# MIG welding low cost FYI



## SmithDoor (Jul 16, 2016)

I just pickup a MIG welding that cost less than $100.00 including shipping
Works good the only draw back is it does need a 20 amp 110 volt by it self
It uses Tweco type mig tips 

Dave












https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0185BEKK6/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

http://www.costway.com/goplus-mig-1...tomatic-feed-welding-machine-w-free-mask.html


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## Nick Hulme (Jul 18, 2016)

MIG means Metal Inert Gas, I know they paint it on the machine but it's not a MIG without Inert Gas, that probably tells you more about the manufacturer than the actual product ;-) 

I paid about that for a second hand ESAB Smashweld 180 on ebay, it needed new front castors


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## goldstar31 (Jul 18, 2016)

Strictly it  is Metal Inert Gas using the Metal Active process ie Carbon Dioxide( or so my tutors insisted)

I bought a scrap 130A machine similar to the one shown for £32. It works but I would mention that it is all too easy to screw things up with a 0.6mm tip. Years ago, I opened up to 0.8mm. with far more success.

Again, I changed the standard nozzle at times to one which  'plug' weld car panels. 

It is NOT an answer to a maiden's prayer - but it works


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## DJP (Jul 18, 2016)

The MIG designation may be to indicate that it uses wire instead of sticks. My version is labeled MIG 156 and it runs on 240VAC. It had a hose out the back to which I attached a regulator but when sourcing gas (Argon/CO2 mix for stainless wire) it became too expensive to operate so I went back to shielded wire and dedicated this welder to sheet metal only. I'm more talented with a stick welder.  

I'll bet that if you open up any of these small 'MIG' welders you will find a connection point for gas. Whether you go that route is a bigger question.


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## goldstar31 (Jul 18, 2016)

DJP said:


> The MIG designation may be to indicate that it uses wire instead of sticks. My version is labeled MIG 156 and it runs on 240VAC. It had a hose out the back to which I attached a regulator but when sourcing gas (Argon/CO2 mix for stainless wire) it became too expensive to operate so I went back to shielded wire and dedicated this welder to sheet metal only. I'm more talented with a stick welder.
> 
> I'll bet that if you open up any of these small 'MIG' welders you will find a connection point for gas. Whether you go that route is a bigger question.


 
The opening up of the machine should reveal whether it is set up for gas or fluxed wire and therefore decide which polarity is appropriate.

Mine was so cheap that converting it to accept fluxed wire was going to cost more than the initial cheap jack price. The instructions were quite clear- but when you have done cost and works accountancy prior to becoming a certified welder alters things- or doesn't. Don't you agree?

Norm


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## SmithDoor (Jul 18, 2016)

I use today and works very
It only cost $93.99 with tax and shipping 
The size is great for storage it only takes a 2 pound spool :thumbup:

The only down size it take a 20 amp breaker I just used my garage door opener pull and heavy cord. Work greatth_wav

I have had mig welders to 750 amp the most I ever use was 250amp with 60 lb of wire. 

Dave




DJP said:


> The MIG designation may be to indicate that it uses wire instead of sticks. My version is labeled MIG 156 and it runs on 240VAC. It had a hose out the back to which I attached a regulator but when sourcing gas (Argon/CO2 mix for stainless wire) it became too expensive to operate so I went back to shielded wire and dedicated this welder to sheet metal only. I'm more talented with a stick welder.
> 
> I'll bet that if you open up any of these small 'MIG' welders you will find a connection point for gas. Whether you go that route is a bigger question.


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## DJP (Jul 18, 2016)

I'm not sure why it would cost more to convert as the flux cored wire is 0.030 to feed through the same drive wheels and the only change is to make the torch negative and ground positive from the same DC power supply. All of the pieces necessary come in the same box and I'll bet that it's cheaper to build them this way.

My cost benefit analysis fell apart with the cost of a rental tank for shielding gas. My plan was to covert a SCUBA tank for this purpose but the gas suppliers make the rules. Any economically reasonable amount of gas only came in rental tanks and I needed an argon mix for stainless wire.

I switched the machine back to flux cored wire and scrapped the old SCUBA tank.

Flux cored 316 stainless wire would make me feel better about buying this welder. Justification of a welder at this price point was easy but the end result was not what I had hoped for.


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## goldstar31 (Jul 19, 2016)

DJP said:


> I'm not sure why it would cost more to convert as the flux cored wire is 0.030 to feed through the same drive wheels and the only change is to make the torch negative and ground positive from the same DC power supply. All of the pieces necessary come in the same box and I'll bet that it's cheaper to build them this way.
> 
> My cost benefit analysis fell apart with the cost of a rental tank for shielding gas. My plan was to covert a SCUBA tank for this purpose but the gas suppliers make the rules. Any economically reasonable amount of gas only came in rental tanks and I needed an argon mix for stainless wire.
> 
> ...


 
Of course, this is the old decision from what is called in economic terms, 'Scant resources' and the decision  on how to employ 'Land, Labour, Capital and for some, Enterprise'

I did my sums some 31 years ago when I invested in 4 years of welding tuition upon retirement.  It wasn't cheap then but over those many years, my investment must have been returned time without number. I get surprised when I wonder where my son learned to do something and find out that I was responsible( or guilty) I pick p something- and put it right.

Those 3 decades ago were days when there was no internet and consequently, no one who cannot be bothered to either read up or is guilty of asking the same damned silly question - and getting the same silly answers.

Suffice to say that the last comment is not original, it was from an old associate who published two definitive books on locomotive valve gear- because others got it wrong. My little home MIG/Mag welder is assisted by a bottle of CO2/Argon and that axiomatic suitability remains unchallenged though I have invested in a slightly more improvement self darkening helmet.

So, sir, reinvent the wheel if you think that you can. I hope that as I try to advance beyond my 86 years to find it interesting.

Regards

Norman


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## Nick Hulme (Jul 19, 2016)

goldstar31 said:


> Strictly it  is Metal Inert Gas using the Metal Active process ie Carbon Dioxide( or so my tutors insisted)



I have Argon gas and wire for Aluminium, Stainless Steel, Cast Iron, Brass, Bronze and Copper, one of my two Smashweld 180s is definitely a MIG ;-) 

I do use MAG with CO2 for welding low carbon steel, where CO2 yields improved weld penetration  

 - Nick


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## Nick Hulme (Jul 19, 2016)

Ever wondered why the flux is on the outside of MMA electrodes? it's on the outside because if you put it inside you would get a weld contaminated with inclusions, "gasless mig" is a great solution for anything too thin for the welder's skill with MMA and where weld integrity is not an issue, I really wouldn't give it workshop space. 
I have in the past owned a mini-mig for portable use and they can be really useful, with gas and the right wire, I gave it away when the duty cycle became a massive pain, if you buy a mini unit ensure it has a big noisy fan to improve run time before thermal cutout ;-) 

 - Nick


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## goldstar31 (Jul 19, 2016)

I own a mini mig because it would be ridiculous  to have something larger and it is sufficient for my modest needs- at my age. 
Suffice to say that I have fiddled about joining metals since I could walk. My father was a blacksmith/farrier and the rest of the tribe were Shildon trained with Hackworth.
However, none of them seemed to be bothered extolling the virtues of torturing metal. All that I can recall is that I was threatened with 'knee capping' should I choose engineering as a  means to getting a crust.  31years ago and after earning enough to get crusts for the foreseeable future at 55, I ventured yet again to joining and shaping bits of metal. Perhaps, I am in my second childhood and mere oblivion  but it's a lot easier than what I was used to doing- and still do. I'm investing  for the future crusts- of my grandchildren. Playing with metal is rather interesting but very secondary- to me.

Regards

Norman


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## DJP (Jul 19, 2016)

That's what I like about this forum.... it's filled with wisdom that comes with age and time spent with children and grandchildren.

We pass along valuable life lessons but example.


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## SmithDoor (Jul 19, 2016)

I agree with this statement :thumbup:
Dave



DJP said:


> That's what I like about this forum.... it's filled with wisdom that comes with age and time spent with children and grandchildren.
> 
> We pass along valuable life lessons but example.


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## SmithDoor (Jul 24, 2016)

Manual from UK
 Note it works on 230 volt
 The best one I can find
http://www.drapertools.com/products/manuals/32728ins.pdf


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## goldstar31 (Jul 24, 2016)

SmithDoor said:


> Manual from UK
> Note it works on 230 volt
> The best one I can find
> http://www.drapertools.com/products/manuals/32728ins.pdf


 
About a year or so ago, I bought a scrap little MIG and wrote about it here.

Actually there is quite a lot on the net about changing polarity and changing to Euro Standards and such. Apart from a UK MIG welding forum which is excellent, the SIP site has lots of manuals etc for its Migmate series. There are drawings for PCB's and whatever.

My opinion( FWIW) is that the schematics etc for the Migmates are pretty similar to an host of similarly sized machines from other sellers . Apart from the labels, I guess that they are fairly interchangeable.

Apart from changing the worn tubing etc, I left things pretty well as I bought it because the modifications would have cost me more than my original price.


Hope this helps

Norman


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## SmithDoor (Jul 25, 2016)

FYI on breaker using on small 120 volt welder this work most

http://www.askforney.com/files/6414/5997/8717/TB-0001_Circuit_Breaker_Use_Info.pdf


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## SmithDoor (Aug 4, 2016)

Note the best setting a have found that does not trip the house breaker is
 Max 1 note my house voltage is 122 volts and the voltage on the welder is 110 volt
 The OC voltage at this setting is 36 volts

 The OC voltages at 122 volts is
 MIN 1 = 30 volts
 MIN 2 = 33 volts
 Max 1 = 36 volts
 Max 2 = 40 volts


 Calculate for other voltages for OC voltage

 Input voltage= 115.0

 Min 1 28.3
 Min 2 31.1
 Max 1 33.9
 Max 2 37.7

 Input voltage= 120.0

 Min 1 29.5
 Min 2 32.5
 Max 1 35.4
 Max 2 39.3

 Input voltage= 125.0

 Min 1 30.7
 Min 2 33.8
 Max 1 36.9
 Max 2 41.0

 Hope this help some one

 Dave


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## Nick Hulme (Aug 5, 2016)

Noticing that your avatar says Gunsmith - I thought you'd have TIG ;-)


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## SmithDoor (Aug 5, 2016)

When I was doing gunsmith work I use a Victor's Torch 
Today I am doing hobby work and need a low cost welder and sharing the welder with ever one
I still have the torch and still using for cutting steel

Note: Gunsmith work is low pay I can go back to work as a journeyman machines working some one else and make far more that a self employed  Gunsmith 

Dave



Nick Hulme said:


> Noticing that your avatar says Gunsmith - I thought you'd have TIG ;-)


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## SmithDoor (Aug 16, 2016)

-FYI Harbor Freight is having a parking lot sale on the Aug 19-21 for 110 volt mig welder for only $87.00. Note this one only has 2 heat settings
http://images.harborfreight.com/hftweb/home-page2016/images081616/AugPLS-2016-3105a.pdf 





Dave


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## SmithDoor (Sep 2, 2016)

I have upload a copy of the Manual to the downs if any want to view the doc
http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/downloads/welder-fds-wolf-mig-130-322.html

Page 11 and 12 have additional information on duty cycle and voltage:thumbup:

Dave


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## Nick Hulme (Sep 4, 2016)

SmithDoor said:


> Note: Gunsmith work is low pay I can go back to work as a journeyman machines working some one else and make far more that a self employed  Gunsmith
> 
> Dave



So why are you using a logo for a trade which you are openly denigrating?


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## SmithDoor (Sep 4, 2016)

I am NOT denigrating gunsmith work 
I was Lic in CA as gunsmith for years and at that time I joined this group.
I only let others know it is not same pay as journeyman repair machines

I am very proud of being a Gunsmith:thumbup:
Dave




Nick Hulme said:


> So why are you using a logo for a trade which you are openly denigrating?


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## 10K Pete (Sep 4, 2016)

I'm here to tell ya that 95% of gunsmithing hardly makes wages. 

Pete


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## Nick Hulme (Sep 6, 2016)

10K Pete said:


> I'm here to tell ya that 95% of gunsmithing hardly makes wages.
> 
> Pete



Pete, 
You are kind of right, most people think gunsmithing is the same as mechanic work, and most think that fitters are mechanics. 

If you can't run a mill, lathe, grinder, heat treat furnace etc. and make a revolver and/or a semi-auto from stock you're kidding yourself and you're a fitter, not a gunsmith, plain and simple! 

 - Nick


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## 10K Pete (Sep 6, 2016)

Nick Hulme said:


> Pete,
> You are kind of right, most people think gunsmithing is the same as mechanic work, and most think that fitters are mechanics.
> 
> If you can't run a mill, lathe, grinder, heat treat furnace etc. and make a revolver and/or a semi-auto from stock you're kidding yourself and you're a fitter, not a gunsmith, plain and simple!
> ...



Abso-f-ing-lutly correct!!!!!

Pete


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