# My Sidewinder Buggy project



## Jones

Hi,
While not model engineering, this is a mechanically inclined project so I thought I would share it here for anyone interested.
I have always wanted an off-road buggy and now that I have finished school I have a 4 month break in which I have been building this, as a little break from model engineering. It's a Sidewinder, designed by 'The Edge'. http://www.edge.au.com I looked at many different designs before settling on this one.

Frame progress












Rear suspension swingarm (Increased size of the bracing tube to make it stronger)











Front suspension swingarms











I bought this written off motorbike (statutory write off - can never be re-registered) from an auction:






It's a 2007 Suzuki GS-500F with only 9,500 km's on it.
Here is the engine removed (it's VERY heavy)











I hope to have it finished, or at least driveable, sometime mid january.
Comments, questions and *constructive* criticism welcome.


----------



## malcolmt

Hi Jones'y
What a great project, I hope you will keep us updated with the build, I see some fantastic work in that frame and suspension parts you have built. :bow: :bow: :bow:
Criticism ???????
NEEDS A BIGGER ENGINE   

Great stuff

Kind regards

Malcolmt


----------



## BobWarfield

Buggies like that are cool. Some are insanely fast with a motorcycle engine. I like the full roll cage too.

Are you going to scavenge the bike's brakes too?

Cheers,

BW


----------



## stevehuckss396

I made something like that years ago with a 2 cylinder 340 snomobile engine. You wont regret it!! Just be careful!!


----------



## rake60

Nice looking project Jones!

Please keep us posted on the progress.

Rick


----------



## Tin Falcon

Jones nice project . From personal experience you may want to disassemble the engine and check for internal damage. I had a car years ago that I bought as a wreck it had minor front end damage. I ended up giving it to my brother who needed a car. After only few hundred miles it started smoking. My brother being an experience bike mechanic opened up the engine and found that the retaining ring that held tone of the wrist pins in place apparently broke loose in the accident. This little part put a deep score in one of the pistons and allowed oil to blow by. That engine looks great but you may not want to assume that it is fine internally. A inspection tear down may save you major problems later. Just a thought. 
Tin


----------



## kustomkb

Cool!
Ya got a real nice powerplant there.


I have done a little swing arm building of my own.

From a cub 70











http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6636067717591910300&q=source:004805650779899911724&hl=en

Have fun.

Kevin.


----------



## Bernd

Kevin,

Were can you get plans to build something like that. 

I'm thinking steam powered. :big: :big: :big:

Bernd


----------



## kustomkb

Bernd,

It is a one off I built as I went along, Sometimes I look back at something I've built and have no idea how it was done.

Like I was possessed or something. ;D

KB


----------



## Jones

Kevin that has got to be one of the weirdest rides I have ever seen! It looks like great fun.

OK, I have done a bit more since the last update. HAVE PICS!

Close up of the bars which I added to the front of the frame:






Put on the rear suspension mounts:






Cut the frame






Then welded it back together 20mm downwards. The HUGE Suzuki engine won't fit otherwise


























I also bought two shocks from a yamaha XT-550. Unfortunately the designer of the Edge buggies says that I will have to upgrade the springs in them to make them work properly. I'ill see how it goes.

Andrew


----------



## kustomkb

Good foresight on the frame.

Why is everything blue? Is there alot of moisture out there?


----------



## rleete

kustomkb  said:
			
		

> Why is everything blue?



It's sad because it isn't finished?  :big:


----------



## Jones

All steel comes from the supplier painted that blue colour. I guess it is to stop rust. I think the manufacturer is called "Bluescope steel", and they paint all their steel blue. It's great because it never has rust on it (except where it get's welded)


----------



## Metal Mickey

Really great thread! Keep up the good work. I built a lotus 7 replica from a book sold in the UK that was called "Build a sports car for under £250" or something like that. Anyway I built it for my suns 17th Birthday as it was cheaper to insure!

Don't take it as a criticism because your welds seem deep and strong so I would grind some of the excess off if I was you......just a thought.....

I would love to build something like it again but being disabled,would never use it. If someone in the UK wants a frame welded up let me know. I love working with 1" square tube steel. Making the frame was the best part of building the car and I think your doing a great job.

That's the trouble with this forum theres so many good things going on......I never get to do the things i should!

Looking forward to your next post.


----------



## Maryak

Metal Mickey  said:
			
		

> That's the trouble with this forum theres so many good things going on......I never get to do the things i should!



You too ???

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## Jones

> I would grind some of the excess off if I was you



I know what you mean, some of the welds look pretty bad. It is arc/stick welding and I am now much better at it than I was when I first started the frame. HOWEVER, some places wont let you race if you grind off any of the welds so I thought 'better safe than sorry if I decide to race this at a later date'.


----------



## Metal Mickey

I didn't think the welds looked pretty bad, but I am interested in your comment that they won't let your race if they are ground back! Not being involved in that side of things, it is a bit of a surprise. You learn something everyday.

Keep going your projest does you proud! :bow:


----------



## Maryak

Jones,

For your vertical welds - vertical up - reduce the amps and a slight weave
                 vertical down - increase the amps and go like hell no weave.

They look like V up to me which is stronger than v down but much harder to get a neat weld.

Hope the above helps ??? ???

Best Regards
Bob


----------



## zeusrekning

I was so please to see this post. I actually though I was @ the wrong forum. This is the same buggy I hope to start on sometime after the new year. Make sure to keep us informed. Are you on the edge fourm. I have been been following The Edge buggies since the mid to late 90's.


----------



## Jones

> For your vertical welds - vertical up - reduce the amps and a slight weave
> vertical down - increase the amps and go like hell no weave.



Thanks very much Bob :bow: , I had only tried to do a vertical down once and it immediately blew a massive hole in the metal. Almost all the welds on the frame were done by rotating the frame so I was just doing a normal flat weld. It is getting a bit more difficult to do that each day as the frame gets heavier.

Zeusrekning, I am on the Edge forum. I have a topic in the 'in progress' section called "Andrew's Sidewinder".
I would highly recommend the Sidewinder over the other Edge buggies because it is SO much easier to build than the Piranha (needs laser cut parts and CV joints = $$$), and it is a huge step up from the Taipan (no suspension).


----------



## Jones

MERRY CHRISTMAS!

Well, I have a small update. I have done 2.5 of the 4 engine mounts. I need to get some bolts to do the front and rear mounts because they need to be removable so that I can get the engine in and out.






















All mounts have these machined washers (made on the lathe) so that if it needs to be moved slightly I can machine a slightly thicker/thinner washer to move the engine.






Here is a picture of the frame as it is now






And Rocky likes to think he has helped a bit ;D


----------



## Jones

Thought I'd post an update for anyone still interested in this project.

Finished modifying the steering rack. Instead of tacking a bush on one end, I decided to machine a press fit bushing on the lathe to press into the rack. I might have to bore it out a bit more, but at the moment it works perfectly.






Rear bearing plates arrived from Edge, so now the rear swingarm is 100% complete except paint






520 50 tooth sprocket from a motorcycle shop in Brookvale was $40 new. The guy went through all the 520 50 tooth sprockets to find me the cheapest, AND then he gave me a discount! I think it looks pretty good. The place was called APW motorcycles.






Picked up a seat on ebay. A friend and I bought the pair for $140, and I got the more faded one because I need the reclining lever on the left. It won't fit on the right because of the engine.






Mounted the oil cooler at the back of the buggy. If I was to do it again I would save some money by using rigid steel pipes, rather than the expensive oil cooler pipes.











Removed the rear brake assembly from the bike






Made the suspension pivot pins. The rear one is a bit longer than stock because I made the pivot wider.
Instead of threading the end of the pins I decided to use cotter/split pins through the end of the bars. I think this is a good alternative to buying an expensive die to thread the end of the bars. I also bored out the nuts to weld them on the pins, rather than threading them on.






Seat rails without the holes drilled in them






One of the wing supports done. It was easier to cut the correct angles than I expected






Also, I fitted the front suspension mounts. I had to tack and grind off the top suspension mount like 10 times to get it in the right spot and square to everything. Magnets helped hold it in place but made the arc (during welding) go a little bit strange






I hope to have the buggy done by the 1st of feb. It will be close, but I think I can make it, especially if my friend comes over to help.

Andrew


----------



## T70MkIII

Jones  said:
			
		

> Instead of threading the end of the pins I decided to use cotter/split pins through the end of the bars. I think this is a good alternative to buying an expensive die to thread the end of the bars.



Hi Andrew

Cool project! If I understand what I'm quoting above, you're only going to use a pin to retain the suspension pin at one end? I would NOT do this. If the pin is sheared through because of lateral forces, or just worn away by rotating against another piece of metal over time, you could be in for a catastrophe. I would ensure I build these critical parts exactly to edge spec (or greater with any mods).

Are you going to add some more triangulation to the frame? I haven't seen the original design, but it looks like it could twist a bit. Maybe that is an advantage in a buggy?

I hope I didn't sound too negative, because I think you are doing a great job. I just want you to be safe.


----------



## Jones

Thanks Richard,
All feedback is welcome!
The designer of Edge buggies has also told me that I should thread the suspension pins, mostly so that I can preload the bushings a bit, but you also make a good point. The pin doesn't experience any lateral forces due to the way it is designed but you're right about it wearing away.
The frame is pretty much complete to the Edge design, and they all seem to work really well without any (or very minimal) chassis twist. However, because I have extended the frame by 180mm to give me more leg room I might put 1 extra bar in the middle of the frame. My main concern at the moment is keeping weight down because less weight means faster acceleration!

Thanks again,
Andrew


----------



## T70MkIII

Sounds good, Andrew.

Looking forward to more pics as the build progresses.


----------



## Jones

Hey everyone, just thought I'd give a little update to those who were following this project. I've pretty much completed the buggy. I've taken it apart and painted the frame. All that's left to do is to paint the suspension parts, reassemble, and then a couple of odd jobs like wiring...

Here's a pic of the buggy before I took it apart:






Yes, it's EXTREMELY loud ;D


----------



## Krown Kustoms

That is sweet, a friend of mine gave me a 25hp Kholer v twin engine the other day, that is exactly what I was going to do with it.
I was going for a mono rear with the engine mounted there so the chain wouldnt get as much stress.
I have a miniature chopper I have been working on for a while, I am going to finish it before I start in the buggy.
very nice build
-B-
ps I see you upgraded to a mig welder


----------



## Jones

> I was going for a mono rear with the engine mounted there so the chain wouldnt get as much stress.



The engine sprocket is inline with the swingarm pivot so there is no stress in the chain (in theory). It seems to work quite well.

Heehee, that's not a MIG welder, its an AC/DC TIG welder. My new toy!


----------



## Krown Kustoms

nice, have you tried anything non ferrous, aluminum is hard to weld (for me it is) 
I only have a DC Tig, an AC is in the works.
I checked out the website and am thinking of getting the piranha plans instead of designing one.
thanks for the motivation and the website.
-B-


----------



## Jones

Your welcome B 

I have tried welding aluminium... at first it didn't go very well but I watched a short DVD on the process which taught me a lot (12mm arc length. I was using around 5mm and it wasn't working well). I'm still pretty rubbish at it. It's great fun though, much more precise than arc welding. It's sort of what I imagined welding would be like before I started, it's great.

The Piranha really looks like an awesome buggy. If you go onto the Edge forums there is a double front A-arm mod which looks pretty good. I'm pretty happy that I went for the sidewinder, but if I was planning on racing it and/or had a bigger budget then I would have definitely gone for the Piranha.


----------

