New from Atlanta Ga

[John Russell]

Hello all,
I'm actually a very bad machinist, I can clearly see how to do it, but my execution is severely sub-par. I have to work on my equipment and my own patience and am here to try to improve both. I'm a car person, electronics person, and a machinery person, and have a mechanical/electrical type of job. Some of my influences are YouTube producer/presenter Allen Millyard, he has created some amazing engines for motorcycles without the aid of a full machine shop, and Quinn from Blondihacks as well as This Old Tony and Stefan Gotteswinter from YT. I have about 100 other presenters that I follow somewhat regularly. A search for information on 'Google Search' brought me to this forum and I hope to be able to learn lots of new information as well as possible some old information presented in different ways. Thanks in advance for your patience and bandwidth.

 

[GreenTwin]

Welcome

Allen Millyard has some nice videos.
They remind me of the Kawasaki triple 2-stroke 500 that my brother-in-law let me ride.
That thing was a screamer.

Quinn is one of the best videography folks I have seen that does model engine work.

MrCrispin has some interesting material.

Everyone had to start machining, and I don't think anyone machined perfectly when they started.
It takes some practice, and observing how the very good machinists do it.

There is a ton of info here; enough to keep you busy for many years.

Pat J

Edit:
How bout that rush hour traffic you have ?

.

 

[minh-thanh]

@John Russell
Welcome to the group !

 

[John Russell]

How bout that rush hour traffic you have ?

I drive it to & from work and all day for work as well. I do over 25K miles a year, in and around Atlanta.

Thanks for your reply

 

[Richard Hed]

I drive it to & from work and all day for work as well. I do over 25K miles a year, in and around Atlanta.

Thanks for your reply

What kind of machines do you have, and projects?

 

[Apprentice707]

Welcome John.

Regards

B

 

[John Russell]

What kind of machines do you have, and projects?

SIEG X2 Mill, RF-31 Mill, 7x14 Chinese lathe, and 9x48-A South Bend lathe unrestored.
Lincoln 250A AC and 2nd 250/125A AC-DC Tombstones, 90A Grainger MIG, 140A Lincoln MIG, 300A Lincoln TIG, 350A Miller Syncrowave.

Thanks for the interest and intro.

 

[Roadhawg]

welcome aboard John! -joe

 

[Richard Hed]

SIEG X2 Mill, RF-31 Mill, 7x14 Chinese lathe, and 9x48-A South Bend lathe unrestored.
Lincoln 250A AC and 2nd 250/125A AC-DC Tombstones, 90A Grainger MIG, 140A Lincoln MIG, 300A Lincoln TIG, 350A Miller Syncrowave.

Thanks for the interest and intro.

What's with all the welders? You a pro? I recently got a Prime TIG 225 and am trying to learn TIG for some projects. My prob is that I simply don't use it often enough.

 

[John Russell]

What's with all the welders? You a pro? I recently got a Prime TIG 225 and am trying to learn TIG for some projects. My prob is that I simply don't use it often enough.

When they become available at a good price, I get it. The tombstone 250 was in VGC at an estate sale for $60, then the 250/125 AC/DC became available for $90 looking to be unused. And so on, and so on. -- Absolutely not a "WELDER"! I get by.

 

[ajoeiam]

What's with all the welders? You a pro? I recently got a Prime TIG 225 and am trying to learn TIG for some projects. My prob is that I simply don't use it often enough.

That's one of the significant differences between welding and machining.
Machining is much more of a calculated art (use x speed with y feed to get z result in material a) where welding is more of a coordinated physical art between the eye, brain and body. Without regular practice - - - its very challenging to improve one's skills. Machining - - imo anyway, far easier to improve. Easier to learn machining from a book - - - welding - - books - - useful but I think its practice practice practice to get the skills up there.

(Pic is one that a buddy sent me - - - I aspire to this level - - am not there (that's stainless too if one's interested).)

 

[awake]

Welcome to the forum!

 

[GreenTwin]

I always wanted one of those AC/DC tombstone Lincolns, but they cost about twice what a standard AC tombstone cost, so I just use the standard unit.

I have welded with DC before, and if you get the right rod and polarity, it is much easier to get a high quality weld, and much easier to weld in general.

Using the wrong brand of AC rods with an AC welder will give some dreadful welds, and I found that out when I got back into welding in about 2011.

I finally went down to the local welding supply store, and asked them if they had a better brand of 6013, and they did.
I forget the brand, but I get consistently good results with AC with the new rods.

I have learned to weld sheet metal on the 40 amp setting, and that is a bit if a trick, and takes some quick in and out motion to prevent a burn-through.

I considered a TIGG machine, but they are pricey, and I really don't have a need for TIGG-quality welds.

I have seen a lot of folks use MIG, so I guess my stick welding with a tombstone is old-school, but it works for me, and is a simple solution.

I generally weld out-of-position, and so all I want is a strong weld with little splatter.
If the weld is not pretty, then that is not really a problem, as long as it is structurally sound.

.

 

[awake]

I always wanted one of those AC/DC tombstone Lincolns, but they cost about twice what a standard AC tombstone cost, so I just use the standard unit.

I have welded with DC before, and if you get the right rod and polarity, it is much easier to get a high quality weld, and much easier to weld in general.

Using the wrong brand of AC rods with an AC welder will give some dreadful welds, and I found that out when I got back into welding in about 2011.

I finally went down to the local welding supply store, and asked them if they had a better brand of 6013, and they did.
I forget the brand, but I get consistently good results with AC with the new rods.

I have learned to weld sheet metal on the 40 amp setting, and that is a bit if a trick, and takes some quick in and out motion to prevent a burn-through.

I considered a TIGG machine, but they are pricey, and I really don't have a need for TIGG-quality welds.

I have seen a lot of folks use MIG, so I guess my stick welding with a tombstone is old-school, but it works for me, and is a simple solution.

I generally weld out-of-position, and so all I want is a strong weld with little splatter.
If the weld is not pretty, then that is not really a problem, as long as it is structurally sound.

.

This is going to sound odd, but ... I had more luck welding sheet metal / thin metal using 6011 than 6013. Yes, the arc force of this rod makes it easy to blow a hole in the metal if one is not careful, but the fast-freeze nature of the rod, along with the back and forth movement that this rod favors, always seems to help me to keep things under control. Mostly.

That said, I haven't welded sheet metal using SMAW in a long time. Most of the welding I do these days is TIG, with some occasional MIG; I mostly save SMAW for heavy sections.

 

[Richard Hed]

I always wanted one of those AC/DC tombstone Lincolns, but they cost about twice what a standard AC tombstone cost, so I just use the standard unit.

I have welded with DC before, and if you get the right rod and polarity, it is much easier to get a high quality weld, and much easier to weld in general.

Using the wrong brand of AC rods with an AC welder will give some dreadful welds, and I found that out when I got back into welding in about 2011.

I finally went down to the local welding supply store, and asked them if they had a better brand of 6013, and they did.
I forget the brand, but I get consistently good results with AC with the new rods.

I have learned to weld sheet metal on the 40 amp setting, and that is a bit if a trick, and takes some quick in and out motion to prevent a burn-through.

I considered a TIGG machine, but they are pricey, and I really don't have a need for TIGG-quality welds.

I have seen a lot of folks use MIG, so I guess my stick welding with a tombstone is old-school, but it works for me, and is a simple solution.

I generally weld out-of-position, and so all I want is a strong weld with little splatter.
If the weld is not pretty, then that is not really a problem, as long as it is structurally sound.

.

In the Philippines I had to buy a stick welder about 20 years ago. it has served well, however, it would have been really nice to use MIG. Problem with MIG is that the wire rusts very quickly and even a bit of rust will cause the wire to stick in the snake. In the US, 45 years ago I bought a Lincoln 250, one with the wheel that has "infinite" adjustability, it is MUCH better machine than the one in the Phils which has just six settings.

It was difficult to near impossible to get rod smaller than 1/8th" and I tested out all the types of rod and different brands. There was one brand called "Wip-weld" it was so offal (viz. awful), that it would not even scratch start at all. But eventually, I found 3/32" rod and various brands including cheap Chinese stuff that is actually very good. Occassionally, I need 1/16th but have to import it from US.

If yuou haven't tried MIG, then yhou need to ttry it, it is like spreading hot butter on hot toast, it is so easy. And, now we can buy cheap but decent welding machines of all types, MIG, TIG and if you want to bother with stick, they all three often come in cheapo chinese jobs. I don't know if they are any good, I suspect not all that good, but probably the main part of MIG works fine. I would rather use dedicated machines: TIG machine fo4r TIGging, MIG for MIGging, and if I wanted to bother using stick when not necesssary, I would use a stick welder.

6013 is not the best rod, it is "general usage", in the biz, it's known as "farmer rod", a quick fix for anything. My personal opinion is DC rod is usually better. (Not always). for general usage, I prefer 6010 but will use a variety of types. IN the Phils, one can only get 6013, or stainless.

 

[awake]

MIG definitely is an easy-to-use process, and it can produce great results ...

... but it can also produce welds that look good which turn out not to be good. (By contrast, as I understand it, a stick or TIG weld that looks good generally is good, or to say it another way, if the weld is bad, it will look bad. But MIG can go on like butter and slide right back off.

Here is a video that illustrates some potential problems. Note that the welds look good each time ... but there are dramatic differences in performance:

 

[Richard Hed]

MIG definitely is an easy-to-use process, and it can produce great results ...

... but it can also produce welds that look good which turn out not to be good. (By contrast, as I understand it, a stick or TIG weld that looks good generally is good, or to say it another way, if the weld is bad, it will look bad. But MIG can go on like butter and slide right back off.

Here is a video that illustrates some potential problems. Note that the welds look good each time ... but there are dramatic differences in performance:

That's absolutely true. MIG can fool a beginner. Jody is demonstrating this. Notice the first weld, the scale has not even been attempted to clean off. any welder with experience knows to take the scale off before welding. This is one of the problems I had in the Philippines is to get my welders to clean the scale. All too often it is a problem everywhere, not just Asia. I did the same thing when I was just learning--dint wanna clean the scale.

BTW, that all is one of the reasons to LEARN on stick then go to MIG. Stick is harder to learn but easier (IMNSHO) make gooder welds. But once you have learned stick, then going to MIG, you understand more what a good weld is. It is easy to do good welds with MIG IF you know what constitutes good welds. I understand that usually MIG is not as penetrating as stick which is easy to understand if you have welded both ways.

Notice that Jody does his third weld, cleaned off the scale BUT he also does a different weld technique of weaving which he did NOT do on the first weld. For any test anywhere or anytime, the characteristics have to be the same EXCEPT for the one dimension being tested. Jody did not do this, so it is really an invalid demonstration. Even so, scale is like trying to glue two pieces of wood together with a sheet of plastic between--it jusst doesn't work.

 

[awake]

Agreed - I would have been interested to see the effect only of cleaning the scale, without any other changes, and then compare to cleaning the scale + improving the technique. Also agreed on the benefits of starting with stick, but I wonder if TIG might be even more beneficial as a starting place (though in my limited experience, that is always the last technique learned). Really learning to see the puddle was a significant part of the learning curve for me, and with TIG, you can really watch the puddle without flux or splatter getting in the way.

One thing that I have learned from Jody's videos, that has been invaluable when dialing in MIG settings, is to do a test weld followed by a cut/polish/etch. It can be rather eye-opening to see how much - or how little - the weld actually penetrated. That has been especially helpful with the cheap import MIG welder that I have - yes, one of those import inverter machines that can do MIG, stick, and scratch-start TIG. I haven't bothered to try TIG with it, but it does both MIG and stick surprisingly well ... except for one thing. The machine I have, like so many others over the past few years, tries to eliminate the learning curve of wire speed and voltage, and instead uses a semi-sorta-integrated control with some sort of "synergic" feedback. On the one hand, this makes it even easier for a beginner to use. On the other hand, it makes it harder to know exactly what you are adjusting.

 

[a41capt]

Agreed - I would have been interested to see the effect only of cleaning the scale, without any other changes, and then compare to cleaning the scale + improving the technique. Also agreed on the benefits of starting with stick, but I wonder if TIG might be even more beneficial as a starting place (though in my limited experience, that is always the last technique learned). Really learning to see the puddle was a significant part of the learning curve for me, and with TIG, you can really watch the puddle without flux or splatter getting in the way.

One thing that I have learned from Jody's videos, that has been invaluable when dialing in MIG settings, is to do a test weld followed by a cut/polish/etch. It can be rather eye-opening to see how much - or how little - the weld actually penetrated. That has been especially helpful with the cheap import MIG welder that I have - yes, one of those import inverter machines that can do MIG, stick, and scratch-start TIG. I haven't bothered to try TIG with it, but it does both MIG and stick surprisingly well ... except for one thing. The machine I have, like so many others over the past few years, tries to eliminate the learning curve of wire speed and voltage, and instead uses a semi-sorta-integrated control with some sort of "synergic" feedback. On the one hand, this makes it even easier for a beginner to use. On the other hand, it makes it harder to know exactly what you are adjusting.

In the US Navy welding school, we started with oxy-acetylene welding, then brazing cast iron, and finally “stick” welding. My later classes included high pressure silver brazing, high pressure pipe and hull (with exotics like inconel, etc.), and then on to the aircraft school for all forms of TIG.

I feel the oxy-acetylene school really assisted with the hand/eye coordination necessary for TIG work, with the addition of a pedal and foot coordination with TIG. I still use oxy-acetylene when I have a quick steel job that doesn’t require any flux rather than dragging out my shielded arc or TIG, and I prefer my TIG for silicon bronze “brazing” of dissimilar metals.

John W

 

[Richard Hed]

Agreed - I would have been interested to see the effect only of cleaning the scale, without any other changes, and then compare to cleaning the scale + improving the technique. Also agreed on the benefits of starting with stick, but I wonder if TIG might be even more beneficial as a starting place (though in my limited experience, that is always the last technique learned). Really learning to see the puddle was a significant part of the learning curve for me, and with TIG, you can really watch the puddle without flux or splatter getting in the way.

One thing that I have learned from Jody's videos, that has been invaluable when dialing in MIG settings, is to do a test weld followed by a cut/polish/etch. It can be rather eye-opening to see how much - or how little - the weld actually penetrated. That has been especially helpful with the cheap import MIG welder that I have - yes, one of those import inverter machines that can do MIG, stick, and scratch-start TIG. I haven't bothered to try TIG with it, but it does both MIG and stick surprisingly well ... except for one thing. The machine I have, like so many others over the past few years, tries to eliminate the learning curve of wire speed and voltage, and instead uses a semi-sorta-integrated control with some sort of "synergic" feedback. On the one hand, this makes it even easier for a beginner to use. On the other hand, it makes it harder to know exactly what you are adjusting.

I started out with a TIG attachment for the Lincoln 225. It was scratch type, new for it's time, about 40 years ago. Afterr a while I gave up on th e scratching. It only had one adjustment besides the welder's adjustable amps--the gas flow. I would not recommend learning on TIG first.

Jody is really great, I watch and download his stuff extensively. Even so, that vid was faulty. Yes, the puddle, it took me a long time to understand what it was. Now, when I teach someone, that is what I teach first (after how to strike a stick).