Casting Sets / Kits?

[SolarFreak]

I've been digging around for casting related threads, and I've come across the term(s) - Casting Sets and Casting Kits. What are they? Are the a set of castings to be machined? Or a set of patterns to cast, then machine?

Second - Until recently, I've been geared more toward casting than machining. I don't expect this to change dramatically, and I was thinking of seeing if anyone wanted to collaborate on a casting kit (or set?) My engine knowledge is slim to none, but pattern and foundry work is my thing... Thoughts?

On collaboration... I'd be particularly interested in alternative energy type projects, which for me means Sterling engines, or anything else to work with low grade "waste" heat. You give me plans, I produce patterns and cast. You get castings and we machine separately-together...

-Ryan

 

[RonGinger]

I think in the model engineering hobby the reference to a casting kit or set refers to a collection of castings, ready to be machined. Over the years there have been many, probably hundreds, of such kits offered. Many were by an individual that set up shop and sold castings, probably as a 'hobby business'. I think the most famous one, now in existence for over 100 years is Stuart Turner from England. The company has changd hands several times, starting as a division of a large company that made industrial pumps.

Many years ago there was a 'pattern pool' a set of patterns for some locomotive models. This pool of patterns was passed around and guys made their own castings, then passed the set along. As I understand it the pool ended when some holder of it suffered a fire and the patterns were lost.

 

[stevehuckss396]

I've been digging around for casting related threads, and I've come across the term(s) - Casting Sets and Casting Kits. What are they? Are the a set of castings to be machined? Or a set of patterns to cast, then machine?

Second - Until recently, I've been geared more toward casting than machining. I don't expect this to change dramatically, and I was thinking of seeing if anyone wanted to collaborate on a casting kit (or set?) My engine knowledge is slim to none, but pattern and foundry work is my thing... Thoughts?

On collaboration... I'd be particularly interested in alternative energy type projects, which for me means Sterling engines, or anything else to work with low grade "waste" heat. You give me plans, I produce patterns and cast. You get castings and we machine separately-together...

-Ryan

I have always wanted to cast a 1/3rd scale Briggs Stratton Kit and a 1/4 scale Ford Model "A" Kit.

The briggs would be the block, head, and side cover.

The Model A would be the block, head, timing cover, side cover, and maybe the water pump.

I would love to work with you on one or both of these.

I have 3 frames done and planned to machine blocks and heads for the Briggs anyway.

http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/f31/mini-bike-17956/

 

[Tin Falcon]

Ryan

here is my view:
casting kit: A kit consisting of all the castings,bar stock , hardware and blueprints needed to Machine and assemble and engine or project.

casting set: all the castings packaged together for an engine or project.
may or may not include bar stock. fasteners or the actual plans /blueprint.

pre machined casting kit. same as number one except ALL machining is done the castings just need a little filing sanding painting and then assembly with hand tools.

Pattern set: would be a complete set of patterns to make a set of castings,

Pattern board : A flat Piece of ply wood or mdf that has a set or partial set of patterns attached to it it also contains gates . it allows for faster casting and keeps small patterns together. If you are casting a set with more than one metal then each pattern board would be set up for a specific metal.


The model engineering hobby is vast. While the primary focus of this board is machining model engines this is merely one large facet of the hobby. There is certainly a place in this hobby and on this board for someone who focuses on castings.
Non of us here will know everything about this hobby and have the tools to do it all. collaboration is a great thing.
so post a note in the specialist sub fora and let folks know you can help them with pattern making and castings.
also when the time comes you have a casting set ready post in the buy sell trade area. I expect there are fold here looking for good castings at a fair price and others that would be willing to barter machining time for castings.

Also there are lots of guys here pretty good at 3-D cad that can help you designing engine parts or patters or redrawing classic designs for clarity.

Tin

 

[chucketn]

Ryan,
What metals would you be casting?

Chuck

 

[SolarFreak]

Tin -

Thanks for all the definitions! What you laid out there is in line with what I was thinking, right down to the final commercialization of the casting set.

I would be machining my own engine from the castings first, and my hope was that I could find someone else with more model engine machining experience who I could follow along with in case I run into difficulties. I have a older, but very solid 12"x36" Clausing lathe, and will be getting a mill in the not too distant future.

Chuck -

As far as what metals. Primarily aluminum. I by far have the most experience with that. I have the equipment to handle pretty much anything up to and including cast iron melting temps (I have done only 1 cast iron pour). Brass, Bronzes (Al, Sn, Si), Zinc / ZAMAK. Metals that require an inert atmosphere are out ! Mg and such. I might even put copper out, but I'd be willing to try it.

 

[trapper23]

As a newbie over the last few days I have been researching the idea of home castingin ageneral "crafting" application and not just for engine casings etc but also for maybe some bowls, utensils plaques etc. Trouble here in the uk is finding a suitable furnace....... although there seem to be plaenty of self build tutorials on the net If a kit was available for a new start id like so see either the component parts of a furnace or maybe a small furnace and the necessary tools and safety gear at reasonable prices............ one such set up i found here online coast nearly £5,000.00 ($7,850)and thats aimed at hobby users I doubt they actually sell many!!!

 

[Tin Falcon]

Bronze and cast iron kits are the most desirable aluminum is ok .

I am sure there are people out there would would be willing to do product testing to prove the design of a kit. They could document the build and write up an instruction manual in exchange for a casting set. They would have to find errors and suggest revisions or work around. just make sure it is someone that will do the build in a reasonably time frame and it is not just going to a kit collector.
You would get documentation for your casting set they would end up with an engine.
Tin

 

[SolarFreak]

As a newbie over the last few days I have been researching the idea of home castingin ageneral "crafting" application and not just for engine casings etc but also for maybe some bowls, utensils plaques etc. Trouble here in the uk is finding a suitable furnace....... although there seem to be plaenty of self build tutorials on the net If a kit was available for a new start id like so see either the component parts of a furnace or maybe a small furnace and the necessary tools and safety gear at reasonable prices............ one such set up i found here online coast nearly £5,000.00 ($7,850)and thats aimed at hobby users I doubt they actually sell many!!!

I don't know what's in that kit, but it better be good and comprehensive! I've built more than several furnaces over the course of my "career" and if all you want to do is pour a couple of pounds of Al, you should be able to get yourself setup for under $200, maybe even less than that if you scrounge.

Good crucibles are IMHO the most expensive part, second would be good casting sand...

Here's my current furnace, not factoring in the leftovers, I have $5 in the shell, $50 in the commercial castable lining, $15 in the spun Aluminum Oxide insulation, ($15) in the burner (that's negative $15!). Old HVAC oil burner I removed. I kept the burner, and scrapped the rest.

 

[Tin Falcon]

there is a good handful of people /companies currently producing engine casting kits.
you should take a look at what is available out there.

In the US the most popular starter kits are from PM Research. In the UK Stuart is the one to look at.
also in the us there is tiny power
coles and myers. IIRC the latter two do mostly larger hit and miss Internal combustion engines.
Art decalb is a one man show and sells a couple little kits.

http://precisionserv.com/steam-engine/steam-engine-price-list/
Tin

 

[Herbiev]

I sure would love a set of castings for a jewellers lathe. Not an engine but would make a neat project

 

[OrangeAlpine]

A word of caution. Talk is drifting toward providing (selling?) castings. That could easily get a fellow crosswise with state and federal air and water regs. The nature of the regs are such that non commercial activities are not covered, so if you can keep your neighbors happy, you are good to go. However, when the activity becomes commercial, you automatically fall under regs. What constitutes commercial? Depends on the inspector. Some consider a six pack as a token of appreciation, others see it as payment for services.

Speaking as a retired water bureaucrat, regulating industrial discharges to city sewers. Operative word is retired, I'm going to rat out anybody, but I am familiar with regs.

Bill

 

[Tin Falcon]

The nature of the regs are such that non commercial activities are not covered, so if you can keep your neighbors happy, you are good to go. However, when the activity becomes commercial, you automatically fall under regs.

Good point IMHO regulations are one reason a lot of local foundries are gone.
I used to work as a regulatory agent myself. I was a weights and measures officer. All scales used for trade are required to be registered with the state and inspected by W &M 1 sale over a scale per year and you are operating commercially.
As far as a hobby business probably in reality does not exist by some definitions .
I used to work in a govt DOD machine shop position. We were allowed to do favors for friends in the military unit I was attached to . It was OK to be compensated with a reasonable amount of the recipients favorite beverage as a return favor. but . Any monetary compensating was strictly prohibited, because then you were using military assets for personal monetary gain.
In the eyes of the government the rational of bartering or trading for money does not cut it and is probably crossing a line.
Keep it small keep it fun and keep it a hobby . That is unless you really want to go commercial and have the resources.
A friend of mine started out as a back yard welding business. he was forced into an industrial location by local authorities. . He ended up with a successful business employing several people, including myself and my son for a while. He was doing well at least until the economy went sour.
Remember Entrepreneur: (into manure) french for businessman (Has to deal with lots of S**t)
Tin

 

[GaryK]

I think the most famous one, now in existence for over 100 years is Stuart Turner from England. The company has changd hands several times, starting as a division of a large company that made industrial pumps.

Is there some place in the US that sells the Stuart casting kits?

Gary

 

[Tin Falcon]

Good question ;

I would think someone has been importing them. Stuart just underwent a reorganization and production stock levels were down.

a couple places that used to carry Stuart are either not importing or out of stock.
you may have to patiently Google . it may take a few weeks or months for things to settle in.
and please post an introduction in the welcome area.
Tin

 

[Wizard69]

I sure would love a set of castings for a jewellers lathe. Not an engine but would make a neat project

Interesting idea, what size are you talking about? Something Sherline or Taig sized or possibly a Gingery spin. I ask because I find tool building to be an interesting sub culture.