Off-Grider Generator Kit

[GreenTwin]

For those who want to go off-grid on steam.

I think it would be best to generate DC, charge some batteries, and then use a rectifier to get AC.
That way you would not need to worry about an exact frequency/rpm, etc.
I think that is a DC motor shown in the photo.



https://www.ebay.com/itm/355847231241?itmmeta=01J49VZEAZ2G5BBC0N0E4KFSWB&hash=item52da25d709:g:W6IAAOSw2l9miSWE&itmprp=enc:AQAJAAAA4AQdoE/+POvMxbC++UoVwAXAgq8U4b2Iij4bG5sKvB7DPe78Bx9yVylxw6AnVQuu64q2D+sfuaIcvv3ufnMPLfVZuhVi2xFTZxRxBVjB7iotWnRIMKfwOsYBjGy0oIl0c8etBCtrpaTwqeu4iqaTcKJSvVsYnxeR+45NgvwfFQfjepgWEhFqlxfELUlJvnjr/7/Rd/paVaz9YL7shXhNHCM8LpjIGw5NRFV+5lXIN5/6MZE1d7VAwXE+dnUe4Iey8Jtc0Ev7l5E33NnMLqug3WElSrGaQ6J/dapfuHbIrElV|tkp:Bk9SR-bl_buiZA

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[SmithDoor]

For those who want to go off-grid on steam.

I think it would be best to generate DC, charge some batteries, and then use a rectifier to get AC.
That way you would not need to worry about an exact frequency/rpm, etc.
I think that is a DC motor shown in the photo.



https://www.ebay.com/itm/355847231241?itmmeta=01J49VZEAZ2G5BBC0N0E4KFSWB&hash=item52da25d709:g:W6IAAOSw2l9miSWE&itmprp=enc:AQAJAAAA4AQdoE/+POvMxbC++UoVwAXAgq8U4b2Iij4bG5sKvB7DPe78Bx9yVylxw6AnVQuu64q2D+sfuaIcvv3ufnMPLfVZuhVi2xFTZxRxBVjB7iotWnRIMKfwOsYBjGy0oIl0c8etBCtrpaTwqeu4iqaTcKJSvVsYnxeR+45NgvwfFQfjepgWEhFqlxfELUlJvnjr/7/Rd/paVaz9YL7shXhNHCM8LpjIGw5NRFV+5lXIN5/6MZE1d7VAwXE+dnUe4Iey8Jtc0Ev7l5E33NnMLqug3WElSrGaQ6J/dapfuHbIrElV|tkp:Bk9SR-bl_buiZA

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View attachment 158659

Looks great

I have look at solar steam .

The Titania on third engine use water at 185°F [85°C] At this point you could store water in a inclosed pool.

Dave

 

[The Ignoble Troll]

Benefit of going DC to AC is no rpm wander which translated into HZ wander and if you buy a sine inverter, it's easier on electronics.

 

[Lloyd-ss]

Wow, I am assuming that that is being sold as a novelty, LOL. For $6,500 plus transportation you can buy a lot of trouble free (more or less) modern equipment where you don't have to be shoveling coal in the middle of the winter. Yikes!

 

[The Ignoble Troll]

I have a 20kw natural gas unit that I would swap in a heart beat for a steam engine lol. My wife would probably murder me but damn a steam powered back up would be amazing after you threw a couple arduino at it to at least make it have an ECU.

 

[GreenTwin]

The steam engine/boiler approach may not be very practical.
I have operated boilers and steam engines, and you basically have to babysit them constantly.
I would not trust an automatic water injection system.

But, you would be the coolest off-grider in the neighborhood, in my opinion.

I had a video of one off-grider running his setup like this, but I lost that video.
Very nice sound though.

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[GreenTwin]

If things really go south, you could always use your steam pickup truck to get to the Dollar General (pun intented, sort of, but I think there is a grain of truth here).

Not my photos.

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[Lloyd-ss]

...........My wife would probably murder me but damn a steam powered back up would be amazing after you threw a couple arduino at it to at least make it have an ECU.

Yup. Another thing that only you can operate, LOL. My wife has plenty of those, too.

 

[Lloyd-ss]

@GreenTwin Jack Nicholson from The Shining should be driving that truck with smoke and flames rolling out and a big deadly snowplow breathing down your neck.

 

[The Ignoble Troll]

Yup. Another thing that only you can operate, LOL. My wife has plenty of those, too.

I suggested it, murder was confirmed.


"But with a wood pellet feed, an ECU and a hotplug igniter it would be pretty much automatic"

*Murder re-confirmed*

But hey on the way home I found an unused 100cc two stroke motor kit for adding petrol engines to pedal bikes, so I have something new to fiddle with.

Also a cast iron weight kit; free cast iron and an unused engine to gut. A good day.

 

[kf2qd]

And just how big would your boiler have to be? And how much would it cost for annual inspection? And just what would your insurance company think of your steam plant? And what would the down time be every tie you want to start it up? What is the efficiency of you boiler and steam engine? And of your generator? and of your inverter? I think it would be much more practical to have a properly sized generator.

 

[The Ignoble Troll]

And just how big would your boiler have to be? And how much would it cost for annual inspection? And just what would your insurance company think of your steam plant? And what would the down time be every tie you want to start it up? What is the efficiency of you boiler and steam engine? And of your generator? and of your inverter? I think it would be much more practical to have a properly sized generator.

I have a properly sized generator and auto transfer switch. What I *want* is a loud steam huffing boiler and engine that can barely run my ice box.

 

[GreenTwin]

And just how big would your boiler have to be? And how much would it cost for annual inspection? And just what would your insurance company think of your steam plant? And what would the down time be every tie you want to start it up? What is the efficiency of you boiler and steam engine? And of your generator? and of your inverter? I think it would be much more practical to have a properly sized generator.

It would be sort of a deep woods, way off grid sort of thing.
Like post-apocalypse, when there are no gas stations, etc., just firewood and water.
The ultimate survivalist tool.

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[WisJim]

We built and lived in an off grid home starting in 1977. It was initially non-electric but as we were talking to people and buying useful tools etc, we found a 1937 vintage Windpower brand wind turbine and 55 foot tower for it, and used it for quite a few years until replacing it with a 1940s vintage Jacobs wind turbine. Our back up was a 1920s vintage Delco light plant that started on gasoline and ran on fuel oil. I always wanted a steam powered backup generator so no fuel would have to be purchased, but the expense and complications of using steam discouraged me. As it turned out, we ran the Delco plant only a few hours a year as our battery system was large enough to run our necessities for 4 or 5 days, and it was usually windy more often than that. When we could get commercially available solar electric panels (1982) we got some and they helped a lot on calm days. Of course, our system worked because we had low electrical energy needs, heated with wood and passive solar, etc.
We removed and sole our wind turbine when we moved into town a couple of years ago. They were both still functioning after all those years, although the Jacobs got new blades and governor around 1999 to replace the old style unit.
With the technologies available today, a solar electric system would be much more practical to provide electricity to a totally off grid home.

 

[Lloyd-ss]

We built and lived in an off grid home starting in 1977. It was initially non-electric but as we were talking to people and buying useful tools etc, we found a 1937 vintage Windpower brand wind turbine and 55 foot tower for it, and used it for quite a few years until replacing it with a 1940s vintage Jacobs wind turbine. Our back up was a 1920s vintage Delco light plant that started on gasoline and ran on fuel oil. I always wanted a steam powered backup generator so no fuel would have to be purchased, but the expense and complications of using steam discouraged me. As it turned out, we ran the Delco plant only a few hours a year as our battery system was large enough to run our necessities for 4 or 5 days, and it was usually windy more often than that. When we could get commercially available solar electric panels (1982) we got some and they helped a lot on calm days. Of course, our system worked because we had low electrical energy needs, heated with wood and passive solar, etc.
We removed and sole our wind turbine when we moved into town a couple of years ago. They were both still functioning after all those years, although the Jacobs got new blades and governor around 1999 to replace the old style unit.
With the technologies available today, a solar electric system would be much more practical to provide electricity to a totally off grid home.

Jim (?)
Wow, I love that narrative! You are one of the few (to my knowledge) that has stuck with the energy independence for such a long time. My hat is off to you, my good sir. And indeed, the technology has improved exponentially since your first 55 foot wind tower. Maintaining a frugal energy lifestyle must take serious discipline, but I guess once you are firmly entrenched, it just becomes habit.
Did you advance the technology of your energy set-up over the years? It sounds like it was mostly home-grown by you, which is praise-worthy. You mentioned the solar panels, but what about the battery technology? Did you manage to get away from lead-acid, or have those continued to be satisfactory. Did you have many stretches of time where the system kind of took care of itself? It seems that with my large scale home grown projects, maintenance and repair tasks are always needing to be done.

I am curious about what you personally found to be the biggest challenge over the years with your off-grid set-up? Fascinating!

Thank you for sharing this with us.
Lloyd

 

[WisJim]

We added more and newer solar panels (PVs) to the system 3 times, and improved the controller that connects the batteries to the inverter and couple of times, and added a sine wave inverter in 1999 with an auxiliary transformer to provide 4 kw of 120/240 60 cycle AC power. The Jacobs wind turbine is a brush type generator but is quite efficient as it is direct drive and puts out rated output at under 300 rpm. It hasn't needed brushes or bearings in the 40+ years we used it, but we did replace the original wood blades and corresponding governor that had lots of gears, with a later style governor with new wood blades and a mechanism using only bushings and ball joints, avoiding lots of wear on gears that only moved back and forth a little bit.
Our original batteries back in the 1970s were used telephone company cells that they had used for backup power at the local central office, and were replaced when a couple of independent exchanges were combined and expanded, requiring replacement of the battery with a larger set--and I was lucky enough to know someone who knew someone, so I got a great set of almost new batteries at scrap price. When we finally scrapped that battery, the scrap price had risen a lot and we made good money on those batteries. That isn't case in recent years with the price of scrap metals. If I was doing this again, I would seriously consider some kind of lithium battery. We did buy brand new batteries (lead acid) in 1999 and they finally started showing decline in 2020, but are still barely functional as far as I know. (We sold the farm with batteries and solar.)
Maintenance involved climbing the wind turbine tower twice a year to grease a half dozen fittings, check some bolts and electrical connections, and maybe touch up the paint on the wooden blades. Battery maintenance was adding water monthly if needed and checking connections annually. A good battery monitoring system helped keep track of battery high and low voltages, maximum discharge, days since charged, etc., and helped with maintenance.
Today the cost of small home sized wind turbines compared to solar would mean the solar electric would be the way to go, with some kind of lithium battery. A very well insulated modest sized house would need so little energy to heat and cool that it could be done with a minisplit heat pump run on the solar system, or maybe an efficient ground-coupled heat pump. Our house that we built in the early 1970s was superinsulated, beyond what most "well insulated" house are today, so it never got very hot in the summer or cold in the winter.

 

[bluejets]

think it would be best to generate DC, charge some batteries, and then use a rectifier to get AC.

No, does not work like that at all.

 

[The Ignoble Troll]

think it would be best to generate DC, charge some batteries, and then use a rectifier to get AC.

No, does not work like that at all.

Lol rectifer vs inverter you pedant!

 

[Lloyd-ss]

We added more and newer solar panels (PVs) to the system 3 times, and improved the controller that connects the batteries to the inverter and couple of times, and added a sine wave inverter in 1999 with an auxiliary transformer to provide 4 kw of 120/240 60 cycle AC power. The Jacobs wind turbine is a brush type generator but is quite efficient as it is direct drive and puts out rated output at under 300 rpm. It hasn't needed brushes or bearings in the 40+ years we used it, but we did replace the original wood blades and corresponding governor that had lots of gears, with a later style governor with new wood blades and a mechanism using only bushings and ball joints, avoiding lots of wear on gears that only moved back and forth a little bit.
Our original batteries back in the 1970s were used telephone company cells that they had used for backup power at the local central office, and were replaced when a couple of independent exchanges were combined and expanded, requiring replacement of the battery with a larger set--and I was lucky enough to know someone who knew someone, so I got a great set of almost new batteries at scrap price. When we finally scrapped that battery, the scrap price had risen a lot and we made good money on those batteries. That isn't case in recent years with the price of scrap metals. If I was doing this again, I would seriously consider some kind of lithium battery. We did buy brand new batteries (lead acid) in 1999 and they finally started showing decline in 2020, but are still barely functional as far as I know. (We sold the farm with batteries and solar.)
Maintenance involved climbing the wind turbine tower twice a year to grease a half dozen fittings, check some bolts and electrical connections, and maybe touch up the paint on the wooden blades. Battery maintenance was adding water monthly if needed and checking connections annually. A good battery monitoring system helped keep track of battery high and low voltages, maximum discharge, days since charged, etc., and helped with maintenance.
Today the cost of small home sized wind turbines compared to solar would mean the solar electric would be the way to go, with some kind of lithium battery. A very well insulated modest sized house would need so little energy to heat and cool that it could be done with a minisplit heat pump run on the solar system, or maybe an efficient ground-coupled heat pump. Our house that we built in the early 1970s was superinsulated, beyond what most "well insulated" house are today, so it never got very hot in the summer or cold in the winter.

Very interesting history of how you changed and adapted the setup as technology changed, but kept some of the key elements (that were doing well) in the system. Having that nice source of batteries for the original installation and then again when replacement time came around, must have really helped with the capital outlay and also driven some of the decisions along the way. Getting 15 to 20 years out of the batteries is pretty great... must have been quality items. A nice progression.

I had an old golf cart that I used as a utility vehicle around our property. It was time to replace the batteries and a buddy of mine who was totally into the electric bike scene (about 8 years ago) convinced me that getting used lithium battery modules from a Nissan Leaf was the thing to do. I bit. The used modules were inexpensive at that time. I went from 36v Lead acid to 56v lithium (7 modules) (required new charger, motor and controller). Total outlay was maybe 50% more than just the cost of what new 36v would have been. The new system knocked 300 pounds off the cart, the torque is thru the roof (I can pull logs out of the woods), and after 8 years and 1,000 miles it is still going strong. But like all home grown installations, you have to stay on top of it, just like you did.
Lloyd

 

[GreenTwin]

No, does not work like that at all.

Sure it does.
Works well.
I have been doing that for 40 years.
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