# Simple CAD programme?



## John (Dec 4, 2007)

Does anyone know of a simple CAD program (preferably free) that could be used to make simple drawings of simple engines by simple people? 

All that I have looked at are fine if you want to draft the complete plans of the Titanic, engines and all, but are a bit too complex for the sort of engine commonly seen on this site.

Thanks 

John


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## jcon (Dec 4, 2007)

Hello John ,


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## jcon (Dec 4, 2007)

Hello John ,
Try www.emachineshop.com . This is a commercial program but can be used privately and is "FREE" . I have found it very handy .

Brgds


John


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## Brass_Machine (Dec 4, 2007)

John (and John)...

Try Alibre, It is very easy to learn how to use. If I can learn it anyone can. They have free tutorials plus there is a ton of free ones one the net. But most of all... they have a fully functioning version for FREE!


Eric


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## cfellows (Dec 4, 2007)

John  said:
			
		

> Does anyone know of a simple CAD program (preferably free) that could be used to make simple drawings of simple engines by simple people?
> 
> All that I have looked at are fine if you want to draft the complete plans of the Titanic, engines and all, but are a bit too complex for the sort of engine commonly seen on this site.
> 
> ...



I agree with you, John. Most of the CAD programs I've fooled around with such as Alibre, Sketchup, Autodesk Inventor, SolidEdge, etc., are all geared toward 3D drawings. CAD programs are difficult to learn and the 3D CAD programs are even more difficult.

Both Alibre and Sketchup have a free version of their CAD programs, but I never spent enough time with them to be able to recommend them or not.

At work, I use Microsoft Visio. Unfortunately, it isn't free and not even particularly cheap although Academic versions can be found on the internet and eBay for $75 - $150. The most recent version is Visio 2007 although Visio 2003 is still available on eBay and the internet. Visio 2003 is somewhat cheaper and not significantly different than 2007. Both 2003 and 2007 are available in Standard and Professional versions. Again, the Standard version is cheaper and functionally equivalent to the Professional version for most people's needs.

At first, I thought Visio was crap, but after I got comfortable with it, have found it fast and easy to use and feature rich enough for most of my needs. You can also download a trial version from Microsoft that is good for 30 days. I would have no problem recommending Visio to a beginner as long as you're willing to stick with it and invest enough time to learn it.

Chuck


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## shred (Dec 4, 2007)

I like Visio as well for 2D-- mostly because I've been using it forever. It saves into DXF which a lot of CAD/CAM programs can read for conversion to CNC.

I keep trying to get into Alibe and such, but can't put enough time in on them to get where I don't have to start from scratch again the next time..


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## Cedge (Dec 4, 2007)

John,
Rather than try to recommend a simple cad program, I'm going to send you to a place where you can try out a whole bunch of them.... before you buy. If you've never been to Tucows.Com, you've missed out on a very special and extremely handy spot on the web. 

Don't sweat downloading anything you find there, the place is a legitimate source for clean freeware, shareware, trial and demo versions of software from nearly every major and minor software producer. The companies themselves make sure Tucows has copies of their software... not some pimple faced hacker kid with a bent for viruses. Tucows is not a warez site. They've been at this since about 1996 and the software companies love them.

You can try out quite a variety of 2D and 3d CAD packages, ranging from robust and complex to relatively bare bones at:
http://www.tucows.com/search.html?s...&search_size_multi=b&search_terms=cad&x=0&y=0

Best
Steve


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## Brass_Machine (Dec 4, 2007)

I will second Cedge's confidence in Tucows... it is a reliable site.

I have been using Alibre for about 2 years. One of the nice things about the free version is it is a fully functioning CAD program. You can create your drawings in 2D relatively easy. You don't have to use the 3D function at all. Then, if you ever decide to use\learn 3D cad, you wouldn't have to learn\get\buy new software...

Eric


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## Cedge (Dec 4, 2007)

Eric
I was looking at Alibre while I was there. How stiff is the learning curve? My 3D software does all i ask except for dimensioning the drawing. It's not a cad program and it was never meant to do what I make it do, so I can't complain much about it not putting measurements on the drawing. 

Steve


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## Brass_Machine (Dec 4, 2007)

The learning curve is pretty shallow. I was able to pick it quick. Even with the free version there are tutorials included. If you do a search for "Alibre tutorials" on google, you will find a bunch of helpful free ones.

I was impressed enough with the free version to spend the cash on upgrading to the PRO version so I could have more parts in my assemblies and access to the parts library. I did use the free version for a long time before that tho. It is very robust for being free. Better than some of the simple ones that cost money.

Download it. Give it a try... do some of the tutorials and see how easy it is.

Eric


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## John (Dec 4, 2007)

Thanks for all the suggestions.

I have looked at TWOCOWS in the past for other things but will check it for CAD programs you have suggested.

Bye the way if anyone wants a simple circuit diagram drawing program that also designs printed circuit boards as well have a look at http://www.expresspcb.com/.

You can download ExpressSCH for circuit diagrams and ExpressPCB for boards, and they come complete with symbol libraries.

Both are simple to use and are free (they hope you might order some boards through them). The circuit diagram program can output a bitmap image of your circuit to publish on forums like this.

John


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## tattoomike68 (Dec 4, 2007)

I used to be a wizzard at cad running autocad, now Im lazy and tent to just draw things in my head.

I have been wanting to just sit down and program a free cad program from scratch but that is easier said then done. (I still might do it)

being an old time hacker and cracker I have no problem ripping off greedy software makers and getting anything I want for free. piss on them.

http://www.bitlord.com/


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## compound driver (Dec 5, 2007)

HI
having paid cash money for both Solidworks 05 and Autocad 2000. I have to agree with the sentiment about greedy software people. The Eula that comes with all these is beyond me and beyond a joke. I either own the product i paid for or I dont. The idea that I can be told how many people use the software is just downright nasty.

So go for it and rip as much as you want from these programs.

Cheers Kevin


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## Loose nut (Dec 31, 2007)

Solid edge has a very good 2D cad program available for free.


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## zeusrekning (Dec 31, 2007)

Google CADStd. There lite version is free I think the pro version is $20. Great, simple 2d drafting. Very small learning curve.


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## Rog02 (Dec 31, 2007)

http://freecadapps.mcadcafe.com/

Many,many freeware, Demo, and Shareware CAD programs and applications available. Click on the "OtherCAD" and find your poison. There are also lots of useful add-ins available for the asking.

Be advised that not all free programs will have full function enabled. Many of them have Print/Plot disabled so as to limit them to demo purposes only.

I have heard many good comments on the Alibre program and I see they have included a 3-d version to the free offer. Tutorials are included and it is full functioned so the price is right. I might download it just to have it and investigate it in comparison to my Intellicad (now CADopia).

I can relate to the other comments about AutoDesk products. I purchased AutoCAD from them and had many problems with it. "Customer Disservice" as I began to call them was hopeless and the policy of "Ongoing Pay To Play" got old. It failed me on a trip and I ended up with a close out copy of Intellicad from the local office superstore and never went back. Have been using Intellicad ever since.


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## SignalFailure (Jan 1, 2008)

Vector Engineer is pretty easy for 2D (at least as a CAD novice I think so)...

http://www.vectorengineer.com/

For 3D modelling without dimensions I find Wings 3D the easiest/quickest:

http://www.wings3d.com/


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## RonC (Jan 1, 2008)

My 0.02c worth on this subject, and if this reads like a put-down of a good, honest question, it's truly not intended that way at all: 

1. Sophisticated software is complex; deal with it
2. You get what you pay for (and you can decide how much is too much--it varies with your outlook)

The things that "traditional" CAD packages (like AutoCAD and its siblings) and "parametric modelling" packages like Alibre do are non-trivial and sadly, learning to use them requires effort, just like learning to use machine tools.

I've used traditional CAD (TurboCAD in my case) for over 10 years to produce over 70 complete IC model engine plan sets (starting with all the ones in the AMA Motor Boys Plans book). It is not expensive and older versions are freely available. But the vendor (IMSI) seem to purposely orphan the native file format every 2 versions (eg, V8 will read V9 files, but not V10). For this alone they should be publicly burnt at the stake, IMHO (not an issue if file sharing is not an issue, I'll admit).

The comments re Alibre are spot on (see the Jan 2008 issue of Model Engine News for more observations) and having done 3D and 2D work in both, my feelings are:

a) Alibre IS comparatively simple to learn and will not require re-learning for 3D work if you've not touched it for a few months
b) A simple 2D sketch (like a coordinate layout for a complex hole pattern from some common datum) can be done in either Alibre, or a "traditional" CAD package, but is probably quicker and easier in the latter.

The "try before you buy" philosophy mentioned by someone else is a very sound suggestion, but learning ANY package is an investment in time and possibly $$. And there is the danger of then staying with that package because of this investment (like I've stuck with TC from V3 to V10, but no more ;-). 

Read as much as you can about CAD "features" on the Web until you can understand all the advertising promises made by all the different the vendors (and not just the free ones). Then hunt up product comparison tables and make an informed choice from what will meet YOUR requirements, ranking the features. Unless you have lots of time on your hands, I truly, truly, humbly, suggest that while license cost should feature in your choice, it should not be at the top. The time invested in learning the thing will make the cost seem small in comparison and making a bad choice just because it was free will probably bite you later. Rank the availability of documentation, on-line tutorials, dedicated user forums, examples, third-party books, etc higher, and make good use of them. 

Product stability should feature high too. Something that crashes frequently and takes your work with it will sour your whole day (regardless of how often you think you will "save" as a precaution). Check the forums for an indication of what other users are experiencing.

< rant mode .off. >

rc


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## SignalFailure (Jan 3, 2008)

For anyone interested in quick 3D visualisation Wings 3D as I mentioned above is great.

I want to make a simple finger engine so I used Wings to create a basic 3D model - it took me about 5 minutes (recording the screen and editing the video took much longer!). Anyway here's the result (WMV format)

http://www.artefact-rescue.co.uk/video/fingerwings.wmv

(File is just under 2MB and will need media player or somesuch to play).


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