# Lotsa free engine plans



## gunboatbay

Is everyone familiar with this website: http://www.john-tom.com/html/SteamPlans.html
There are so many free plans here that you'd think there would be some copywrite infringement!


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## Mainer

Oh, great. Now I'm up to SEVEN lifetime's worth of projects! ;D

Thanks for the link. Looks like good stuff.


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## Bernd

gunboatbay  said:
			
		

> There are so many free plans here that you'd think there would be some copywrite infringement!



Look carefuly through the web site and you'll see where he lives. : 

Bernd


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## ChooChooMike

He's included all the plans from the book *Elmer's Engines*. 

That book (if you can actually find a copy) is a WEALTH of information !!


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## shred

Elmers Engines is available free in electronic format with permission of the copyright holder on the Elmers' Engines yahoogroups. I assume John-Tom got them from there since they're the same scans. It was kinda cool a few months ago when one of Elmer's granddaughters sent an e-mail to the group.


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## Bernd

ChooChooMike  said:
			
		

> That book (if you can actually find a copy) is a WEALTH of information !!



Lucky me I have one. Paid $42.00 way back when.

Looks like John-Toms scans are 3rd genration copies. Looks like they came out of a spiral bound book. You can see the edges of the copies in some cases.

Bernd


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## mklotz

Would you believe $450 used?

http://www.bestwebbuys.com/Elmer's_Engines-ISBN_9780962167102.html?isrc=b-search

or even $3000??

http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Sea...ite=k172077&isbn=096216710X&pfxid=a_180881519

This book and my copy of "Machine Tool Reconditioning" might have to fund the rest of my retirement.


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## b.lindsey

I was fortunate to have bought a copy too when it was last offered, like Bernd...I think i paid $42.00 new. The dust cover is a bit taped up now but the book itself is in excellent shape. Whenever I made engines from it I would not use the book itself but make copies instead. 

Honestly I wish the family had chosen to reprint the book rather than let the plans out in the various scanned versions, but I am guessing the economics just weren't there. I cherish the copy I have and wouldn't take $450 for it...$3000 on the other hand might be a different matter.

I noted that John-Tom is shown as a member of this group. I certainly don't know if all the plans shown are public domain or not even if the Elmer's engines are, but the Philip Duclos' Fire Eater is shown (even if redrawn by a high school student) and I would bet that one is still under copyright. 

Bill


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## Johntom

The Elmer's Engine files on my site where sent to me in Tiff format by member from a long since passed forum on Steam Engine Models (nothing to do with Yahoo Groups) - the owner of that forum had decided to charge for the access to the files so the files where put on my server. 

The majority of files on my Steam Engines Plans pages have been sent to me for sharing and if there are any copyright issues the offending links will be removed.

All plans are inevitably covered by some type of copyright and I try not to include plans that are available commercially unless they are clearly public domain - the correspondence received from the copyright holders has been positive and as yet have not been asked to remove any files - generally people are happy that their plan is being used for its intended purpose and not being sold by some shark on eBay. 

I hope you enjoy the plans and I will immediately deal with any complaints from copyright holders - The fact I live in Thailand is not an issue with copyright law - it is still applicable.

Best Regards


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## ChooChooMike

I got my copy of Elmer's Engines book in a roundabout way from another machinist for $85 a few years ago and am forever thankful to that fellow hobbyist !

I was bidding on a copy on eBay years ago and was up to $160 before I threw in the cyber-towel. Yeah, I too have seen copies on Amazon for $250-$2500+.

I'm not sure of the copyright on Elmer's plans. I doubt they're in the public domain ?? The issue has been batted around the various machining message boards for years. I talked to a guy who said he did the original scans and was selling them for a minor fee to cover his costs. Told me that someone took his scans and was sellling them on eBay for $25 and subsequently Elmer's scans (this guys or someone elses) are now available in several places on the net - john-toms (nice site !), Yahoo groups and elsewhere. Someone else started up a steam engine model site a couple of years ago and eventually started charging access fee to his site for plans that are available elsewhere for free. Needless to say, that didn't work too well.

Mike


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## ianjkirby

Hi Mike,
 I just noticed your avatar - it must have been a VERY windy day. Not only is the smoke blowing backwards, but the loco is going backwards too!!!
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




Regards, Ian.


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## ChooChooMike

Ian,

Yeah, the loco rods are going in reverse . Don't remember where I found that avatar. Smoke going "backwards" usually indicates the loco running foward, or as you pointed out a helluva windy day  

Hmmmm, maybe I should do surgery on the animation and make the rods run forward ....


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## Orrin

Johntom, I tried several times to download the plans for the _Popular Mechanics_ 1963 engine and tried once to download the _Popular Mechanics_ boiler 1963. Every time, Adobe 7.0 crashed as the download approached the end of the file. 

Do you have any idea what is causing this?

Thank you.

Orrin


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## Johntom

Hi Orrin

I have downloaded and checked both files; it does not seem to be a problem with the files.

I would recommend right clicking and using "Save Target As" or "Save Link As" rather than using Adobe Acrobat to open and download the file.

If you are still unable to download the files, send me an email and I will attach the files to my reply.

Best regards, 
John


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## Tin Falcon

Johntom :
I wanto to interject here and thank you for the fantastic site you have . and thank you for making the plans available to the HMEM community
Tin


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## wareagle

Johntom,

Welcome to HMEM! Thanks for coming on board, and great big huge thanks for having those plans available! Something as simple as that really helps a newbie get going, and it certainly helps keep the hobby affordable and fun. Looking forawrd toyour contributions.

Kind regards,
W/E


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## Maryak

Johntom,

Welcome to our forum 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Thank you for sharing your plans site with us 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Best Regards
Bob


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## SignalFailure

Tin Falcon  said:
			
		

> Johntom :
> I wanto to interject here and thank you for the fantastic site you have . and thank you for making the plans available to the HMEM community
> Tin



I'll second that!

Paul


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## Orrin

> I would recommend right clicking and using "Save Target As" or "Save Link As" rather than using Adobe Acrobat to open and download the file.



Thank you for the tip, John-Tom. That did the trick. 

Thank you for posting the plans. I remember seeing many of them back when I was a kid and never thought I'd ever be able to find them, again. I wouldn't have known where to begin. Now, you've saved all of us a whole bunch of effort. 

best regards, 

Orrin


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## Johntom

Thank you for a great welcome, when people appreciate the site it makes it all worthwhile.

Thanks to all on HMEM for a great community and sharing your experience and excellent engines.
I think I am going to need a bigger workshop!

Best Regards

John


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## fla Jim

John,
Let me add my thanks for your great site. As a Rookie on engines your site in an inspiration to me.

Jim


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## David Morrow

Johntom  said:
			
		

> The majority of files on my Steam Engines Plans pages have been sent to me for sharing and if there are any copyright issues the offending links will be removed.



It looks like the Fire eater plans by Anthony Davies are actually the Philip Duclos which is published in "The Shop Wisdom of Philip Duclos".

How do I know...
http://www.ldrider.ca/cnc/fire-eater/fire-eater-1.htm

I guess mine would be considered a variant in most respects except the critical dimensions.


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## vascon2196

John-Tom,

Nice website! I would be lost without it.

Christopher Vasconcelos


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## jonesie

nice site john-tom thanks for sharing. jonesie


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## 4wheels

I too would like to welcome you John Tom   to this site - great to have you. The plans on your site are the best range of starters and followers available and I will definitely be making plenty of use of a lot of them. When I get stuck I will know who to call!

(Had to have a play with the font/colour options)

Cheers,


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## de_das_dude

thanks for the link!


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## Swift752

Elmers plans are ALL open domain and free.  It says so at the beginning of the plans page.  If in one of is books, he published hoping they'd be freely distributed.  At least that's what I have read.  SO don't worry!!!  Do you have Elmers # 43?  If so, could I have a copy of the plans?  Been very anxious to build but can find no plans at all.  I have built over 24 Elmer engines and love them all.  Always work first time. Can you help me or tell me where to go?  Thanks.  Swift       Bob


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## deverett

Here's the link to Elmer's engines:  http://john-tom.com/html/ElmersEngines.html
About half way down the page is no.43

Dave
The Emerald Isle


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## Tom Jamboretz

Would anyone have the text from Live Steam magazine that had the stirling #3 engine in Elmer's engines website. It was July /August 1999.  It looks interesting but I think I need more info. Thanks,  TJ













would anyone


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## Blogwitch

Tom,

Elmers #3 isn't a Stirling engine, just a normal steam engine.

John


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## Tom Jamboretz

Blogwitch,  I just re-checked and it is a stirling. It is listed under stirling and hot air engines on the website.   Have a re-look.  Tom


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## Blogwitch

Tom,

I think where things went wrong is that you stated Elmers website, when it is in fact the John Tom website, and the engine you mention has nothing to do with Elmer Verburg.

If you go onto the Elmers part, you will see his #3 engine.

I also had a look at the plans for the one you talked about, and even though I am almost brain dead with regards to figuring some things out, I couldn't see anything basically wrong with the plans, just make the parts shown to VERY FINE tolerances, hammer it together with 6" nails and gorilla glue and it should run.

John


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## John47

If you haven't found it already 

http://www.john-tom.com/ElmersEngines/43_horizontal.pdf


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## Tom Jamboretz

I'm still confused. The stirling I'm looking at is near the top of the website referenced in the original post. I've printed the plans and it is definitely a stirling.  We must all be confused!


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