that held the machine tool as well as the needed accessories the boxes could be closed for easy transport. The list could go on. here is a link to the Sherline site with multiple examples of portable and tiny shops. 
http://www.sherline.com/shops.htm
The Us military has also utilized various portable machine shops over the years some set up in a shipping container that expands when set up . The military had /has machine shops the back of a truck or tucked into the belly of a submarine. 
NASA used to have a and may still have and operate a portable shop in the back of a truck that supported robotics competition. 
Although the military considers a 7 ton mazak in a shipping container portable I would not. and the Navy ship board shops are massive. These are interesting but not hobby shops. 
Now more on the real topic. The late great Rudy Kouhoupt utilized small unimat and perry sized machines and had a small shop by many standards. 
Guys and gals there is no reason to feel inadequate or second class because of the size of your shop. Even if you are starting out with a hand saw a hand drill a few files and and some measuring tools all are welcome here . 
Lets face it we all started knowing nothing about machining. some learned young from a dad or grandad. Some had shop class in Jr high or high school, some like myself had military training. Some apprenticed then went on to be professional machinist or tool and die makers. And many here are self taught with the help of books the internet and sometimes videos. 
Like Sam said many moons ago...


> It's not the size of the shop that matters, it's how you use it.



Tin


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## steamer (May 21, 2011)

I will absolutely second what Tin's saying.  It's not the tools or the square footage...its' whats between the ears.  I have seen some amazing work performed on old worn equipment ill suited to the task....but with a brilliant "hand".

Dave


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## Tin Falcon (May 21, 2011)

Jerry Kiefer is another one that comes to mind that only has little Sherline equipment. 
But has done amazing things with it. 

http://www.craftsmanshipmuseum.com/Kieffer.htm
Tin


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## shred (May 21, 2011)

Its extremely rare to find a home shop machinist that thinks his shop is large enough.... ;D ;D


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## mklotz (May 21, 2011)

shred  said:
			
		

> Its extremely rare to find a home shop machinist *that who thinks his shop is large enough.... ;D ;D
> *



Considerable research indicates that the concept is not defined.


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## stevehuckss396 (May 22, 2011)

shred  said:
			
		

> Its extremely rare to find a home shop machinist that thinks his shop is large enough.... ;D ;D


Well I'm the one. When we bought the house I knew that there was no way the tiny garage would work out. Working on the Hotrods and antiques the 2 car was just too small. Back in 2003 the plans were made and the addition went on. Now some 8 years later I still have more than enough room. The engines are 4 times and more smaller so the garage keeps getting bigger. I do need more counter top so I'm tossing around building a big island like they put in kitchens. We still park the everyday cars in the front and the back is MINE, ALL MINE.

Here are some pics when it was first completed.


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## kcmillin (May 22, 2011)

Steve, that is a huge garage, I cant even see a machine shop in there :big:

Kel


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## peatoluser (May 23, 2011)

Just been viewing the links Tin posted. The skill and ingenuity that's shown in those portable workshops is truly inspirational. My workbench seems positively spacious by comparison!
And what can one say about Jerry Kiefer's work but th_confused0052 th_confused0052 th_confused0052 they really are masterpieces in miniature.

and to quote steamer :-
I have seen some amazing work performed on old worn equipment ill suited to the task....but with a brilliant "hand".

I'm sure I remember looking through some old volumes of model engineer were Tubal Cain set himself the task of building a stuart engine without recourse to any power tools or lathe (including treadle operated). used a carpenters belly brace , hand drill and adjustable reamers to do the cylinder bore. can't remember how he accomplished the rest, but i think he hand filed the flywheel rim to within .002" runout.
does anybody know what year/volume it appeared in? I'd love to read it again.

yours

peter


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## krv3000 (May 31, 2011)

HI just a note my fens farther is a mobile black smith shoes horses for a living workind out of a back of a van with a forge and a anvil the life span of the vans is no more than 3 years caring all that wate in the back dus them no good seen him mack up a set of gates all out of old horse shoes


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## steamer (May 31, 2011)

Clearly Steve, the part about whats between the ears is all you buddy......I keep looking at that V8 in amazement....... :bow: :bow:


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## Tin Falcon (May 31, 2011)

KRV Here is the states most of the mobile blacksmiths are set up in a stainless steel trailer. neat rigs . There is a annual black smithing event / competition at a sort of local living history Museum. Rough and tumble @ Kinzers PA. I have wandered about there a couple time during blacksmith days. 
Tin


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## blighty (May 31, 2011)

first post 

our man caves can never be "too big"

 I'm form the U.K and used to have a shed of 8 x 6 (U.K standard man cave) i moved house just over a year a go and could not take the shed with me. so for the last year all my stuff has been doted around the house. lathes and press drill under the stairs, mill in the dinning room..... that sort of thing. 

i have now built a 241 square foot shed (5x bigger ;D) in the back garden, all lined and insulated. over the last week or so i have been moving stuff in there and I'm struggling to find a home for it all.  : :


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## krv3000 (May 31, 2011)

hi tin i love watching him I'm no stranger to hitting things with a hammer but he makes it look so simple theirs sum beautifully work cums out of all shapes and sises of work shop in this forum I'm in or at sum of the work that gets dun  regards bob


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## GWRdriver (May 31, 2011)

Here's a view of an ME's shed workshop ca.1890. Note the treadle lathe, and the coal heater under the worksbench. I've never been able to identify the locomotive.


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## steamer (May 31, 2011)

blighty  said:
			
		

> first post
> 
> our man caves can never be "too big"
> 
> ...






 ;D  I'm glad I'm not the only one with that problem!

Welcome Blighty

Dave


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## ChrisB (Jun 2, 2011)

I'm also a member of the UK bunch.

Small house, small garage, no shed, but a spare upstairs bedroom, shared use I have one side the wife has the other. Is a length of kitchen worktop big enough, no, but then again I know I would fill anything eventually ;D

One thing I do know though, is that I enjoy my time in there and can happily say everytime I do venture into the 'playroom' I lean something new. So its good in my book. Also amazing to learn how far swarf can travel and how well it sticks into the carpet in the rest of the house.


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