# Mills 1.3cc diesel - Plans by Ron Chernich from Model Engine Builder magazine



## Metal Mickey (Jul 12, 2008)

Hello, thought I would share with you the progress of the model diesel engine I am building from the article and plans of Ron Chernich (Australia) he published in issue 1 of Model Engine Builder magazine. I started in January this year. My progress depends on the time I can get in the workshop and how fit I am (excuses I know!) The build is documented on my website (along with all the other projects I have done this year) http://www.mikes-models.com I hope the photo's load as this is my first time.....






about to start turning the front taper.....






Where I have got to at the moment........






Made 2 fuel tanks and tops. One for a reader of my website and the other for mine.






Turning the radius on the end using the method described by Ron Chernich






Where I am now and I have jsut started to make the crankshaft.......more to follow......

And here they are......getting on with the crankshaft and the prop nut.....





the two phosphur bronze bushes trial fitted to crankshaft blank..






 the prop nut....






 why do we always trial fit to see what its going to look like when finished! (well at least I do......)





Ron Chernich, the designer of this engine says it will swing a 12" wooden prop.......well it looks big to me!


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## doubleboost (Jul 12, 2008)

Very nice 
Splendid looking shop you have there
I enjoyed looking at your web site
John


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## Metal Mickey (Jul 12, 2008)

Thank you John, can you see the photo's? Because i can't.


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## CallMeAL (Jul 12, 2008)

I don't see any photo's either ???


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## Metal Mickey (Jul 12, 2008)

Sorry about the photo's. I found the page where it suggested using Photo Bucket. Seems to have worked. So every day we learn a little more........... ;D


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## Divided He ad (Jul 12, 2008)

All clear to me Mike ;D I think I just clicked on it as you updated the photo's  

Nice looking engine you got going there.... I've never seen a model diesel engine, it will be nice to see/hear one running ;D 




Ralph.


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## Twinsquirrel (Jul 12, 2008)

Top quality work and photos Mike, an old friend of mine had a Britton Norman Islander RC aircraft running on a pair of these, everyone stopped what they were doing when it started.

David


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## Metal Mickey (Jul 12, 2008)

Thanks. I have been told these engines are very flexible and it will (not necessarily mine though!) drive a 12" wooden prop. Look forward to it breathing...........


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## bentprop (Jul 13, 2008)

12"????????Wow,that's a BIG prop :big:
Looks like a nice engine,Mike.I've owned a couple of diesels in my time(DC,Philtech),but could never get along with them.Please post a video of it running if you can,once you finish it.
They do sound lovely when running well.


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## Circlip (Jul 14, 2008)

And don't flood it when trying to start it, cos if it's like its' little brother, the 75, it backfires and starts backwards! been,seen,done,video,T-shirt, etc.
 Regards Ian


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## Metal Mickey (Jul 14, 2008)

Hello bentprop, interesting name...story there I bet! I am working all out to get it finished (subject to health) instead of rotating my projects. I want to here it run as well and *IF* it does I will post a video here.
 ;D


Thanks for the tip re flooding Circlip. I remember many years ago my first diesel when I was about 14 and how I knew it was alive. How do I know it was alive? It kept ^&&%$g biting me!

I have read about people using a starting stick. I guess that's simply a stick with some protection that is used instead of fingers? Any experience of using them, and a general description?


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## Circlip (Jul 14, 2008)

Stiff upper lip man, you're BRITISH, no damn lacky bits of wood/plastic. Wear the Admiral's stripes (Right forefinger) with PRIDE. 
 Also get ready for the three day Caster Oil perfume.
 And just to correct the term it's called a CHICKEN stick (Check it out)
 And in the model world there's only two types of IC engines, Diesels and four strokes

  Regards "Admiral" Ian


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## Twinsquirrel (Jul 14, 2008)

You can get a rubber finger sleeve from most model shops or you can make a starting stick from a piece of dowel about 1/2" diameter with some silicone exhaust tubing forced over one end to protect the prop.


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## Metal Mickey (Jul 14, 2008)

Thanks Twinsquirrel but since the 'Admiral' has posted I must go 'bareback'.....


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## Circlip (Jul 15, 2008)

And I know it's only posed Mike,but PLEASE don't sha..... ruin such a beautiful engine by gripping and starting it in the vise, seen too many crankcases with knurl marks.

 Regards Ian


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## Metal Mickey (Jul 16, 2008)

Hello Circlip, caught you! The Mills is only sat on the vice and not held. But the comments you made are still of value. I am going to make a stand/clamp when I run it (as ever hopeful). Its the first time I have been well enough to get back out into the workshop today and only managed to make the compression screw and what a problem I had for a 'simple' job. I used a taper tap in the cylinder head to make sure it was a tight fit and used the die as open as it could be but the screw cut in BMS was not as tight as I would have liked. In the end I turned it from stainless steel on the hope that it was a harder metal. Fortunately it seemed to work, at least better than BMS.

A couple of photo's for your delectation





















After making the conrod I made a start on the last two items today. One the piston and the second will be the contra piston. In anticipation of trying to make the engine run I have been trying to tie down a supplier of diesel fuel in my area. That is from Plymouth, Exeter and Torbay. All to no effect. I had quite a few comments of "oh we don't stock that, very old engines that!


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## Twinsquirrel (Jul 16, 2008)

Looking great!!!!! hope you feel a little better soon


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## Metal Mickey (Jul 20, 2008)

Just had a couple of sessions in the workshop....making the fuel system for the Mills and here are a few photo's of the progress. Details are on my website www.mikes-models.com

The latest picture......but don't be conned...still have the contra piston and piston plus finishing the crankshaft......but it is getting closer..........







Cross drilling using the parallel's to make sure its level and also support......using a button to centre.....





Cutting a slot in the thumbnail.....holding the brass bar in the tool holder as per Ron Chernich's advice





The parts made and trial fitting prior to soldering up......


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## Metal Mickey (Jul 31, 2008)

Well I have gotten back into the workshop at last and have the piston and contra piston left. After that I perhaps face the hardest task....finding a small supply of diesel fuel!

Anyway the piston has been completed in relation to machining but has yet to be honed to fit. I have two fixtures to make. One a temporary con rod to hold the piston when honing and the second is the piston hone itself. I am following the directions as per issue 2 of the American magazine Model Engine Builder (and excellent it is too...). SO it shouldn't be too long now before I finish my first model diesel engine (subject to remaking if it won't start!). 

When it does....I can then get back and put some real effort into my Fowler traction engine and I am really looking forward to it!

Some photo's for your delectation..............


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## Twinsquirrel (Jul 31, 2008)

First class as always!


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## SandyC (Jul 31, 2008)

;D

Hey MM, super job.

that sure brings back some great memories.... ETHER, PARRAFIN, CASTROL R and AMYL NITRATE...... can't get the last one now, it's illegal...rotten spoilsports&#160; :big: .

I still have a matched pair of MILLS 0.75's (original, not run in) and sequential serial numbers... from way's back in the early 60's.&#160; NO YOU CAN'T BUY THEM&#160; ;D ;D ;D

Suitable fuel can be purchased from 'MODEL TECHNICS' in Shoeburyness, Essex.

www.modeltechnics.com

I would suggest the 2% Nitrate mix for your engine. (they use Isopropyl Nitrate these days and synthetic oils)

Hope this helps.

Best regards.

SandyC&#160; ;D


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 2, 2008)

Hello SandyC a single 0.75cc fetches over £100 on ebay so a matched pair as you describe must be worth at least two and sixpence! Sure you don't want to sell them! Thanks for the link re fuel. I tried to buy some diesel from Model Technics but they told me they only sold to trade and couldn't send any in the post anyway! There is a model shop in Newton Abbot who are trying to get me some but it seems its like gold dust!


Thanks for the comment Twinsquirrel...kind of you. That's one thing this site offers us lonesome modellers....the wife just says " that's a small one". I think she was referring to the engine........


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## dave e (Aug 4, 2008)

Hi Metal. It looks like you're really getting close. Congrats on the beautiful build.



			
				Metal Mickey  said:
			
		

> I have read about people using a starting stick. I guess that's simply a stick with some protection that is used instead of fingers? Any experience of using them, and a general description?



I flew RC planes competitively a few years ago. Starting sticks are ok, but the simplest method is to get about a 4 inch long piece of automotive heater hose. Get a size large enough to stick your finger in. If you're fingers are too big for the largest size, it's fine to split it lengthwise. All you do is flip the prop over with your finger protected by the rubber hose. It still smarts a bit if you get whacked, but there won't be blood or missing body parts. If you prefer to use the stick, just cut a length of broom handle about 8 inches long. Put the rubber hose over the business end to protect your prop, and flip away with that.

Also, for a prop that size you need to be sure to check the balance. I hunted around in Google for a couple minutes and was surprised that I couldn't find a nice step-by-step about how to do it. This is about the best I could find. http://www.rctoys.com/pr/2008/08/01/how-to-balance-rc-model-airplane-propellers/. If you look this over and still need help, let me know and I'll try to write up something. Lastly, I hope it's obvious, but the hole in the prop has to be the right size. If it's too big, either get a different prop or make up some bushings for a nice snug fit.

Good luck.

Dave


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 8, 2008)

Sorry Dave e I didn't respond to you email. thanks for the tip re bushes. I checked both props I have and whilst one is fine the second will need a bush! So again thanks for the tip.

Tomorrow I hope to have the engine fully assembled and I found out tonight I have sourced some diesel just a few miles from me....so if all goes well I MAY be able to at least get frustrated trying to start her! Nervous or what......If I do there will be a video on here as soon as possible....if I don't you won't hear from me ever again............ :

Just a couple of photo's of the latest position........

Used the wife's ultrasonic cleaner.........







Some of the dirt that came off......






The parts prior to cleaning further with thinners....






So if the engine don't start... this is my last post..................(or until it does!) :big:


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## kustomkb (Aug 8, 2008)

looks real nice, it'll run.


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 8, 2008)

kustomkb  said:
			
		

> looks real nice, it'll run.



Oh I do hope so.............. :'(


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## CrewCab (Aug 8, 2008)

It'll run Mickey  ............ but on the off chance it don't  ............ just pop back here and ask why, help is just a keystroke away 8)

Good luck mate.

CC


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 11, 2008)

Well I thought I would give an update on progress. Its some good news - bad news.........

The good news is the engine is finished and I have also completed (nearly) a test stand (see photo's below)






and 






and 






Now to the bad news.....After making a couple of adjustments (which included making a new contra piston) the engine is now finished and the long job of trying to find the best settings to give it life has started. The bad news is that due to my disability, the energy required in flicking it over, does me no good so the time I can spend trying to start her is severely diminished! Something I never ever considered.

On a more positive note however is I believe I am getting near to the correct compression setting......time will tell...so I spent the rest of this morning tiding up the workshop and getting the Fowler Traction engine bits in some sort of order to start making progress on her build. My targets for this year requires me to get her sat on all four wheels and the steam cylinder bolted to the boiler. I have only 3 months of the year left and there is a lot to be done!

On a separate note where does all the time go? Its only another 15 weeks or so till the end of the year (I am away three weeks cruising to the Caribbean :big


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## GailInNM (Aug 11, 2008)

Mike,
Most of the writings on model compression ignition engines say "do not use an electric starter". This is because the high compression ratio makes it easy to get a hydraulic lock. When this happens, a bent con rod or crank pin is the normal result when using an electric starter. 

Now that that is out of the way, I sometimes do use an electric starter on compression ignition engines until I get the engine to a reliable starting condition. After the engine is broken in and I learn the engine, one or two flips will fire it up. You do have to be careful however. If you prime the engine in the exhaust port, be sure to turn the engine over slowly 2 or three times to make sure there is no hydraulic lock. In fact, always turn the engine over a couple of times slowly by hand before using an electric starter. 

Be gentle with the starter. I use a 12 volt starter. On small engines, I use a 9.6 volt NiCad pack. This helps limit the power some and provides plenty of power. Never increase the compression with the starter running. 

I suggest that, due to your disability, an electric starter may be the correct answer for you. If you do decide to use one, I can provide more details on my startup procedures for new engines or engines that have not been run for a while. 

Gail in NM,USA


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 11, 2008)

Hello Gail,

Thanks for your post. I appreciate your advice and I will follow it with the cautions you mention. I am sure its close to starting. Do you think if I made up a fitting using two nylon small diameter rods, that would help? Some sort of fork arrangement. That way it may be a little safer?

Mike.


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 11, 2008)

Ignore my last post in regards to the fork thingy. I didn't think it through in regards to if/when it starts it won't disengage! A severe case of ooooppppppssssss :wall: :wall:


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## CrewCab (Aug 11, 2008)

MM ............... much better to sort it out at the "Drawing Board" stage, well done. 

CC


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## GailInNM (Aug 11, 2008)

Mike,
I was going to comment on your posts, but you got that figured out rather quickly with out any prodding.  Actually, there was a commercial starter that did something like that. It was a wind up spring affair and the posts were folding, so they would fold out of the way when the engine started. I don't know of anyone who liked them.

I think all of the commercial ones now use a rubber cone which can be pressed against a large spinner, or can just be pressed against the prop. I have always just pressed against the prop, and if a small spinner or tapered prop nut ,like you have, is used, it just fits into the recess of the rubber sleeve. The rubber sleeve is replaceable so if it gets chewed up it is only a couple of dollars to replace. Mine needs to be replaced, but just because it is dried out. I have used it for a long time. 

The starter I use has not been made for a number of years, but it is similar to the following one by Tower Hobbies that sells in the US for under US$20. You probably have something similar available in your area.






Gail in NM,USA


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 11, 2008)

I was thinking of using some neoprene to make "something" that would have two slots in the neoprene. I will have ago and post the first attempt......... :fan:


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## NickG (Aug 11, 2008)

Good luck, we're all waiting with baited breath!


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## rickharris (Aug 11, 2008)

Metal Mickey  said:
			
		

> Hello Gail,
> 
> Thanks for your post. I appreciate your advice and I will follow it with the cautions you mention. I am sure its close to starting. Do you think if I made up a fitting using two nylon small diameter rods, that would help? Some sort of fork arrangement. That way it may be a little safer?
> 
> Mike.



In my youth - I owned and flew a PAW 1.5 cc diesel - in fact still have the engine although not run for many a year.

My method - which worked for me - Screw in the throttle needle all the way (be gentle) back off (open) 2 full turns.

Back off the compression and turn the prop over to push contra piston up to the stop.

Put finger over air inlet and turn the prop over 2 full cycles to draw fuel into the crank case.

Turn prop until compression is felt and flick with vigour! make sure to pull hand back on each flick and DO NOT put hand/finger back into the spinning prop (it's easy to get into a pattern and not register the engine has started).

if no joy after a few flicks - tighten the compression down and repeat - eventually it will start to cough - your close then. These simple diesels draw the fuel into the crank case and then pass up to the cylinder getting some in there for a start helps.

you can prime the cylinder with a short squirt of fuel from the bottle through the exhaust port = this can give you a quick route to firing and you may well get a few cycles and a chance to adjust the settings.


mind the prop when adjusting the fuel/compression. I agree most "experts" advise against a starter as too much fuel/too much compression can see you shoot the head right off the engine. fingers work and its not all that dangerous - probably less danger than you were in when making it.

Good luck - a suitable model is next to fly the beast - I can guide you to some on line plans


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## Bogstandard (Aug 11, 2008)

Mike,

I think Gail was on about a friction cone starter.

Your spinner is rather small for a commercial unit, so I have done an ideas sketch to show you how it works. Just a piece of rubber tube glued into a holder, and is pushed against the spinner to turn the engine over.
The drawing shows a cut thru, it should be a full circle.

John


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## CrewCab (Aug 11, 2008)

Bit like the Moto GP slave starters, particularly favoured by Ducati, however in this case I think "much smaller" is required as aptly illustrated by Mr BS ;D

John, have I missed a "Crap-O-Cad" update, I see new fonts and better rendition   ....... I'll send mi' 50p for the upgrade 

CC


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## GailInNM (Aug 11, 2008)

John,
You are right, but you leave the tubing stick out a ways, 3/16 inch or so, and you can press it against the prop without using s spinner. If pressing against a prop nut like Mike's it is easy to loosen the nut if you are not careful. Just use the prop nut to help initial centering. Large natural rubber tubing, like surgical tubing, works better than a stiff rubber like garden hose or neoprene when doing this.
Gail in NM,USA


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## Bogstandard (Aug 11, 2008)

Thanks for that Gail, it is about thirty odd years since I have used a starter. We didn't have stuff like surgical tubing in my day. You used what you could get hold of and hope for the best. Us old farts are like that, try anything once.


You have got to admit Dave, a couple of minutes sketching saves hell of a lot of fingerwork typing it all out, and even then it might not be understood.

Just designing new fonts, but they tend to change the more tired and ratty I get, so a bit unstable yet for an upgrade. You can still send the money though, donations always welcome.


John


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## rickharris (Aug 11, 2008)

GailInNM  said:
			
		

> John,
> You are right, but you leave the tubing stick out a ways, 3/16 inch or so, and you can press it against the prop without using s spinner. If pressing against a prop nut like Mike's it is easy to loosen the nut if you are not careful. Just use the prop nut to help initial centering. Large natural rubber tubing, like surgical tubing, works better than a stiff rubber like garden hose or neoprene when doing this.
> Gail in NM,USA



Diesel can/should run both ways - so if just need to run in stand then can start in prop nut tightening direction to save embarrassing moment as prop flies forwards. PS I ALWAYS put a lock nut on the prop to stop it getting loose.


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## GailInNM (Aug 11, 2008)

> We didn't have stuff like surgical tubing in my day.



I can't let you get away with that one John. I was using surgical tubing on model airplanes when you were still a little boy. ;D ;D

Gail in NM,USA


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## Bogstandard (Aug 12, 2008)

Gotcha Gail, so now we know you are not an old fart, but a REAL old fart.

Those materials were most probably about in the early 70's, affording them was the problem at that time. I was so poor, I used to dip my feet in black gloss paint, so it looked like I could afford shoes.

You made do with what you could get your hands on. I think that is where my fetish for recycling came from.

Imagine models being built using aircaft quality high tensile precision machined nuts and bolts, but they were free (except to the taxpayer of the time).

John


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## Twinsquirrel (Aug 12, 2008)

Ignore this if it has already been said,



> Mike,
> 
> I think Gail was on about a friction cone starter.
> 
> ...



The rubber cup in most commercial starters can be removed from the starters' pulley and flipped 180 degrees giving a flat face with a 10-15mm hole in the center. In my experience the flat face pushed against the prop is enough to turn the engine over and I've rarely had a prop nut come loose but I've only ever run glow engines this way.

David


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## Twinsquirrel (Aug 12, 2008)

Sorry, just been out to the workshop to take some pics (first time I've been out there in about 2 weeks) 

Standard cone start,






Prop nut start


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 13, 2008)

Thanks for all the information and advice. I hope to be well enough to get back into the workshop tommorow so I will let you know how I get on........


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 19, 2008)

Just an update really. Not started yet BUT it did fire today...blue smoke and all! However before we get to that I decided to try and start her again today. First I made a starter to run in my drill and after that I stripped the engine down and checked the contra piston, and piston in particular. 

According to Ron Chernich's article the piston fit was spot on. i.e. the little end moving to the exhaust ports before stopping. It also showed the taper to be correct as well. Looking at the contra piston though, it was a pretty good fit but not as good as the piston so I made up another and made it fractionally bigger. It did not go into the cylinder liner quite as much as the other before becoming stiff. Indeed I would say this one was more on the very tight side, which is what I wanted.

Cleaned the engine parts again in the ultrasonic ring cleaner (stolen from under the nose of 'she who must be obeyed'!) and reassembled the engine. I must admit I was very surprised at the difference in compression for such a small adjustment. But then, I am new to this game........

Armed with renewed enthusiasm, I followed Ron's start up instructions and screwed the compression screw in, between trying to start her. Unfortunately it became a little discomforting so I decided to use the startering adaptor I made earlier. After three or four more adjustments to the compression screw, the thing fired! Whereas I 'hoped' I felt it fire before, I now know it didn't, because this was completely different. This time there was a puff of blue smoke from the exhausts and a definite smell......(no comments please).

I thought I would go back to the manual method again, as it may be near its setting, but it was too difficult. So I decided to retire before I broke something, and will try again tomorrow. 

I may make another piston though, first thing, and see if this will make as much difference and the contra piston did. Its easy to dismantle the engine and change things.

I marvel when dissabling on how few parts there are, compared to how long it took me to make the thing! It is a simple job to disassemble and reassemble so hopefully I can report a more positive result soon..........


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## NickG (Aug 21, 2008)

Sounds promising, yes a new better fitting piston may just do the trick. Although if it fired once, it can do it again, you'll find the setting you need soon! Good luck.


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 21, 2008)

Thanks for the support NickG :bow:


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## robert1352 (Aug 22, 2008)

Fantastic work !! Great job!! Can't wait to see it running!!!


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## Metal Mickey (Aug 22, 2008)

Robert, your too kind and it makes two of us that want to see it running! :big: many thanks for the support.

Mike


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## NickG (Aug 22, 2008)

I've just been through the same thing with my first hot air engine, although I'd say yours is a bit more complex! 

I was just about to give up despite it showing signs of life, but then I thought I'd dedicate 1 more day to it, turns out it only needed 30 mins of logical thought dedicated to it and got it running!

Your engine fired so I am confident it will run. I bet there are loads of people that can't wait to see it run.

Nick


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## Jadecy (Aug 22, 2008)

For what it's worth...I built a MLA-17 which is a model diesel and very similar in nature to your engine. The biggest issue I had was with the carburetor. I finally did get it running and it ran very well but has always been very tempermental when it comes to adjusting the carb. I never did it but I thought about trying an adapted carb off of a Norvell model engine.


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## Metal Mickey (Sep 5, 2008)

Well it has finally decided to run! It may not have been for long, but run it did! I have given a fuller description on my website www.mikes-models.com if you are interested and a SHORT video here....


[youtube=425,350]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/sG7nm-SaOGg&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/sG7nm-SaOGg&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/youtube]​
The answer was the new piston and whilst it has not run for long, I now know it will, so its more tinkering with the settings. The trouble is the back doesn't match the needs of the engine! I don't want to use the drill starter as it does fire up OK and I would be worried it kick out.......so I will have a go over the next few days and get it running continuously......


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## NickG (Sep 5, 2008)

Congratulations, that's fantastic. A bit of tinkering is all that's needed now!

Nick :bow: ;D


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## Metal Mickey (Sep 5, 2008)

Thanks ever so much. I know its daft but its surprising how much enjoyment I felt when it first fired! Well shock really.


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## CrewCab (Sep 5, 2008)

Nice one MM ............. sounds as good as it looks too 8)

CC


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## Metal Mickey (Sep 5, 2008)

Thanks ever so much, I wonder how a smaller prop would sound? Does anyone know?


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## Divided He ad (Sep 6, 2008)

Nice.... So very close to having it take off with the bench  

Bet you are a happy guy right now..... Are people are talking to you and all you can see and hear is that little beautie? (and they're wondering why you have that permanent little smile on your face ;D )


Good stuff Mike.



Ralph.


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## Metal Mickey (Sep 6, 2008)

Thanks Ralph, I will be able to get on with the refurbishment of a Myford ML7 lathe and the 2" scale traction engine........I must admit I am looking forward to next year so I can start on the 15cc Seal 4 cylinder petrol engine!

Oh happy days, oh happy days...... :big: :big:


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## Circlip (Sep 6, 2008)

Told you hand starting was the way to go Mike 8) Sounds a bit Sloppy, Rich, Keep the big prop, better flywheel effect. Used to start Bee's, Racer, Frog2.49 and even an OS 40 with Right hand middle finger swinging right to left over the shaft. Prop was set on shaft just starting to feel compression with right hand blade on 2.( Overall position twenty to two ) you're soooooooo close, after an hours running medium speed first and slightly rich, you can gradually lean it off and increase compression. Thanks, Suuuuuuuuuuper sound, you never forget it.
 Regards Ian.


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## Metal Mickey (Sep 8, 2008)

Hello Circlip, Thanks ever so much for the advice, I will take notice. For the time being however I am back onto the Fowler traction engine. It sounds daft but the amount of additional disconfort is out of all proportion to the act of turning it over!

So I will come back to it in a couple of weeks and give it another go with the aim of getting it run for the first hour(!) :

Once again, many thanks for the guidance. I didn't have a clue about it running rich etc. It gives me a starting point to increase its efficiency. Perhaps what I really need is to hire in someone with a good back! :big:


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## Bryn (May 28, 2012)

Metal Mickey  said:
			
		

> Hello, thought I would share with you the progress of the model diesel engine I am building from the article and plans of Ron Chernich (Australia) he published in issue 1 of Model Engine Builder magazine. I started in January this year. My progress depends on the time I can get in the workshop and how fit I am (excuses I know!) The build is documented on my website (along with all the other projects I have done this year) http://www.mikes-models.com I hope the photo's load as this is my first time.....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## rklopp (May 29, 2012)

That was a timely bump. After spending a couple frustrating hours getting two of my Nano 0.1-cc engines to only run on a prime, I pulled out the ol' Mills 1.3 and fired it up. Ahhh, nothing like a easy starting, strong running engine. I ran through about three tanks of fuel just basking in the sun, noise, and oil fog.

As for the Nanos, I think I must have a rotary valve timing issue, because the engines simply will not pull fuel from the tank when running. Oddly, they do pump nicely when fully choked. I can get about a 1-2-second burst off of a prime, but that's it.


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## Ramon (May 29, 2012)

There's nothing quite like a whiff of diesel on a hot sunny afternoon eh RK? ;D The Mills has great character.

Re the Nanos I don't want to appear to be teaching granny but have you checked the exact timing out as built? I haven't built anything as small, (or owned any diesel smaller than .5 - which all ran well) but I know a couple of guy's who have and they have both had the same problem as yourself - running on the prime but not able to obtain a consistent run. I believe the Albon Bambi sufferred from the same problems - some would run as expected but many just wouldn't. Thoughts were that possibly the pumping forces are so small that even the slightest deviation from the optimum prevent or rather hamper the engines ability to get up to a speed quickly enough to get a reasonable draw. 
Thats a shame really after putting in all that work - why not try a 5cc .

Just a thought but have you tried starting/running them backwards?

regards - Ramon


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## Admiral_dk (May 29, 2012)

Sorry to hear that you can't get them running normally.

I can't help think that it might be the classic problem of a to big venturi - not enough vacuum to lift the fuel.


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## rklopp (May 29, 2012)

My Nanos won't even pull fuel when it is practically force fed! I disconnected the fuel hose and held it up to see if that would help. Even with gravity assist, the fuel won't drain from the hose. Boy will I be red-faced if I the engines start in reverse. I'll visually inspect the timing first, because I'll have to wind a backwards starter spring to test the theory. I'm not one to give up and build a 5 cc.


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## Ramon (May 29, 2012)

Hi RK,
When I wrote that this morning I was thinking that the Nano was a side port engine - confusing it with the 'Alpha'. I got the old file out to have a look and can now see it's not! As such then running it backwards probably won't help!!

A few other things spring to mind but first your comment on the fuel not draining - Is that by 'gravity' holding the fuel tube above the engine draining into the venturi with the needle open? or from the engine held up with the fuel draining downwards ? If so and the fuel is not moving you may have a blocked jet as any slight detritus in there can play havoc with getting a fuel flow. It's certainly worth checking. On occasion I have seen the hole gum up but appear totally clear on inspection and that can really throw you out. Back flushing with a small drop of cellulose thinner works really well in clearing this problem.

Looking at the drawing/description I think it would be fair to say that it would be easy to alter the timing slightly using the described method of drilling the inlet hole in the crankshaft but not significantly enough to prevent running unless there was some serious machining errors to effect the set up using the case as a jig.

I appreciate this is a very small engine - my hat goes off to you there, that is one seriously small cylinder - but the size of prop may have a bearing too. I see it calls for a 3-1/2" diameter however going to a larger say 6 x 4 even possibly a 7 x 3, but very light, wood prop may give you a better flywheel effect in the early stages.

As you have built two - do they both exhibit the exact same characteristics?

I'm definitely not advocating you give in either, getting them to run is what it's about after all - the suggestion was very much 'tongue in cheek' - we need a smiley - but a '5' has definitely more manageble parts, well for my eyes they have 

Hope this helps a little, keep up the perseverence as they can be temperamental little devils at times but usually if they will run on a prime, if the timing's right they _will_ run Thm:

Regards - Ramon


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## rklopp (May 29, 2012)

I've built three Nanos. I did not try starting the third one yet, but it's ready to go. I expect the same result as the first two, since I made them identical as nearly as I could. The first two act the same with respect to only running on prime and not drawing fuel.

"Is that by 'gravity' holding the fuel tube above the engine draining into the venturi with the needle open?" - yes it is. I doubt I have a blocked jet, because fuel comes through when I completely choke the venturi and flick the prop. 

"When I wrote that this morning I was thinking that the Nano was a side port engine - confusing it with the 'Alpha'. I got the old file out to have a look and can now see it's not! As such then running it backwards probably won't help!!" I am confused. I though an engine with a crankshaft rotary valve would only run one direction. I know for a fact that side ports will run either direction, because my Mills 1.3 did it yesterday.


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## Ramon (May 29, 2012)

rklopp  said:
			
		

> My Nanos won't even pull fuel when it is practically force fed!





			
				rklopp  said:
			
		

> I I doubt I have a blocked jet, because fuel comes through when I completely choke the venturi and flick the prop.



Yes I know what you are saying but though you can pull the fuel through by choking it there may still be a restriction that prevents the engine sustaining itself. It's certainly worth checking. I have experienced this situation on a number of occasions. The fuel pulls through but the engine will only run the prime out. Open up the needle a tad - same thing. Its only after the needle is out several turns that the penny drops - something is restricting the fuel. This has usually happened on engines in airframes that have been stored despite running 'after run' oil through them and general cleaning before storage. Not saying yours are just that its worth checking as the first point in eliminating potential causes of effect.

The fact that the engine will pull fuel through on the choke however shows that some suction is there which indicates potential for running at some stage.

Re the side port confusion - Thinking at first that the Nano was a side port the thought that trying it to run backwards was reasonably valid - as you say they do run backwards as easily as forwards. However once the fact that it was front rotary induction was realised that thought became redundant. Of course, having said that though designed for one way running there are many FI engines that will 'kick' themselves into backwards mode and run quite happily.

You didn't mention the prop size - I still feel that might be relevant. I know sizewise its a different kettle of fish but when I built the Nova (4.6cc) engine my friend John built one at the same time. Though a superb engineer John would be the first to admit he had no knowledge of these small motors. He phoned to say somewhat disappointedly that he couldn't get his to start. Turned out he was trying to fire it up on a 7" diameter nylon prop. Once fitted witha 13 x 6 it was away within a couple of flicks. Like I say somewhat larger in all respects but definitely something else worth considering.

I really do hope you are able to find the cause and get these little engines singing

Regards - Ramon


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## vincex (Sep 28, 2012)

hii mike, verry nice!

for school i have to make a school project and i like the *Mills 1.3cc diesel *
can u please help me to purchase some plans of a 1cylinder diesel motor?
but the drawings/blueprint have to stand in millimeters 
i would appriciate if you can help me.

if you can help me pls send plans to [email protected]

thanks 

vince


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## vincex (Sep 28, 2012)

ii mike, verry nice!

for school i have to make a school project and i like the *Mills 1.3cc diesel *
can u please help me to purchase some plans of a 1cylinder diesel motor?
but the drawings/blueprint have to stand in millimeters 
i would appriciate if you can help me.

if you can help me pls send plans to [email protected]

thanks 

vince


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## Jasonb (Sep 28, 2012)

Does it have to be a diesel, by you email I assume you are in the UK and its not that easy to get hold of the model diesel fuel, its not the same as they sell at the local petrol station.

If you can change to a glow (nitro) engine then I can give you a link to some metric plans for a beginners engine that are free.

J


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## tedsmith (Feb 15, 2014)

hi can anyone help me with a set of plans for this 1.3cc mills engine please pm me thanks ted smith


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## cox24711 (Oct 27, 2016)

hi mike could you send me the plans for the mills 1.3? thank you very much 
Greg


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## edholly (Oct 27, 2016)

I built this from Ron's site plans about 2 years ago. It runs superbly, often starting first flick. Not the easiest of engines for a newcomer to builds as it requires quite a bit of thread cutting. And make sure you use a good heat treated alloy for the muff, those very thin fins are easy to have broken by a build-up of molten alloy on the tip if using soft material.

The end result looks and runs just like the original ... 

Ed


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## Keith whiddett (Jan 13, 2019)

Please could any body send the link so as I can get the plans for the Mill 1.3 cc engine, I have tired many many places with no luck


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## rklopp (Jan 13, 2019)

https://www.modelenginebuilder.com/

You should be able to buy the relevant issues straight from the publisher.


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## Keith whiddett (Jan 14, 2019)

rklopp said:


> https://www.modelenginebuilder.com/
> 
> You should be able to buy the relevant issues straight from the publisher.


Many thanks ordered


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## DickG (Jan 14, 2019)

Jasonb said:


> Does it have to be a diesel, by you email I assume you are in the UK and its not that easy to get hold of the model diesel fuel, its not the same as they sell at the local petrol station.
> 
> If you can change to a glow (nitro) engine then I can give you a link to some metric plans for a beginners engine that are free.
> 
> J


The local petrol station doesn't sell glow plug fuel, either! Model diesel fuel is just as easy to get as glow plug fuel in the UK. I built Ron's replica Mills 1.3 when it was first published. Runs really well and not that difficult to make.


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## Maris Dislers (Jan 14, 2019)

Regarding the Nano .1cc diesel starting, you're not alone. I've struggled with AE .1cc, the .1cc Valentine DIVA and one D-C BAmbi. Although another Bambi was fine. I don't have the complete answer, but did find that reducing effective choke area helped with starting. From memory, the Nano has around .6 sq mm area and you may find reducing that to .3- .4 would do the trick. Even if that loses a bit of power. It gets quite critical at smaller engine sizes, when the numbers get smaller. And I'm sure some designers/manufacturers approximate badly by using common drill sizes. You may find my venturi choke size calculator on Adrian Duncan's Model Engines website useful, when assessing choke size for an engine and likely RPM for reasonable operation.


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