# Flame Eater



## dnp101677 (Aug 21, 2009)

I am looking at making a Flame Eater for my next project but I am not sure which one to make. I have several different plans and I was hoping to get some feedback from people who have actually made a flame eater. Since this is my first one, I would like to make one that I am confident with  meaning that the plans are good and also that I can get it running with my intermediate knowledge of machining. 

The ones I am looking at are attached except for Jerry Howell's 4  in 1  Vacuum Engine which is listed here http://www.jerry-howell.com/4in1.html 

I also like Jan Ridder's version shown here... 

http://heetgasmodelbouw.ridders.nu/Webpaginas/pagina_happer_inw_schuif/inw_schuif_frameset.htm

After all the videos I have seen on YouTube, I think the like the PM Research "Flame Licker" the best but, I don't know how to get plans for it. 

Thank you in advance for your suggestions.

Dan


View attachment FireEater[1].pdf


View attachment FireEater[1].pdf


View attachment Candle_Engine[1].pdf


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## Jadecy (Aug 21, 2009)

I built the "Little Blazer" but I would not recommend it. That little bugger took me as long to get figured out and get running as it did to do the initial machining.

I've heard slightly larger ones are easier to be successful with. At a show last year a guide had 2 that he built from a book and they ran very well. I don't remember what the book was but I would suggest starting here which is a very similar engine:

http://www.projectsinmetal.com/free-metalworking-project-plans-the-flame-eater-vacuum-engine-by-jan-ridders/


Jan Ridders provides these plans for free and they are quite nice. They are in a PDF which you can download from the site


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## Stan (Aug 21, 2009)

Dan: All fire eaters can be a pain in the butt to get running. I built the the one in your first download from plans in a book (maybe Duclos). I then made the same one in half scale and it was a pure bi..ch to get get running. I found that the machining was not all that critical, but the size and position of the flame is critical. I use denatured ethanol for fuel and I have read posts where methanol would not work. Flame eaters and Stirlings are great lessons in patience.


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## mklotz (Aug 21, 2009)

I built J. R. Senft's "Poppin" from plans originally published in "Live Steam". While it does demonstrate some sensitivity to flame position, once running it's a strong and steady performer.







If the cylinder is too cool the hot gas will quench too quickly (i.e., before the valve can close fully) and insufficient vacuum will be developed. I warm the cylinder with the alcohol flame before trying to start it and seldom have any trouble getting it to run.


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## rake60 (Aug 21, 2009)

I have built about 6 different Flame Licker designs.
The only one that ever ran for me was the "Poppin".






Rick


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## kustomkb (Aug 21, 2009)

I built the first one designed by Philip Duclos, not anthony davies who probably made the drawings for a drafting class. The plans can be purchased in the book steam and stirling.

It took a bit of fiddling to get going but now runs quite reliably until it gets hot.

http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/index.php?topic=3568.msg35736#msg35736


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## putputman (Aug 21, 2009)

Dan, I think you would be very happy with the Poppin. I have both the Poppin & Jan Ridder's & the Poppin definitely runs better. When you get it running, you will know how it was named "Poppin".

I did use graphite for the piston on mine. I think it does eliminates some of the problems of obtaining a good fit vs. friction. A flame sucker does not have much for power so friction is quite a factor.

Good luck on which ever way you go.


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## dparker (Aug 21, 2009)

Dan: I built one that was mentioned in Popular Science in the early 1950's and early 1960's. The casting kits were available then and I have seen some pictures of new models very much like it in the last year or two on this forum. I do not know who sells the kit now but it must be a copy of the old one. 
The one I built was fairly easy to build but it takes a little pre-warming of the cylinder to get it to run. I use kerosene for a fuel but it smokes almost too much to run it in the house very long.

 [youtube=425,350]XSaT_lAJ46k[/youtube]
I added a hood over the intake port to help guide the flame into the cylinder. This addition helped the engine run faster and allowed it to operate in a slightly breezy area.
It is a good runner if you keep it clean and oil the bearing areas with a light oil like sewing machine oil.
don


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## Stan (Aug 21, 2009)

Marv may have hit on the reason for the flame sensitivity. You may have to suck the right volume of flame at the correct temperature into the cylinder to produce enough vacuum to suck the piston up far enough for the flywheel to carry it the rest of the cycle. By moving the flame, I can vary the speed by at least two to one. If it is in the right position, it will start on one turn of the flywheel without any preheating.


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## dnp101677 (Aug 22, 2009)

Man I love this site! You guys are awesome :bow:. Thank you so much for all the responses - this is exactly the kind of feedback I was looking for. I hope I can return the favor some day. 

It sounds like the Poppin might be the way to go. I presume everyone made the Poppin from the engine plans that I posted; unless, is there another set of plans out there? I especially like Kevin's "Philip Duclos' Fire Eater". I really like the way it looks and  sounds. Does anyone know where I can get the plans for that one? Actually, all the engines referenced were quite impressive. I have always liked the Flame Eater engines and I can't wait to make one! 

Thanks again,
Dan


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