# Educate me on lathe carriage stop please---



## Brian Rupnow (Jul 20, 2008)

I have found that many things I go to machine on the lathe end up being very close to my whirling chuck. This means that I have to be extremely cautious when taking a cut parallel to the axis of the rotating part so as not to run my compound rest or cutting tool into the chuck. Since I always turn the lead screw manually, I should be able to clamp a physical stop to the lathe ways to stop the carriage travel at a safe distance from disaster. The people at Busy Bee are anxious to sell me stuff, but they don't know s#*t from mud about what accesories are available for the things they sell. It would seem to me that anything which clamps to the lathe ways would have to be somewhat of a custom build, suited to the lathe it was going to fit on, but perhaps there are generic ones available.-Any help would be appreciated.---Brian


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## Alphawolf45 (Jul 20, 2008)

A turret type carriage stop is handy sometimes for repetitive work...But for ordinary work the impact zone varies from setup to setup so a carriage stop cant do much good , I got one on one lathe and just only very seldom - every other year or so I might use it.


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## old-biker-uk (Jul 20, 2008)

Here are a couple of designs (2nd row of pics). I'm sure the one that attaches to the ways could be adapted for most lathes.
Mark


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## Bogstandard (Jul 20, 2008)

I used mine almost every day.

The first item to make for my new lathe will be a multi spindle carriage stop, it only comes with a single spindle.

John


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## mklotz (Jul 20, 2008)

When I was first starting out, I worried about running the carriage into the chuck too.

Although I eventually built a stop, I was concerned too about running the carriage into the stop under power.

What I did was attach a microswitch to a strong magnet and wire it to a small battery-operated buzzer. It was easy to adjust - just slide the magnet along the ways. Best of all, powering the carriage into it couldn't wreck the machine.


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## BobWarfield (Jul 20, 2008)

I've always liked the idea of powering the feed with a variable speed motor, ala the Hardinge's. Especially nice if your lathe lacks a quick change gear box. It's a very easy modification to make and you get to change you feedrate with the twist of a dial. 

Add Marv's "electric carriage stop" in series with the motor and normally closed and you'd have a real nice setup I would think.

Cheers,

BW


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 20, 2008)

Okay---After a closer examination of my lathe, I see 2 M8 bolts that hold the headstock onto the "ways" of the lathe (they are machined onto a cast frame). Far as I can see, this (the 3D CAD model) would be a perfect adjustable carriage stop. I was previously thinking of something that clamps to the "ways", but for what I want to do, this looks like the perfect solution.


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## Bogstandard (Jul 20, 2008)

Brian,

The stop you have envisioned doesn't really have the necessary adjustment required. Plus it is too rigid, if you make a mistake and run under power onto it, it just might do some serious damage to your lathe.

Also just by changing your chuck can make it ineffective, as lathe chucks usually have different lengths.

Your bed seems to have a similar setup to my old Atlas 10F.

To make a simple adjustable stop, that can be positioned anywhere along the bed, the sketch that I have attached should solve the problem.

I used to have mine tightened just enough to hold if I drove in by hand, but if it was under power feed and hit, it would slip.

John


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## greenie (Jul 20, 2008)

Brian, those two bolts that you have circled, why are the in that position, what do they actually do and how accurate do you expect your lathe to be, once you have released the pressure on them and removed them?


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## BobWarfield (Jul 20, 2008)

Brian, be careful that those are not the bolts used to dial in the alignment of the headstock to the ways!

Best,

BW


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## shred (Jul 20, 2008)

Where's the photo of the little Kant-Twist clamp clamped to one of the ways as a stop? Reasonably cheap and multi-purpose.

ah, it's here: http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/index.php?topic=1604.0

I made a simple stop, but I rarely use it, preferring instead to use it to hold an indicator to see where I'm at


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 20, 2008)

greenie  said:
			
		

> Brian, those two bolts that you have circled, why are the in that position, what do they actually do and how accurate do you expect your lathe to be, once you have released the pressure on them and removed them?



I expect that as long as those two bolts are torqued back down to the same general torque spec, that there will be no change in alignment. On this lathe, the entire bed and the ways are cast as one peice. The entire headstock sets on top of the ways and is attached with at least 4, possibly 6 bolts. Only the two that you see are accessable without tearing everything apart. If the entire headstock was removed, then I would be concerned about losing alignment. For 2 bolts, I wouldn't worry about it.


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 20, 2008)

Bogstandard  said:
			
		

> Brian,
> 
> The stop you have envisioned doesn't really have the necessary adjustment required. Plus it is too rigid, if you make a mistake and run under power onto it, it just might do some serious damage to your lathe.
> 
> ...



John---I only need about one inch of adjustment. That threaded rod will give me that easily. Remember, I am only concerned about running the cutting tool into the chuck. The stop would never be used anywhere else. I never use the power feed when I am working that close to the chuck, and I am sure that if I mistakenly left the power feed on, that running the compound rest into the chuck would do the same or even greater damage to the lathe.


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## Mcgyver (Jul 20, 2008)

in old biker dudes link, 2nd column 2nd row has a micrometer stop. This is adjustable, and you make it just like a micrometer (or use a micrometer head) so you can read in thou's .... really useful for repetitive tasks or facing something to length...don't know if you have indexing tackle yet - i'd hold off making a carriage stop until you do just because with the micrometer they are so much more useful. Carriage stop to stop from hitting the chuck? sorry dude i gotta chalk that up as a plastic banana guard ( http://tinyurl.com/5gh8az) Might seem like a good idea once upon a time, but once you're used to your banana you realize you don't really need it


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## Powder keg (Jul 20, 2008)

I'm with Mcgyver, You'll probably never use it ounce you start using your lathe a bunch. 

Respectively, Wes


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## itowbig (Jul 20, 2008)

here is one i made it doubles as a dial holder too









very simple to make


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## Bogstandard (Jul 20, 2008)

I'll agree to disagree with you on that one lads.

I used mine almost every day.



> But for ordinary work the impact zone varies from setup to setup so a carriage stop cant do much good , I got one on one lathe and just only very seldom - every other year or so I might use it.





> Carriage stop to stop from hitting the chuck? sorry dude i gotta chalk that up as a plastic banana guard ( http://tinyurl.com/5gh8az) Might seem like a good idea once upon a time, but once you're used to your banana you realize you don't really need it





> You'll probably never use it ounce you start using your lathe a bunch



Ever heard of the phrase 'familiarity breeds contempt'.

I can guarantee, just like the lathe chuck backstop and vice backstop on the mill, they are indispensable. Try boring to depth, without one, you arse is twitching all the time, with one, a piece of cake.

Production machines don't have them on just to hang your coat on, they are there for a reason, and once set up they make machining safer and easier. If you get used to using one, it will be fingers up to the 'you don't need one' brigade.

The previous owner of my old lathe nearly destroyed it, BECAUSE he didn't have a stop on there. It took out the chuck, leadscrew, leadscrew rear support, reverse selector plus gears, a few of the change gears, change gear bracket, toolpost holder, topslide, and the list goes on. I took pity on it and remade a fantastic lathe.

What would you rather do, make a saddle stop, or buy a new lathe.

John


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## ksouers (Jul 20, 2008)

Carriage stops are wonderful things. It was the first tool I added to my Sieg.

The Clausing I first worked on had a turret type stop that also released the power feed when it hit. Repeated profiles were a breeze. Threading to a shoulder was not very exciting at all.

Now if I could just figure out how to make the Sieg power feed release...


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## Bogstandard (Jul 20, 2008)

I have attached a pic of what happened to my lathe in a previous life.

All caused by running the tool into the chuck.

The hardest part to get was the reverse selector, just to the left of the green circle. I couldn't find a good used one, so I eventually got one cast in bronze rather than mazak. The rest of the parts were purchased new, except for the topslide and Timken head, which were purchased second hand from the US.

I also fitted a less powerful motor, so if anything really nasty happened, it would stall rather than carry on.

All the pink circles show where the damage was done.

The green circle shows the cure to prevent it.

Still want to work without one?

John


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## greenie (Jul 21, 2008)

Brian Rupnow  said:
			
		

> I expect that as long as those two bolts are torqued back down to the same general torque spec, that there will be no change in alignment. On this lathe, the entire bed and the ways are cast as one peice. The entire headstock sets on top of the ways and is attached with at least 4, possibly 6 bolts. Only the two that you see are accessable without tearing everything apart. If the entire headstock was removed, then I would be concerned about losing alignment. For 2 bolts, I wouldn't worry about it.



Ooops, sorry for saying anything about those bolts, looks like you know it all now, so why start this thread with the subject heading in the first place?


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## Alphawolf45 (Jul 21, 2008)

Bogstandard  said:
			
		

> I have attached a pic of what happened to my lathe in a previous life.
> 
> 
> Still want to work without one?
> ...


.

 Yes I work without one and will certainly continue to do so..Indeed I do use one when that is there is a real need like boring to a shoulder but its rare circumstance.Your previous owner was terminally careless , such ruinous occurances rarely happen to normal people .There are people who should never be allowed around machinery and I will agree with you that those folks should use carriage stops religiously but everybody else , I trust they will use caution and it will never be a problem for them...


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## Powder keg (Jul 21, 2008)

Lets make sure this thread doesn't turn into something bad, Please.

Thanks, Wesley


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## Brian Rupnow (Jul 21, 2008)

greenie  said:
			
		

> Ooops, sorry for saying anything about those bolts, looks like you know it all now, so why start this thread with the subject heading in the first place?


I started this thread to get other peoples opinions. I never said that I would apply exactly what other people suggest. There are many very knowledgeable people on this board. Their applications are similar to mine, but not exactly the same. When you have worked in engineering for 43 years, been involved in the building of literally thousands of custom machines, and built race cars that competed in top end drag racing succesfully, then you can insult me. Untill then, bite your tongue. Put a real effort into growing up a little bit, and then maybe, just maybe, you will know enough to make rude comments to me.---Brian


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## Powder keg (Jul 21, 2008)

Be nice guys! I don't like where this is going!

Wes


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## Mcgyver (Jul 21, 2008)

> Still want to work without one?



John, someone could do the same damage by not setting a stop properly. I use them as a dimensioning device along with a graduated leadscrew handwheel and of course the trusty compound for quick and dirty work...but as a safety device to stop chuck crashes? Nope and haven't heard this as SOP. It just doesn't strike me as problem, 15 years without a crash, preventing something not spinning from hitting something spinning is what i'm there for  One could argue the contrary - that someone would be as likely to miss set the thing properly and cause a crash or that it would ceate a false security. but hey, no harm done if that's you want to do it....I'm with you so far as their usefulness as a dimensioning device goes.

lathe headstock bolts. I think greenie is right, but that's coming from the paradigm of someone who doesn't think, as a safety device. its useful. As a dimensioning device, it needs to be movable along the ways - like the simple and neat rig itowbig posted. A lathe should have nothing aligning the head stock to the ways except for the V way - the headstock should mate to bed that way. You should be able to unbolt and reattach a headstock, and I've done it more that once, without having an alignment issue. This is a precise and fundamental aspect of a quality lathe; that the spindle bore holes in the headstock perfectly align the to the V in its bottom.

However, we've seen and been told of all manner of things on import tooling and I wouldn't exactly be as surprising as the second coming to find a shimmed headstock or otherwise arrangement shouldn't be disturbed. Because of this my sense would be leave the headstock alone, drag racing experience or other not withstanding ;D. Granted, there's varying opinions on the usefulness of a carriage safety stop, mine is it's useless and not worth taking a chance disturbing the headstock.


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## Bogstandard (Jul 21, 2008)

> Yes I work without one and will certainly continue to do so..Indeed I do use one when that is there is a real need like boring to a shoulder but its rare circumstance.Your previous owner was terminally careless , such ruinous occurances rarely happen to normal people .There are people who should never be allowed around machinery and I will agree with you that those folks should use carriage stops religiously but everybody else , I trust they will use caution and it will never be a problem for them



Just for your information, all that damage was caused by a couple of seconds lack of concentration. Not because he was a bad machinist. In fact he could most probably have run rings around everyone on here.

Are you such a perfect machinist that you never have a lapse, or do anything wrong? You don't happen to walk on water as well?

No one person is exempt from using safety features as and when they are required, but to tell someone they shouldn't use machinery because of having an accident, I am very sorry, but you need to be told otherwise. 
If you accidently run into your chuck, will you give up machining? I think not.


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## Powder keg (Jul 21, 2008)

I really dont like the way this is going!!! I'm locking this topic for now.

Wes


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